Entry level Night Vision

[Stix]

Whats the page called...or got a link...?

[bigpete]

Hunting buy sell swap

[Stix]

Ok cheers...A closed group eh...cant even have a look first...too good for the non bookfacers...

Gets me why people do that & not have it on the open internet...

[bladeracer]

Ok cheers...A closed group eh...cant even have a look first...too good for the non bookfacers...

Gets me why people do that & not have it on the open internet...

They close groups because a huge number of social justice warriors spend their entire dole money on infiltrating any group even vaguely related to firearms, then berating Facebook with complaints until they shut the group down. Closing the group doesn't prevent them, but does tend to allow the group to last a little longer before it gets canned.

[Stix]

Ok cheers...A closed group eh...cant even have a look first...too good for the non bookfacers...

Gets me why people do that & not have it on the open internet...

They close groups because a huge number of social justice warriors spend their entire dole money on infiltrating any group even vaguely related to firearms, then berating Facebook with complaints until they shut the group down. Closing the group doesn't prevent them, but does tend to allow the group to last a little longer before it gets canned.

Yep...
I see no value to any of that what so ever.
I thought it would be closed for reasons that are something to do with it being "guns"...
And that makes it utterly ridiculous & all should simply boycott it...!!
I cannot for the life of me understand why people would use a platform that treats you like that...
And this is exactly why we have the issues we have (in relation to gun laws).

If it were on the open net with reasonable policing, it would not be a problem---how long do the numb-nut'd warriors last on here...???
Maybe 2 or 3 posts at best if they are so extraverted in their behavior, maybe half dozen baiting ppsts before we gang rape them if they are slowly testing the waters.

This is exactly the type of behaviour being discussed last night on the 'USA thoughts of our gun laws' thread', that demonstrate how we inadvertantly bow to being ass-pummelled.

Now...can you or pete get me a cheap night vision thing on there before you begin your boycott...

Seriously, this is a prime example of how being in it to win it, actually causes us to loose...slowly...but all the same we loose...

I dont mean to derailthis into a gun laws bitching session, but i feel this NEEDS to be said...& ill do my part & keep out.
Now back to night vision...

[bigpete]

Pard nv007 works well.out past 100m

Screenshot_20190730-201457_Gallery.jpg (232.22 KiB) Viewed 5941 times

[xDom]

I received my Thermal Monocular today. Night Tech 25.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXv2_38R8bM

For the price, I'm impressed. $1550 delivered.

I heated a coffee cup of water to 40 degrees, hopefully dropped to about 38, body temp of a bunny, by the time I got it outside. Could pick it up from about 120m away.

[xDom]

I took the Night tech out this morning to see how it faired in the field. Keeping in mind that I've had no exposure to any other thermal setups before.
From a distance of possibly 100m away I could see two small white blobs, their movements gave it away that I was looking at a pair of rabbits.
Later on I saw a larger animal disappear down the gully, I suspected it was a fox. I gave a few quick whistles and he climbed back out to see what was happening. Once again it's movements let me know it was a fox. By the time I put the thermal down and grabbed the rifle, he got wind of me and quickly pissed off.
This local area I go to is very frequently used by other shooters so anything there is notoriously flighty. I think that with the use of torches alone, I wouldn't have even known the critters were there.

I'm not going to say that this unit is in the league of any of the thermal scopes that have been mentioned before in this thread. I did a lot of research before making this purchase and I was reasonably confident of what I was getting.

I'd also say that this particular model could be described as being the entry level model in the "usable" range of thermal viewers, meaning any models with less performance than this wouldn't be of much use. On the whole, I'm happy with this purchase. I'm confident it's going to take a lot of the frustration and guess work out of my previous trips, stumbling along with my torches.
Combined with the Infra red attachment, I'm geared up for my next trip out the farm in September.

[Blr243]

It’s good u have lots of time to practice before the September hunt. All the settings and buttons take time to get familiar with and that practice can save u heaps in the field. Good luck

[marksman]

Screenshot_20190730-201457_Gallery.jpg

they say a picture is worth a thousand words Pete but how about a report mate
can you say that it compares to the utube vids ect...

[xDom]

Screenshot_20190730-201457_Gallery.jpg

they say a picture is worth a thousand words Pete but how about a report mate
can you say that it compares to the utube vids ect...

I’m gonna say yes.

[marksman]

cheers xDom

[bigpete]

Yeah,it's a bloody good thing hey. Although I've learnt the hard way not to put the flat top batteries in the charger the wrong way.....
Can be a little finicky to get everything spot on and focussed properly when it's on the scope sometimes,but when it's sorted,you can see quite a distance. I've shot a fair heap of rabbits with it in a short time,and it's absolutely fine well past 100m with the on board IR torch.

[xDom]

and it's absolutely fine well past 100m with the on board IR torch.

I've been leaving the IR add on torch at home lately, its just extra weight. I've learnt to click the onboard IR off and the leave the unit in standby until I'm preparing for a shot, saves heaps on the battery.

I spot a white blob with my thermal monocular and then ID and hopefully crack a shot off at it with the PARD. Great set up.

[marksman]

I know what I want for xmas

[xDom]

I know what I want for xmas

Hey MM, it's said that a parallax adjustment scope is needed for the Pard. I personally didn't find much difference with it.
If you don't have a PA, I'd try it with your current setup before buying anything else.
Just a tip.

[bigpete]

I don't know about that,I found an absolute s**t load of difference myself....

[xDom]

Actually, I’m gonna retract my comment on not needing a parallax adjustment.
Went out early this morning, my fixed parallax 3-9 was blurry, no good at all.

[SCJ429]

I have seen a mates ATN and if that is any indication of what they can produce then avoid them like the plague. What a piece of junk.

[Harrynsw]

I’m thinking about spending some coin on a night vision Monocular.
I’ve been doing some reading and I’ve been looking at some Yukon/Pulsar units for about $650.
What sort of quality would you expect for that?
I did some reading on earlier threads where posters were asking about NV scopes. The responses were along the lines of , if you’re not gonna spend megabucks then it’s only gonna be gimicky gear that’s of little use.
Is this the same with monoculars?
Note, I am stearing clear on the Aldi/EBay $150 specials!

Just picked up a bushnell equinox z monocular for $400. Awesome.

[niteowl]

I realize this is a really old thread, but don't get caught with entry level gear.
We run "workshops" for teaching people and Govt departments about the various types of "night vision" and the after a PP and discussion session we then show people the actual equipment.

Starting with basic stuff that is really only toys, which impresses people who have never used anything before. The comments are "Fantastic, this is great I can see things".

Then go to Gen 3 Mil spec, which blows them away. (Gen 2 is not worth the extra cost for the small increase in performance).

Great you think, then go to commercial grade thermal. The stunned comments can't really be printed here, it is FAR ahead of Mil Gen 3.
From there we go to Military thermal. I DO realize that Military thermal is way out of reach for more than a fortunate few, but it shows what can be achieved.

A few things need to be clarified here, one, digital has problems as it needs a truck load of IR to make it workable at more than a hundred meters especially when there is no moonlight, BUT nocturnal animals CAN see IR, even 940 nm covert IR. As well as the red light that is very visible to all, especially when the power level gets up with lower frequency IR illuminators. After a while animals get wary just like when you are using a spotlight, it works for a while. Gen 3 Image intensifying is better but still needs light of some kind, IR or visible AND a high contrast target even though the resolution is good.
There is also a lot of confusion, some people refer to IR night vision. IR night vision is thermal only, as it detects IR ONLY. You have all heard of FLIR, Forward Looking Infrared!
Image intensifying and digital will see various wave lengths of IR and visible light.

When we have concluded a workshop, the opinion is that people do not want entry level any more, and prefer to save and not waste precious money on poor equipment that seemed so good because they did not know what was available.

My apologies to all I have offended, but I / we have been through ALL the versions and types over time and believe I can give an unbiased view on them all.
As a contractor for over about 55 years, and "NV" user for 14, now use nothing but thermal, except at specific times, due to a special situation where I need to see through glass, I will use a Gen 3 monocular for observation only.

[bladeracer]

I realize this is a really old thread, but don't get caught with entry level gear.
We run "workshops" for teaching people and Govt departments about the various types of "night vision" and the after a PP and discussion session we then show people the actual equipment.

Starting with basic stuff that is really only toys, which impresses people who have never used anything before. The comments are "Fantastic, this is great I can see things".

Then go to Gen 3 Mil spec, which blows them away. (Gen 2 is not worth the extra cost for the small increase in performance).

Great you think, then go to commercial grade thermal. The stunned comments can't really be printed here, it is FAR ahead of Mil Gen 3.
From there we go to Military thermal. I DO realize that Military thermal is way out of reach for more than a fortunate few, but it shows what can be achieved.

A few things need to be clarified here, one, digital has problems as it needs a truck load of IR to make it workable at more than a hundred meters especially when there is no moonlight, BUT nocturnal animals CAN see IR, even 940 nm covert IR. As well as the red light that is very visible to all, especially when the power level gets up with lower frequency IR illuminators. After a while animals get wary just like when you are using a spotlight, it works for a while. Gen 3 Image intensifying is better but still needs light of some kind, IR or visible AND a high contrast target even though the resolution is good.
There is also a lot of confusion, some people refer to IR night vision. IR night vision is thermal only, as it detects IR ONLY. You have all heard of FLIR, Forward Looking Infrared!
Image intensifying and digital will see various wave lengths of IR and visible light.

When we have concluded a workshop, the opinion is that people do not want entry level any more, and prefer to save and not waste precious money on poor equipment that seemed so good because they did not know what was available.

My apologies to all I have offended, but I / we have been through ALL the versions and types over time and believe I can give an unbiased view on them all.
As a contractor for over about 55 years, and "NV" user for 14, now use nothing but thermal, except at specific times, due to a special situation where I need to see through glass, I will use a Gen 3 monocular for observation only.

Depends on your purpose, you don't need to spend $10K+ on a thermal scope if you're just shooting rats around the sheds, or the occasional fox coming around the house.

[niteowl]

No you don't need to for just that, but most people don't want stay there once they have a taste of it. And no you don't need to go to 10K as you say but 2K will get you a toy.
It need to be pointed out that sooo many people get sucked in because they have not had a chance to see anything else and feel that first impression of actually seeing in the dark for the first time is stunning.
Sorry if you do not like newcomers to the forum that may know something??

[bladeracer]

No you don't need to for just that, but most people don't want stay there once they have a taste of it. And no you don't need to go to 10K as you say but 2K will get you a toy.
It need to be pointed out that sooo many people get sucked in because they have not had a chance to see anything else and feel that first impression of actually seeing in the dark for the first time is stunning.
Sorry if you do not like newcomers to the forum that may know something??

I agree with the quality of the higher-end gear, but few shooters have any need for that stuff.
I don't understand your last comment, did I say something that upset you?
I don't mind anybody coming in and offering people advice, that's what forums are for.

[niteowl]

The first line of my last post should explain what I am saying

[TassieTiger]

The first line of my last post should explain what I am saying

After viewing a small range of thermals (upwards of $7k) and Several night vision monoculars and dedicated night scopes that ranged up to $3k, I settled on a $800 pard...I could afford the better equipment but I couldn’t justify the extra expense so - everything You’ve said is not only subjective but also based individual circumstance.

[wanneroo]

The first line of my last post should explain what I am saying

After viewing a small range of thermals (upwards of $7k) and Several night vision monoculars and dedicated night scopes that ranged up to $3k, I settled on a $800 pard...I could afford the better equipment but I couldn’t justify the extra expense so - everything You’ve said is not only subjective but also based individual circumstance.

Agreed, it all depends on a number of factors and your uses. I personally prefer Gen 3+ white phosphor lenses in a PVS 14 and that's what I plan on purchasing. Wouldn't mind PVS-31s that I have used with the military but the price on that is too much. I have used some that you could switch between thermal and NV but now they have ones that can blend the image and I would like to try those. Yeah if the PARD works for folks and it gets it done, good. A lot of the cheaper digital stuff will work for the civilian world. For the government types, digital is a battery hog and is still a big bulky, so that's why the military still uses a lot of analog optics.

[mchughcb]

I realize this is a really old thread, but don't get caught with entry level gear.
We run "workshops" for teaching people and Govt departments about the various types of "night vision" and the after a PP and discussion session we then show people the actual equipment.

Starting with basic stuff that is really only toys, which impresses people who have never used anything before. The comments are "Fantastic, this is great I can see things".

Then go to Gen 3 Mil spec, which blows them away. (Gen 2 is not worth the extra cost for the small increase in performance).

Great you think, then go to commercial grade thermal. The stunned comments can't really be printed here, it is FAR ahead of Mil Gen 3.
From there we go to Military thermal. I DO realize that Military thermal is way out of reach for more than a fortunate few, but it shows what can be achieved.

A few things need to be clarified here, one, digital has problems as it needs a truck load of IR to make it workable at more than a hundred meters especially when there is no moonlight, BUT nocturnal animals CAN see IR, even 940 nm covert IR. As well as the red light that is very visible to all, especially when the power level gets up with lower frequency IR illuminators. After a while animals get wary just like when you are using a spotlight, it works for a while. Gen 3 Image intensifying is better but still needs light of some kind, IR or visible AND a high contrast target even though the resolution is good.
There is also a lot of confusion, some people refer to IR night vision. IR night vision is thermal only, as it detects IR ONLY. You have all heard of FLIR, Forward Looking Infrared!
Image intensifying and digital will see various wave lengths of IR and visible light.

When we have concluded a workshop, the opinion is that people do not want entry level any more, and prefer to save and not waste precious money on poor equipment that seemed so good because they did not know what was available.

My apologies to all I have offended, but I / we have been through ALL the versions and types over time and believe I can give an unbiased view on them all.
As a contractor for over about 55 years, and "NV" user for 14, now use nothing but thermal, except at specific times, due to a special situation where I need to see through glass, I will use a Gen 3 monocular for observation only.

I love get the intel from people in the know. The pros you know. What nocturnal animals can see 940nm IR?

[Tilb004]

I’ve seen a second hand FLIR thermal on EBay. How do you go about using it on the field?
Bladeracer in his post before mentioned the issue of looking at a bright screen then your eyes adjusting back when you look away from the device.
I’ve read other reports in the internet, people saying the same thing.
I guess ideally you need thermal monocular and a thermal scope! $$!

Hi xDom

I have a nighttech hd 25 thermal monocular and it works great for a base model . Have seen foxes running across a field at over 250m .
I paid $1600 but i think they are more like $2000 now days .Not sure how it compares to the flir ive never had a look through one .
As far as NV goes the pard 007 is probably the best value even know i got rid of mine cos the poi was too great from day to night .
Ill explain , i would zero my day scope then attach the 007 and it would be an inch difference at 50 meters .
In saying that people have had a lot of success with them .
I was using it on a night force shv scope , picture was great but poi was shocking .
The other scope i mounted it on was a stryka 4-14 x 44 and it is spot on so its the scope that it goes on .

For the money the pard 007 is the cheapest good NV in my opinion and for what you want to do its perfect ..
If you want some footage of the pard 007 private message me and ill do what i can to get it to you .
I would send you vid of the night tech thermal monocular but it doesnt record .
For the record i have a pard 008 LRF now and its great.

Just my honest opinion , lot more experienced people than me on this forum , your bound to get pointed in the right direction .

all the best mate .

[niteowl]

All nocturnal animals.
They have evolved over 100s / 1000s of years as the night "light" consists of a large percentage of natural IR in many wave lengths.
This means those that naturally use the night, not ones that have become "nocturnal" because of hunting pressure. Although they cannot be completely ruled out either.
OK you say, "they will not react to IR then". That natural IR that is an "overall light" is not the same as shining an IR illuminator at them.
When you go digital and therefore need IR to make them workable to a degree, what will happen is those animals will see it when it is used like a spotlight.
For a while it will be similar to the old days when we used a spotlight, you get a lot until they get wary of the light. IR usually takes a bit longer as it is not running the same power levels and therefore intensity as a spotlight.
After they get to that point most people feel that they have "got rid of the problem". Go to thermal and you will see the ones you assumed did not exist.

One way of getting some info on this, is to get a genuine covert camera (some poorer ones still emit a low visible glow) that is genuinely silent and put it high in a tree looking down at a bait. Set it to take multiple shots or video.
A fox for instance, will approach the bait looking down at it in the first image and then all the others looking straight up at the camera. Otherwise get hold of a genuine 940 covert illuminator and watch them react as you sweep it across them. Most so called 940 nm covert illuminators still emit a small amount of visible red light.
I do admit that I do not know how low (lower frequency, longer wave length) they can see, I do know 940 nm is visible to them.

PS. Just rereading my post I should have said "Higher frequency" not lower, when referring to the visible red light from the high power IR illuminators. ie Shorter wave length, 805 - 850 nm.