Not happy with SSAA!

Semi automatic and single shot handguns, revolvers and other pistols

Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by bullzeye » 07 May 2018, 9:36 am

This is why I'm not interested in joining the SSAA. They apply additional red tape and regulations ontop of what is already too much.

What the NSW APA dictates is enough for me :-)
User avatar
bullzeye
Corporal
Corporal
 
Posts: 143
New South Wales

Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by brett1868 » 07 May 2018, 11:44 am

sungazer wrote:Are you still off to the US this year Brett?


That's the plan, still working on the logistics of getting my gear to New Mexico and if I should take the boy or not. There's not many juniors and the prizes for them are quite generous so he'd be in with a good chance for sure :)
How's my posting?
Complaints, Concerns - 13 11 14
User avatar
brett1868
Lieutenant General
Lieutenant General
 
Posts: 3283
New South Wales

Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by sungazer » 07 May 2018, 4:09 pm

Nice idea just for the experience for him its another world over there "Sir".
sungazer
Major
Major
 
Posts: 1622
Other

Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by deye243 » 10 May 2018, 4:00 pm

Smiley wrote:A new member to our club applied for 2 handguns which had a "tactical" appearance, and this application had to be endorsed by the club.
Our Secretary spoke directly with someone at Qld WLB and who was a little supprised that we approved the use of these at our range because he said, most clubs wont allow them. Our Secretary's reply was something like "I can't see why not".

Personally I'm a bit turned off by the whole tacticool thing, but we should stand united against the unrelenting pressure on gun ownership.
The SSAA is not the first organisation to think of itself, I remember back in 96 when the SSAA campained against the Howard government and asked for backing from the NRAA (or whatever they were called then), but the attitude from them was "well we don't use semi autos so it won't affect us".


yes I remember this very well :evil:
User avatar
deye243
Second Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
 
Posts: 788
Victoria

Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by grandadbushy » 10 May 2018, 9:22 pm

I've listened to and read the posts on this issue and can't understand why gun clubs stop people from using guns of any description (other than caliber )
but others cater for those calibers
Providing they are legal, How can they take the position of the government whilst the guns are legally registered by the very governments
If the gov wins and these guns are made illegal well then it is understandable they will not be allowed to be used in clubs but until then I would be asking the clubs
to Please Explain why these guns are being knocked back in some clubs because to me it certainly don't sound right
I have only just joined and I do now wonder if I have wasted my money but I suppose I have 12mths to think about that and my decision will not be made lightly
grandadbushy
Captain
Captain
 
Posts: 1354
Queensland

Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by bladeracer » 10 May 2018, 10:17 pm

grandadbushy wrote:I've listened to and read the posts on this issue and can't understand why gun clubs stop people from using guns of any description (other than caliber )
but others cater for those calibers
Providing they are legal, How can they take the position of the government whilst the guns are legally registered by the very governments
If the gov wins and these guns are made illegal well then it is understandable they will not be allowed to be used in clubs but until then I would be asking the clubs
to Please Explain why these guns are being knocked back in some clubs because to me it certainly don't sound right
I have only just joined and I do now wonder if I have wasted my money but I suppose I have 12mths to think about that and my decision will not be made lightly


I came back to SSAA, primarily due to arguments put forward by members here, after giving up on them decades ago. I gave them a go as part of supporting all firearm owners, but have been singularly disappointed. I consider them nothing more than a self-serving insurance company, and not a very good one of those. The emails I have sent to various clubs and organisations listed on the SSAA website have singularly gone unanswered. I understand that many of these contacts are nothing more than people like myself that have volunteered to be a "contact" for their sport, but it is pointless making such details available if nobody monitors messages, or ever responds to them in any way.

I did a tally of my shooting room and decided that I actually have a great deal of money invested in my firearms, ammunition and associated equipment already, with no sign of slowing growth. At last, something the SSAA is good for, so I emailed SSAA to ask their advice about insuring it all...and heard nothing. Our insurer asked me to provide an inventory so they can specifically include it in our property insurance, but I am a little hesitant to provide that level of detail to a company without knowing their stance on firearms (obviously they tell me they understand country people owning firearms, but that is very different from actually supporting us). Is there a firearm-friendly insurer I can use other than SSAA?
Practice Strict Gun Control - Precision Counts!
User avatar
bladeracer
Field Marshal
Field Marshal
 
Posts: 4363
Victoria

Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by deye243 » 10 May 2018, 11:01 pm

just wait till you have to make a claim
User avatar
deye243
Second Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
 
Posts: 788
Victoria

Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by deye243 » 10 May 2018, 11:02 pm

I wont give the ssaa the steam off my ####

they did nothing after julian knight and gave up after Martin Bryant pack of lefty scum
User avatar
deye243
Second Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
 
Posts: 788
Victoria

Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by deye243 » 10 May 2018, 11:07 pm

and yes this will be deleted just like most of my content
User avatar
deye243
Second Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
 
Posts: 788
Victoria

Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by Smiley » 11 May 2018, 5:54 am

grandadbushy wrote:I've listened to and read the posts on this issue and can't understand why gun clubs stop people from using guns of any description (other than caliber )
but others cater for those calibers
Providing they are legal, How can they take the position of the government whilst the guns are legally registered by the very governments
If the gov wins and these guns are made illegal well then it is understandable they will not be allowed to be used in clubs but until then I would be asking the clubs
to Please Explain why these guns are being knocked back in some clubs because to me it certainly don't sound right
I have only just joined and I do now wonder if I have wasted my money but I suppose I have 12mths to think about that and my decision will not be made lightly

From my understanding clubs cannot endorse a handgun that cannot be used in one of the matches they shoot. For example if the club only shot Single Action, then they legally cannot endorse a semi automatic.
But I agree. If it is otherwise legal, how can the club be the judge?
Smiley
Lance Corporal
Lance Corporal
 
Posts: 65
Queensland

Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by sungazer » 11 May 2018, 9:00 am

i suppose you make a good point. As there are usage at club requirements so if it cant be used at that club you should be asking and be a member of the club where it can be used.
Last edited by sungazer on 11 May 2018, 1:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
sungazer
Major
Major
 
Posts: 1622
Other

Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by grandadbushy » 11 May 2018, 12:03 pm

From my position my view on the matter is unbiased as I have never shot in a club and may never do so and what I read seams to be one sided in favor
the clubs
And yeah Smiley the law should govern what can be used in clubs ''If they have the facility'' not clubs because I feel that if clubs are given the power to decide then if you get the wrong person in power in the club it then has the potential to reek havoc on our gun laws if the gov sees fit to follow through as we would not have a body to protect us
I know that some gun clubs don't have the facility to cater for some guns as I said previously but they can still be used at clubs that can provide for them
Do these clubs have a range where one can go to just fire of some shots or set your scope up, if so why can't these guns be used there rather than ban them
from the club
From what I've read its of my opinion that politics are running high in the club management as well as ego's and personal grievances with some people
but at the end of the day you can bet your life the government will be watching with intent to change the gun laws when the opportunity presents itself
so with clubs making their own laws it would be easy for corruption from the gov to set in especially if clubs are starting to knock back ''Legal '' guns
Big statement I know I could be wrong but I don't think so because once governments know these guns can't be used at clubs even though they are legal
they will be gone
The only good thing I can see is that these guns can still be used in some other clubs so far and this is a benefit to some shooters for now

Things certainly would get people thinking about not joining the ssaa or clubs for that matter but a mass exodus from either would not fix the matter
or be beneficial in any way for stable gun laws this is why I said in another section here that my decision would not be done lightly

One thing I see that has me worried is that if you are a member of the ssaa and only the ssaa then it is ok in some states to hold a gun licence
( This will probably differ from state to state )
Now with the gov giving the ssaa the exclusive right then this becomes a bargaining power for the gov against the gun laws in other words the government
has the potential to have the ssaa on a string and it will take the proper people in the ssaa management to repel the gov advances on gun laws and i'm
not sure that has happened of late
The only thing we can do is stand up for our rights at clubs and ''DEMAND'' answers when we are fronted with these stupid happenings of individual bans
or any other bans we find unusually different
grandadbushy
Captain
Captain
 
Posts: 1354
Queensland

Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by trekin » 12 May 2018, 6:32 am

deye243 wrote:
Smiley wrote:A new member to our club applied for 2 handguns which had a "tactical" appearance, and this application had to be endorsed by the club.
Our Secretary spoke directly with someone at Qld WLB and who was a little supprised that we approved the use of these at our range because he said, most clubs wont allow them. Our Secretary's reply was something like "I can't see why not".

Personally I'm a bit turned off by the whole tacticool thing, but we should stand united against the unrelenting pressure on gun ownership.
The SSAA is not the first organisation to think of itself, I remember back in 96 when the SSAA campained against the Howard government and asked for backing from the NRAA (or whatever they were called then), but the attitude from them was "well we don't use semi autos so it won't affect us".


yes I remember this very well :evil:


Whereas, here in QLD, this was the attitude of the QRA (the NRAA's QLD branch) AND SSAA QLD. At the time, I was a full bore shooter and member of the QRA since the mid '80's, and in '96/97 my two eldest were coming of age and showing an interest in the shooting sports. I thought, at the time, that they should join a small bore club for coaching and training as a way to ease into full bore. Well long story short, was very curtly told by the president of the local small bore club, which was run by the SSAA, that we couldn't join because, as far as he was concerned, the only reason I wanted to join was to keep my semi's. You will also have to understand that the then QLD Govt was willing to buck Howard and the NFA to allow semis for compettion use IF they had the support of the, then, major organisations, that being the SSAA and QRA. Also at the time, I was a member of a local miltary rifle club affiliated with SSAA and we got the same response from SSAA State.
Image Rifle stock and pistol grip reproduction.
"legally obligated to be a victim in this country"
User avatar
trekin
Sergeant
Sergeant
 
Posts: 385
Queensland

Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by Ramslamer » 15 May 2018, 5:53 pm

Ok - I will play Devils Advocate. What is the reason we are allowed to own handguns in Australia ? Hunting ? NO - Self Defense ? Big NO - The only reason we are allowed to own a handgun in Australia is to compete in target shooting competitions. That it!! To have fun was definitely not part of the National Firearms Agreement agreed to by all states after the Howard buy back. If memory serves that agreement also specified that such competitions should lead to State and National Championships, Commonwealth and Olympic Games.
Target shooting competitions all have a set of rules and those rules usually define the types of handgun allowed in that particular match. Most match rules allow a multitude of different handgun types but none that I can think of allow a shoulder stock. It might be licensed a handgun but by fitting the kit you have turned it into a short rifle. This is where the SSAA is coming from - If there is no match that allows such a pistol to be used then, to comply with their Insurance Policies, they cannot allow it to be shot on their ranges. Victoria even have a big notice on their web site - check it out.
http://ssaavic.com.au/carbine-kits-bann ... al-issues/
I am sure all other States have or will, in the near future, follow suit - So that's it folks - if you bought a handgun to have fun best sell it now while you still can.
Ramslamer
Private
Private
 
Posts: 3
Queensland

Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by Smiley » 16 May 2018, 5:08 pm

I think everyone is agreeing with that, but the gripe is that some clubs are not endorsing handguns that are allowed in the rules of competitions they host, based on personal tastes.
:unknown:
Smiley
Lance Corporal
Lance Corporal
 
Posts: 65
Queensland

Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by Stix » 16 May 2018, 8:08 pm

Ramslamer wrote:Ok - I will play Devils Advocate. What is the reason we are allowed to own handguns in Australia ? Hunting ? NO - Self Defense ? Big NO - The only reason we are allowed to own a handgun in Australia is to compete in target shooting competitions. That it!! To have fun was definitely not part ... ... ...


Interesting first post... 8-)

So what your saying is...you can shoot a pistol at a SSAA range as long as...
1) it is legal...
2) SSAA club representatives/officials allow it...
And 3) YOU DONT HAVE FUN...!!!

And its interesting to note that point 3 is the point you again reiterate at the end... :?
I can't believe you said that...!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Lets all be miserable & not enjoy our sport folks... :crazy:
fair dinkum, ive heard some pretty stupid defensive & dictatory arguements before but thats a gem...!!!

I dont know how other ranges work, but i just dont understand why there cant just be an "open" class for firearms owners to enjoy shooting what they legally own.
The man who knows everything, doesnt really know everything...he's just stopped learning...
Stix
Major
Major
 
Posts: 1685
South Australia

Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by grandadbushy » 16 May 2018, 9:19 pm

G'day Ramslamer mate I don't know where you got your info about we're only allowed to own guns to compete ,unless you know something we don't
As far as changing the stock changes the gun to a short rifle, well there are several hand guns that were built to receive a extended stock and one is
the Luger and I think there is a couple of Russian ones but they are still classed as a hand gun
If gun clubs are going to be powerful enough to stipulate what guns can be used on their ranges without having to compete ( mind you they have to be registered)
then we are wasting our money joining them because they are in the position to diminish our rights to own a gun for the legal reason we chose to use them
Also sport ,any sport is used for having fun, good , clean , legal fun
All comp shooting has rules like caliber, safety, points scoring and various others so its like you can't put a truck in a formula 1 race so you must have guide lines and controls

The more I read about this post the more I believe I have wasted my money by joining the ssaa as we don't have to be part of it or a club up here to own a gun
so there you go we can own a gun for hunting and feral control not only comps
If gun clubs are going to let only people in comps to shoot on their ranges then in my opinion they are about to loose a lot of revenue through non comp people
not being able to shoot there, not everybody wants to be in comps
grandadbushy
Captain
Captain
 
Posts: 1354
Queensland

Re: Not happy with SSAA!

Post by brett1868 » 16 May 2018, 11:16 pm

Stix, mate...Ramslamer's having a crack at the NFA through sarcasm rather then endorsing it. He's pretty well nailed it as the govt fella doesn't want us having any fun with guns cause it upsets them. (NSW Centric) When a club is formed they get endorsed by the registry as to what competitions they can run which then dictates what PTA's can be approved in conjunction to the ranges caliber approvals. If you join a club focused purely on ISSF completion based at a range approved for only 22LR then getting a PTA for a .357 cannot happen. That said, there's no rule about how many clubs you can belong to provding you notify the registry which one is your primary for reporting purposes. I'm a member of 2 pistol clubs at the moment and about to join a 3rd purely because it's an outdoor range and I can shoot my Colt Walker 44 ther :)
As I'm also member of another club that runs virtually the full spectrum of comps I've been fortunate enough to be able to buy pretty much anything I've liked by way of pistols because the club is approved for competitions that use them. Remember the "Genuine Need" clause....I've no shortage of Genuine Need with 3 clubs and a son in a pistol club with me :)
It's stupid, I know but that's the rules we have to play by a the moment. I'd love to see recreational hunting with pistols made legal, it's a nice fit between bows and rifles.
How's my posting?
Complaints, Concerns - 13 11 14
User avatar
brett1868
Lieutenant General
Lieutenant General
 
Posts: 3283
New South Wales

PreviousNext

Back to top
 
Return to Pistols - Semi-automatic handguns and revolvers