Not happy with SSAA!

Semi automatic and single shot handguns, revolvers and other pistols

Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by grandadbushy » 16 May 2018, 9:19 pm

G'day Ramslamer mate I don't know where you got your info about we're only allowed to own guns to compete ,unless you know something we don't
As far as changing the stock changes the gun to a short rifle, well there are several hand guns that were built to receive a extended stock and one is
the Luger and I think there is a couple of Russian ones but they are still classed as a hand gun
If gun clubs are going to be powerful enough to stipulate what guns can be used on their ranges without having to compete ( mind you they have to be registered)
then we are wasting our money joining them because they are in the position to diminish our rights to own a gun for the legal reason we chose to use them
Also sport ,any sport is used for having fun, good , clean , legal fun
All comp shooting has rules like caliber, safety, points scoring and various others so its like you can't put a truck in a formula 1 race so you must have guide lines and controls

The more I read about this post the more I believe I have wasted my money by joining the ssaa as we don't have to be part of it or a club up here to own a gun
so there you go we can own a gun for hunting and feral control not only comps
If gun clubs are going to let only people in comps to shoot on their ranges then in my opinion they are about to loose a lot of revenue through non comp people
not being able to shoot there, not everybody wants to be in comps
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Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by brett1868 » 16 May 2018, 11:16 pm

Stix, mate...Ramslamer's having a crack at the NFA through sarcasm rather then endorsing it. He's pretty well nailed it as the govt fella doesn't want us having any fun with guns cause it upsets them. (NSW Centric) When a club is formed they get endorsed by the registry as to what competitions they can run which then dictates what PTA's can be approved in conjunction to the ranges caliber approvals. If you join a club focused purely on ISSF completion based at a range approved for only 22LR then getting a PTA for a .357 cannot happen. That said, there's no rule about how many clubs you can belong to provding you notify the registry which one is your primary for reporting purposes. I'm a member of 2 pistol clubs at the moment and about to join a 3rd purely because it's an outdoor range and I can shoot my Colt Walker 44 ther :)
As I'm also member of another club that runs virtually the full spectrum of comps I've been fortunate enough to be able to buy pretty much anything I've liked by way of pistols because the club is approved for competitions that use them. Remember the "Genuine Need" clause....I've no shortage of Genuine Need with 3 clubs and a son in a pistol club with me :)
It's stupid, I know but that's the rules we have to play by a the moment. I'd love to see recreational hunting with pistols made legal, it's a nice fit between bows and rifles.
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Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by sungazer » 17 May 2018, 9:32 am

I dont think that will ever happen in my life time. I just cant see a few blokes going camping and all wearing sidearms. Can you imagine the amount of guns that would suddenly be bought. Not that i mind that but it would be a massive flood.
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Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by Stix » 17 May 2018, 11:52 pm

Hi Brett,
Well maybe i read ramslammers post differently.
To be honest, being a first post, sounded to me like a SSAA member/heirachy/defendant/overlord doing the 'passive aggressive' giving of reasons (by way of playing devils advocate) why the OP had/has the issues at the said club with his pistol...(& those reasons appear all fair enough & ive not an issue with that).

Now i can only dream of having the time & money to be a handgunner, but im not, so ive no overwhelming need to understand why any club cant give an 'open' comp for anyything/everything in legal handgun, just to satisfy the 'genuine need' clauses.

So if i read it wrong, im happy to apologise to ramslammer, & i would make a point of doing so if he isnt a SSAA official trying to defend the poor treatment the SSAA gave to the OP...!!

Unfortunately the reality is, that the culture i 'reacted' to, DOES exist in certain ranks.
And at the end of the day, the OP should have been given all relevant info immediately, but unfortunately he wasnt. Rather, going by what he has said, he's been made to feel the persecuted one...and i believe THAT is the main point here, & a point that appears to rear its ugly head all too often.
:D

As for hunting with handguns...it should be allowed...period.
Ive not been lucky enough to ever go pigging, but from what i hear, i wouldnt want to go in thick bushland chasing big bad bobby boar without a decent handgun strapped to my leg.
Handgun/small .22lr pistol would also be handy strapped to leg for general hunting to dispatch wounded animals.
And, i confess, it would also be 'no fun at all' to use one on that very occasional but not so skitchy rabbit that sits 3 metres from the car blinded by the blitz. :shock:
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Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by Rod_outbak » 18 May 2018, 6:22 am

Stix,

The few times I've ventured into pork-infested scrub, I'd recommend clutching something bitey like a short-barrelled .30-30, with a big-arse handgun as your backup.
[There is something much more comforting in knowing that if the damn rifle jams, you can flog a pig to death with the .30-30 before Mrs Porkey takes your leg off, if need be...]

A semi-auto shotgun also works wonders as Plan A, in thick scrub.

Personally, I find handguns really useful for carrying on a bike, but I find they arent quite as fantastic when using them as the primary hunting weapon. Probably the fact that a .30-30 can nail anything from 2 metres, right out past 150 metres, without hassle.
[Might be slightly different if I had a .357 Magnum, I suppose.... .45's fly like bricks.]

And one of my most enjoyable moments with a handgun, has been blowing feral cats out of a tree with .45 shotshells, at 11pm.
WHY a pair of feral toms would be stupid enough to have fight in the gum tree outside my bedroom is a mystery, but the only one laughing after the gunfire ended, was Roddy...

Cheers,

Rod.
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Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by Rod_outbak » 24 May 2018, 7:24 am

I have a mate who lives and works in Rockhampton (QLD), and used to shoot at one of the local SSAA ranges. He shoots distance regularly, and is teaching his son to shoot responsibly. He is also one of a hunting team that comes out here to my property once or twice a year, and I find him a very responsible shooter.

He was prevented from wearing a deer-stalker-style cap at the range, as it had a camo pattern on it.
He was informed that ANY camo clothing was not allowed, as it made the organisation look 'too-military'.
I cant find any reference to camo clothing in any SSAA QLD range policies or rules.
There are a LOT of hunters(ie sporting shooters) in the US who have been using camo for longer than the military have...

The ONLY place I can find any reference to the crime of wearing camo, is in the CWM QLD conditions, and that states camo or black clothing is verboten unless expressly instructed for conservation management purposes.
http://cwm.ssaaqld.org.au/2013/index.ph ... of-conduct (Item 12)

Pretty freaking childish. Most sporting shooters 60 years ago were using military gear, as it was what was available.
Why does the SSAA have a fear of being vaguely associated with the military?

SSAA membership? Thanks, but no thanks...
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Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by Daddybang » 24 May 2018, 7:49 am

Rod_outbak wrote:Stix,

The few times I've ventured into pork-infested scrub, I'd recommend clutching something bitey like a short-barrelled .30-30, with a big-arse handgun as your backup.
[There is something much more comforting in knowing that if the damn rifle jams, you can flog a pig to death with the .30-30 before Mrs Porkey takes your leg off, if need
Cheers,

Rod.



I spend a fair bit of time in thick teatree scrub chasing pigs and I agree 100%. Something short barreled either lever or pump with a good punch behind it is essential in the thick sh#t :drinks:
Would love a handgun for back up but I'm not eligible! :drinks:
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Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by bladeracer » 24 May 2018, 10:30 am

Rod_outbak wrote:I have a mate who lives and works in Rockhampton (QLD), and used to shoot at one of the local SSAA ranges. He shoots distance regularly, and is teaching his son to shoot responsibly. He is also one of a hunting team that comes out here to my property once or twice a year, and I find him a very responsible shooter.

He was prevented from wearing a deer-stalker-style cap at the range, as it had a camo pattern on it.
He was informed that ANY camo clothing was not allowed, as it made the organisation look 'too-military'.
I cant find any reference to camo clothing in any SSAA QLD range policies or rules.
There are a LOT of hunters(ie sporting shooters) in the US who have been using camo for longer than the military have...

The ONLY place I can find any reference to the crime of wearing camo, is in the CWM QLD conditions, and that states camo or black clothing is verboten unless expressly instructed for conservation management purposes.
http://cwm.ssaaqld.org.au/2013/index.ph ... of-conduct (Item 12)

Pretty freaking childish. Most sporting shooters 60 years ago were using military gear, as it was what was available.
Why does the SSAA have a fear of being vaguely associated with the military?

SSAA membership? Thanks, but no thanks...


I've seen a document from SSAA banning camo clothing at their ranges. I noted it because I live in camo clothing since moving to Victoria. My warmest clothing is hunting clothing, and I'm always bloody freezing! Currently my most comfortable boots happen to be camo as well, so I was expecting them to be banned if I had attended the Lever Action Nationals.

So a camo cap is "too military" but I'd be fine wearing fatigues, GP's and giggle hat?
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Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by sungazer » 24 May 2018, 11:51 am

At least the Spike Cammo beenie can be turned inside out to bright orange. :D
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Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by Smiley » 24 May 2018, 12:03 pm

Rod_outbak wrote:I have a mate who lives and works in Rockhampton (QLD), and used to shoot at one of the local SSAA ranges. He shoots distance regularly, and is teaching his son to shoot responsibly. He is also one of a hunting team that comes out here to my property once or twice a year, and I find him a very responsible shooter.

He was prevented from wearing a deer-stalker-style cap at the range, as it had a camo pattern on it.
He was informed that ANY camo clothing was not allowed, as it made the organisation look 'too-military'.
I cant find any reference to camo clothing in any SSAA QLD range policies or rules.
There are a LOT of hunters(ie sporting shooters) in the US who have been using camo for longer than the military have...

The ONLY place I can find any reference to the crime of wearing camo, is in the CWM QLD conditions, and that states camo or black clothing is verboten unless expressly instructed for conservation management purposes.
http://cwm.ssaaqld.org.au/2013/index.ph ... of-conduct (Item 12)

Pretty freaking childish. Most sporting shooters 60 years ago were using military gear, as it was what was available.
Why does the SSAA have a fear of being vaguely associated with the military?

SSAA membership? Thanks, but no thanks...

The "no camo" thing would be the branch rules, not necessarily a state or national rule.
My club also has this in the standing orders with the exception of caps. It's not military association that we are avoiding, it's the perceived "tacticool commando wannabe " image that our sport can do without.
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Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by Gaznazdiak » 24 May 2018, 12:05 pm

Stix wrote:
Ramslamer wrote:Ok - I will play Devils Advocate. What is the reason we are allowed to own handguns in Australia ? Hunting ? NO - Self Defense ? Big NO - The only reason we are allowed to own a handgun in Australia is to compete in target shooting competitions. That it!! To have fun was definitely not part ... ... ...


Interesting first post... 8-)

So what your saying is...you can shoot a pistol at a SSAA range as long as...
1) it is legal...
2) SSAA club representatives/officials allow it...
And 3) YOU DONT HAVE FUN...!!!

And its interesting to note that point 3 is the point you again reiterate at the end... :?
I can't believe you said that...!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Lets all be miserable & not enjoy our sport folks... :crazy:
fair dinkum, ive heard some pretty stupid defensive & dictatory arguements before but thats a gem...!!!

I dont know how other ranges work, but i just dont understand why there cant just be an "open" class for firearms owners to enjoy shooting what they legally own.


I agree with your last para wholeheartedly, but the sad fact is our beaurocraps want to make Australia into the place where Fun comes to die.
One of their main objections to chronically ill people getting relief from their condition by using cannabis is that one of the constituents that relieves pain is the euphoria enducing THC.
God forbid a dying person should feel good while they are on the way out.
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Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by bladeracer » 24 May 2018, 12:27 pm

Smiley wrote:The "no camo" thing would be the branch rules, not necessarily a state or national rule.
My club also has this in the standing orders with the exception of caps. It's not military association that we are avoiding, it's the perceived "tacticool commando wannabe " image that our sport can do without.


I saw it in a document on the SSAA site, not a branch site.
I'll see if I can find it...
The Standard Rules "strongly discourage" camo.
Can't find anything about actually banning it, so you may be right about that being down at branch level.
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Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by Wylie27 » 24 May 2018, 12:46 pm

Ipsc shooters cant wear camo when participating in comps either and that internationally..
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Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by sungazer » 24 May 2018, 12:48 pm

It may have also to do with the way a SSAA range is run. ie A cease fire is called and all people can go forward of the firing line and to different distances to check and replace targets. I have seen some ranges that dictate that orange safety vests are worn when going beyond a certain distance or actually informing the RO. So rather than any political agenda it may just be a safety precaution. A lot of the safety rules have been put in place after a specific incident to try and prevent that happening again.
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Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by Ziad » 24 May 2018, 1:46 pm

Honestly though I think someone in ssaa realized that ppl wearing camo gear are invisible... maybe that's why the rules. Just imagine the RO feeling confused maybe even have a heart attack if they see just a head and two hands running towards them when in reality it was blade in his camo jacket, pants and shoes
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Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by Rod_outbak » 24 May 2018, 4:39 pm

bladeracer,

Is there any chance that SSAA have different 'Standard Rules', dependant on your shooting discipline??
Reason I ask, is that I actually pulled the standard rules from the national SSAA website before posting, and this is whats on the current one (2015):

2.4.5 Safety Equipment
It is strongly recommended that ear and eye protection be worn at all
times by persons who are in the vicinity of the firing line whilst shooting
is underway.
It is recommended that suitable clothing, including enclosed shoes or
boots, be worn at all times by a competitor whilst engaged in the
competition and in the vicinity of the firing line.

A competitor may wear medical equipment which may be seen as giving
support if a medical certificate confirming the competitor's need to wear
such a device for health reasons is submitted to the National Discipline
Chairman and / or Discipline Subcommittee for approval prior to the
commencement of the competition.

2.5 STUCK LIVE ROUND: MANDATORY RULE etc etc etc...

Interesting that they've changed it, OR, there are different 'Standard Rules' for different disciplines.

My version is titled: "SSAA STANDARD RULES
OFFICIAL NATIONAL RULES
Revised 2015
No. 5..."

Cheers,

Rod.
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Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by bladeracer » 24 May 2018, 4:42 pm

Rod_outbak wrote:bladeracer,

Is there any chance that SSAA have different 'Standard Rules', dependant on your shooting discipline??
Reason I ask, is that I actually pulled the standard rules from the national SSAA website before posting, and this is whats on the current one (2015):

2.4.5 Safety Equipment
It is strongly recommended that ear and eye protection be worn at all
times by persons who are in the vicinity of the firing line whilst shooting
is underway.
It is recommended that suitable clothing, including enclosed shoes or
boots, be worn at all times by a competitor whilst engaged in the
competition and in the vicinity of the firing line.

A competitor may wear medical equipment which may be seen as giving
support if a medical certificate confirming the competitor's need to wear
such a device for health reasons is submitted to the National Discipline
Chairman and / or Discipline Subcommittee for approval prior to the
commencement of the competition.

2.5 STUCK LIVE ROUND: MANDATORY RULE etc etc etc...

Interesting that they've changed it, OR, there are different 'Standard Rules' for different disciplines.

My version is titled: "SSAA STANDARD RULES
OFFICIAL NATIONAL RULES
Revised 2015
No. 5..."

Cheers,

Rod.


This is the one I grabbed when I posted that picture from it.
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Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by brett1868 » 24 May 2018, 9:45 pm

A competitor may wear medical equipment which may be seen as giving
support if a medical certificate confirming the competitor's need to wear
such a device for health reasons is submitted to the National Discipline
Chairman and / or Discipline Subcommittee for approval prior to the
commencement of the competition.


Wylie27 is probably thinking to himself if a strap-on is classed as medical equipment and can he get a Dr. Cert for it. :lol: :lol: :lol:

Sorry mate, sometimes that inner 14yr old gets loose and I can't help it.
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