Best value night vision scope deals

[olly_2001]

Enjoying the chat folks
Another factor worth mentioning perhaps is the falling Aussie dollar. All this tech is generally from the USA. It could all be going up 10% at this rate. I’m heading there ina couple of months and fancied bringing me back a Gen 3 ..... er no .. import license required which is sad as it’s about 1/3 of the price.

[olly_2001]

[quote="Blr243"]Scope is an xp50 pulsar. I think it has the same specs as the binos

This scope has great reviews , can you please give me your thoughts? Am close to getting one

[bigpete]

Took the pard nv007 out again last night for another 7 bunnies. Excellent attachment

[ramshackle]

On my wishlist right now
Pard NV007 ($550)
OR
Pard NV008 ($850-$950)

Thermal Tracking scope (Leupold Tracker or Quest $1500 - $1950)

[Blr243]

Olly . My thoughts are make sure u spend up big no matter how much it hurts ..... because taking a cheapie in the paddock won’t work

[Blr243]

Xdom. I got a bit confused when I had to choose between an xp50 scope and the xp 38 version. ( if I remember correctly the former was a couple of grand dearer ) So I just asked the salesman “ if your boss was going to give u one for a present which one would u want ? “ immediately he said the xp 50 so that’s what I bought ....next week when I’m back in the paddocks I will post some thermal pics of pig mobs

[xDom]

BLR, how do you find your thermal binoculars in the day and the warmer weather.?

On my last trip, I was scanning for rabbits on a rocky hill in the afternoon. The sun had been hitting the rocks all day and there was a lot of warmth in them. In these conditions the thermal was near on useless.
In other conditions it’s simply outstanding, just not in the situation before.
Is this a characteristic of thermals in general or is it a limitation of my entry level model?

[Blr243]

I remember one arvo in real rocky country ( Carnarvon gorge type thingy ) in warmer weather. After the sun had set I could see about a million white rocks so it would have been near impossible to see a pig unless it was moving and big. Then someone from this site recommended I look into the settings / modes. I think mine has a rocks mode so that helps a lot .....if I’m correct , in normal mode it reads heat from the lowest to the highest and the highest is usually a red blooded active animal. in rocks mode the unit tends to display only the heat sources that are way above and beyond most of the surrounding lifeless heat sources , so that’s when it helps to identify a pig amongst a million warm rocks ,,,,,,, something like that , I’m pretty big on practising and adjusting my gear all the time on things I don’t shoot like Roos in actual hunting situations. Eg contrast and brightness settings....inside 200 metres a pig is a pig and a roo is a roo but at 1500 metres I don’t want to do a big walk when I’m tired only to find out that heat source was a roo.....so after many months I’m still constantly learning how to use this new gear and attempting to get the best out of it eg due to good insulating fur Roos in winter at night look off white but a pig in winter covered with sparse hairs looks glowing white because u really can see it’s heat well. These things I notice beyond 1000 metres but between 500 and 1000 metres I’m looking for thin vertical shapes as Roos And horizontal rectangular blobs I think will probably be pigs. There different behaviour / movements I study very closely too. It helps me determine if I need to do that long walk across the paddock. The numbers eg 1 4 A dozen , thirty animals It all tells me stuff ,,,,Roos and pigs all behave diffently depending on how many are in their group at the time. After a while I see, nervousness, relaxation, hesitation, erratic behaviour too. I’m always on foot i the middle of the paddock in the dark but there are people shooting these paddocks that just spotlight from the perimeter. Because the paddocks are so big some of the pigs have worked out that the parts of the paddocks that are most dangerous are the edges. They feel safe in the middle because they are nearly 2 k from the spotlighters They also see lots of dead pigs around the edges within rifle range of the perimeter......I know this because sometimes I see big old boars as they enter the paddock after dark they are running flat out till they hit the middle of the paddock then they slow down , relax and start feeding. Then I go get them. Seven more days before I get back out there. I’m counting down ,

[Stix]

BLR, how do you find your thermal binoculars in the day and the warmer weather.?

On my last trip, I was scanning for rabbits on a rocky hill in the afternoon. The sun had been hitting the rocks all day and there was a lot of warmth in them. In these conditions the thermal was near on useless.
In other conditions it’s simply outstanding, just not in the situation before.
Is this a characteristic of thermals in general or is it a limitation of my entry level model?

Gees xDom...
Seeing this thread rise to the top again, i had to look & see if our mate had returned for another bout of telling you how good your Pard is at sending you blind...

I was reaching into my pockets ready to shell out for gold seats, but it seems i get to put that cash towards something else...

[bigpete]

Lol, you and me both Stix

[xDom]

Thanks BLR. I don't have any modes that can be changed with varying conditions but there is a "gain" setting. I think this is typical in electronics, its an amplification of the signal. Im gonna try stuffing around with that.

I don't know if you guys have seen the UK Night Vision forum.? A sleepy little forum where I doubt the mods had ever had to step in at all... Until Ram cam along! Ha! didn't make too many friends over there!

[Blr243]

I don’t read much into the forum arguments , I just work , hunt , play guitar and piano and take Deisel to the dog park .....I would like to have a good thermal drone within 6 months

[xDom]

I don’t read much into the forum arguments , I just work , hunt , play guitar and piano and take Deisel to the dog park .....I would like to have a good thermal drone within 6 months

What sort of piano do you play?

[Blr243]

I have an old beat up European walnut thing that weighs about fifteen tons but it’s out of tune now for a long time and is more of a piece of furniture now .....so I just use a cheap electric keyboard. Ballads , mucking around for myself , terrible technique , no lessons , I just play because I get real good floods of dopamine , I’ll never need drugs because I can get so high naturally just with musical notes , and it’s free !

[Elite_Sniper]

I know you just mentioned thermal but do you already have any night vision gear?

If not, I would highly recommend you get a combination of gear instead of one piece that takes your full budget.

For $8k you could get a decent setup that’s more well rounded for the full hunting trip, not just the shooting. Something like a pvs14 for navigation ($3k), a handheld thermal for spotting ($2k) and a rifle mounted thermal for shooting ($3k).

And with a combination of tools like that you get a lot more options on how to hunt particular games and conditions.

[markdonald]

My impression is that the cheapest way of getting into thermal is to combine a thermal monocular (such as the $1000 Flir or $1200 Leupold below), which is much cheaper than a thermal rifle scope, and a Gen 2 or Gen 3 IR scope. Correct me if I am wrong.



Note: bear in mind I am a max. 150 metres rimfire shooter.

Also, is there such a thing as an entry level thermal scope? I'm seeing a lot of scopes that do everything for you except pull the trigger. I don't want to take pictures or movies, have a GPS reading, a wifi, a rangefinder, a picture-in-picture, etc.

Hello.I am looking to acquire a good but not bank smashing scope for night work in the not to distant future. Or is there an add on available that is workable I guess is the other logical question ? I’ve heard some suggest thermal over night vision but I have very little experience with either (in scope form). In an ideal world it would be something I could potentially swap across rifles as I’m looking to do my fac and get some higher powered units to play with down the line. Currently using a bsa r10se carbine. Any suggestions ? Pro’s / con’s etc etc ? Any features to particularly look for? I understand some have built in range finders ? If so that would be a great thing to have imo.. Thanks in advance,

[Shannon]

I've been looking at the Pard DS35. Its a day/night (NV) scope. has laser rangefinder and a ballistic calculator. from memory you can save 4 different bullets, so in theory you could swap it between 4 different rifles as long as you always use the same bullet in each rifle. or 1 rifle, 4 different bullets. after you rangefind, it will show you where to aim based off the bullet you are using. it will record to SD card, even has setting for auto record when it feels recoil it record a few seconds before and after the shot. looks good for around $1800-$1900. from what I understand (limited) thermal is AWESOME for finding target, night vision is better for identifying target. maybe a cheap thermal monocular for finding and NV for shooting.
Oh, the Pard also has the screen as a circle so its more like a traditional scope rather than looking at a square/rectangle screen.

hope this helps

[Larry]

Snakes are another problem walking in the dark. Die to the lack of colour in my thermal scope a fox at a distance is close to the same shape as a kelpie I deal with that by ensuring working dogs are kept strictly close to home base and I only shoot a hell of a long way from home base

Yep...
Every farm i shoot on i ask the farmer--"what about dogs...?..."

I dont shoot on land where dogs arent either locked up, or around the house...

I dont want to shoot anyones dog, but all farmers want me to shoot foxes if i see them around the house &/or yard...

We come to an agreement that i take all care & no responsibility, but i always back out of it...during summer through to Easter earlier in the year ive come accross 3 fox looking creatures close or close-ish to houses & backed out of the shot every time only to have the farmer tell me next day that it had to be a fox as they locked dogs up just in case...ah well...

I rather take the thought "ill get him next time" than have what id imagine to be god awful feeling of having to pick up the farmers dog...

Better to be safe than sorry & always have that discussion.

Thats a good policy Stix even though farmers can be very detached and pragmatic towards their animals. Dogs are different they are part of the family and loosing one can be devastating. I would just about bet my life that someone else has taken their own life because of the loss of a dog. They really cant be replaced. But there is always tomorrow. /next time when you can be sure.

[Larry]

To the OP if you are willing to take a chance once you pick a model have a look on Aliexpress for one that looks identical to the one you chose or a higher spec unit they are so much cheaper there I have always had good experiences dont think I have had anything that has been such poor quality that I have regretted spending the money even if I latter purchased a better unit. The first one was always worth getting its a step on the journey worth taking.

[niteowl]

Interesting subject. I / we use nothing but GSCI thermal scopes and binos as well as monoculars. Yes, they are a bit expensive but they are genuine professional products.
Due to the fact that we are doing contract work for the Govt. we need to have reliable gear that really works, not some Chinese consumer product.
It is easy to ID a fox at over 400 m compared to a dog. OK at that end of the range you can see the difference in the way it moves. Back at 300 no question, fox.
Even with a 3 X scope you can see cows at 2000 m across a valley, and tell they are cows not horses.

PS DO NOT RELY ON QUOTED SPECS. In a LARGE number of brands they are complete and utter BS.

[Billo]

niteowl do you know who's lenses and sensors GSCI use ? I also noticed they don't share much of the sensors specs, whats that about ?

Some of the lens sizes are huge, would certainly help with ID'ing critters

[niteowl]

niteowl do you know who's lenses and sensors GSCI use ? I also noticed they don't share much of the sensors specs, whats that about ?

Some of the lens sizes are huge, would certainly help with ID'ing critters

BE AWARE THIS WILL BE LONG AND BORING

A huge lens is not completely necessary for good ID.

A couple of things here, lenses and sensors are European as GSCI has Govt regulations governing as to where their parts may come from. ( Not Chinese )
Now you mention not much info, have you looked at the "Australian" site? GSCI do not put a lot of detail on their site as they want their distributors to pass on the info and brochures. These have a lot of detail in them.

Re the big lenses, the focal length governs the magnification, whereas the f Number governs the lens speed and overall system sensitivity.
With the older TWS series the lenses were all f1.0 up to 100 mm focal length then f1.1. this means that a TWS 675 has a 75 mm long and 75 mm diameter lens. Yes they are bulky devices, the 6100 has obviously a 100 mm long lens and 90.9 mm diameter. Very big.
But now things need to be considered here, the 75 has 3 X magnification regardless of lens speed the ID is very good. Lens speed will make virtually no noticeable difference to the user (If any at all). Lens diameter (f No) does NOT alter the Field of View, only the focal length / magnification changes that.

Now the Ti series and the new TWS series use an f1.3 lens that is a good compromise of sensitivity and physical size. (Except the 50 mm model with an f1.0 lens). A problem with the faster lens is cost, as the lens is a MAJOR cost of the device and speed (f No) does not provide any noticeable benefit within reason, don't expect an f4.0 to be unnoticeable. Another point is that a faster lens becomes more susceptible to recoil !! GSCI will withstand up to 50 Cal. and machine guns.

When you get to say 12 micron sensors, be wary as they are physically smaller even with the same number of pixels and therefore will provide a magnification increase of 1.4 X with any lens length, and the image viewed will be exactly the same as on at the same magnification with the next longer lens at a higher price. When you have large 12 micron sensors that are the same physical size as an equivalent 17 micron one, the magnification will be the same, but at a substantially higher price. They do have the magnification benefit with the shorter and therefore cheaper length lens though.

Now this is where the "advertised" sensitivity of dodgy manufacturers mislead the user with ridiculous figures ! All tests should be carried out on a heated target of 30 degrees C with an f1.0 lens. This is because you are looking at the temp. difference between the target and the sensor. So, if you use a target of 40, 50 or even 60 degrees you get a lower and "better" figure with the same sensor.
This is where cryogenically cooled sensors come up with such low figures.
Some just give figure as they know it will impress the punters and they also know the punter will not see the difference anyway and have no way of actually testing it.
There is so many variables in the atmosphere that alter the users results. Even on the same night when looking in various directions, especially in hilly country that has "dry" areas and "wet' areas with differing humidity where ever you turn.

Now there are things like gain control if fitted in the device. This will enhance the image to a degree until you get to an image that will give you a headache from the stark image and no actual improvement. At the same time you enhance the all atmospheric crap in the air.
Brightness is often used to try to make the image look like day time but does not help with detection or image quality. Lower brightness settings are more beneficial.

At the end of all this, if anyone is still reading (Oh get a life) I / we almost exclusively use 75 mm 640 x 480 17 micron devices and can ID cattle at 2000 metres from horses at 3 X magnification.
I have a 100 mm 640x 480 17 micron Ti that I used a couple of times to show people, but have never used it on a firearm.

[Billo]

Thanks for taking the time explaining, and yes I didn't check the Aussie sight first, will do that now.

I do get what you saying about IDing animals at a great distances, a property I've been hunting is wombat city and its easy to look at something 4-500m away and struggle to see if it has a snout.

[wanneroo]

There are a lot of advances being made in night optic technology.

The US military is moving to blended analog/thermal scopes and optics.

Holosun apparently is coming out with an "affordable" thermal and analog scope here soon.

I think you will see some changes and upgrades in technology coming down the pike.

A lot of potential with digital night vision but it's a battery hog and that is the big issue with it.

[mchughcb]

There are a lot of advances being made in night optic technology.

The US military is moving to blended analog/thermal scopes and optics.

Holosun apparently is coming out with an "affordable" thermal and analog scope here soon.

I think you will see some changes and upgrades in technology coming down the pike.

A lot of potential with digital night vision but it's a battery hog and that is the big issue with it.

The pard will last hours on a 18650 battery. Longer if you only turn on WiFi and IR and use the screen saver. When it goes flat you can swap new batteries in a minute and good to go. It's not a big issue unless you want everything powered all the time and battery is captive.

[NTSOG]

G'day,

Here's another day/night sight, made in China I believe, that's become popular in the UK:

https://arkenoptics.uk/products/arken-z ... or-zhd520r

It was originally called HITTAC, but Arken bought the company.

There's also a model without rangefinder and ballistic calculator that costs the equivalent of about $A870.

Jim

[niteowl]

Detection range 400 m sounds about right foe the specs listed and the price supports this.
A good scope we are talking 2500 m detection range.