Howa 223 wont shoot light pills. (Stupid long throat)?-Rant

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Howa 223 wont shoot light pills. (Stupid long throat)?-Rant

Post by Medic » 11 May 2020, 9:16 am

Hey Team,
Never thought I'd say this but I'm having HOWA problems.
I'm an experienced reloader, and I'm a bit miffed at Howa to be honest.

I've edited my earlier post to be less rant-y.

So, Howa 223, 1:9. Has the longest throat length I've encountered in a 223... why? I have to seat a 50gr TNT to 59mm to touch the lands.
40 and 50gr pills will not group, is anyone having good success shooting light pills in their Howa?
55gr factories were grouping in the 8-10mm range. Amazing.

I seated the 50gr TNT to be near the lands, but since I was raging out there because I was hours from home, with hundreds of rounds loaded (I know, I know) couldn't get a group. I had also just sold my tikka that groups 6mm at 150meters with 40's, I was a bit upset. I didn't try seating them to 2.2" or so. (I'll own that.)
40gr Zmax's which are a personal favourite I also couldn't get to group better than 2 inches either.

So has anyone had good success shooting light pills in a relatively recent howa 223? Thanks team.
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Re: Howa 223 wont shoot light pills. (Stupid long throat)?-R

Post by in2anity » 11 May 2020, 10:02 am

If you're looking for a cheap plinker, the 62gr TAP pills shoot well out of a 1:9. Easy 2" at 200m.

IMO that's the dark side of the in-vogue, long-throated, tight-twist rifles designed to shoot VLD bullets. If you don't run the (more expensive) VLDs, you are actually disadvantaging yourself. A knock-about 223 farm gun meant for pluggin pests with light, cheap ammo is really better suited to the old 1:12".
At what point does lack of maintenance become patina?
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Re: Howa 223 wont shoot light pills. (Stupid long throat)?-R

Post by marksman » 11 May 2020, 10:26 am

a 1 in 9" is to shoot 70gr max reason why the longer throat and maybe why the 40gr and 50gr wont group
but you will probably find the tangent ogive bullets are closer to the lands with lighter bullets

IMHO unless you can leave at least a caliber diameter in the case neck you should load for concentricity by loading with a caliber diameter left in the case neck and making sure your handloads are as straight as they can be,
if the bullet is not in the case as it hits the lands l would be going for a longer bullet that does
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Re: Howa 223 wont shoot light pills. (Stupid long throat)?-R

Post by bladeracer » 11 May 2020, 11:49 am

I wouldn't be too concerned about trying to get near the lands with such light bullets, unless you need the case volume for velocity. Did the Tikka let you seat close to the lands with 40hn bullets? Have you tried longer bullets? I would think 55gn or longer would group better, or non-lead bullets if you must go lighter. The 35gn NTX shoots well in my Ruger 8"-twist.
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Re: Howa 223 wont shoot light pills. (Stupid long throat)?-R

Post by Medic » 11 May 2020, 12:37 pm

I think you are all confirming what I have thought as well. This crazy obsession to shoot 95grain projectiles out of 223's is getting stupid. I had a few howas over the years and I am pretty sure I'd never encountered throat lengths like this. (Last 223 howa was a probably 15 years ago, pretty sure it a 1-10 twist.)

The tikka touches the lands at 2.21" with 40gr zmax. Shoots them amazingly.
Howa will not shoot the 40's at any length, including 2.21"

I have a love affair with 40's and 2207, so not being able to use them is going to drive me crazy. So much so I think I might take it to a smith to have it re-cut for a "nominal" throat length. About the cheapest way out of this mess I think. I also have 4kg of 2207... yes I can use it with 55's but I'd rather not, probably loose 250+ fps in velocity. I need to buy 4kg of 2208 anyway for a 22 creedmoor. But still, I want my 223 to shoot light bullets well.

Cheers ya all. Not sure what else I can do here.
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Re: Howa 223 wont shoot light pills. (Stupid long throat)?-R

Post by in2anity » 11 May 2020, 1:19 pm

You could trade it for an older 1:12" howa - they go really cheap because they're not "tacti-cool" enough for most kids... that path might even be cheaper than having it short throated.

On a related note, I have a Ruger 300blk. 1:7" blackouts also have ridiculously long throats on them to cater for the long, heavy, subsonic pills. Neverthless I only shoot light, flat-based supersonics out of it (the 130gr TNTs to be precise). And it's a massive jump for them also. In reality, that gun+handload can only hold a 1.5moa group, which is O-K for standing offhand, but not ideal for supported shots.

So I've ordered a custom, slower 1:10" along with a custom short-throat reamer designed specifically for ~125gr supersonic loads. Due to arrive in July (thanks covid).

Moral of the story (at the risk of stating the obvious), tight twist barrels are not necesserily "superior" (despite what many shooters think). Horses for courses.
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