223 Proj's Sectioned

[Oldbloke]

Bored today and have to stay at home. So thought I would go out into the cave and have a play.

I filed 2 55gr 223 projectiles in half today. (obviously these ones are at the cheaper end of the market)

One was a Hornady 55gr. SP (currently used by me for the odd fox) Weighed 4 and all were within 0.2 of a gr of the nominal 55gn

And a pulled 55gn from a S&B round. Weighed 4 and varied from .3 gn under to .6 gr over the nominal 55gn

(Pls note there are some dents in underside of the S&B proj, this damage is due to the way I pulled the projectiles)

Both had lead harder than normal lead,,about the same hardness as my cast projectiles. ( basic scratch test )

Filing in vice

IMG_0568.JPG (1.2 MiB) Viewed 5285 times

Both cut in half

IMG_0572.JPG (451.31 KiB) Viewed 5285 times

Both with lead melted

IMG_0578.JPG (474.07 KiB) Viewed 5285 times

Initial conclusions:
1. The S&B looks to be a slightly different metal & perhaps a little thicker all round.
2. The Hornady seems to have pure copper & thinner at the nose, & I expect would open up a little quicker.
3. Neither have anything built into the design to help hold the projectile together as in more expensive projectiles.
4. S&B projectiles vary a hell of a lot in weight. This would explain my 4" groups from the Sellier & Bellot ammo in my Marlin.

[brett1868]

You should get bored more often if you do educational things like this Definitely some differences in jackets between the 2 and Hornady are looking the better for quality. I noticed on the Hornady a difference in jacket thickness between the Ogive & Meplat with the left side appearing thinner which would have a slight impact on accuracy. What sort of groups you getting from them?

[Oldbloke]

Mmmm,, I hadnt noticed the variation in the hornady jacket. Without any experimentation to speak of Im getting .7 moa out of the hornadys and I am definately an amature target shooter. Good enough for my use. Will tinker further when Im bored and the weather is kind, but currently too busy trying to find time to use them on foxes. Mainly because the fallow are calling me.

ps. I do this stuff besause there is a lot of missinformation out there and Im a curious old bastard.

[bluerob]

I tried some S&B Match branded ammo in .223 last week. Couldn't hold a group.

Tried Winchester Match ammo and I was tack driving at 130m.

The S&B brass might be ok to reload, but, their factory ammo is crap.

I've seen different loads in a box of S&B .22 pistol in use. Some went bang and others you hardly heard?

Glad that I reload. I'll never buy S&B factory ammo again.

[Oldbloke]

"I'll never buy S&B factory ammo again." Same here.

[bigfellascott]

Here's some .224 projectiles I sectioned about 4yrs ago

From L to R Sierra Blitz Varminter 40gn, Sierra BK 50gn, Nosler Solid Base 50gn, Sierra Super Roo 55gn, Nolser BT 50gn, Hornady V-Max 50gn, notice the Noslers have a real thick solid base compared to the others, the Nosler Solid Base definitely penetrated and killed better than some of the other offerings I've seen used. (they sounded like they hit harder and were a instant drop on the spot compared to the others that were being trialed at the time where run offs were a common result (not that they ran far but there was a noticeable diff in performance considering they were the same gn weight.

[Oldbloke]

Cool Scott. Dont supose you have a clearer pic. They seem to be a little out of focus.

[Oldbloke]

Cool Scott. Dont supose you have a clearer pic. They seem to be a little out of focus.

[bigfellascott]

I do have a better one somewhere but buggered if I can find it, so that's it for now (still might have the cutaways somewhere?

[deye243]

Scott i have a sneaking suspicion that the vmax is 55g

[bigfellascott]

Scott i have a sneaking suspicion that the vmax is 55g

It could be D, been a long time since I did it, just trying to remember if it was the 50 or 55? The others I'm certain of.

[deye243]

mo probs just it ain't got a BT

[bigfellascott]

mo probs just it ain't got a BT

Yeah it doesn't look like its got a Boat Tail in the pic, if I can fine em again I'll let you know but I'd say you are right (I must have bought a pk of 55's to try in the 250? I really liked the Nosler Solid Based Projies - they were great at killing stuff quickly, I guess the closest to it now is their BT range (has the same solid base) but I'm pretty sure I tried them and I still reckoned the Solid Base Lead Tipped jobbies did a better job (I guess they just penetrated that little bit better)

[deye243]

yeah i used the 50g BT for around 10 years now use the 55 varmageddon tipped and they are a better pill AFAIC they red mist small thing heaps better

but still penetrate roos at all range's and you know i like to stretch things a bit...

[bigfellascott]

Yeah I wouldn't mind giving those varmageddons a run one day, they'd be fun on fur I reckon, Those Solid based Noslers made a very distinct sound when they hit (very noticeable when compared with the Sierra BK) which was also being used at the time.

Have you tried the Sierra Super Roos? they go real well too, they kill very well indeed too, I redmisted a fox a few year back at 270m under lights using one out of the 22.250 Howso under the light, looked like a firecracker when off (massive fan shaped explosion) nailed it right in the heart/Lung area from memory - very spectacular to see indeed.

[Hercl]

I never got the difference of the Super Roos, they're just Game Kings as far as I can tell?

[Chronos]

I never got the difference of the Super Roos, they're just Game Kings as far as I can tell?

my un derstanding is they are game king seconds, could be urban myth though

Steve

[bigfellascott]

I never got the difference of the Super Roos, they're just Game Kings as far as I can tell?

Yeah mate they are the Game Kings in Bulk packs for roo shooters. They sell em in Africa too under the name of "Super Bok" got a box of them sitting the on the shelves too.

As for being seconds I'd highly doubt it, if these are seconds and shoot like this I wonder what the 1st would be like?

They are a very good all round hunting projectile that can handle pigs, foxes, rabbits, Roos - excellent value for $$$ and if they made em for the 204 I'd be using em in that too

For $110 for a box of 1000 I got no complaints!

Hardox 500 plate penetrated by the 55gn Sierra Super Roo from a 22-250 @ 80m from memory (other splash marks are from 338 Lap, 308's, 223 and 222


Howa 22-250 @ 100m shooting off a bipod and rear homemade sand bag.

[veep]

Hardox 500 plate penetrated by the 55gn Sierra Super Roo from a 22-250 @ 80m from memory (other splash marks are from 338 Lap, 308's, 223 and 222

The 22-250 really does a number on the gongs.

STS Targets had an example gong out at the Shot Shot by a bunch of different calibres including .338 and 22-250.

The .338 group just looks like the paint was missing from the target, the 22-250 shots all created little wells in the metal 1-2 mm deep.

Goes hard for a little bugger.

[bigfellascott]

Hardox 500 plate penetrated by the 55gn Sierra Super Roo from a 22-250 @ 80m from memory (other splash marks are from 338 Lap, 308's, 223 and 222

The 22-250 really does a number on the gongs.

STS Targets had an example gong out at the Shot Shot by a bunch of different calibres including .338 and 22-250.

The .338 group just looks like the paint was missing from the target, the 22-250 shots all created little wells in the metal 1-2 mm deep.

Goes hard for a little bugger.

Yeah mate they are hard on them alright, its all to do with Velocity and projectile diameter from my understanding. Even out to 300m the 250 was leaving the same depth of penetration on mild steel gongs as the 308 (slightly smaller in diameter but pretty much the same penetration so to speak).

[Seconds]

"Velocity kills.........Gongs"

[bigfellascott]

"Velocity kills.........Gongs"

It certainly can do depending on proj type/diameter/velocity etc - I was rather surprised when the 250 punched a hole through that Hardox 500

[Oldbloke]

Hardness of projectile has heaps to do with it. More copper, nickel or steel means better penetration. Shape too.

[Harper]

Steel projectiles?

[Oldbloke]

Steel projectiles?

During ww1 & perhaps ww2 they seem to have used whatever alloy they could find. But some specialised projectiles are made out of hard alloys, SS for example for greater penetration. Collectors would be know more than me.

[sarki]

They must do wonders for barrel life