3-9 vs 4-12

[308cool]

Hi guys,
Dont want to incite too much of a war here, but for general Australian conditions (NSW state forest's specifically) chasing pigs, goats, deer and fox's would you go a 3-9x50 or a 4-12x50. Scope will be a meopta meopro mounted on a 25-06. Will use the range a couple of times a year to test loads at 200 yards.
Cheers

[Gwion]

The question is, how far are you planning to take shots?

I used my 3-9x40 to hit the bull at 500yd before I bought a new scope. For general hunting, 3-9 or even 2-10 would be plenty and having lower end for close in bushy hunting would be better.

[brett1868]

Given the minimum magnification is so close, I'd go the 4-12 as a bit more zoom can't hurt. I use Leupold VX2 4-12x50 on the hunting rifles as its a good balance of clarity at range and light gathering.

[juststarting]

Unless you are hunting where you need to take a quick shot at something reasonably close, say within 30-50m, in which case wider angle (3) is more ideal.

[308cool]

I will be hunting out to a maximum of around 400 yards, where anything further then that I will get closer before taking a shot. The range I'll be testing loads at is 200 yards. This is where I think having that extra 12x might be a bit beneficial even if I sacrifice some FOV down low.
Cheers for all the replies, all very helpful as usual!

[bladeracer]

I will be hunting out to a maximum of around 400 yards, where anything further then that I will get closer before taking a shot. The range I'll be testing loads at is 200 yards. This is where I think having that extra 12x might be a bit beneficial even if I sacrifice some FOV down low.
Cheers for all the replies, all very helpful as usual!

That's why I use the 4.5-18x40. At 9-power I can't clearly see smaller bullet holes at 100m, although I do start to see a discoloured blur on the target after I put a few shots into a group so I can get an idea of where my shots are dropping. At 18-power it's no trouble at all. I have a 75-power spotting scope as well but it's cumbersome compared to using the scope that's already on the rifle.
Field of view at 25m is tight, not much more than one-meter but I don't take snap shots on moving targets, and I bring a rifle onto a target using both eyes anyway.

[bigfellascott]

3-9 or even smaller might suit the state forests where it's more close action shooting that long range work.

[Gwion]

I'm sticking to my 2-10 recommendation.

[Gamerancher]

Depends on how large your 400m target is. If you are planning on doing some 400m bunny sniping, which the .25-06 is really good at, I'd go with the higher power. You can't hit what you can't see, I'd put money on the cross-hairs in the 3-9x being a lot bigger than the rabbit @ 400m. 4x is hardly too much for 50m shots.

[RoginaJack]

I've got a 4-12 on the .243 and in the bush around here I don't get off 4X. I'd have a look at a 3-9, Leopold have a fine cross hair too.
About the only time I use 12X is at the range, too lazy to take a spotting scope.
Cheers,

[bigfellascott]

Depends on how large your 400m target is. If you are planning on doing some 400m bunny sniping, which the .25-06 is really good at, I'd go with the higher power. You can't hit what you can't see, I'd put money on the cross-hairs in the 3-9x being a lot bigger than the rabbit @ 400m. 4x is hardly too much for 50m shots.

Pretty sure he's hunting, pigs, goats, deer etc - should be able to hit those easily enough with minimal mag - the other thing to take into consideration is if hunting pine forests they can be quite dark so look for a scope that is good in low light conditions.

[308cool]

Gwion, unfortunately the meopta scopes don't come in 2x10.

So I think the general consensus, since 90% of the rifles use will be hunting, Is to go 3-9? My last bit of doubt about going the 3-9 comes from the fact I might be able to get on some farms to do some shooting. The landscape then obviously becomes a bit open. Would 3-9 still be ok here?

Cheers

[Gamerancher]

308cool was the one who stated the 400 bit Bigfella, not me.
He set the choices. He asked for peoples thoughts on the matter, I conveyed mine. There is f-all difference between 3 or 4x at close range but a huge difference between 9 and 12x at the longer ranges. The .25-06 can be loaded to be an awesome long range varmint cartridge, hence my suggestion in favour of the higher power. Not sayin' I'm right or your wrong, just my thoughts and experiences.
I mostly use old steel tubed Kahles fixed 6x on my hunting rifles, they suit my purposes. For any long range work, where you are usually set up off a steady rest, I'll take higher magnification any day.

[bigfellascott]

308cool was the one who stated the 400 bit Bigfella, not me.
He set the choices. He asked for peoples thoughts on the matter, I conveyed mine. There is f-all difference between 3 or 4x at close range but a huge difference between 9 and 12x at the longer ranges. The .25-06 can be loaded to be an awesome long range varmint cartridge, hence my suggestion in favour of the higher power. Not sayin' I'm right or your wrong, just my thoughts and experiences.
I mostly use old steel tubed Kahles fixed 6x on my hunting rifles, they suit my purposes. For any long range work, where you are usually set up off a steady rest, I'll take higher magnification any day.

I wasn't talking about the 400m mate, you mentioned shooting rabbits hence needing more mag apparently, the OP only mentioned hunting Pigs, Deer, Goats and Foxes nothing about rabbits.

[308cool]

308cool was the one who stated the 400 bit Bigfella, not me.
He set the choices. He asked for peoples thoughts on the matter, I conveyed mine. There is f-all difference between 3 or 4x at close range but a huge difference between 9 and 12x at the longer ranges. The .25-06 can be loaded to be an awesome long range varmint cartridge, hence my suggestion in favour of the higher power. Not sayin' I'm right or your wrong, just my thoughts and experiences.
I mostly use old steel tubed Kahles fixed 6x on my hunting rifles, they suit my purposes. For any long range work, where you are usually set up off a steady rest, I'll take higher magnification any day.

I wasn't talking about the 400m mate, you mentioned shooting rabbits hence needing more mag apparently, the OP only mentioned hunting Pigs, Deer, Goats and Foxes nothing about rabbits.

All good guys . I appreciate both of your comments, you've given me some good info about the pro's and con's of the potential setups.

I'm thinking about getting a 17 hmr soon as well for target, bunnies, cats and fox's a bit closer in, so thats why I'm thinking the 25-06 will be more for my smallish (fox etc)-medium game out to 400 yards. I think if I was soley targeting fox's with my 25-06, which I may very well do during some hunts, I hope I'll be able to call them in a little closer then 400 yards. So that 400 yard limit is more for the larger pigs, goats, deer.

Cheers

[Gamerancher]

It's all good mate. Best bet would be to look through them side by side, at varying distances and looking at various sized "targets" out the window of the shop. ( Been a while since you could poke a rifle out the door in George St Sydney and look down the street to compare scopes )
Reticle size and type vary a fair bit and depending on the set up in the scope, some some will change in size with the magnification changes, some don't.
See what your eye prefers. Good heavy duplex's are great in low light close up work, fine ones much better for small targets further away in good light.
Hope we have helped and not further confused,

[bigfellascott]

It's all good mate. Best bet would be to look through them side by side, at varying distances and looking at various sized "targets" out the window of the shop. ( Been a while since you could poke a rifle out the door in George St Sydney and look down the street to compare scopes )
Reticle size and type vary a fair bit and depending on the set up in the scope, some some will change in size with the magnification changes, some don't.
See what your eye prefers. Good heavy duplex's are great in low light close up work, fine ones much better for small targets further away in good light.
Hope we have helped and not further confused,

Yeah always hard to know which way to go for sure, definitely look through diff brands and mag ranges to see if anything stands out and appeals to your eyes and don't forget to focus each scope you test so you get a proper idea of what they are like.

I don't like fine duplexes much, too limiting I find, I use a Nikon 3-9x50 which runs the Nikoplex Reticle (thick duplex bars running down to a fine Xhair type thing) which is good for all sorts of shooting I find from Night/low light/daylight - I've managed to remove a few bunny heads out 300m plus now using it on the Howa 204 (now put it on the Tikka 308) and dropped the 6.5-20x50 Zeiss Conquest on the 204 as it's more suited to the 204 compared to the 308 and the type of use it's used for (pigs and goats/deer etc) in scrubby/open paddocks etc. I would have happily left the 3-9 on the 204 and prefer it to use to be honest but I needed a scope on the 308 and that's what I had that would suit so it got the gig so to speak.

There's definitely pros and cons to high and low mag, you just have to work out what you can and can't live with I guess and go from there.

[308cool]

Just to add, the difference in FOV at lowest mag setting is 2.7m with the 3-9 being 11.9m and 4-12 being 9.2m. As you can already tell I don't have to much experience with scopes so, is this considered a large difference. Both Scopes come with the same reticle being standard 4 thick posts to the centre then thin posts in the middle.

Screen Shot 2017-02-25 at 5.16.43 pm.png (51 KiB) Viewed 9630 times

Cheers

[bigfellascott]

That's a Duplex Reticle - as for FOV it can make a difference when somethings moving, not so much standing still as such. I think that's a difference of around 30% between the two.

[brett1868]

There's no such thing as too much magnification....

I like to see the blood vessels in their eyes...at 500m

IMG_2990.JPG (139.05 KiB) Viewed 8808 times

[308cool]

Thanks for all the replies. All have been extremely helpful. Put an order in for 4-12x50. Although I lose a bit of low end FOV I don't think It will be too much that it has a drastic effect on closer shots. The 12x will be good for testing the loads + in the future I might try build up some 75g v-max loads for long range varminting.

Hope I've made the right choice.
Cheers

[Bent Arrow]

For what it's worth, I think you have made a good choice. I put a 4-12 x 50 on my 25-06 and love it.

[happyhunter]

I've got a 3-9x40mm on the 308 and a 2.5-12.5x42 on a 204 Ruger. Rarely use the full 12X setting, even on long shots but it does come in handy for testing hand loads.

[308cool]

So too throw a spanner in the works, just got a reply saying that the 4-12 is actually not in stock with the supplier so won't come in for a while. Should I just go back to a meopta 3-9x50?
Cheers

[Gamerancher]

Or try a different shop. Plenty of options with this interweb thingy.

[308cool]

Or try a different shop. Plenty of options with this interweb thingy.

Unfortunately I cant try a new shop because I have a deposit originally on the 3-9x50 but they have been willing to swap the scope over to different brands. They do also have quite good prices.
Cheers

[Gamerancher]

Bugger. Which shop?

[bigfellascott]

3-9 will be fine.

[Gwion]

Yep. Go the 3-9x50 and get the thing shooting already!

[308cool]

Too easy. Another rifle I'm probably looking at getting is a .308 in the future, so if I'm not happy with the 3-9 in the end I'll just grab a 4-12 with the 308 and swap the scope. Ultimate plan for me personally is a .22 for target, 25-06 loading 75g v-max for varminting, 308 for deer/adventure.
Cheers