Which Bushnell scope do you recommend exactly?

[Member-Deleted]

I will let you make the recommendations regarding Bushnells. You are better qualified than me in that regard.

If he had a $1,000 budget and wanted a competition oriented scope like you asked for, then a NF would have been in the running. While I have many flaws, the inability to describe what I am looking for and to be able to take good advice, is not one of them.

...But he doesn't have $1000
...And he doesn't want a competition oriented scope like I (or he) asked for


...And still you persist


It's not about who knows more mate. You obviously have been around for a long tooth and have done it all.
I know little. I have my first rifle in the safe, still unfired. I have just gone through all this. I did my research.

It's about reading the OPs question and trying to answer him, not post stupid examples of what he doesn't need or is looking for....

Just as you did when I was looking for scopes.


Keep up the good work

[Member-Deleted]

Is a Bushnells AR series any better than this scope?

http://www.visionking.com.cn/en/product ... 18&c_pid=1

Maybe yes, maybe no. Depends on the specifics

Bushnell warranty was a big winner for me too. Don't like the chances of much warranty when buying through eBay though

[SCJ429]

He did not say he had a $1,000 budget, you said that. You also wanted good glass and 24 or so magnification, and that it was to be used for paper only. I responded that a second hand Nightforce was an excellent option. How was this inappropriate?

You ended up with a Bushnells AR, your choice and your money. It is a scope that retailed for under $200 and is probably made in the same city if not the same factory in China as the Visionking. It is very difficult to judge the quality of scopes made in China without trying one out, they may have improved out of sight lately.

Would I buy a Nikko Sterling for $500? No, I would put the money towards a quality optic like a Nightforce BR Series. Is this what you would do? I am betting that it is not.

[Member-Deleted]

He did not say he had a $1,000 budget, you said that. You also wanted good glass and 24 or so magnification, and that it was to be used for paper only. I responded that a second hand Nightforce was an excellent option. How was this inappropriate?

You ended up with a Bushnells AR, your choice and your money. It is a scope that retailed for under $200 and is probably made in the same city if not the same factory in China as the Visionking. It is very difficult to judge the quality of scopes made in China without trying one out, they may have improved out of sight lately.

Would I buy a Nikko Sterling for $500? No, I would put the money towards a quality optic like a Nightforce BR Series. Is this what you would do? I am betting that it is not.

Why are you responding to my wants in someone else's thread?? You tripper
You were wrong in your responses there too champ. Nothing you posted came of any good to me. You were in your own little world of scopes that nobody gave a rat's butt about... And here we are again.

I said it might be a good scope.... But I doubt it will be better than an AR.... And it has no known warranty..
Bushnell has an excellent warranty and the Nikko looks pretty good too. There are also plenty of reviews and info on both on the web's... Bugga all for the Visioning. Do you own one? Have you tried one? Are you even from this planet

That's why I bought the AR. It's cheap.
So I can save my money for an excellent scope... Not a Nightforce BR series because I don't want a bench rest scope as I've said multiple times..... And here we are again

[Am88]

In another thread I seen you said you hunt with a nightforce benchrest scope, and on another gun have a vx3, pretty easy to understand. No need to attack him because I can follow it, so do you want or do you not want expensive scopes? work it out so you can finish clogging up someone elses thread.

Cheers

[SCJ429]

I know you bought the scope because it was cheap, why else would you?

Your petty insults say plenty about you. If you don't agree with my comments why waste time reading them let alone responding to them. You are wasting valuable time that you could be researching cheap Chinese scopes.

[Am88]

You are wasting valuable time that you could be researching cheap Chinese scopes.

[bladeracer]

I could only recommend what I've used myself, which also means they suit my specific wants in a scope. I haven't put much time into scopes I have no interest in owning, like capped turrets or adjustable-objective designs, or scopes with price tags based around a fifty-year-old reputation. I don't want or need a dozen $1000 scopes sitting in my safes, especially when they don't give me anything I don't find in scopes of half the price or less. If I were only going to own a couple of scopes, or own one for a very specific purpose, then I could see me paying $1000 or more, and several times I have been finger-hovering-over-the-button close to pulling the trigger on something before coming to my senses.

One very important point for me is that I want all my scopes to be identical on all my field rifles, from .22LR to .30-06 and pistol-caliber levers. No matter which rifle I'm carrying, the scopes are exactly the same, same view, same controls, in the same places, same holdovers, same reticle. And my rifles don't shoot twenty rounds per year at sambar, I shoot thousands of rounds per year. I use them in rain, from winter's zeros to summer's 45's without any problems.

For me it came down to the AR Optics 4.5-18x40 223BDC for around $350. I have eleven of these now, I've been using them on my .22LR's out to 300m+, making elevation adjustments of 100 minutes (400 clicks) and back with zero tracking problems. I've used them shooting groups on paper until it's too dark to see the white paper at dusk. I have dropped rifles more times than I can count, without damaging a scope yet, the nastiest probably being when I knocked the rifle off my bench, landing inverted on the floor on the elevation turret, hard enough to compress the adjustable rail mount.

For my purposes I haven't been able to fault them at all. I can't comment on how well they work for spotlighting as that's not something I do, but I'd bet there are plenty of these being put to that purpose as well.

I received the Visionking 10-40x56 yesterday and mounted it on the .204 last night. My initial impression is that I'm impressed, but I need to get out and do some testing with it alongside the Bushnells. It says 1/8 MoA clicks on the turrets which I need to confirm on paper. 60 clicks per rotation, which is a little strange as it's 7.5 MoA, so you have to divide your elevation adjustments into 7.5 MoA groups, 13MoA would require a full rotation to 7.5 MoA, plus 5.5 for example. It only does 6.5 rotations (around 48MoA) though so it's not a PRS-type of scope you'd be making huge adjustments to. It is of course huge so would not go onto a hunting rifle, although it wouldn't be out of place on a varmint rifle. One odd thing is that it has illuminated reticles - plural. It has two reticles, one roughly 6MoA below the primary. It's very hazy with smoke here still, but looking at a fence line 650m away, set on 18x alongside the Bushnell, I can't see a significant difference in optics, both show up magpies perfectly well. The VK reticle is finer, at 40x it's about half the width of a star picket at 640m.

I'll post my thoughts once I've had a good play with it.

[Sergeant Hartman]

Awww scj429 and deano.... you both need to get a room and get your lovers quarrel out of the way.

In a way you both will quickly realise that you need something better than a $200 scope if you are punching paper... esp when you get better at it or start to shoot regularly. My friend has a Leopold 45x leupold on his 22lr and another has a 8x32 sightron. I just got a sightron 35x and ohh it's just lovely to look through. I dunno if you can find em new but they were under 800 (i picked mine up second hand).

After reading blade reply, i think in the end it will come to what the person wants to use the scope for and everyone is different, what might work for a person A might not work for someone else.

The reason people get the high mag scopes is that they want to be able to see the bullet holes esp in a competition type environment... and adjust for wind and conditions

[bladeracer]

It is very difficult to judge the quality of scopes made in China without trying one out, they may have improved out of sight lately.

They have in my opinion, even top-tier manufacturers are using Chinese glass in their cheaper lines nowadays.

[Raband]

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Bushnell-Ba ... 2749.l2649

$50

[SCJ429]

I agree Blade, that is why I decided to try one out for myself. Instead of looking down from my Ivory Tower surrounded by Schmidt and Bender, Ziess and Nightforce scopes I should test out the cheapest of them for myself. I am suprised by what you can get for $150, and there is no reason why you could not go out and use the scope. I have seen the videos where the retical moves diagonally across the lens or the focus ring does not work but no problems like that so far for me.

For me I do not expect a warranty but I understand that this is important to most. I bought the Visionking expecting it to fail, and am doing what I can to see if that will happen.

I find it hard to recommend a cheap Chinese scope in case the person has a bad experience. You have had a good run with your Bushnell AR series and they do what you expect from them. More power to people who buy budget scopes and have a good run from them.

[SCJ429]

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Bushnell-Banner-Accurate-Elite-6-24x50AO-Sight-Tactical-Rifle-Scope-with-Mount/233291232925?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649

$50

Isn't that a Bushnell fake?

[Raband]

Isn't that a Bushnell fake?

It's on the internet, so it must be true

[bladeracer]

[quote="Raband"https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Bushnell-Banner-Accurate-Elite-6-24x50AO-Sight-Tactical-Rifle-Scope-with-Mount/233291232925?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649

$50[/quote

Isn't that a Bushnell fake?

I think so, but I don't know if Bushnell have any way of telling the difference in their bottom-line scopes. I doubt it matters in such a low-end scope anyway. I have two of these, one of which is on my air-rifle at present, and they're not terrible. But it is adjustable objective, which sucks, and has capped turrets, which also sucks

6-24x is a fairly common size offered by lots of manufacturers, so it'd be worth looking at what everybody is offering before settling on the Bushnell.

[sungazer]

When people specifically say they want to use the scope for mainly target use at paper and out to 100 yrds or more then I really cringe when I see them wanting to buy cheap scopes and the cheap scope recommendations.

Deno you say you still haven't even used your rifle so how do you know what you really need.

The old recommendation of go and have a look at people doing what you want to do and what they use is the best but nearly always un listened to advice.

Spend $500 on a scope only to find out it does not suit the job you wanted. Try to sell that $500 scope only yo find out it has basically no re sale value.

[bladeracer]

When people specifically say they want to use the scope for mainly target use at paper and out to 100 yrds or more then I really cringe when I see them wanting to buy cheap scopes and the cheap scope recommendations.

Deno you say you still haven't even used your rifle so how do you know what you really need.

The old recommendation of go and have a look at people doing what you want to do and what they use is the best but nearly always un listened to advice.

I tend to think you want the better scope for picking the fallow out of the background shadow and foliage on dusk, or a dawn rabbit hiding in the hay field.
Shooting in daylight at a high-contrast sheet of paper though, you could virtually do that with open sights

[allan]

Boy, looks like a lot of ground has been covered since I was here yesterday.

I'll just add that IMO, Asian optics in general have come a LONG way in recent times (And I'm old enough to remember when we thought anything coming out of Japan was rubbish!)

I have various brands here made in Japan, South Korea (Bushnell's Nitro) and Philippines.
The last Sightron I bought (STAC 4-20X50 SFP MOA-2 - Ideal for the OP's intended use but more than his budget) is made in The Philippines but it's certainly proving to be a decent scope from what I've seen so far.

[bladeracer]

Boy, looks like a lot of ground has been covered since I was here yesterday.

I'll just add that IMO, Asian optics in general have come a LONG way in recent times (And I'm old enough to remember when we thought anything coming out of Japan was rubbish!)

I have various brands here made in Japan, South Korea (Bushnell's Nitro) and Philippines.
The last Sightron I bought (STAC 4-20X50 SFP MOA-2 - Ideal for the OP's intended use but more than his budget) is made in The Philippines but it's certainly proving to be a decent scope from what I've seen so far.

Japanese optics have been excellent for many decades, Chinese optics were very poor for a long, long time, so finding "Made in Japan" on your Tasco, or Nikko-Stirling made them worth hanging on to. But now the Chinese probably make the equipment the "not made in China" manufacturers are using to produce their scopes, and their glass technology has really stepped up

[Member-Deleted]

When people specifically say they want to use the scope for mainly target use at paper and out to 100 yrds or more then I really cringe when I see them wanting to buy cheap scopes and the cheap scope recommendations.

Deno you say you still haven't even used your rifle so how do you know what you really need.

The old recommendation of go and have a look at people doing what you want to do and what they use is the best but nearly always un listened to advice.

Spend $500 on a scope only to find out it does not suit the job you wanted. Try to sell that $500 scope only yo find out it has basically no re sale value.

Your totally right in that I haven't fired my rifle yet. It's really killing me
I'm just waiting on my scope to arrive....
And geez I've learnt some stuff while I've been waiting.
I researched for weeks for exactly the same type of scope that OP is after.
I read every article I could find about scopes, their differences, their different uses. I went down to the range and spoke to different shooters from different disciplines. I went to 4 different gun shops and looked through dozens of scopes before deciding that I couldn't get what I wanted for what I wanted.
So I compromised and bought the AR for $395. It will go on my air rifle eventually so it won't be a waste.

The one thing I did want was versatility. A scope that would be able to do most disciplines... Field, 3p, silhouette etc.
I don't want to use my .22 for long distance stuff. 150-200m max will do.

There seems to be a hole in the tactical/target scope market between $500-$1200.
I mean if you are going to spend over $500 you may as well spend over $1500+ for a match grade scope.

And yes, if your going to spend that much then you'd want to be pretty specific of what you want it for.
I am not there yet so I'll keep saving my dollars for when I am.

[bladeracer]

The AR Optics line are not springer air-rifle rated unfortunately, they didn't say it wouldn't do the job but it would void warranty. They suggested I look at their other lines, Nitro, Forge and another one I can't recall.
The $60 Banner 6-24x50AO is on it currently and is quite good. I bought two of them five years ago when I was still trying to determine what I wanted. They've been on a bunch of different rifles since, generally while I was waiting for more AR's to arrive, and I can't recall having any significant problems with them.

I was hoping to have a play with the Visionking today, but the fires are more of a priority

[Member-Deleted]

It's not going on a springer mate.
Next rifle will be a Crosman 1077. They are CO2 powered.

I'm told they don't rattle like springers do.

[solarpak]

Ahh the good old scope trash talk ..................seems most people havent got one iota what happens in the optics manufacture industry.

There are companies in China, Japan, Phillipines, Korea (Asia) that make the bulk of the sport optics - yes the europeans still make some of their sport optics in their own countries but even they do source out manufacture of some of their scopes to the asian manufacturers.
The Asian manufacturers that make most of these sport optics you would probably never heard of - Japanese companies like Light Optics Works and Shirstone Optics make the bulk of the current 'made in Japan' scopes and basically and Joe Blow can approach them and have a range of scopes, binos etc....made to any specification - as long as you have the moolah, they will make what you want.

Even the high priced Europeans dont make all their scopes - due to high labour costs. The current Zeiss V4 is made in Japan and the old Conquest line was assembled in the USA from Japanese components (the old 3-9x40 MC was a bloody cracker of a scope!) I am sure other Euro makers do the same .

The only European maker that impresses me is Meopta - they make everything in-house including all their glass (other Euro makers buy their glass mainly from Schott) but Meopta make their own. All brilliant scopes from the Meopro, the new Optika, Meostar and the ZD. The ZD range seriously spanks the high end Zeiss, S&B, Swaro scopes for the price.

At the end of the day, you get what you pay for - and if you spend $200 on an optic and enjoy it - thats what matters.....thats what its all about, having a good time in our chosen hobby.
C.

[bladeracer]

It's not going on a springer mate.
Next rifle will be a Crosman 1077. They are CO2 powered.

I'm told they don't rattle like springers do.

Yep, I think my Ruger 10/22 .177 is based on the 1077?
Bugger all power but a decent amount of enjoyment in the shooting.

[bladeracer]

At the end of the day, you get what you pay for - and if you spend $200 on an optic and enjoy it - thats what matters.....thats what its all about, having a good time in our chosen hobby.
C.

You get what you get, how much you pay for it has little to do with how good or bad it is. Price is based on a very long list of things that have next to nothing to do with the final product you're buying, or how well it'll do what you want of it.

You can buy the AR Optics for $395 or more, or you can pay under $200, for _exactly_ the same scope when it's on special. The price changes because of factors that have nothing at all to do with the product or the manufacturer. If you want a product that has "no questions unlimited transferable lifetime warranty", you can bet that you're paying extra for it, the manufacturer doesn't absorb the cost of those warranty claims, the customers do.

[Clem]

I put a Bushnell Trophy XTREME on my wife's 223.

2.5-15x50mm with the illuminated reticle

It was $450 and it is basically only used for target shooting(up yo 200 yards), very minimal hunting use.

I really can't fault it. Are there better scopes out there? Of course, but it does it's job quite well in my opinion.
I could have probably done without the illuminated reticle, but it's there if needed.

I would recommend one.
YMMV

[sungazer]

One thing I would like to add and I think i can speak for perhaps some others as well. I am not bashing any scopes although I have looked through some really bad ones I don't remember what they were or how old. But when asked for a recommendation I look at what the poster has said he is looking for in a scope and try and fit the best value proposition to the budget they have come up with. Yes sometimes i would recommend that they double their budget given what they are looking for in a scope and buy second hand. again it might seem like elitism recommending a well know brand name scope. But they are only the ones i have personal and extensive experience with and also seen the same experience in many, many regular weekly shooters over a long period of time. they are by no means the most expensive scopes that I use and i have also bought second hand.

Deno you are right about the $500-$1000 target scopes a bit of a gap in that market. Sightron used to fill it well but their scopes have gone up and taken away the value advantage. I purchased an Athalon Argos which cost me about $800 on the recommendation of a LGS owner. I regret that purchase nothing really wrong with the scope it is over size compared to others but there is nothing special about it either I could have spent $200 more and been much more satisfied with a second hand scope that I know stands the test of time and has great local lifetime warranty and customer service with really good value repairs even if you do damage it accidentally. A friend had one repaired after it fell out of the gun safe and landed on a turret nearly breaking the turret out of the scope tube. tube and turrets replaced anlong with all the other remove, replace, service and clean for $200 back in just over a week.

[bladeracer]

I put a Bushnell Trophy XTREME on my wife's 223.

2.5-15x50mm with the illuminated reticle

It was $450 and it is basically only used for target shooting(up yo 200 yards), very minimal hunting use.

I really can't fault it. Are there better scopes out there? Of course, but it does it's job quite well in my opinion.
I could have probably done without the illuminated reticle, but it's there if needed.

I would recommend one.
YMMV

Do you find 15-power enough for 200yd paper shooting?
Can you see .22-cal bullet holes at that distance?
I can just barely with the 18x, but 180m is about as far as I can.

[SCJ429]

]At the end of the day, you get what you pay for - and if you spend $200 on an optic and enjoy it - thats what matters.....thats what its all about, having a good time in our chosen hobby.
C.

You get what you get, how much you pay for it has little to do with how good or bad it is. Price is based on a very long list of things that have next to nothing to do with the final product you're buying, or how well it'll do what you want of it.

You can buy the AR Optics for $395 or more, or you can pay under $200, for _exactly_ the same scope when it's on special. The price changes because of factors that have nothing at all to do with the product or the manufacturer. If you want a product that has "no questions unlimited transferable lifetime warranty", you can bet that you're paying extra for it, the manufacturer doesn't absorb the cost of those warranty claims, the customers do.

I think that the "you get what you pay for" is as true as it ever was. There is not a budget offering out there that comes close to a $3,000 Schmidt and Bender but many shooters do not need that high end of scope. You can get a very nice scope for $1,500 and something usable for $200. Many new shooters want to dip their toe in the water and look at the bottom end of the range of optics. The best optics that are more reliable are fixed power scopes, they usually have better quality glass and are more robust because they are simpler. I used a fixed power 12x Leupold for many years in Rimfire competition. Still have the scope and it has never failed me.

[Ferrisweil]

You get what you get, how much you pay for it has little to do with how good or bad it is. Price is based on a very long list of things that have next to nothing to do with the final product you're buying, or how well it'll do what you want of it.

You can buy the AR Optics for $395 or more, or you can pay under $200, for _exactly_ the same scope when it's on special. The price changes because of factors that have nothing at all to do with the product or the manufacturer. If you want a product that has "no questions unlimited transferable lifetime warranty", you can bet that you're paying extra for it, the manufacturer doesn't absorb the cost of those warranty claims, the customers do.[/quote]

I think that the "you get what you pay for" is as true as it ever was. There is not a budget offering out there that comes close to a $3,000 Schmidt and Bender but many shooters do not need that high end of scope. You can get a very nice scope for $1,500 and something usable for $200. Many new shooters want to dip their toe in the water and look at the bottom end of the range of optics. The best optics that are more reliable are fixed power scopes, they usually have better quality glass and are more robust because they are simpler. I used a fixed power 12x Leupold for many years in Rimfire competition. Still have the scope and it has never failed me.[/quote]

Well said mate. I’ve been very lucky over the years to look through some VERY expensive glass and it VERY much is a case of you get what you pay for. Sitting in a tree stand in the UK, in fading light and waiting for that perfect buck, made me grateful for nice bit of kit I was using. Shooting a pig at 50m at 1pm or a piece of paper at 100m with a 22 and you could get away with a school magnifying glass and say it works brilliantly.
My opinion is that high end optics are def better (if you’re using them in the right situation) but at the end of the day, we all want the best we can afford.