Thermal Imaging choices

Rifle scopes, iron sights and optics. Spotting scopes and target acquisition devices.

Thermal Imaging choices

Post by madang55 » 07 Apr 2022, 2:04 pm

I just wanted to open a thread just for Thermal scopes and monoculars. There are lots more to chose from with a much greater price spread as well. The clip-ons are starting to be more available, but still pricey I think. I am looking for a functional scope. Not a cheap one, and certainly not prepared to pay current top dollar. I don't expect it to last until I fall off the rail (not long if I think about it), but I expect it to stand a bit of reasonable punishment. I want to be able to mount it on everything I own. 22LR, 204R, 223Rem, 6.5 Grendel, 308W, and 9.3 x 62. Its got to be able to handle all the recoil and NOT LOSE ZERO. I don't need it to do calculus. Its like buying a new phone a couple of years ago. This wunderkind spent 30mins marveling at the wonderful things this phone could do, the applications, the games, the computing power, the storage, etc etc, etc. When I asked him "does it make phone calls?" I think I ruined his day. So simple is best. Video, not required, photos, in the middle of the night, why? range finding, maybe, different shaped reticles, OK, white hot, red hot, black hot, if you must, but trajectory calculations, recording of bullet weights etc etc etc, I don't have that long to live. Again, I don't need it to do calculus. When I'm planning a shoot, I want to mount it on the intended rifle, take it to the range, confirm the zero, get to the hunt, turn it on, and its ready. Mounts, I just want to use standard mounts, not some thing that looks like it used to be attached to a mecano set. Simple batteries, not Li-on power packs. If its got a power pack, all that power is being used/wasted by the additional computations going on. I have a night vision scope which has been a little troublesome. What I did find though was that in open country, its fine. but in the bush....the bush is where the Thermal works a lot better.
My wife knows me well.
The dog often reminds me of that
User avatar
madang55
Corporal
Corporal
 
Posts: 370
Victoria

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by Wyliecoyote » 07 Apr 2022, 5:26 pm

Thermion XQ38. Mounts as a regular day scope. Internal and a replaceable battery that can be charged while still in the unit on the rifle. Relatively simple sight in procedure. Great field of view at the low base magnification of 3.5x.
I have two Thermions, the other of which is the XM38.
Both Thermions have been set and forget. Never altered zero from the day they were installed. I personally like the conventional scope configuration over all the others and when i think back to the days of the Apex XD75, it was like strapping a house brick to the rifle. Great unit, probably the best viewing unit I've got, but very cumbersome.

The other stuff like video, wifi is all there in the Thermion range as it is in many other makes these days, but it does not detract from their basic function. But if you want to take a video or share with a friend on a phone or tablet, you can and really is not that complicated to do.
The only recommendation i would make is if the rifle is not being solely dedicated to thermal use is to fit a quality steel rail and QDs. That way zero reset on scope change overs remains constant. All Thermions have the ability to store zeroes for 5 rifles, and 10 setting within each rifle, so you could swap from top to bottom as you described. All will need rails but.
Wyliecoyote
Lance Corporal
Lance Corporal
 
Posts: 141
Queensland

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by madang55 » 07 Apr 2022, 6:44 pm

Cool stuff. Yours hold zero, but on what calibres please?
My wife knows me well.
The dog often reminds me of that
User avatar
madang55
Corporal
Corporal
 
Posts: 370
Victoria

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by brinny » 07 Apr 2022, 7:22 pm

Dont know of a thermal scope out there that would handle the recoil of the 9.3....except GSCI maybe......they mount them on machine guns in the military.....
A day without a hunt, is a day lost.....
User avatar
brinny
Corporal
Corporal
 
Posts: 302
Victoria

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by madang55 » 07 Apr 2022, 8:20 pm

Saw your post re yr new acquisition, very nice...if I had the $ and the reason to spend, they would be top of my list I think. Putting a Thermal on the 9.3 is probably not a great move, will probably do the work with the 308, but I've seen them on 30-06 which have a similar boot. I'm waiting on some recommendations which will hopefully fall into the units I've been looking at....Has anyone any experience with the ATN thermals????
My wife knows me well.
The dog often reminds me of that
User avatar
madang55
Corporal
Corporal
 
Posts: 370
Victoria

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by Blr243 » 07 Apr 2022, 9:07 pm

No experience with atn but I hear lots of bad things about atn , poor service and back up .....I don’t think atn can b trusted. When I bought a pulsar thermal I knew it had video ability but I was not the slightest bit interested in that , I just wanted a thermal scope. But very quickly I realised I really like video recording
Blr243
Major General
Major General
 
Posts: 4551
Queensland

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by scoot » 07 Apr 2022, 9:14 pm

Not to sound condescending but why would you consider giving ATN more money given your current experience with their products. :unknown:
Plenty of other fish in the sea.
User avatar
scoot
Corporal
Corporal
 
Posts: 254
South Australia

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by Wyliecoyote » 07 Apr 2022, 10:09 pm

Recoil is not the issue with the Thermion line where they are rated to 375 HH. Eye relief at 50 mm is going to be your real issue. My limit is 308 before i get nervous about recoil. The XM 38 is permanently on a Swede running 140 grain Accubonds. The XQ 38 goes from a 223, 62 grain TSX to 308 running 165 grain SST max for me. A shooting friend runs his XP 50 on a Howa in 375 Ruger but he says that he pulls his head back before firing a shot, something i don't care for as it shrinks your field of view drastically. As for your 9.3, there are very few thermals on the market that would have sufficient eye relief. I would get a clip on, a very low powered steel objective scope with a lot of eye relief and clamp it up very tight. I would say that a Thermion is definitely not suitable for what you wish to do.

The only bitch we have had with all the Thermion line is eye relief, which is as stated at 50mm. The local gun shops run ATN and Pulsar come try nights where they go out to one of the local ranges and showcase their NV and thermal. The most common question is about eye relief with the thermals. There is no reason they cannot extend the focal length of the ocular lense to double that.
Wyliecoyote
Lance Corporal
Lance Corporal
 
Posts: 141
Queensland

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by Die Judicii » 07 Apr 2022, 11:18 pm

As I've posted before, I'm a big fan of the Pulsar clip on's,,,,,, so much so that I bought two identical units.

But,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, and I stress,,,,,,,, take note,,,,, that although an American company (is/was?) they are located and made
in Belarus.
Which may not sit well in the current climate.
I do not fear death itself... Only its inopportune timing!
I've come to realize that,,,,, the two most loving, loyal, and trustworthy females in my entire life were both canines.
User avatar
Die Judicii
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 3742
Queensland

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by JimTom » 08 Apr 2022, 7:06 am

Mate I am running a Pulsar Thermion XP38. Have had it for a few years. Never had to adjust the zero after I did the initial.
It is on a 6.5 CM so only mild recoil. I rate it highly.
User avatar
JimTom
Second Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
 
Posts: 2136
Queensland

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by mchughcb » 08 Apr 2022, 8:22 am

brinny wrote:Dont know of a thermal scope out there that would handle the recoil of the 9.3....except GSCI maybe......they mount them on machine guns in the military.....


I've seen thermals on 9.3, 300 Win mags. They were using the older pulsars and nightwolf. They are rated up to 375 H&H.
User avatar
mchughcb
Sergeant Major
Sergeant Major
 
Posts: 1590
Victoria

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by Wyliecoyote » 08 Apr 2022, 9:40 am

JimTom wrote:Mate I am running a Pulsar Thermion XP38. Have had it for a few years. Never had to adjust the zero after I did the initial.
It is on a 6.5 CM so only mild recoil. I rate it highly.


I would kill for an XP38. Why Pulsar discontinued that model, as well as the XM38, is very puzzling
Wyliecoyote
Lance Corporal
Lance Corporal
 
Posts: 141
Queensland

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by madang55 » 08 Apr 2022, 10:12 am

Barn have XM30 and XQ38 both just within a dwarf toss of my budget. Are they upgraded models of the XP's? I'm guessing they are well worth considering?
The clip ons are outside the finance controllers idea of necessary.
My wife knows me well.
The dog often reminds me of that
User avatar
madang55
Corporal
Corporal
 
Posts: 370
Victoria

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by brinny » 08 Apr 2022, 10:16 am

mchughcb wrote:
brinny wrote:Dont know of a thermal scope out there that would handle the recoil of the 9.3....except GSCI maybe......they mount them on machine guns in the military.....


I've seen thermals on 9.3, 300 Win mags. They were using the older pulsars and nightwolf. They are rated up to 375 H&H.


Doesn’t surprise me….The older pulsars were built well… my first was an Apex XD75 and was as tough and reliable as you would get..The shutters jammed shut after 18 months and I sent it back for repairs… they sent me the new trail XQ50 as a replacement… and it’s been all down hill from there…
A day without a hunt, is a day lost.....
User avatar
brinny
Corporal
Corporal
 
Posts: 302
Victoria

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by JimTom » 08 Apr 2022, 12:19 pm

Wyliecoyote wrote:
JimTom wrote:Mate I am running a Pulsar Thermion XP38. Have had it for a few years. Never had to adjust the zero after I did the initial.
It is on a 6.5 CM so only mild recoil. I rate it highly.


I would kill for an XP38. Why Pulsar discontinued that model, as well as the XM38, is very puzzling


Unfortunately I don’t get to use it as often as I’d like. No one I hunt with has any night gear so whilst they’re drinking beer and sleeping, I am creeping around by myself. A bit anti social, however hunting on your own can be good too.
User avatar
JimTom
Second Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
 
Posts: 2136
Queensland

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by Blr243 » 08 Apr 2022, 3:01 pm

I prefer hunting on my own. I can focus 100 per cent on finding game ....a hunting mate would be like an annoying girlfriend that is forever talking
Blr243
Major General
Major General
 
Posts: 4551
Queensland

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by JimTom » 08 Apr 2022, 3:19 pm

Blr243 wrote:I prefer hunting on my own. I can focus 100 per cent on finding game ....a hunting mate would be like an annoying girlfriend that is forever talking


:lol: :lol: :lol: I was waiting for you to say something along those lines mate. There are times I enjoy the solitude of hunting alone however I don't mind doing it in pairs either. I only hunt with a few selected people so don't have the problem of having muppets around.
User avatar
JimTom
Second Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
 
Posts: 2136
Queensland

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by Blr243 » 08 Apr 2022, 7:28 pm

I must admit last October driving all the way to cape York from brissy and back again by myself was a stretch ... I did actually think about asking a couple of blokes but my dad could not come interstate because of covid laws and I never got around to ringing the other bloke ..
Blr243
Major General
Major General
 
Posts: 4551
Queensland

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by niteowl » 08 Apr 2022, 7:35 pm

Just a comment on batteries for thermals. I would now NEVER have a device that would not operate on "off the shelf" batteries rather than some special proprietary expensive, special battery pack.. In an emergency you can get batteries from the local store.
niteowl
Lance Corporal
Lance Corporal
 
Posts: 148
Western Australia

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by NTSOG » 09 Apr 2022, 7:10 am

G'day,

On the subject of thermal monoculars I decided to replace my basic Night Tech 25 monocular with something newer as I didn't think it was suitable for my level of visual function anymore. I'm developing cataracts and was having trouble seeing foxes and hares at 180 yards on well-grazed paddocks through it. Two years ago I had no problem seeing them. I contacted Night vision Australia about a Pulsar Axion XM30. They did not have any Pulsars and were having difficulties getting stock. In the end I bought a Hikmicro Lynx LH25 at their recommendation as being more suitable for my eyes. It's brilliant. Not only can I now see small animals on open paddocks easily, it also allows me to track them as they move through the bush between trees and shrubs at 250 yards and more. The device has more features than I will use, but the clarity at base magnification and the reduced eye strain makes it worthwhile. It's also smaller than the Night Tech.

Jim
NTSOG
Sergeant
Sergeant
 
Posts: 578
Victoria

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by JimTom » 09 Apr 2022, 8:15 am

niteowl wrote:Just a comment on batteries for thermals. I would now NEVER have a device that would not operate on "off the shelf" batteries rather than some special proprietary expensive, special battery pack.. In an emergency you can get batteries from the local store.


I applied this principal to most of my other gear, ie, torches, gps, etc, however I don’t know of any thermal that operates on off the shelf batteries. My thermal has an internal battery as well as a replaceable one too. I have three spares plus the internal so I figure I should have it covered.
Replacement batteries are a bit expensive however to date I e not had to purchase any additional due to malfunction etc.
User avatar
JimTom
Second Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
 
Posts: 2136
Queensland

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by niteowl » 09 Apr 2022, 11:05 am

JimTom wrote:
niteowl wrote:Just a comment on batteries for thermals. I would now NEVER have a device that would not operate on "off the shelf" batteries rather than some special proprietary expensive, special battery pack.. In an emergency you can get batteries from the local store.


I applied this principal to most of my other gear, ie, torches, gps, etc, however I don’t know of any thermal that operates on off the shelf batteries. My thermal has an internal battery as well as a replaceable one too. I have three spares plus the internal so I figure I should have it covered.
Replacement batteries are a bit expensive however to date I e not had to purchase any additional due to malfunction etc.


All GSCI thermal scopes, monoculars, binos. do. It is a huge benefit if you get caught out.
I wonder who sells them :roll:
niteowl
Lance Corporal
Lance Corporal
 
Posts: 148
Western Australia

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by Die Judicii » 09 Apr 2022, 12:11 pm

Wyliecoyote wrote:
JimTom wrote:Mate I am running a Pulsar Thermion XP38. Have had it for a few years. Never had to adjust the zero after I did the initial.
It is on a 6.5 CM so only mild recoil. I rate it highly.


I would kill for an XP38. Why Pulsar discontinued that model, as well as the XM38, is very puzzling


At a rough guess, they do the same as Zeiss.
The same story that keeps coming up,,,,,,,,,, the EARLY models are great,,,,,, and the newer ones are not so great.

"If it ain't broken,,,,, don't fix it" still rings true.
I do not fear death itself... Only its inopportune timing!
I've come to realize that,,,,, the two most loving, loyal, and trustworthy females in my entire life were both canines.
User avatar
Die Judicii
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 3742
Queensland

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by Die Judicii » 09 Apr 2022, 12:30 pm

JimTom wrote:
niteowl wrote:Just a comment on batteries for thermals. I would now NEVER have a device that would not operate on "off the shelf" batteries rather than some special proprietary expensive, special battery pack.. In an emergency you can get batteries from the local store.


I applied this principal to most of my other gear, ie, torches, gps, etc, however I don’t know of any thermal that operates on off the shelf batteries. My thermal has an internal battery as well as a replaceable one too. I have three spares plus the internal so I figure I should have it covered.
Replacement batteries are a bit expensive however to date I e not had to purchase any additional due to malfunction etc.


Both my Pusars are designed to run on CR123 batteries which only last for four hours MAX,, but they both also have a plug in adapter (which goes in place of the batteries) so you can run an external power pack.
The power packs from Pulsar are pretty expensive I think.
Instead,,,,,,,, I bought power packs from Office Works.
These work extremely well and I get up to 16 hrs continuous running before having to recharge them. (can't complain about that)
Because I shoot over the bench of my rig in the ute the battery pack/s sit in a special compartment one inch below the bench surface.
Having a cord length of one metre is just perfect and gives me all the movement I ever need.
Plus,,,,,,,,, the Pulsars work faultlessly on the power packs.
I do not fear death itself... Only its inopportune timing!
I've come to realize that,,,,, the two most loving, loyal, and trustworthy females in my entire life were both canines.
User avatar
Die Judicii
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 3742
Queensland

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by Wyliecoyote » 09 Apr 2022, 1:00 pm

Die Judicii wrote:
Both my Pusars are designed to run on CR123 batteries which only last for four hours MAX,, but they both also have a plug in adapter (which goes in place of the batteries) so you can run an external power pack.
The power packs from Pulsar are pretty expensive I think.
Instead,,,,,,,, I bought power packs from Office Works.
These work extremely well and I get up to 16 hrs continuous running before having to recharge them. (can't complain about that)
Because I shoot over the bench of my rig in the ute the battery pack/s sit in a special compartment one inch below the bench surface.
Having a cord length of one metre is just perfect and gives me all the movement I ever need.
Plus,,,,,,,,, the Pulsars work faultlessly on the power packs.



Can i ask what power pack from Office Works?
Wyliecoyote
Lance Corporal
Lance Corporal
 
Posts: 141
Queensland

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by madang55 » 09 Apr 2022, 7:47 pm

Guys, you have no idea how helpful this topic has been and probably will be for some time. . So far I haven't seen any random bovine droppings appear. Thanks for the valuable input, keep it up.
My wife knows me well.
The dog often reminds me of that
User avatar
madang55
Corporal
Corporal
 
Posts: 370
Victoria

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by Die Judicii » 09 Apr 2022, 8:12 pm

Wyliecoyote wrote:
Die Judicii wrote:
Both my Pusars are designed to run on CR123 batteries which only last for four hours MAX,, but they both also have a plug in adapter (which goes in place of the batteries) so you can run an external power pack.
The power packs from Pulsar are pretty expensive I think.
Instead,,,,,,,, I bought power packs from Office Works.
These work extremely well and I get up to 16 hrs continuous running before having to recharge them. (can't complain about that)
Because I shoot over the bench of my rig in the ute the battery pack/s sit in a special compartment one inch below the bench surface.
Having a cord length of one metre is just perfect and gives me all the movement I ever need.
Plus,,,,,,,,, the Pulsars work faultlessly on the power packs.



Can i ask what power pack from Office Works?


It is 75mm wide, 158mm long, 18mm thick.
And I quote from the back of its case,,,,,,,,

Model No PB158K Input DC 5v 2A
Capacity 15000mAh Output1: DC 5v 2A
Watt Hour 55.5Wh Output2: DC 5v 2A
Made in China Total Output 5v 2A
I do not fear death itself... Only its inopportune timing!
I've come to realize that,,,,, the two most loving, loyal, and trustworthy females in my entire life were both canines.
User avatar
Die Judicii
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 3742
Queensland

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by mchughcb » 09 Apr 2022, 11:07 pm

I know someone who ran a pulsar thermal on their 416 Remington. It finally killed it but what do you expect it's not a 204R. So they bought another lol
User avatar
mchughcb
Sergeant Major
Sergeant Major
 
Posts: 1590
Victoria

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by JimTom » 10 Apr 2022, 6:18 am

mchughcb wrote:I know someone who ran a pulsar thermal on their 416 Remington. It finally killed it but what do you expect it's not a 204R. So they bought another lol


From memory my Pulsar Thermion was certified for up to 375 H&H and 9.3x62 I think. I’m saying that I would be reactant to use it in anything bigger than a 308.
User avatar
JimTom
Second Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
 
Posts: 2136
Queensland

Re: Thermal Imaging choices

Post by brinny » 10 Apr 2022, 10:49 am

JimTom wrote:
niteowl wrote:Just a comment on batteries for thermals. I would now NEVER have a device that would not operate on "off the shelf" batteries rather than some special proprietary expensive, special battery pack.. In an emergency you can get batteries from the local store.


I applied this principal to most of my other gear, ie, torches, gps, etc, however I don’t know of any thermal that operates on off the shelf batteries. My thermal has an internal battery as well as a replaceable one too. I have three spares plus the internal so I figure I should have it covered.
Replacement batteries are a bit expensive however to date I e not had to purchase any additional due to malfunction etc.


GSCI thermal scopes do.....i have 3 of them and they all take 123A batteries.....
I had a Night Tech MS42 also and it took the 123A batteries also......

Image
A day without a hunt, is a day lost.....
User avatar
brinny
Corporal
Corporal
 
Posts: 302
Victoria

Next

Back to top
 
Return to Scopes, sights and optics