reduced loads 444 marlin

[mickb]

Hi gents, wondered if anyone has played with reduced loads in this cartridge, or has any quoted data of that nature. Query relates to the possibility of no pistol powders being available for 44 magnum long term, and a way to make use of 44 mag projectiles if need be, at a speed that wont necessarily turn them into grenades

Top end loads of 44mag get 1900fps with 240xtp so wondered if there are reduced loads of rifle powders in 444 mag getting anywhere down there-ish (safely).

[mickb]

actually should have checked ADI data before posting, just found a couple right off

50 grains Benchmark2 and 200 grain Barnes XPB gets 2040fps in 444 marlin.
My 44 mag Rossi throws factory hornady custom 200 grain XTP at 2000fps even, so that is essentially the same power right there.

Also 51 grains AR2206H and 240grain JHP gets 1999fps.
Top end 44 mag carbine loads scrape 1900fps so that is not too far off.

[jpsauer88]

Hello
ADI has data on this using AR2205 (if you can get your hands on it) down to almost 44 mag speeds.

Cases: - Remington
Primers: - Remington 9 ½ Large Rifle
Projectiles: - 240 grain Cast Lead Semi-Wadcutter
Barrel: - .444 Marlin proof, pressures test barrel
1:38 twist
C.O.L.: - 64.61mm (2.540 inches)
SAAMI Limits: - Loading Limits 42,000-psi chamber pressure
(Piezo pressures)
TABLE 1
Propellant
Type
Charge Weight
(grains)
Velocity
(ft/s)
Chamber Press.
(psi) Piezo
AR2205 23.0 1552 11,800
AR2205 26.0 1712 16,100
AR2205 29.0 1893 23,000

[mickb]

lack of 2205 is the point in question bud

[yoshie]

What twist rate is your 444? Mine is 1:38 micro groove and really needs to be moving to stabilise. I tried 300g and they didn't. If you back off too much 240s might not stabilise.

[jpsauer88]

Sorry about that

I use ar2206h for 300g load at 1800-2080fps thats low velocity

[mickb]

What twist rate is your 444? Mine is 1:38 micro groove and really needs to be moving to stabilise. I tried 300g and they didn't. If you back off too much 240s might not stabilise.

Good point mate. I dont have 444 Ywt looking to maybe have a CVA in 44 mag reamed out as they have the tighter twist.

[straightshooter]

Mine is also the original 1:38 micro groove but a 22" barrel.
No problems with 300 grain Hornady XPT's at about 1900 to 2000 fps but only slightly milder gas checked 310 cast loads would leave a shotgun pattern.
I have been searching for an old Guns Digest or Guns Illustrated that I have somewhere for an article about the 444 being the ideal survival rifle due to it's ability to digest just about any kind of load (within reason). I even tried as suggested some triplex loads consisting of three .433 diameter lead balls one behind the other. However in the end I preferred the smash produced by a full power 240 grain load.

[mickb]

Hi Straightshooter if you find that article it would be very interesting to read it. Funnily enough the fellas over at Paco Kelly;s site, Leverguns forums are trying to get a copy themselves. I just saw a thread on it there, but the link expired years ago. If you run into that article let us know and I will pass it on.

As to 444 I have seen enough reports to know 44mag can be fired in it, without much chance of accuarcy and balloons the brass but it can be done and worst case could dispatch something at close range. 44-40 in a 444 seems to get slightly better reports- doesnt kill the brass but varying opinions on accuracy...

Shotloads could be worked up fand the brass can be used in a 410 shotgun as well ' i think'- pushing the memory cells here? shotgunning is not my area.

Also a fella at Aus hunt forum just ran higher pressure loads with bullets seated out in a long throated CVA singe shot conversion( 444 reamed from a 44mag, 60k PSI capable action) and topped 2100fps with 410 grain swaged down 425 westley richards bullets.

The math on that has it pushing 4000ftlbs with a jacketed bullet, bonafide elephant capable power. He was still a way off max loads too, I think Quickload had him well under 50KPSI.

[mickb]

Im starting to talk myself into a 444 marlin here lol. The ability to still use a stockpile of 44 bullets should pistol powders dissappear is attractive. 30-40 grains of rifle powder to get 44 mag power with a downloaded 444 is still pretty economical.

Run 300 grain barnes buster solids at 2150fps I doubt a buff could tell whether it got hit with a 444 or a 45-70 or 9.3

These saturday morning musings can be dangerous for the wallet