.222 Rimmed

[beerhog]

Went down to the Melbourne arms and militaria fair today and as luck would have it a rifle decided it wanted to come home with me!

I bought myself a martini chambered for the .222 rimmed cartridge. The problem is that I'm having trouble finding any load data for it.

The nick harvey manual states that you should never exceed the .222 starting loads in Martini actions but how do I work back from here for a safe starting load that does not risk SEE?

I would love to hear anyone's experience with these rifles and any tips for loading for it.

TIA,
Dwayne

[Ozziammo]

G-Day Mate,

The 222R is a uniquely Australian calibre so you will probably only find data in Australian publications.

Nick Harveys early manuals list data for 222R as does Cyril Waterworths "Reloading Simplified"

The mention of not exceeding starting loads in Martinis is pretty self explanatory, use the starting load for the given projectile weight & work down in load weight until you get an accurate load.

The extraction system on the Martini action consists of a claw either side of the case that picks up on the rim to give rearward movement to pull the case out of the chamber. If the chamber pressure is too high the cases stick to the sides of the chamber & the leverage needed to pull the case out cannot be achieved. Keeping pressures down fixes the problem.

If you get game you can try working up in 1/2 grain increments from the minimum listed load until the extraction gets too tight, but do not ever exceed the maximum listed load for a given projectile weight. You will know when you have reached your maximum load when you cannot extract or experience hard extraction. The Martini action is a relatively strong action, but the extraction system is the problem.

Good luck.

Regards Ozzi.

[yoshie]

From what I remember you use 222 dies with 357 shell holder, load data was the same as 222 however like Oz said there were issues at the higher end of the load spectrum. It was up to you to find the upper limit in your own rifle.

[beerhog]

Thanks for the info.

ATM I plan to start working up to a load starting a grain or two under the ADI starting load for the .222.

[Norton]

I plan to start working up to a load starting a grain or two under the ADI starting load for 222.

Be aware (if you're not already) that there is such a thing as too little powder.

Under pressure can lead to dangerous events just as over pressure can.

Not trying to get you a lecture on safety, but just be aware that less powder isn't always safer... Potentially the opposite.

[beerhog]

Yeah that's why I put the question up here.

The fact that the starting .222 load is the max load in Nick Harvey's book threw me a bit.

Doing a bit of extra research online though it seems the rimmed case has thicker walls and should have slightly less capacity.

Now that I think of it I might fill up a case with AR2207 and do the same with a regular .222 case and use the difference as to adjust my starting load.

If the rimmed holds 1 grain less than a .222 I will knock one grain off from the .222 starting load as an example.

The last thing I want is a hand grenade next to my face!

[Kelix]

The fact that the starting .222 load is the max load in Nick Harvey's book threw me a bit.

The ADI data and Nick Harvey manual vary quite a bit in places.

I can't remember exactly, but just as an example. I think there are some of the heavier bullet .243 loads which the Nick Harvey starting load is more than the ADI max load. Same situation as above anyway...

Some will disagree, but personally I will always follow the manufacturer data.

My 2c - I'd begin with the starting load from the ADI data and give it a thorough inspection for over and under pressure signs and make some decision from there.

[Mick375hh]

I use 20 grs of Benchmark 1 in my BSA Martini which my grandfather built for me in the 80's I've found this load to be safe and very accurate .

[Mick375hh]

I forgot to mention 40 grn VMax projectiles

[Antie]

Some will disagree, but personally I will always follow the manufacturer data.

As do I.

Dunno what some peoples problem with ADI data is TBH.

[Rocker]

People just like to "fight the power!"

[Norton]

Nick Harvey just likes the faster loads.

Reloading for the velocity junkies.

[RoginaJack]

Went down to the Melbourne arms and militaria fair today and as luck would have it a rifle decided it wanted to come home with me!

I bought myself a martini chambered for the .222 rimmed cartridge. The problem is that I'm having trouble finding any load data for it.

The nick harvey manual states that you should never exceed the .222 starting loads in Martini actions but how do I work back from here for a safe starting load that does not risk SEE?

I would love to hear anyone's experience with these rifles and any tips for loading for it.

TIA,
Dwayne

Hi Dwayne, how did you go with the 222 rimmed loads; could you put some data up, please.

Cheers

[Oldbloke]

This is out-of the ADI manual.

reduced loads .jpg (39.15 KiB) Viewed 7078 times

[RoginaJack]

Thanks OB. I've read where .222 Remington loads could be substituted for .222 Rimmed but I'm not too sure about that.

ADI doesn't list any loads or information re .222 Rimmed that I could find and that's why I was interested in how Dwayne went. Using him as a guinea pig so to speak.

My previous Martini, the extractor was the weakest link; if the loads were a bit too warm, extraction was tight.
Cheers,

[snag]

The .222 rimmed has the same case capacity as the .222 rimless but, yes, you need to use starting loads in the Martini action.

I had trouble with my .222 rimmed extracting as well. I used a starting load of 17 grains AR 2207 behind a 50 grain Vmax and got great accuracy but about 1 in 3 cases wouldn't extract (still use this load when I want to do pinpoint stuff, just carry a cleaning rod to shift the stubborn cases). I mucked around with lower loads but couldn't get the same accuracy so I ended up going for a 40 grain projectile with the 17 grains and had no extraction problems, but not quite as good accuracy. Every gun is different however, and particularly Martinis!

The Martini is an inherently strong action, but does not have a strong extraction system. A lot of problems arise from general wear and tear on the extractors stopping a firm grip on the cartridge rim. If you drop the action out and try an empty cartridge in the extractors and see how much purchase they have on the rim, you may see that erosion is your problem. You can fix this with a bit of silver solder and some careful filing, or get a gunsmith to do it - it's not a big job.

Another common problem with Martini conversion calibres is the firing pin either piercing too deep into the primer, or the firing pin hole being too big, causing the primer to crater back into the hole and stopping the action opening. Again, both easily fixed.

Not sure if I'd be worried about secondary explosion effect on a .222....... I've loaded them down to .22 Hornet ballistics with no problems. I was of the belief that it was more symptomatic of large capacity cases using slow-burning powders? I think that the last case I ever heard of was a .25/06 being loaded to sub-sonic? However that was on an American website so I don't know for sure.

Hope this helps you in some way.

[Oldbloke]

". I was of the belief that it was more symptomatic of large capacity cases using slow-burning powders? "

Correct. See above.

Not sure if 222 would be a contender for "large cartridge". . " And I think you can load a little lighter with 2206h. If in doubt just email ADI.

[Stix]

Ive tried 2206h in my 222 rimmed martini with no results...

I tried 2207 with a 55gr nos bt,--looks like around 17grains or a bit less is around the mark.
Due to the need for lighter loads i went to a 40 grain proj for more velocity & BM2...the load is around 22.5 of BM2.--no problems with extraction & only need to neck size...

The rifle is off the road for the time being to get some work done & also hopefully bed the forend, as im having too much trouble with poi shift every time i remove the forend for cleaning.

[RoginaJack]

Thanks,much appreciated....

[Stix]

Thanks for the info.

ATM I plan to start working up to a load starting a grain or two under the ADI starting load for the .222.

Hi mate...i should add that i started a comfortable 10% below min load in ADI data...
Just work up in half gr increments until you hit a group or hard extraction.

I also found in my rifle that i got better results with slower powders, & the faster powder (2207) was more touchy with extraction--ie; i hit pressure earlier (relatively speaking) in working up.

The thing i found though is dont get too worried if 'one' case only is tight in any given load set...it might be the case itself.

The thing about this round in a Martini is you will most likely encounter difficult extraction well before any dangerous pressures.

As for case capacity with .222Rimmed compared to .222, i understand its the same case, so capacity will be more dependant on the brand of the brass.
So dont use different brands or batches, & i always weight sort my brass anyway.

Its a pretty easy round to load for...
Here is a fox that crossed paths at 90 yds with my .222R...

.222 Rimmed, 40gr Zmax, 22.5gr BM2.

2017-10-30 20.34.37.jpg (528.08 KiB) Viewed 5532 times

Hope you post up some results & let us all know how you went !!

[RoginaJack]

Ah. looks dead to me.

And will do...Cheers.

[Gamerancher]

Gotta love that "high-tec" cheek piece ol' mate.

[Stix]

Gotta love that "high-tec" cheek piece ol' mate.

Yea i had to upgrade to high tech...the old masking tape would leave residue so i pulled the good high tech stuff out of the tool trailer--can leave it for weeks & leaves no residue when removed...!!!

Ive tried a few strap on aftermarket ones & they all suck...

Here's another rifle...
This method seems to work pretty well...

The 22-250 & tenterfield team...

2018-02-22 13.14.45-1.jpg (1.24 MiB) Viewed 5513 times

Let me know if your interested in one mate...& ill send you the blueprints...

[Stix]

Ah. looks dead to me.

And will do...Cheers.

Yep it was dead alrite...!

But its heart was still beating...i actually got video on my phone of blood still pumping out the gaping hole in the poor things head...amazing it was still pumping in the time i got to it & turned it over for the pic...

[RoginaJack]

What, do you have a fox farm over there?

[Stix]

Lol...i wish mate...
I think i have bad luck cos i have no one to go with that actually knows what they're doing...so i have to spot shoot n drive myself...

I was away this last weekend & should have got a clean dozen if i was on the back of a ute with a good driver & spotter that actually knows how to use a light on foxes...
Instead i got 6 shootin out of windows & over bonnets..
Also they didnt seem to like any whistle...if i blew a wistle they were gone, if i didnt blow they seemed to hang around...
Typical unpredictable foxing...!!!