Storing reloading stuff in the shed long term

[schink]

Guys,

I've got shed / man cave / soon to be reloading room if all goes to plan.

It's a concrete base, tin walls and door.

It's not particularly sealed against moisture, but it hasn't been a problem for anything else in there. There are some old cardboard boxes and stuff that have been in their for years and are still fine.

Temperature is pretty wild though. Melbourne weather through the year is anywhere from 5c to 45c and everything in between.

Does it sound like that would be a problem for powder, primers etc? Brass holding up? I wouldn't be storing tonnes of supplies but if there is some in there for say a year max?

Thoughts?

Thanks.

[yoshie]

Temp won't hurt powder and primer too much, humidity and water is more of a concern. If you're worried about temp what about storing it in a cheap esky. It will even out most of the climatic condition and keep them fairly dry if rain got in. You could even put a hasp and staple on it and lock it up.

[Noisydad]

My ammo cupboard is in the shed (and has been for the last nine years) and it gets to at least 1000 degrees (Scouts honour it does!) in there in the northern Victorian mid summer and all my ammo is fine.

[Apollo]

I'm going to dissagree with some of the comments so far.

Temperature will be detremental to powder & primers. The 5c to 45c is a huge temperature difference and both items for long term storage need a more stable climate. ADI on their own web site stipulate that powder must be stored in a cool climate, heat is one problem but big temperature swings is worse and 45c is really bad. In that environment stored even in an Esky as suggested is not going to work, it will still get hot and stay that way. The only benefit is that it will slow the swing rate down but still get hot.

Primers are sealed against contamination (moisture & oil) but again temperature swings will be detremental.

In my opinion you need to take big steps to reduce the maximum temperatures yet alone the huge temperature swing. So, how big is this shed....??? How high is the roof .... ??? Not relevant to the powder & primers but if it has a concrete floor was the floor laid with a moisture barrier underneath the concrete (plastic seal) as most outside unexperienced builders do not do this and hence the concrete will absorbe and excrete moisture, especially anything sitting on top unprotected. This at times will explode the humidity content inside. The only way to fix that afterwards is to seal the surface of the concrete with the likes of epoxy resin.

If the shed is reasonably high, like 2.4m or so then I would suggest heat treating the whole shed, walls and roof with insulation plus an internal lining and/or a false ceiling. Going overboard.... yes, but I would not store components in my shed if it wasn't correctly built. I do store powder in my shed. It has 3m high walls, 4.8m peaked and fully insulated roof, the concrete floor is fully moisture proof with a plastic barrier underneath and the surface is coated with an epoxy sealer....very easy to keep clean too. The big advantage is it's big, 7.5 x 10.5m and before I would put anything reloading wise in there I would need to finish my project by fully lining and insulating all the walls. Then it will be reasonable. It has a verandah out the north but getting one all around.

I store all my gear in my house, even times it was 40c plus outside it was never above mid 30c then in winter it's heated with a wood fire so the humidity is always very low and would never get below say 15-20c in winter, even with all the snow n ice outside. My powder storage is in the coolest part of the house but I also wished I had air conditioning, not worth it for just a few days.

Ammunition sealed in the cartridge case might be fine but heat is still going to have an effect over a long period of time, years perhaps.

If you have a small tin shed, think about a tropical roof.... ie another roof over the top with an air gap between to reduce the heat from direct sun. Store powder & primers close to the floor where it's much cooler and the concrete floor provides a more stable temperature.

My thoughts only, I've only been at this game for nearly 50 years so I'm only a beginner.

[Apollo]

From the ADI Web Site!

QUOTE...

Q: What is the recommended way to store my powder?

A: Store smokeless powders in their original containers, which have been approved for that purpose.

Keep in a cool dry place separate from solvents, flammable gases and other combustible materials.

Ensure that the storage area selected is free from any possible source of excess heat and is isolated from open flame, hot water heaters, furnaces, chimneys, flue pipes, etc.

Avoid storing smokeless powders in areas, which may be heated by the sun or where electrical, electronic or mechanical equipment is operated.

Do not allow containers of powder to contact walls of storage areas where the outside wall is exposed to sunlight or any other form of heating. Any such form of heating may result in spontaneous ignition, either immediately or at a later stage, due to accelerated chemical deterioration.

An average storage temperature below 25ºC is recommended to obtain a safe shelf life of at least ten years from the date of packing.

Increased storage temperature will reduce the safe shelf life significantly – by approximately one third for every 10ºC above 25ºC.

[Chronos]

Thanks for posting that Apollo, I've never read that on their site

Wondering if I could slip a couple of kilo's of powder into the back of the fridge without the Mrs noticing next summer LOL

Chronos

[Apollo]

Not everyone has the time I spend researching, no worries mate. Hope to see you soon.

The back of the fridge, hmm. Now I'm thinking too cool.

Might have another yarn with Ken from ADI and get some more "in house" views. I know heat is the major problem of powder breaking down but I do not know about being too cold.

[schink]

Temperature will be detremental to powder & primers. The 5c to 45c is a huge temperature difference and both items for long term storage need a more stable climate.

5-45 is through the course of the year though of course, not over days/weeks. 5 on winter mornings, 45 on summer days. Never a swing from one extreme to the other.

In my opinion you need to take big steps to reduce the maximum temperatures yet alone the huge temperature swing. So, how big is this shed....??? How high is the roof .... ??? Not relevant to the powder & primers but if it has a concrete floor was the floor laid with a moisture barrier underneath the concrete (plastic seal) as most outside unexperienced builders do not do this and hence the concrete will absorbe and excrete moisture, especially anything sitting on top unprotected. This at times will explode the humidity content inside. The only way to fix that afterwards is to seal the surface of the concrete with the likes of epoxy resin.

It's just a run of the mill shed... 3m square floor, 2.4m high roof sounds about right. I'm not a builder but the way the floor to me looks like there was a metal tray which they filled with concrete. The floor is 3" thick and sitting on earth.

Don't know if the floor is sealed with anything... All I can say is that on my casual observations it moisture doesn't seem to be a problem.

If the shed is reasonably high, like 2.4m or so then I would suggest heat treating the whole shed, walls and roof with insulation plus an internal lining and/or a false ceiling. Going overboard.... yes, but I would not store components in my shed if it wasn't correctly built.

The time/expense isn't going to be worth it for me to do all that...

Not a big deal though, if it's not suitable to store the stuff out there then that's my answer so it's all good.

I'll still be setting up the man cave in their, I'll just have to store my combustibles inside.

Thanks for all for replies, especially Apollo.

[AusC]

An average storage temperature below 25ºC is recommended to obtain a safe shelf life of at least ten years from the date of packing.

Increased storage temperature will reduce the safe shelf life significantly – by approximately one third for every 10ºC above 25ºC.

Hmm, that's an eye opener.

When summer gets in full swing in Victoria here we get 45-50c days in the worst effected areas.

If you stock up but don't shoot often I reckon a few people could be skirting the edges of those expiry dates over a couple of years.

[Apollo]

Even if it's 45-50c days I bet that is an outside temperature so should be a lot different inside.

The worse thing about a tin shed is just that, it's tin and with sun shining on it would make it worse. Might be a whole different story if it was in the shade. A wooden box say sitting on the concrete floor might also show a lot less temperature where the floor can help keep it more stable and wood would allow it to breath a little rather than sealed up in something else.

The other thing is that in winter the floor will be warmer than the air temperature in the shed.

So, if I was going to use the shed I would store components as close to the floor as possible.

[Lorgar]

Even if it's 45-50c days I bet that is an outside temperature so should be a lot different inside.

The worse thing about a tin shed is just that, it's tin and with sun shining on it would make it worse. Might be a whole different story if it was in the shade.

Yup, I'm in Melbourne and getting this same weather. I have a shed that sounds pretty similar to schink's one.

It's half in the sun, on a hot day it's easily more than 10c hotter inside the shed than outside it.

[schink]

So, if I was going to use the shed I would store components as close to the floor as possible.

Nah, I think it's just not going to be suitable in the end.

Work outside, store inside now.

[Warrigul]

Work outside, store inside now.

That sounds best, with any tin shed if you are able to ventilate it on hot days they are a lot more pleasant and feels a lot less like an oven... I actually have a couple of fans set up on a thermostat extracting hot air from the ceiling of my tin roofed besser block shed.

That way the worst temp you get is ambient.

Works a treat.

[schink]

No such luxuries on mine.

Regular old tin shed, 1 door, no windows, no extractors, nothing...

Too hot to work out there on a summer day, that's for sure.