12g reloading

Reloading equipment, methods, load data, powder and projectile information.

12g reloading

Post by Putrol » 01 Aug 2020, 11:16 am

Does anyone here reload 12g
I am mostly shooting clays but also foxes rabbits cats I'm after info on what's the best primers wads & powder to use I read 209 primers have a few different sizes & can fall out there's to many options for wads & is #7 shot ok to use any feed back is good & I want to reload because I like doing things myself I've been to a couple of gun shops in Melbourne & didn't want to no me or my money
so any thoughts thanks
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Re: 12g reloading

Post by Yes » 03 Aug 2020, 2:14 pm

Not really answering your question here... but just picking up your last point.

From what I gather loading 12g isn't economical/cost effective... I say that basing my numbers off 410 reloading, where 410 is an exponentially more expensive shell to purchase factory loads.

Even the 410 shell is only borderline worth it - but if you factor in a progressive set-up you are looking at needing to reload around 7000-9000 shells to recoup your money (depending on the system). That's a lot of shooting and a lot of reloading to get your money back. Of course, you can do it by hand in a one stage set-up which helps the initial buy in, but that gets old fast for most people. Your mileage may vary depending on your work/lifestyle commitments.

If I was shooting 12g I would try and visit a store I liked, and buy the shells in a large bulk purchase (1000+ at a time). This would be the most cost effective and also they may want your cash when you are spending those dollars.
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Re: 12g reloading

Post by bladeracer » 03 Aug 2020, 3:55 pm

Putrol wrote:Does anyone here reload 12g
I am mostly shooting clays but also foxes rabbits cats I'm after info on what's the best primers wads & powder to use I read 209 primers have a few different sizes & can fall out there's to many options for wads & is #7 shot ok to use any feed back is good & I want to reload because I like doing things myself I've been to a couple of gun shops in Melbourne & didn't want to no me or my money
so any thoughts thanks


If you are only using Field Loads I would just buy them when they're on special, I grab them when they're around $100/250rds, about 40c apiece. I think you'll have to work hard to save much over that. Wads are about $20/250, primers are about 10c apiece, and shot is about $120/10kg currently. 10kg of shot will make you around 350 1oz loads - about 35c each. So about 50-55c apiece to load your own, without paying for hulls. Buying in bulk does reduce the individual price of course. 5000 primers is about $425 for example, or 8.5c apiece. I am told that you can buy reclaimed shot in Melbourne for about $6/kg so you can get the price down to the 40c mark if you don't include hulls. I haven't bought hulls before but I think they're around the $20/100 last time I asked.

When I want something else, like slugs or buckshot, I dump the 7-1/2's out of some shells and swap in a slug or buckshot.
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Re: 12g reloading

Post by bladeracer » 03 Aug 2020, 6:39 pm

I forgot the powder!
About $90/kg, which will make roughly 900rds, so about 10c per round.
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Re: 12g reloading

Post by Putrol » 03 Aug 2020, 8:31 pm

A month ago they wanted $115 a slab (250) & I've never seen 12g on sale anywhere but I do like your idea of pulling out the shot & putting in a slug I'm going to try that one & I'd shoot 500 plus on a weekend & I like to make things so it's basically the same price but the time to make them thanks
bladeracer wrote:I forgot the powder!
About $90/kg, which will make roughly 900rds, so about 10c per round.
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Re: 12g reloading

Post by bladeracer » 03 Aug 2020, 9:17 pm

Putrol wrote:A month ago they wanted $115 a slab (250) & I've never seen 12g on sale anywhere but I do like your idea of pulling out the shot & putting in a slug I'm going to try that one & I'd shoot 500 plus on a weekend & I like to make things so it's basically the same price but the time to make them thanks
bladeracer wrote:I forgot the powder!
About $90/kg, which will make roughly 900rds, so about 10c per round.


I enjoy making my own ammo also, but 500rds in a weekend would be a great reason to just buy them, that's a few hours work making 500 shells :-)

I bought myself a clay thrower as I want to do some more clay shooting, but I have a badly damaged shoulder that really can't cope with more than a handful of 12ga shots. So I'm having to delve deeper into shotshell reloading, with reduced payloads and charges, and recoil-reducing wads. Just by dropping the velocity of a one-ounce payload to 1050fps brings recoil down to 6.5mm centrefire rifle levels.
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Re: 12g reloading

Post by Mattraff » 03 Aug 2020, 11:52 pm

Years ago there was big savings to be made by making your own but with component prices so high it's not worth the effort for standard loads. If you are making certain field loads you can save money but not much. The other problem is component supply, wads are not easy to find nor is lead, primers and powder are easy enough to buy. Powder choice is ADI and that's about it but if you can find it Vectan is great powder and is smoother to shoot with less recoil. Primers are common and NSI or Fiocchi are what you will need for the ribbed cases as the Winchester primers will be to loose. Hulls are rubbish these days and you will only get 1 reload out of them but you will be able to get them by a truck load at any clay target club. The other issue will be actually finding a press although you can buy them from a place in QLD a progressive MEC press will set you back $1160.
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Re: 12g reloading

Post by Oldbloke » 04 Aug 2020, 9:21 pm

Lee loadAll 2.
Plastic fantastic. I must have loaded 1500 rounds with mine. Still going strong.

https://youtu.be/LZIbmcM2oZA

Cheap as chips
https://www.ozgunmart.com.au/lee-load-a ... ding-press
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Re: 12g reloading

Post by bladeracer » 04 Aug 2020, 9:27 pm

Mattraff wrote:Years ago there was big savings to be made by making your own but with component prices so high it's not worth the effort for standard loads. If you are making certain field loads you can save money but not much. The other problem is component supply, wads are not easy to find nor is lead, primers and powder are easy enough to buy. Powder choice is ADI and that's about it but if you can find it Vectan is great powder and is smoother to shoot with less recoil. Primers are common and NSI or Fiocchi are what you will need for the ribbed cases as the Winchester primers will be to loose. Hulls are rubbish these days and you will only get 1 reload out of them but you will be able to get them by a truck load at any clay target club. The other issue will be actually finding a press although you can buy them from a place in QLD a progressive MEC press will set you back $1160.


There is no difficulty ordering shot and wads online.
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Re: 12g reloading

Post by Oldbloke » 04 Aug 2020, 9:50 pm

Yeh, I bought a bag of wads about 6 months ago.

Ballintine shot tower in Laverton is still operating was I heard.
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Re: 12g reloading

Post by Jarhead » 05 Aug 2020, 11:14 am

Hi Putrol,



Shot size:

#9 is best for skeet. #7 1/2 is best for trap. Use #3-6 for vermin & game. Use a mix of #9 and 7 1/2 for sporting clays-9 for close in shots and 7.5 for the longer ones. If you only want to buy one type of lead, get 7 1/2- it is more universal. Try to get shot with graphite lube to avoid clumping. Hard shot containing antimony is better- it deforms less and will pattern better.

Primers....

I have found loose primers on cheaper hulls only. If you use HS AA Winchester hulls (usually red) you will not see any loose primers. You can also get 7-10 loads out of them. If you find these hulls in the hull bin at the clay range, grab'em all up!

If you are loading the cheaper hulls- you can tell these as they have ribbed plastic instead of smooth- you can get a tight primer pocket buy using a pocket press. My ancient Stirling reloading press has a pocket press (red arrow) on the de-priming punch (blue arrow) . You pull the handle down on the press until the primer pops out, then keep pulling until the pocket press contacts the primer pocket. Give it a squeeze- the primer pocket gets flatter and smaller and your primers will be tighter. Most presses have this feature but not many people know it is there or how to use it. Once you do this- it will not matter what primer you buy. They all fit. I buy Winchester 209's unless there is a significant price difference for another type.

deprime.jpg
deprime.jpg (1.96 MiB) Viewed 15 times


Powder

I would recommend APS350 powder from ADI. It burns the cleanest and faster and you need less per shot, so it is the most economical I have used. You can also use APS450, . Both can also be used for pistol loads if you do that. Load data can be found here:

http://www.adi-powders.com.au/

Wads

I usually use Winchester WAA12SL wads for 28 grams loads -these are pink . I use WAA12L - grey- for 24 gram loads for Olympic Skeet. Generally I use the wad that is called for in the load recipe listed on the ADI site. I bought a heap of pink claybuster wads a few years ago while on a US trip. They are less expensive that Winchester WAA12SL's and just as good- in fact I liked them better as the wad petals folded under the shot less when reloading.

Economy:

I can get economy out of 12G target loads, but not near as much as rifle loads.

Buckshot and slugs are economical to reload. I have been told that the other gauges, 20, 16, 28, .410 are worth reloading for economy.

The cost reduction would be for premium loads- e.g a slab of Winchester red HS AA skeet loads- 28 grams of #9 at 1250 FPS costs $130. I can reload a slab with all Winchester components for $110. Conversely, I can buy the same cheap Bronzewing skeet loads for $90 a slab.

I don't do it for economy though, I do it for fun and competitive edge. And more recently to keep me busy while in lockdown.

The competitive edge comes from being able to weigh the powder and shot for each round, and get tolerances better than .5%. You can also tailor loads- American skeet has 4 doubles in a round, and for competitions I will often load 4 lower recoil shells for the first shot of the double to help get back on target for the 2nd shot of the double.I use grey HS AA hulls for these to tell them apart. The rest are red HS AA hulls.... You can also max your shot weight for competitions- the rules state for 28 gram skeet loads they need to be 28 +/- .5 grams, so all of my comp loads have exactly 28.49 grams of lead.....and practice loads have less to make it harder......

Crimp

Most cheap hulls have 6 point crimps, Winchester HS AA hulls have 8 point crimps. You will need a crimp starting die for each type if you want to do both. My press came with an 8 point crimp starter, I bought a plastic 6 point crimp starter for a lee press and cut it down to fit.

Resizer

It is a good idea to get a resizer. If hulls are fired in a chamber slightly bigger than yours, they might not fit in your gun well. This can cause problems closing the breech, both barrels firing at the same time and some other problems. A resizer will squeeze the brass back to spec. I am using an MEC Super sizer and it has never missed a beat.

https://www.ballisticproducts.com/MEC-S ... o/1308119/

Do you have a press already? What type is it?
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