Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

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Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by Cooper » 01 Nov 2017, 5:16 pm

After jumping of the 6.5 Creedmoor bandwagon. I just had to have a scope with 6.5 Creed written on the side. :lol:
Well not really! After buying my Creedmoor/dies/projectiles and Lapua brass I was out of money. I had pinched one of my AR optics 223 scopes of my 223. I wanted to put a scope back on my 223 when the Bushnell 6.5 Creedmoor scope popped up for $229.

The Bushnell AR optics 6.5 Creedmoor scope is relatively new. I cannot seem to find many detailed reviews. I was just expecting a normal Bushnell AR optics scope. Maybe with slightly different BDC sub tensions to suit the Creedmoor. Which would be fine. However the rectitle defiantly has smaller BDC subtension dots. Maybe too small? Whereas the 223 ones are on the large size, maybe being a little too large?

Anyway hopefully I'll test it out this weekend. Other than the slightly different looking recticle with smaller BDC dots it is just like the normal Bushnell AR optics range. Which is pretty good value for money in my opinion.
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by bladeracer » 01 Nov 2017, 5:19 pm

Do you now need to build a load that will follow those dots?
I would just use the .223 and determine what range with my load coincides with each dot. I have eight of the .223 BDC's now.
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by Cooper » 01 Nov 2017, 6:36 pm

No need to build a load that follows the dots. But I reckon I should at least have the the 6.5 creed on the 6.5 Creedmoor and the 223 scope on the 223 and see what the dots do on the correct calibres. Either way I realise the dots aren't going to line up with different loads.
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by bladeracer » 01 Nov 2017, 6:40 pm

Email Bushnell and ask for the MoA drop of the dots.
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by brett1868 » 01 Nov 2017, 6:48 pm

Cooper, have you done any reloading for the 6.5 yet? Just picked one up today and looking to see what works for others.
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by nightforcenxs » 01 Nov 2017, 7:29 pm

brett a friend of mine his mate got the tikka t3 tac a1 in 6.5 creed and hes got a old roo shooter helping him reload for it using lapua brass and 140gr projectiles my mate gave him and there using that benchmark 8208 and he said its going great accuracy is good at 100m then 200m sucks but then 300m it comes back to great again
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by Cooper » 01 Nov 2017, 8:47 pm

brett1868 wrote:Cooper, have you done any reloading for the 6.5 yet? Just picked one up today and looking to see what works for others.


Mine seem to love 120gr Amax's and was fine just using AR2208. I only bought the Amax's because they were cheap $48 for 100. I tried the 123SST with the same charge thinking they were similar. But they didn't shoot anywhere near as good as the Amax's. Definaltely need to weight sort Hornady brass. It is all over the place.

Since switching to Lapua brass and Hornady 143 Eldx's I haven't found the sweet spot. 40.1gr AR2209 for 2650fps seem to be the best. I went up to 42.5 AR2209 for 2828fps (26 inch barrel) but the accuracy seems to back in the low 40gr range.
I have just fire formed 50 Lapua cases now. So will do a bit more load development.
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by brett1868 » 01 Nov 2017, 10:42 pm

Cooper wrote:
brett1868 wrote:Cooper, have you done any reloading for the 6.5 yet? Just picked one up today and looking to see what works for others.


Mine seem to love 120gr Amax's and was fine just using AR2208. I only bought the Amax's because they were cheap $48 for 100. I tried the 123SST with the same charge thinking they were similar. But they didn't shoot anywhere near as good as the Amax's. Definaltely need to weight sort Hornady brass. It is all over the place.

Since switching to Lapua brass and Hornady 143 Eldx's I haven't found the sweet spot. 40.1gr AR2209 for 2650fps seem to be the best. I went up to 42.5 AR2209 for 2828fps (26 inch barrel) but the accuracy seems to back in the low 40gr range.
I have just fire formed 50 Lapua cases now. So will do a bit more load development.


Excellent, very close to what I guestimated so Ill give that a crack first up. What primers you using? I was thinking CCI BR4 as I've got a couple thousand in the cupboard :)
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by brett1868 » 01 Nov 2017, 10:47 pm

nightforcenxs wrote:brett a friend of mine his mate got the tikka t3 tac a1 in 6.5 creed and hes got a old roo shooter helping him reload for it using lapua brass and 140gr projectiles my mate gave him and there using that benchmark 8208 and he said its going great accuracy is good at 100m then 200m sucks but then 300m it comes back to great again



Might try some 8208 if the 2209 doesn't work out :D . Accurate at 100 & 300 but sucks at 200 makes no sense to me so I'd be curious to know how this can happen.
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by darwindingo » 02 Nov 2017, 2:16 am

brett1868 wrote:

Might try some 8208 if the 2209 doesn't work out :D . Accurate at 100 & 300 but sucks at 200 makes no sense to me so I'd be curious to know how this can happen.


Worth a try Brett, just avoid shooting at 200.... :D

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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by Cooper » 02 Nov 2017, 7:41 am

brett1868 wrote:Excellent, very close to what I guestimated so Ill give that a crack first up. What primers you using? I was thinking CCI BR4 as I've got a couple thousand in the cupboard :)


I started using S&B standard small rifle primers. I use them in everything else. Are get them for $45per 1000. But I started getting cratering at 41.5 got to 42.5 with the CCi 450 small rifle magnum primer before the same thing happened. Also the velocity increase seemed to flat line between 42.3 to 42.5 Ar2209. Which made me think it might be a sweet spot. Alas around the 40gr mark seems to be where the accuracy is.

Silver primer is CCi

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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by nightforcenxs » 02 Nov 2017, 10:32 am

yer i dont know how it loses accuracy at 200m but 300 its fine it will be a mystery on why this happens as old mate tends to argue with you when you question him :lol:
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by straightshooter » 02 Nov 2017, 3:54 pm

nightforcenxs wrote:yer i dont know how it loses accuracy at 200m but 300 its fine it will be a mystery on why this happens as old mate tends to argue with you when you question him :lol:


The answer is quite simple.
Accuracy does not improve at a longer range compared to a shorter range.
It just doesn't happen.
Yes it can get worse but never better.
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by sarki » 10 Nov 2017, 11:43 am

brett1868 wrote:Accurate at 100 & 300 but sucks at 200 makes no sense to me so I'd be curious to know how this can happen.


Is there a little wormhole in space in the middle of the range :lol:
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by nativeMan85 » 22 Feb 2018, 2:15 am

Attached is the drop zone in MoA for the BDC reticle. I got this fro Bushnell.
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by bladeracer » 22 Feb 2018, 4:35 pm

nativeMan85 wrote:Attached is the drop zone in MoA for the BDC reticle. I got this fro Bushnell.



Odd that they don't specify the dot size.
The 223BDC has 1MoA dots, and these scale at 1MoA also.
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by sungazer » 22 Feb 2018, 4:45 pm

Very close to a 140grn traveling at 2600 fps.
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by Cooper » 26 Feb 2018, 6:25 pm

AR scopes on special for $185. Includes the 223,308 and 6.5 version. I’ll probably buy a spare!
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by bladeracer » 26 Feb 2018, 6:36 pm

Cooper wrote:AR scopes on special for $185. Includes the 223,308 and 6.5 version. I’ll probably buy a spare!


Yes, I saw that. I don't really need any more just now but it's hard to pass up a deal like that :-)
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by SCJ429 » 11 May 2018, 9:26 pm

It is hard to be critical of the Bushnell AR 4.5 - 18 for $185. The optics are quite good, the turrets move OK. People say they have tracking issues. I used a friends and only wound it up 4 MOA and back. It did move the point of impact 4 inches and returned to the original zero. The only thing I didn't like was the heavy retical but it would be fine for hunting especially in low light. There are worse scopes around that cost more than $185.
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by SCJ429 » 15 Jun 2018, 10:39 pm

The 4.5 to 18 for $159, great scope for someone starting out.
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by Stix » 16 Jun 2018, 12:04 am

Wow thats cheap...
I bought one just to try it for around the $200 mark at xmas time i think...
Personally i hate it...but its certainly good value for that money...!!
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by SCJ429 » 16 Jun 2018, 6:13 pm

What do you hate about it?
I have used one and the optics were pretty good. Compared to a friends Leupold VX1 it was much better. Turrets are a little mushy but they worked pretty well. The thing I didn't like was the heavy retical but that wouldn't be a problem when hunting. I cannot think of anything else you could get for the money that comes close. I spent more on dinner last night than this scope costs. Upgrade later when you have the funds.
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by JimTom » 17 Jun 2018, 6:54 am

Seems like a pretty good deal. I paid about $700 for the scope for my 6.5CM. I tend to believe that in most cases you get what you pay for however if the cheaper scope works fine and suits the applocation ok then happy days. I will be interested to hear if the cheaper scope performs ok on your rifle.
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by bladeracer » 17 Jun 2018, 7:07 am

JimTom wrote:Seems like a pretty good deal. I paid about $700 for the scope for my 6.5CM. I tend to believe that in most cases you get what you pay for however if the cheaper scope works fine and suits the applocation ok then happy days. I will be interested to hear if the cheaper scope performs ok on your rifle.


I don't agree that you get better by paying more money, look at Ducati or Harley Davidson for evidence of that fallacy. I have this scope on all my rifles. I have run it on 8x57mm, but probably .44 Magnum is the heaviest recoil I subject them to.
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by JimTom » 17 Jun 2018, 8:09 am

bladeracer wrote:
JimTom wrote:Seems like a pretty good deal. I paid about $700 for the scope for my 6.5CM. I tend to believe that in most cases you get what you pay for however if the cheaper scope works fine and suits the applocation ok then happy days. I will be interested to hear if the cheaper scope performs ok on your rifle.


I don't agree that you get better by paying more money, look at Ducati or Harley Davidson for evidence of that fallacy. I have this scope on all my rifles. I have run it on 8x57mm, but probably .44 Magnum is the heaviest recoil I subject them to.



As I said mate, “in most cases you get what you pay for”. I agree that sometimes the more expensive item is not necessarily the best. Not being critical of the item or those who use it.I have a couple of Bushnell scopes and like the product. Was just curious to see how the more cost effective scopes handle the recoil on a centrefire.
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by Stix » 17 Jun 2018, 3:06 pm

SCJ429 wrote:What do you hate about it?
I have used one and the optics were pretty good. Compared to a friends Leupold VX1 it was much better. Turrets are a little mushy but they worked pretty well. The thing I didn't like was the heavy retical but that wouldn't be a problem when hunting. I cannot think of anything else you could get for the money that comes close. I spent more on dinner last night than this scope costs. Upgrade later when you have the funds.


Im not a fan of the dots-i think they block out too much of the target...thats not a problem for close range stuff, but with an 18 power scope you (well i) tend to want to use it at reasonable ranges...& ive no doubt that dot will take up the bulk of a rabbits head at 250 yds--thats no good for me..!!
Having said that, there are ways around that, & id happily put it on a rifle not shooting those ranges.

But i also find i need a set of vice grips to adjust parralex-it is so bludy tight its fukn ridiculous...!! & forget about "over time it will loosen up"...its just so stupidly tight it wouldnt loosen up before the glass decays to nothing...!

Also, it is not in focus when the paralex is adjusted correctly-a feature i find on many scopes sub $1.5k but its really bad on this unit.
Thats also a point i think many people dont realise--having a sight picture in focus & paralex correctly adjusted are seldom calibrated to the same point on cheap scopes....so if when hunting you dont have scope mounts at the right height for yourself "for hunting" as opposed to chasing a good cheekweld when prone LR, as so many do these days, you will miss shots & not know why-combine that with a scope thats not in focus & you have a great lead spreading powder burning & game scaring/wounding tool in your shoulder.

As well the fact it suffers from really bad chromatic aberration--basically it doesnt focus all wavelengths of light to the same plane--the result is you see the warm colours on ine side & the cool colours on tge other.

Its really poor with detail in the shadows too, & the glass relies on the coatings for 'contrast' to give you an 'apparent' sharp image, rather than an optically well resolved image.

Im not trying to be picky--it is great value for money for what you get...
But you DO mostly get what you pay for--yesterday i had the pleasure of spitting a round out of a kimber chambered in 270 that was topped with a swartsa 3-18 Z6i...

Apart from the trigger being too heavy for my liking, that outfit would be a wet dream to hunt with--& i dont like shooting 270...!!
A beautifully balanced & very sexy looking rifle in a blued walnut configuration.

Basically, ive paid as little as $450 for a bushnell elite 4500 in 4-16, & at around 2.5X the price of the scope in question, it is 10X the equipment...there is NO comparison between the two, unless you are one to compare a block of cheddar cheese with a beautiful pair of boobs...

If you could see them side by side & knew what to look for,-or spent a night spotlighting with them, fatigue would demonstrate the difference, if not sll the other factors.
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by SCJ429 » 17 Jun 2018, 8:53 pm

Thanks Stix, that is interesting. The one I used had no optical problems, I was looking through it from full sun in the afternoon until dusk. I was pretty happy with the image. The side focus was easy to operate, yours must have some issues, I would send it back. I never adjusted the retical focus, it was not my scope and it appeared pretty well focused in any case. I compared it to the cheapest Leupold, 3 - 9 and I preferred the Bushnell by far. It also has the advantage of double the magnification and target turrets.
I see your point about the retical covering up your target, I would have liked a finer one but it was quite usable.
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by bladeracer » 18 Jun 2018, 12:52 am

Stix wrote:Im not a fan of the dots-i think they block out too much of the target...thats not a problem for close range stuff, but with an 18 power scope you (well i) tend to want to use it at reasonable ranges...& ive no doubt that dot will take up the bulk of a rabbits head at 250 yds--thats no good for me..!!
Having said that, there are ways around that, & id happily put it on a rifle not shooting those ranges.

But i also find i need a set of vice grips to adjust parralex-it is so bludy tight its fukn ridiculous...!! & forget about "over time it will loosen up"...its just so stupidly tight it wouldnt loosen up before the glass decays to nothing...!

Also, it is not in focus when the paralex is adjusted correctly-a feature i find on many scopes sub $1.5k but its really bad on this unit.
Thats also a point i think many people dont realise--having a sight picture in focus & paralex correctly adjusted are seldom calibrated to the same point on cheap scopes....so if when hunting you dont have scope mounts at the right height for yourself "for hunting" as opposed to chasing a good cheekweld when prone LR, as so many do these days, you will miss shots & not know why-combine that with a scope thats not in focus & you have a great lead spreading powder burning & game scaring/wounding tool in your shoulder.

As well the fact it suffers from really bad chromatic aberration--basically it doesnt focus all wavelengths of light to the same plane--the result is you see the warm colours on ine side & the cool colours on tge other.

Its really poor with detail in the shadows too, & the glass relies on the coatings for 'contrast' to give you an 'apparent' sharp image, rather than an optically well resolved image.

Im not trying to be picky--it is great value for money for what you get...
But you DO mostly get what you pay for--yesterday i had the pleasure of spitting a round out of a kimber chambered in 270 that was topped with a swartsa 3-18 Z6i...

Apart from the trigger being too heavy for my liking, that outfit would be a wet dream to hunt with--& i dont like shooting 270...!!
A beautifully balanced & very sexy looking rifle in a blued walnut configuration.

Basically, ive paid as little as $450 for a bushnell elite 4500 in 4-16, & at around 2.5X the price of the scope in question, it is 10X the equipment...there is NO comparison between the two, unless you are one to compare a block of cheddar cheese with a beautiful pair of boobs...

If you could see them side by side & knew what to look for,-or spent a night spotlighting with them, fatigue would demonstrate the difference, if not sll the other factors.


The holdover dots are for larger game, not for plinking rabbits at 300m plus, at long ranges - well over 300m - you dial up the scope to suit. Out to 300m the holdover required for most calibers is so small as to not require a holdover dot at all. If you need to hold 150mm high you can do that very effectively based on the size of rabbit or fox. The crosshair is only 7.5mm wide at 100m, the size of a .30-caliber bullet hole.

I have eleven of these and haven't found the parallax knob to be that tight, although the zoom ring can sometimes be tighter than I'd prefer.

I haven't had this problem of not being in focus when adjusting parallax, I have not had to alter the focus ever once I've set it. I have not experienced this parallax problem, except at maximum magnification when I have no cheek weld at all, as you'd expect with any scope. Usually only a problem when I've mounted a scope temporarily for load development, I'm unlikely to go hunting with a scope mounted on a rifle in such a position.

I can't comment on the light colouring as it's not something I've ever noticed with any scope, so I can assume it's not something I need to care about.

As for spotlighting, or shooting in poor light, I don't do either. My eyesight these days is not able to cope with poor light anyway, and magnification doesn't help that. I try to include that caveat when recommending these scopes, that I don't know how suitable they are in poor light. I am out very often at night anyway and have no trouble at all seeing the eyes of foxes, rabbits, possums, and such, but I can't usually identify the animal in the scope, at least not until it is moving, so I would much rather not take a shot than risk shooting a possum, wombat, koala, cow, sheep, or a neighbours' dog. I prefer to do my hunting in light that allows perfect target identification.

Does the Elite 4500 suit all rifles, including rimfires at very close ranges? The AR Optics does, and as I specifically wanted a scope that would work equally well on all my rifles it's why I chose it. One reason I would not choose the 4500 is the capped turrets - that just annoys the hell out of me when I'm shooting.

There are two things I can think of that I would like that this scope does not offer, finer (than .25MoA) adjustment clicks, and return-to-zero stops.
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Re: Bushnell AR optics 4.5x18 (6.5 CREED)

Post by Stix » 18 Jun 2018, 2:37 pm

As i said blade, whilst i sound picky, i wasn't trying to be....it just so happens the unit i have is horrible & i slipped when mounting it so scratched the tube so cant get a refund or get it exchanged.
SCJ just asked what i hate about it & i answered.
I appreciate the scopes work for you mate, but the one i have sucks...& also as i said, they have thrir place, but ideally not for me given i like picking bunnies at couple hundred, & i also feel they would be no good for anyone wanting largely to do the same--but id be happy for one on my .222 or a hornett or something like that.
But there is a reason shooters/varminters seeking the tightest in accuracy dont use scopes with large dots over POI...however as you say, if chasing deer fair enough.
But for all round general stuff its as i said a great value scope...no argument from me there!!

One of your first points (relating to holdover hash marks out to 300 on hunting outfits-as you say if you need a 6" holdover at 300 its not necessary to use holdover hash marks or therefore dial it) counteracts your points of needing/wanting a return to zero & exposed turrets--
So im not quite sure of your points there at the beginning & end of your post..
And that is where it comes down to the individual & their priorities in features for scope selection.
My priorities are optics on walkabout hunting rifle--& the Elite i have has optical quality as good, & even better than some scopes of 3X the outlay.
Whilst i too would like the Elite scope to have these features of zero return exposed turrets etc, im happy to save at least $500 on something remotely comparible in optics ,given that these are on walk about hunting rifles, mostly for goats, & hopefully deer (if i ever get on to them). So capped turrets, return to zero & .25moa make no difference to me with shots on goats out to 300 (mind you the longest we've (2 shooters) ever busted is 14 out of a mob of 15 was 200yds).


When i speak of focus i mean a sharp image that is adjusted by the 'parallex correction" dial on the scope, im not referring to the dioptre--the dioptre is set for you eye & left. (im not suggesting thats what you thought i meant, im just trying to be clear).
...if you havnt had, or noticed that some scopes are not in focus (clearest & sharpest target image possible for that given scope) when parallex is correctly set then you are lucky...or its my eyes lol...
Being out of focus/or not quite the clearest image possible is often barely noticable, & you will not notice it in the results printed on targets at usual ranges of up to 100m (unless youre looking through the scope sideways), or out at extended ranges if you have the ability to centre your eye perfectly in the scope every time.
But id be very surprised that if you have so many of these scopes, that at least a couple of them don't suffer from this phenomenon, if not all, even if it is barely noticable if at all.

I have a Zeiss .Conquest HD5 that suffers from chromatic aberration & target being out of focus when parallex is set correctly...its easy to test...i notice it on a good deal of scopes & i suffer from bad eyes.

As for focus/parallex adjustment down to 10 metres...all i can say is that if you need that on a scope with a power of 18 magnification, i hope you got your safety gear on or youre shooting from a bullet proof bunker mate... :lol:
And If you cant shoot a goat in the head at 15 metres with a 4x-6x scope without the need to stop & adjust parallex down to 10 metres, then you be better served using the fuel to drive to the butcher... :lol: :sarcasm:

My problem (or one of many) is i come from an industry of high end optics, & whilst ive lost a lot of my ability to see the quality i used to be able to see, i can still pick these small flaws in scopes-infact they stand out to me.

And being able to see fine detail in shadows of gum tree foliage well over 600 metres in a Swarovski Z6, and not being able to see fine detail in the dirt mound at 220 metres with a $200 scope is proof that you DO sometimes get what you pay for...!!!
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