How important is it to clean cases before reloading?

[Paul]

Hi again folks,

All my current reloading is by fully manual process using a Lee loader, hand chamfer etc (though a little bit of use of the cordless drill to hold cases or primer pocket cleaner).

I see lots of gadgets for tumbling and cleaning, some little brushes for cleaning the throuts of cases etc. I dont currently have this capacity and just do a clean of the outside of the cases with fine steel wool (holding the case in the cordless and give it a qick spin) - pretty much for the nice shinny look I get and perhaps feeds etc better.

Qn. How important is it to clean the inside of the case? I imagine that this happens with a tumbler and medium? Does it afffect the quality of the relaod produced - is there remnant burnt powder etc.

Thoughts? And any suggestions on a DIY tumbler/ cleaner. Oh, and is it important to lube inside necks to hlep projectile seating as many instructions say? I wonder about the impact of remnant case lube on the ingintion process etc.

Thanks in advince team.

Paul

[bladeracer]

I have never cleaned my brass, but I don't throw it around the ground either. It gets fired, ejected into my hand or brass catcher, reloaded, and fired again.

If you were shooting Benchrest competition it might pay to clean just to keep consistency.

I have not seen any manual suggest lubing the neck for bullet seating, that does not sound like a good idea at all.

[Stix]

Its not important to clean the brass--provided its looked after/not abused of course.

I wouldnt be using steel wool on the outside of the cases...
I use a rag dampened with something to wipe the carbon from the outside of the neck in between reloads--thats it...!!
(cheap brake or carbi clean is good enough).

I do wet tumble my brass, but only when i do a FL Size & anneal them.

If you're not cleaning the brass inside (tumbling), then dont use any lube inside the necks.

Bench resters may shoot a few comps in a day with the same brass & dont tumble between loadings that day...

If worried, just run a nylon bore brush in your drill & give the inside of your necks a very quick tickle with that before reloading--that along with removing carbon from outside of neck area is the most anal you need to be...

[SCJ429]

I don't use any electrical powered things to prepare my brass, I think you can remove material when using a drill or other powered devices. I use a K&M primer pocket tool to get the ash out. I use a nylon brush to clean the inside necks. I want to leave a little bit of carbon inside the neck to aid bullet release. With brand new brass or tumbled clean brass, I would add some graphite powder to do this.

I use some fine steel wool to clean the outside of my necks, many of my barrels have tight necks and I do not want to add any thickness there.

Other than cleaning very dirty brass or preparing brass for annealing, I don't see the need to tumble clean your brass.

[Weepy]

Oh, and is it important to lube inside necks to hlep projectile seating as many instructions say?

Do many instructions say that?

Who? Which?

I think you might have mixed up seating with neck sizing?

You will want to lube the next for sizing, not for seating. It not supposed to be dripping though. Just a quick scrub on the inside with a lightly lubed bristle brush.

[Press]

I have never cleaned my brass, but I don't throw it around the ground either. It gets fired, ejected into my hand or brass catcher, reloaded, and fired again.

How long is "never"?

How many firings, how many years?

Not "throwing it around" is fine, but there's still finger oil, moisture, random dust and debris.

Seems like it'd be a bit grubby after not to long?

[JimTom]

Mate I clean my cases every time with a sonic cleaner, then tumble to make shiny. Is it necessary? Hell no, I just enjoy reloading and piss farting around with my cases. In saying that I think it is reasonably important to ensure primer pocket, and flash home etc are cleaned of an excess carbon deposits.

[bladeracer]

I have never cleaned my brass, but I don't throw it around the ground either. It gets fired, ejected into my hand or brass catcher, reloaded, and fired again.

How long is "never"?

How many firings, how many years?

Not "throwing it around" is fine, but there's still finger oil, moisture, random dust and debris.

Seems like it'd be a bit grubby after not to long?

I started loading in '83, for .222Rem. I used the same 40 cases over and over and over, through several cans of IMR4198, without cleaning them even once.

In 9mm, I used the same 500 cases for more than a decade, without cleaning and they did get hurled around the ranges. They were by far the filthiest brass I've used, I still have a few of them, without causing any problems in my pistol.

Now I load for dozens of chamberings. Some of my .204 brass has been loaded 20+ times.

Being grubby has no relevance to their performance.

[Bugman]

Rifle cases...get cleaned sometimes. My pistol cases get tumbled after every shoot.

[Paul]

Oh, and is it important to lube inside necks to hlep projectile seating as many instructions say?

Do many instructions say that?

Who? Which?

I think you might have mixed up seating with neck sizing?

You will want to lube the next for sizing, not for seating. It not supposed to be dripping though. Just a quick scrub on the inside with a lightly lubed bristle brush.

Hi Weepy, I was looking at this vidoe from RCBS, see at about 38 seconds, where he uses a nylon brush to put lube on the inside of the neck - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjCXS3S ... s2&index=3

You may be correct, coz he does say about the lube being useful when the 'ball' retracts, which I am guessing is the nexk resizing you were talking about. So my misundersting. Having said that, would the cases then be cleaned after this step to remove the lube from inside the neck?

P

[marksman]

people have already given the answers l would have but in a mixed fashion

having clean or polished cases are 2 different things, clean cases can be tarnished but they are still clean
a bit of carbon inside the neck does help with bullet release so if your cases are new or wet tumbled cleaning the inside of the case you should IMHO lubricate the inside of the necks if you want to be consistent
if you are going to lube the inside of your neck for a smoother release l use graphite but l have in the past tested lee lube and thought it worked well
l like to be able to pull my bullets and there is no marring or scratches on the bullet, a clean smooth release
my case necks are turned, reamed and lightly polished when l prep them for consistency with around 2 thou neck tension, just enough so you cant pull the bullet with your fingers

if you want to do it go for it, l do it and it makes me happy

bloody hell its been quiet on the forum the last few days

[Hucka]

I was looking at this vidoe from RCBS, see at about 38 seconds, where he uses a nylon brush to put lube on the inside of the neck - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjCXS3S ... s2&index=3

You may be correct, coz he does say about the lube being useful when the 'ball' retracts, which I am guessing is the nexk resizing you were talking about. So my misundersting. Having said that, would the cases then be cleaned after this step to remove the lube from inside the neck?

Hi Paul.

That's for definitely for sizing the cases, not for seating the bullets.

If you don't lube the neck it can be very difficult to get it in and out of the die. I've seen a few where the neck splits horizontally and pulls apart when coming out of the die too, when a bit of lube would likely have saved the case.

You're right that the next step would be tumbling the cases.

The typical routine is.

Shoot cartridges.
Resize brass (which also pops out the spent primer).
Tumble to clean.
Trim and deburr the cases (if you're doing that, doesn't need to be done every time, just once every few reloads)
Reload ammo.

You don't need to separately clean the lube out, only a very minimal amount is applied.

Happy shooting.

[juano86]

Some great responses here. Everyone does something different that works for them. I do wet tumble my brass before every reload for a few reasons.
Consistency - i like knowing I'm starting from a clean slate with every loading.
keeps my dies clean - when resizing with dirty cases, you get carbon buildup inside the die, especially if using lube.
My process may add an extra step or two, but like others mentioned - i like piss farting around reloading haha.

1- de-cap brass with universal decapper.
2- wet tumble with stainless steel pins and burnishing compound.
3- dry brass in dehydrator.
4- anneal brass (only every 3rd or 4th firing, pending cartridge).
5- Neck size (bump shoulder if required).
6- Trim case (if required) and chamfer mouths.
7- prime cases.
8- charge with powder and seat bullet.

That process is certainly overkill if wanting to just shoot minute of deer / pig whatever, but since i went down the rabbit hole of long range shooting and reloading, iv found that's whats worked best for me so far. I also have exceptional brass life. when using Norma and Lapua brass etc, it pays to take care of it. As mentioned above, everyone has different processes that works best for them. happy reloading.

[in2anity]

Some great responses here. Everyone does something different that works for them. I do wet tumble my brass before every reload for a few reasons.
Consistency - i like knowing I'm starting from a clean slate with every loading.
keeps my dies clean - when resizing with dirty cases, you get carbon buildup inside the die, especially if using lube.
My process may add an extra step or two, but like others mentioned - i like piss farting around reloading haha.

1- de-cap brass with universal decapper.
2- wet tumble with stainless steel pins and burnishing compound.
3- dry brass in dehydrator.
4- anneal brass (only every 3rd or 4th firing, pending cartridge).
5- Neck size (bump shoulder if required).
6- Trim case (if required) and chamfer mouths.
7- prime cases.
8- charge with powder and seat bullet.

That process is certainly overkill if wanting to just shoot minute of deer / pig whatever, but since i went down the rabbit hole of long range shooting and reloading, iv found that's whats worked best for me so far. I also have exceptional brass life. when using Norma and Lapua brass etc, it pays to take care of it. As mentioned above, everyone has different processes that works best for them. happy reloading.

Kudos to you mate - very dilligent I do agree for the sake of your dies, it's probably better if your cases are clean. Nevertheless, I challenge you cut out steps 2-4 (replace with quick external wipe) with and see if you can measure any difference. Make for quite an interesting experiment.

[Rwd22]

I know it's a different lubing of necks compared to what we're referring to (Resizing lube). But this video sprang to mind regarding brushing the inside of the neck with moly prior to bullet seating. 1.05min.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWUw6tyzE7U

An Interesting video either way.

[in2anity]

I know it's a different lubing of necks compared to what we're referring to (Resizing lube). But this video sprang to mind regarding brushing the inside of the neck with moly prior to bullet seating. 1.05min.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWUw6tyzE7U

An Interesting video either way.

Yes, annealing is pertinent for bench-rest style shooting, no questions. After all neck tension is the name of the game. Nonetheless, 1/2 moa is way more accurate than I am (for the types of comps and applications I shoot). For the record, I do anneal my 223 comp brass, perhaps every 5 reloads.

W.R.T lubing the neck, if I FLS, after lightly waxing the shoulder, I scrape my finger across the mouth which yields the tiniest bead of lube in there. Might be a similar concept.

[TassieTiger]

Neck tension is now my biggest bugbear - I’ve seen in excess of 100fps across the exact same loads - despite - weighted projectiles, water measured cases, calibrated scales.
I try and batch neck pressures by feel but that’s far from accurate...

[in2anity]

Neck tension is now my biggest bugbear - I’ve seen in excess of 100fps across the exact same loads - despite - weighted projectiles, water measured cases, calibrated scales.
I try and batch neck pressures by feel but that’s far from accurate...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaHGwrKzQYY

[marksman]

l will usually anneal every 4-5 shots depending on case but some only when prepped
the video you put up Rwd22 is a very interesting one that proves if everything is the same every time you will have a better chance of it being the same
l do my neck lubing the same as in the vid but using graphite as l do not want any moly in my bore
my belief is that a smooth bullet release is very important, what l believe anyway

[Stix]

Neck tension is now my biggest bugbear - I’ve seen in excess of 100fps across the exact same loads - despite - weighted projectiles, water measured cases, calibrated scales.
I try and batch neck pressures by feel but that’s far from accurate...

I have exact same issues, but i dont go to the extent of weighing out bullets as i dont see how that would make the differences of 100fps over the distances i shoot...i also hadnt got to the point of volume testing.

My new 204 with new FL sized brass for first firing, & the same brass for second firing, punched out ragged holes @ 100m, & its worst groups at 200m were half inch-ish (just edging over .25 moa)...that equates to easy headshooting of bunnies at 300 yds in no wind...

So i was going to volume test all the cases after the third firing, & this is what happened...
Last time i was out, i was hitting 2 out of 3 bunny's with head shots at 300 yds, & the other shot would either completely miss high, or blow out its chest...
I know its easy to say it was me, but im confident it wasnt--you know when youve let a good shot go...& i was also getting unexplained odd misses at around 200-240...

So i decided to put some shots into a target at 200m again to check it, & it was printing 3 plus inches.. ...so i strapped on the chrono & was getting ES of 100fps... I seriously wanted to hurl this thing out in front of me & drop a grenade on it...!!

Its very deflating when that happens...very deflating...i havent shot it since, as i dont know what to do--ive used lots of consumables to get it shooting so well & load with so much anal-ism & finesse its not funny, then it goes to shyte just like that.. ...
.i cringe at starting the load testing again from scratch...thinking of flogging it to avoid further depression... ...

I suspect my press has something to do with it, but cant measure for concentricity..

Sorry...i didnt mean to turn this into the pastors confession/counselling box...

[TassieTiger]

^ I’m hearing ya Stix.
I’ve meticulously cleaned barrels, now turn off the dance music when reloading to check things twice and sometimes the ES is just painful to see on the chrono.
My Hornady press is a bit like a 40 yr old Ice addict Hooker - it’s a bit sloppy around the turret - so I have similar fears...

[bladeracer]

Neck tension is now my biggest bugbear - I’ve seen in excess of 100fps across the exact same loads - despite - weighted projectiles, water measured cases, calibrated scales.
I try and batch neck pressures by feel but that’s far from accurate...

I have exact same issues, but i dont go to the extent of weighing out bullets as i dont see how that would make the differences of 100fps over the distances i shoot...i also hadnt got to the point of volume testing.

My new 204 with new FL sized brass for first firing, & the same brass for second firing, punched out ragged holes @ 100m, & its worst groups at 200m were half inch-ish (just edging over .25 moa)...that equates to easy headshooting of bunnies at 300 yds in no wind...

So i was going to volume test all the cases after the third firing, & this is what happened...
Last time i was out, i was hitting 2 out of 3 bunny's with head shots at 300 yds, & the other shot would either completely miss high, or blow out its chest...
I know its easy to say it was me, but im confident it wasnt--you know when youve let a good shot go...& i was also getting unexplained odd misses at around 200-240...

So i decided to put some shots into a target at 200m again to check it, & it was printing 3 plus inches.. ...so i strapped on the chrono & was getting ES of 100fps... I seriously wanted to hurl this thing out in front of me & drop a grenade on it...!!

Its very deflating when that happens...very deflating...i havent shot it since, as i dont know what to do--ive used lots of consumables to get it shooting so well & load with so much anal-ism & finesse its not funny, then it goes to shyte just like that.. ...
.i cringe at starting the load testing again from scratch...thinking of flogging it to avoid further depression... ...

I suspect my press has something to do with it, but cant measure for concentricity..

Sorry...i didnt mean to turn this into the pastors confession/counselling box...

The same brass you used before, and sized the same way, with the same die?
How many rounds fired between the two tests? Has the throat eroded significantly - maybe the bullet you're using likes to follow the lands as they erode?
Same bottle of powder, same scale?
Same batch of bullets?

[in2anity]

Stix your expectations are high. I might expect that sort of consistency out of a bench-rifle, but consistent 1/4moa out of anything but an absolute boat anchor - man that's crazy tight keyword there being consistent.

[Bill]

I never felt clean brass was that important til I got one of those ultrasonic cleaners from Aldi.

Instead of manually cleaning primer pocket holes I let the cleaner do it and I end up with nice shiny brass, is accuracy any better, no idea.

I would imagine thou clean brass might grip the chamber walls slightly better so maybe a pooftenth less bolt thrust

[Stix]

Neck tension is now my biggest bugbear - I’ve seen in excess of 100fps across the exact same loads - despite - weighted projectiles, water measured cases, calibrated scales.
I try and batch neck pressures by feel but that’s far from accurate...

I have exact same issues, but i dont go to the extent of weighing out bullets as i dont see how that would make the differences of 100fps over the distances i shoot...i also hadnt got to the point of volume testing.

My new 204 with new FL sized brass for first firing, & the same brass for second firing, punched out ragged holes @ 100m, & its worst groups at 200m were half inch-ish (just edging over .25 moa)...that equates to easy headshooting of bunnies at 300 yds in no wind...

So i was going to volume test all the cases after the third firing, & this is what happened...
Last time i was out, i was hitting 2 out of 3 bunny's with head shots at 300 yds, & the other shot would either completely miss high, or blow out its chest...
I know its easy to say it was me, but im confident it wasnt--you know when youve let a good shot go...& i was also getting unexplained odd misses at around 200-240...

So i decided to put some shots into a target at 200m again to check it, & it was printing 3 plus inches.. ...so i strapped on the chrono & was getting ES of 100fps... I seriously wanted to hurl this thing out in front of me & drop a grenade on it...!!

Its very deflating when that happens...very deflating...i havent shot it since, as i dont know what to do--ive used lots of consumables to get it shooting so well & load with so much anal-ism & finesse its not funny, then it goes to shyte just like that.. ...
.i cringe at starting the load testing again from scratch...thinking of flogging it to avoid further depression... ...

I suspect my press has something to do with it, but cant measure for concentricity..

Sorry...i didnt mean to turn this into the pastors confession/counselling box...

The same brass you used before, and sized the same way, with the same die?
How many rounds fired between the two tests? Has the throat eroded significantly - maybe the bullet you're using likes to follow the lands as they erode?
Same bottle of powder, same scale?
Same batch of bullets?

Talking a new rifle Blade...couple hundred down it now...
I appreciate there being changes in accuracy, what with barrel settling down etc, but i did a barrel run in, & it really isnt a fouler--i had to remove bugger all copper during run in..

As for the other questions, everything else is the same---everything except...
First FL Size was with a wobble die so all the shoulders were similar...but they still werent the same, yet it shot really well...!!
Second & subsequent sizings have been with collet die for reasons of chasing concentricity...so there may be a difference in neck tension between first & second firings, but the results were almost identical...

There was also a slight difference in press technique for the third sizing...--using the same collet die for the last sizing--, i let the die sit closed on the neck for a few seconds, for 3 times each case (part rotating case each press stroke as recommended for collet dies) to make sure the brass would not spring back.
Previous to this ive just cranked the press handle with no hold on the up stroke (down stroke of the press handle).

I havent measured the throat---but i havent fired more than 3 shots at a time for probably any more than 25-ish/odd times in testing...i was lucky enough to see the throat in someones hawkeye before it was fired & it looked a beaut--no great dags that would appear to have made that much difference...(( ))...i dont shoot barrels when they hot so i doubt the throat has had that much wear to make a difference, not to mention the 204's like a good jump.. Heavy barrel too....action all torqued up, barrell free in stock, scope connections all tight etc etc...

I wonder if the press is not running true to the centre axis of the die...

I have another brand new press ive had sitting in a box for years--i should try that--but i
the set up time for me is an issue at the moment...

Its got to be either the scope or the press (says my intuition--maybe its denial about being in denial, but i doubt it)...the only other difference is the initial clean new brass...so maybe i should try tumbling the brass given the thread were in...

Thinking more about it, maybe fouling- -but if its going to perform like that after 25 odd rounds, i dont think i want it...i want to clean it a bit to shoot a lot, not clean it a lot to shoot it a bit...

Happy to hear anything you think you think it may be...

[brett1868]

Shiny is clean but clean isn't always shiny...Its important to get any carbon off the neck and shoulder to protect the dies but this can be as simple as a wipe with a rag right through to pin tumbling.
Neck tension....Yep, damn critical to consistency and I use a K&M Arbour press with the force measurement option along with Wilson Micrometer seating dies so I can sort rounds based on seating force. From a lot of 150 rounds where the brass was prepared identically the seating force varied from 10lbs to 90lbs with the bulk being 30lbs. Knocking a few fps off the ES is great for precision at distance but means bugger all for hunting ranges.

[bladeracer]

Neck tension is now my biggest bugbear - I’ve seen in excess of 100fps across the exact same loads - despite - weighted projectiles, water measured cases, calibrated scales.
I try and batch neck pressures by feel but that’s far from accurate...

I have exact same issues, but i dont go to the extent of weighing out bullets as i dont see how that would make the differences of 100fps over the distances i shoot...i also hadnt got to the point of volume testing.

My new 204 with new FL sized brass for first firing, & the same brass for second firing, punched out ragged holes @ 100m, & its worst groups at 200m were half inch-ish (just edging over .25 moa)...that equates to easy headshooting of bunnies at 300 yds in no wind...

So i was going to volume test all the cases after the third firing, & this is what happened...
Last time i was out, i was hitting 2 out of 3 bunny's with head shots at 300 yds, & the other shot would either completely miss high, or blow out its chest...
I know its easy to say it was me, but im confident it wasnt--you know when youve let a good shot go...& i was also getting unexplained odd misses at around 200-240...

So i decided to put some shots into a target at 200m again to check it, & it was printing 3 plus inches.. ...so i strapped on the chrono & was getting ES of 100fps... I seriously wanted to hurl this thing out in front of me & drop a grenade on it...!!

Its very deflating when that happens...very deflating...i havent shot it since, as i dont know what to do--ive used lots of consumables to get it shooting so well & load with so much anal-ism & finesse its not funny, then it goes to shyte just like that.. ...
.i cringe at starting the load testing again from scratch...thinking of flogging it to avoid further depression... ...

I suspect my press has something to do with it, but cant measure for concentricity..

Sorry...i didnt mean to turn this into the pastors confession/counselling box...

The same brass you used before, and sized the same way, with the same die?
How many rounds fired between the two tests? Has the throat eroded significantly - maybe the bullet you're using likes to follow the lands as they erode?
Same bottle of powder, same scale?
Same batch of bullets?

Talking a new rifle Blade...couple hundred down it now...
I appreciate there being changes in accuracy, what with barrel settling down etc, but i did a barrel run in, & it really isnt a fouler--i had to remove bugger all copper during run in..

As for the other questions, everything else is the same---everything except...
First FL Size was with a wobble die so all the shoulders were similar...but they still werent the same, yet it shot really well...!!
Second & subsequent sizings have been with collet die for reasons of chasing concentricity...so there may be a difference in neck tension between first & second firings, but the results were almost identical...

There was also a slight difference in press technique for the third sizing...--using the same collet die for the last sizing--, i let the die sit closed on the neck for a few seconds, for 3 times each case (part rotating case each press stroke as recommended for collet dies) to make sure the brass would not spring back.
Previous to this ive just cranked the press handle with no hold on the up stroke (down stroke of the press handle).

I havent measured the throat---but i havent fired more than 3 shots at a time for probably any more than 25-ish/odd times in testing...i was lucky enough to see the throat in someones hawkeye before it was fired & it looked a beaut--no great dags that would appear to have made that much difference...(( ))...i dont shoot barrels when they hot so i doubt the throat has had that much wear to make a difference, not to mention the 204's like a good jump.. Heavy barrel too....action all torqued up, barrell free in stock, scope connections all tight etc etc...

I wonder if the press is not running true to the centre axis of the die...

I have another brand new press ive had sitting in a box for years--i should try that--but i
the set up time for me is an issue at the moment...

Its got to be either the scope or the press (says my intuition--maybe its denial about being in denial, but i doubt it)...the only other difference is the initial clean new brass...so maybe i should try tumbling the brass given the thread were in...

Thinking more about it, maybe fouling- -but if its going to perform like that after 25 odd rounds, i dont think i want it...i want to clean it a bit to shoot a lot, not clean it a lot to shoot it a bit...

Happy to hear anything you think you think it may be...

New rifle, that might be all it is then. Throat erosion is greatest with a new barrel as the throat settles in. My .204 gained heaps of jump in the first 470rds, but hasn't increased even one-thou since. Measure your lands again.

[Madang185]

I can think of 3 valid reasons
Clean shiney brass is easier to detect when ejected in the bush.
Your brass needs to be clean if you are going to anneal.
Lastly clean brass will not induce dirt and grime into your dies or more importantly your rifles chamber.

[Stix]

Shiny is clean but clean isn't always shiny...Its important to get any carbon off the neck and shoulder to protect the dies but this can be as simple as a wipe with a rag right through to pin tumbling.
Neck tension....Yep, damn critical to consistency and I use a K&M Arbour press with the force measurement option along with Wilson Micrometer seating dies so I can sort rounds based on seating force. From a lot of 150 rounds where the brass was prepared identically the seating force varied from 10lbs to 90lbs with the bulk being 30lbs. Knocking a few fps off the ES is great for precision at distance but means bugger all for hunting ranges.

Im very interested in this Brett...

Can i ask, do you know the difference in the FPS of the rounds you mention here--or the numbers...? (such as ES & SD)....i ask as im curious to get a gauged perspective of the effects of neck tension...
So for example...the velocity or sd figures of the mean rounds seated with 30lbs...& then the same for the rounds at either end of the spectrum--10lbs & 90lbs.

And also, im curious to know, while seating with the gauge, can you feel the different seating force, & if so, how noticeable is it...?

[marksman]

l have the same setup as brett, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMgHov3jXjk
lMHO you dont need it, you should be able to feel any difference when seating your bullet but the vid l put up shows sort of how it works
l do believe neck tension and a smooth release is very important for precision shooting

recently my 22 dasher went from a ragged hole to a 1/4 inch shooter, everything was exactly the same, l do not have any problems with neck tension in this chamber having a very tight neck and the case neck walls are turned to 8 thou, when l checked the throat it had grown 20 thou longer, as soon as l had the bullet adjusted into the lands again with a bit more powder to get back to the velocity sweet spot it was back to a ragged hole

a couple of things that can make a change are: climate change and cold welding of bullets in case necks
http://forum.accurateshooter.com/thread ... s.3785592/

l have also had days when l'm not up to it and just cannot shoot as well as l have previously cause l am human sometimes