30% of gun shop sales are Thermal Gear

[mchughcb]

That's what a certain rep from a high end optics told me in the weekend. So people moan about the cost of 22 ammo but have no problem dropping thousands on thermal gear during a cost of living crisis.

Then comes the truth. All these tradies are claiming a thermal scope with range finder on tax for work related expenses. As the plumber needed to detect that roof leak at 5m with a pulsar thermion xp50 LRF or HIK Micro Stellar 3.0.

0ne day the tax department is going to close this crap down.

[Die Judicii]

I hear you loud and clear Mate,

It's been happening for years though in one shape or another..
40 years ago I attended a "school camp" as a parent, and 90 % of the other parents that also attended were farmers, or farmers wives.
The camp was 300 klms from our country home town, and the whole bang lot of them were sitting around the campfire on the first night
bragging how all they do is drive to the nearest town the next day which was 5 klms from the camp,, and buy a (spark plug or similar) get their
receipt,,, and hey presto the whole 600 klm round trip was then tax deductable.

The other massive rort is the likes of business owners eg: a camera shop,, that drive around in the latest and most expensive 4WD's all decked
out with every imaginable accessory that can possibly be fitted to it.
Because on the tailgate or doors they have the camera shops name and phone number etc

The whole bloody lot is a tax rort.
It sh!ts me to tears.

[deye243]

I'm still trying to work how an electronic device is a gun

[bigpete]

Well,the government rips people off badly enough as it is. Can't blame them for getting creative. I've known builders to write off a new scope as a levelling device, and fishing reels and braided line as string lines.

[mchughcb]

I'm still trying to work how an electronic device is a gun

Title should be gun shop sales

[Wapiti]

If it's used for, during and in execution of the business that's trying to make an income of which is taxed, fair game.
The tradies ute full of gear is needed to make the income that the government rapes off him to make that money, the small business needs to spend on the infrastructure needed before and during the businesses operations, again for the purposes of the government collecting tax.

You can't have it both ways. But yes I know the line is blurred between what's strictly taxable and what is pushing the friendship.
There are lots of rules and distinctions within the tax framework for allowable deductions, and proof is needed when doing the tax returns.

If I'm audited, and I have been a few times, I have to prove why I would need a thermal device. Real evidence, like the photos of ripped and dead stock, the claimed losses of income from the tax return, even the firearms and ammo adding up to a reasonable number comparable to the use scenario.

It just so happens that this stuff is a viable tax deduction for many, and jealousy and lack of ability to understand that for some, this isn't a macabre pasttime, it's actually necessary to continue a business.
These new devices help a lot in saving income losses, so yes are a tax deduction.

[mchughcb]

I get that. I'm just surprised the % ofvrll revenue is so high proportion.

[Billo]

I'm not surprised thermals are now making up 30% of gunshop revenue, Ive dropped into one of the main thermal distributors in NSW and there is often 100k plus of new gear boxed and ready to go out everyday

[Wapiti]

A very kind member here (DJ) invited me to come with him to a Pulsar new-model night held at the local country town shotgun club recently - and the place was mostly filled with farmers that thd local gunshop invited.
Anyone here with land is being flogged with feral dogs, and dogs see the bloke flashing a spotlight around from K's away and f*ck off.
The prices scared the cr@p out of most of the graziers there, but more than one the reps made sure they all knew that they were a 100% tax deduction for them. Trouble is, you have to have the 4-10k lying around in the first place, expendable income/spare cash, which few have.

And yeah, they dragged out the same old bullsh*t about chippies buying thermal scopes for their shooting weekends and claiming them for finding electrical hotspots etc.
Same old wives tale the country over, spread by reps trying to flog more gear.

How about, don't blame the farming families for needing this gear, or having a use for it that actually DOES stop them suffering animal welfare or income losses. Or for needing big 4WD's because they live on roads worse than the Plenty Highway or Birdsville track, places the townies masturbate over being able to drive their un-needed 300 Series Cruiser triple-polished show ponies.

You look at it your way, this is how the other side look at being judged by those who don't live in their shoes. Who judge from afar. Who say they can fix everyone else's problems but their own.

[mchughcb]

This thread is more about the proportion of total sales.

[MG5150]

A thermal should cost several thousand dollars...

There is no justifiable reason for ammo prices to have doubled apart from prices went up during covid due to 'supply chain issue' and the prices never came down once the issus were resolved.

(that being said I bought the new Mars 1000 by Oneleaf - $1200 USD or just on $2k AUD for a 35mm unit with LRF and ballistics calculator and it's fantastic - Singaporian country going factory to consumer with no middle man to drop prices on top of admitting that manufacturing costs have come down and all the big players have big markups to maximise profits

[Wapiti]

Man that brand has some top features, appreciate the heads up here.
Singaporean made not Land of China?
All the local gunshops are supporting the big marketing brand push.

[ColdStart]

I bought the new Mars 1000 by Oneleaf - $1200 USD or just on $2k AUD for a 35mm unit with LRF and ballistics calculator and it's fantastic

I been thinking of getting one for my .22, most shots would be under well under 100m but being able to scan paddocks is a bonus. How do you find the 35mm lens and digital magnification OK? I haven't been sure what to choose the 35 or 50mm. There doesn't seem much difference that I can see accept 2x vs 2.8x magnification, which doesn't see much to justify the $300 us price difference.

[Wapiti]

You could always try the interchangeable lenses.
I reckon the digital zooms are gay, If it's a clip-on you choose the 35mm for FOV and attach it to an LVPO and twist up the magnification instantly. It's exactly the same outcome.
All the silly features mean SFA when stuff happens in a hurry - as it always does. No time for buttons and marketing wanks.

[mchughcb]

A thermal should cost several thousand dollars...

There is no justifiable reason for ammo prices to have doubled apart from prices went up during covid due to 'supply chain issue' and the prices never came down once the issus were resolved.

(that being said I bought the new Mars 1000 by Oneleaf - $1200 USD or just on $2k AUD for a 35mm unit with LRF and ballistics calculator and it's fantastic - Singaporian country going factory to consumer with no middle man to drop prices on top of admitting that manufacturing costs have come down and all the big players have big markups to maximise profits

The biggest issue with having a battery such as a 18650 in parallel with scope is under heavy recoiling will smash the battery terminal in to the point you can't easily recharge it.

[Wapiti]

You'd think so mate, agree in principal with cheap contacts in badly made gear, but my European clip-on uses 18650's parallel to the bore and it has done a lot of work. daytime too, just to prove it's useability. On a rifle that will break the crosshairs in Land Of China scopes very quickly.
Also, look at the good brands of LED torches mounted to rifles that use these batteries, they are made to absorb the recoil impulse by cushioned, strong contacts.

[ColdStart]

The oneleaf.ai Mars MT1000LRF is a stand alone thermal scope, the lens are interchangeable, but I am wondering if the 2x vs 2.8x magnification off the difference lens is worth the extra $300US

I might just get the 35mm and wait for the 75mm to be released and see if I need it or want to spend the $800US extra for it.

[Blr243]

Imagine u are an electrician asked to put a dozen down lights into a lounge room and first u have to find out where all the structural parts of the ceiling framing are …. Often thermal Binos can find them because the temperature of the plaster board is different where the battens are. It blew me away when I first saw it. By accident, just messing with my equipment at home one day. I wouldn’t dream of trying to claim them. Sure way to get yourself in trouble

[ColdStart]

Imagine u are an electrician asked to put a dozen down lights into a lounge room and first u have to find out where all the structural parts of the ceiling framing are …. Often thermal Binos can find them because the temperature of the plaster board is different where the battens are. It blew me away when I first saw it. By accident, just messing with my equipment at home one day. I wouldn’t dream of trying to claim them. Sure way to get yourself in trouble

Its unlikely they would knock it back from a electrician unless its only purpose was as a rifle scope. Even if they did, the worst that would happen is the ATO would remove the deduction from your return and issue an amended assessment showing a higher taxable income.

[Wapiti]

As I understand it, thermal hunting gear is cheaper than the purpose made electrical-fault finders, the dude that came and sussed out our solar panels after the big Warwick hail event reckons they cost $15k and up.
So I'd just be telling the tax man who audits you that you can claim double the $7k you just spent on yours, if he prefers, and claim that instead... Use them for hunting? Don't be stupid.

[niteowl]

No way, they cost about 0ne tenth of a decent thermal scope.
The special devices are far better than a scope especially for electricians.
I do believe I can comment on this as I have been in the thermal business for about 13 years or so, both as a contract user and importer.

[MG5150]

I bought the new Mars 1000 by Oneleaf - $1200 USD or just on $2k AUD for a 35mm unit with LRF and ballistics calculator and it's fantastic

I been thinking of getting one for my .22, most shots would be under well under 100m but being able to scan paddocks is a bonus. How do you find the 35mm lens and digital magnification OK? I haven't been sure what to choose the 35 or 50mm. There doesn't seem much difference that I can see accept 2x vs 2.8x magnification, which doesn't see much to justify the $300 us price difference.

I'm very happy with it. Headshot a deer at 200m on 6x zoom and dropped it on the spot. Very clear picture.

Did a sitout for a farmer who was losing sheep and nailed a wild dog too - but all happened so fast that I forgot to hit record >_<

Will post some footage on my YT channel shortly.

I plan on getting the 50mm and 75mm lens in future. Will probably get the 75mm lens as a Christmas present to myself. It's great that you can just swap them over.

[MG5150]

You could always try the interchangeable lenses.
I reckon the digital zooms are gay, If it's a clip-on you choose the 35mm for FOV and attach it to an LVPO and twist up the magnification instantly. It's exactly the same outcome.
All the silly features mean SFA when stuff happens in a hurry - as it always does. No time for buttons and marketing wanks.

Depending on whether you have a FFP or SFP the zoom may effect your POI with a clipon?

I have a Thermtec Hunt 335 clipon, but it doesn't hold zero when I switch it from my 223 to my 30-06 despite having the Rusan adapters as recommended by Hunt The Night. Very frustrating when you miss 8 foxes in one night and find you're shooting 3 inches left when zero checking.

After a bit more use, If I find the OneLeaf better I'll sell the clipon, otherwise I'll sell the Oneleaf, but for the price it's fantastic

[Wapiti]

Yeah I still don't get why there are brands of clip-on that require zeroing.
My Nitehog Vipers don't, ever and never have.

I've just changed to the LVPO on the 243 and ditched the 3.5-10x VX3i. Again, all I needed to do is sight the optic in correctly first, then bung the clip-ons on the adapter.
Makes sense, because the scope crosshairs are pointing at the target, and the clip-on just sits in front of it.
Unless the design bends the light off somewhere else in some brands, maybe?

On the FFP vs 2FP thing, I can't see how. But it'll be a cold day in hell before I get a FFP scope. I'm not a commando, and I use a rangefinder to get correct POI on those days I'm pretending to be a sniper.

[tuknal]

Imagine u are an electrician asked to put a dozen down lights into a lounge room and first u have to find out where all the structural parts of the ceiling framing are …. Often thermal Binos can find them because the temperature of the plaster board is different where the battens are. It blew me away when I first saw it. By accident, just messing with my equipment at home one day. I wouldn’t dream of trying to claim them. Sure way to get yourself in trouble

its called a man hole ,,, get in the ceiling lazy pricks and look where joists are im a plaster by trade and have seen to many sparkie not give a s**t holes that have to be fixed ,oh and the look on their face when they get charged for their own F up
all ive got to say is if your in a position to be able to claim the products then go for it,, if your running on the fine line , dont cry if you get caught

[Wapiti]

You can claim thick woolen socks with your workboots if you work in boots all day to earn a living- and why shouldn't anyone work within the regs.
Check with your accountant for your own personal circumstances.
I have no issue with claiming back from the government ANY money legally I consider they steal from me to waste on everything other than supporting this country and those who make it great. As Kerry Packer said, only a fool pays tax that they don't legally have to.
I am talking within the laws as they are now and not advocating trying to con the tax department. Because when you are audited, you will find out the hard way.

[Fester]

If all this thermal gear is being used, the country's pest problem must be just about under control lol
Blokes must have plenty of money to be buying this stuff.

I think the main aim for small businesses is tax deductions as they don't seem to get rich with profits.
The govts main aim is to rip of workers, farmers, and small businesses to rake in massive taxes to then waste.

[Wapiti]

If everyone who bought all tbis "game changer" gear was out there all the time mate, that would be pretty right.
But just as we find here that there's so much else to do to try and make a profit, and the only way is to make sure the only time this isn't top-of-mind, chasing ferals is just fitted in when there's time left.
Then there's the supposed help from recreational shooters, they are only around when they can afford the time and money not to be at work or being with family. So that help is negligible, and usually never when something blows up out there.
Personally, thermal devices are an extra tool, but I really see them just adding to the options available.
Baiting, spotlighting and opportunity shots whilst doing something else form the majority of what goes on.

[Wapiti]

And remember, with tax deductions, you have to spend the money from any profits you have made, then claim at the end of that tax year. Then your refund on that amount isn't what you spent.
So that's why the rush in the weeks leading up to June 30!
You can't spend money you'll need for something possibly tomorrow!
But yeah Fester, every day there's another blow from these politicians that just proves where they come from, an activist dream world where everything THEY get comes from our back pockets.
Maybe one day, the voters will be finally twigging to why they are just about penniless, have had enough of personalities and start thinking who is spitting in their faces.

[mchughcb]

Imagine u are an electrician asked to put a dozen down lights into a lounge room and first u have to find out where all the structural parts of the ceiling framing are …. Often thermal Binos can find them because the temperature of the plaster board is different where the battens are. It blew me away when I first saw it. By accident, just messing with my equipment at home one day. I wouldn’t dream of trying to claim them. Sure way to get yourself in trouble

its called a man hole ,,, get in the ceiling lazy pricks and look where joists are im a plaster by trade and have seen to many sparkie not give a s**t holes that have to be fixed ,oh and the look on their face when they get charged for their own F up
all ive got to say is if your in a position to be able to claim the products then go for it,, if your running on the fine line , dont cry if you get caught

Seen it myself