Building a proper first aid kit

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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Norton » 28 Nov 2017, 1:55 pm

sungazer wrote:I haven't heard of the blood clotting stuff before. There is no way I would give it to someone though. You might cause them to have a stroke and die. I agree with the comment on not doing something I didn't know how to do as well.


If you don't know anything about it how are you making the leap to it causing someone a stroke and killing them?

Tone down the drama a bit :lol:

You know you apply it to a wound, you're not injecting something into the bloodstream etc.
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Norton » 28 Nov 2017, 2:34 pm

Yeah it's applied externally :thumbsup:
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Gormanchov » 10 Dec 2017, 3:10 pm

The quick clot he’s talking about is the probably the bandage impregnated with kaolin, look up the videos on its use. Warning it’s pretty bloody but very impressive.
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by holden4th » 10 Dec 2017, 5:23 pm

What you put in your First Aid kit should reflect both your experience and your knowledge. You also have to think about what you are legally able to do to another person, especially if that person is unconscious.

I was a paramedic at one stage and our first aid kits beggared belief. However, we were trained to use them effectively. Most people have only basic training and their kits should reflect this.

So what do we want to do with our kits. The majority of incidents involve bleeding of some kind and that can require something as simple as a bandaid or something larger to stem major blood flow. (BTW,this should almost never include a tourniquet - there is one excepetion here). Snake bite is another consideration and compression bandages should always be included.

Other bandages could include slings to help immobilise a compromised limb but yet again, you have to know how to use them.

Saline solution for washing out wounds (especially those involving eyes) is something that everyone can use.

As a first aider, is it really your responsibility to a remove foreign object with the likes of tweezers? (I saw forceps mentioned and shuddered) or should that be left to the medical professionals.

I saw clotting compounds mentioned. Unless you are a haemophiliac, your blood has it's own clotting compounds which respond to contact with air. Compressing the wound is the way to go and let nature take its course. This applies to arterial bleeds as well.

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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Lorgar » 14 Dec 2017, 1:39 pm

In a typical setting I'd agree with much of what you've said there holden4th, but I think you've missed the point.

As outlined in my original post, the purpose of my would-be kit is to provide a degree of aid for a serious injury when literally no alternative is available, either due to distance, accessibility, no communication, or some combination of all three.

If help was 10 minutes down the road and a phone call away, that would be the first action, obviously.

For the record, I have no illusions about being a paramedic, doctor, or any other variety of medical "expert". My experience and knowledge extend only as far as being an intelligent, rational guy who can act in that fashion and render what aid I reasonably can until a better alternative can be reached, however long that might take.
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Oldbloke » 14 Dec 2017, 9:30 pm

I have followed this with some interest. Just wondering if we are about to be attacked by the yellow hords?
All seems way over the top for a hunting trip.
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by albat » 16 Dec 2017, 10:05 pm

If you go places off the grid lorgar the first $250 bucks you spend on a bit of medical kit should be on a plb imho ,and dont forget to update your travel itenery with amsa.gov.au every time you go bush
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Daddybang » 17 Dec 2017, 7:08 am

albat wrote:If you go places off the grid lorgar the first $250 bucks you spend on a bit of medical kit should be on a plb imho ,and dont forget to update your travel itenery with amsa.gov.au every time you go bush



I agree that a plb is an essential itrm when going bush but it can still be hours or more(depending on many factors) before help arrives :drinks:

Oldbloke wrote:I have followed this with some interest. Just wondering if we are about to be attacked by the yellow hords?
All seems way over the top for a hunting trip.


Op not really looking at simple hunting trips but those occasions when ya in the middle of nowhere with any sort of help being a long long way off and having sh@t go badly wrong. :drinks: :drinks:
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by tom604 » 17 Dec 2017, 12:44 pm

are you going to carry it /short walks/all day or car based ,, just a "get me back to the car one will be pretty basic while a car one you can have all the bells and whistles, my walk around kit has bandaids, panamax, two large wound, one small wound,one roll of crepe bandage. i always carry a roll of electrical tape for the muzzle and for when the bandaids wont cut it, plus gloves that i use on what i shoot ,double use :thumbsup: if your out and about all you need to carry is enough to get you back to the car :thumbsup:
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Lorgar » 18 Dec 2017, 2:48 pm

Daddybang wrote:
Oldbloke wrote:I have followed this with some interest. Just wondering if we are about to be attacked by the yellow hords?
All seems way over the top for a hunting trip.


Op not really looking at simple hunting trips but those occasions when ya in the middle of nowhere with any sort of help being a long long way off and having sh@t go badly wrong. :drinks: :drinks:


Yup... I don't know how to explain this any clearer than I already have so might have to leave you puzzled OB :lol:
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Lorgar » 18 Dec 2017, 2:48 pm

tom604 wrote:are you going to carry it /short walks/all day or car based ,, just a "get me back to the car one will be pretty basic while a car one you can have all the bells and whistles


This will be vehicle based. No carry kit.
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by bladeracer » 18 Dec 2017, 3:13 pm

tom604 wrote:if your out and about all you need to carry is enough to get you back to the car :thumbsup:


That's assuming you can still move around.
Even a badly twisted ankle can make it almost impossible to return to your vehicle in some terrain.
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Lorgar » 18 Dec 2017, 4:33 pm

bladeracer wrote:That's assuming you can still move around.
Even a badly twisted ankle can make it almost impossible to return to your vehicle in some terrain.


A colleague of mine has gone through this... He was out camping with his son who is about 8 (not much help in an emergency) and had an embankment of some sort give way under him resulting in a fall and a broken kneecap and tibia.

If I remember right this happened about 800m from his truck/camp, and crawling back took somewhere in the neighbourhood of 4 hours. Good times, hey? :?

Thankfully they weren't too far from reception and being able to call for help, he was able to drive a short distance to be able to make a call then wait for rescue.

Off topic to this particular point, but on the subject of accidents and first aid, I've also had a friend lose his dog to snakebite while camping.

My point being real s**t does actually happen. Not often, granted, but like every bit of safety gear in my truck I'd rather have it and never use it than not have it at all.
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by bladeracer » 18 Dec 2017, 4:48 pm

Lorgar wrote:My point being real s**t does actually happen. Not often, granted, but like every bit of safety gear in my truck I'd rather have it and never use it than not have it at all.


Yep, I'd rather have stuff I don't need than not have stuff I do need.
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by tom604 » 18 Dec 2017, 7:17 pm

bladeracer wrote:
Lorgar wrote:My point being real s**t does actually happen. Not often, granted, but like every bit of safety gear in my truck I'd rather have it and never use it than not have it at all.


Yep, I'd rather have stuff I don't need than not have stuff I do need.


fully agree, but you cant carry everything when your going for a longish stroll, too heavy and you may not take it. the red cross makes a four wheel drive kit that with an addition of a couple of snake bite bandages will keep you alive till you get help (i have that one in the car at all times) if your going remote/alone a plb is a good thing to carry, even if it takes help too long to get to you they will at least find your body :unknown: :violin:
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Mitch » 19 Dec 2017, 4:10 am

This is all well and good, but do you know how to use everything properly. No use having stuff if you can't
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by bladeracer » 19 Dec 2017, 3:11 pm

Mitch wrote:This is all well and good, but do you know how to use everything properly. No use having stuff if you can't


I disagree, even if you don't know how to use something "properly", it's still better to have it and muddle through than not have anything at all, and the person you are trying to help, or who is trying to help you, just might know how to use it better than you can anyway.
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Daddybang » 19 Dec 2017, 3:14 pm

bladeracer wrote:
Mitch wrote:This is all well and good, but do you know how to use everything properly. No use having stuff if you can't


I disagree, even if you don't know how to use something "properly", it's still better to have it and muddle through than not have anything at all, and the person you are trying to help, or who is trying to help you, just might know how to use it better than you can anyway.


Yep I'd rather be caught with it than without it!!! :drinks: :drinks: :drinks:
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Bent Arrow » 19 Dec 2017, 10:22 pm

There is definitely an argument for having stuff you don't know how to use yourself, albeit up to a limit. Here's some examples......

1. A tool kit. Just because you might no have a clue how to fix your car, the next person that drives past just might.

2. 4WD recovery gear. If I have to snatch you out, I'd rather the wear and tear to be on your gear than mine.

3. Some years ago my son had an accident and got his fingers trapped between a ladder and the frame on a makeshift jetty at a friend's shack on the river. One of the adults on site was a paramedic but didn't have a first aid kit on hand. I did........... Didn't save a trip to hospital, micro-surgery and physiotherapy but it made a difficult situation easier and reinforced to me the need to have a FAK readily available

Ohh and yes, I still can't get my head around a paramedic not having a first aid kit handy at all times. Strikes me as downright stoopid.
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by darwindingo » 19 Dec 2017, 11:52 pm

Bent Arrow wrote:There is definitely an argument for having stuff you don't know how to use yourself, albeit up to a limit. Here's some examples......

1. A tool kit. Just because you might no have a clue how to fix your car, the next person that drives past just might.

2. 4WD recovery gear. If I have to snatch you out, I'd rather the wear and tear to be on your gear than mine.

3. Some years ago my son had an accident and got his fingers trapped between a ladder and the frame on a makeshift jetty at a friend's shack on the river. One of the adults on site was a paramedic but didn't have a first aid kit on hand. I did........... Didn't save a trip to hospital, micro-surgery and physiotherapy but it made a difficult situation easier and reinforced to me the need to have a FAK readily available

Ohh and yes, I still can't get my head around a paramedic not having a first aid kit handy at all times. Strikes me as downright stoopid.


Agree on all counts.. :thumbsup:

The several paramedic's I know live and breath it, I can't say I have ever seen them to be more than 10 feet away from a FAK, so I guess I'm a little surprised about that... Bloody lucky you had yours handy though :thumbsup: Hope your boys fingers are are as good as new :drinks:
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Member-Deleted » 20 Dec 2017, 1:28 am

I have a big one in my house , one in the hilux and one I take fishing wouldn't be without one also a small one I take
when I used to walk and hunt the scrubs
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Bent Arrow » 20 Dec 2017, 7:07 pm

darwindingo wrote:
Bent Arrow wrote:There is definitely an argument for having stuff you don't know how to use yourself, albeit up to a limit. Here's some examples......

1. A tool kit. Just because you might no have a clue how to fix your car, the next person that drives past just might.

2. 4WD recovery gear. If I have to snatch you out, I'd rather the wear and tear to be on your gear than mine.

3. Some years ago my son had an accident and got his fingers trapped between a ladder and the frame on a makeshift jetty at a friend's shack on the river. One of the adults on site was a paramedic but didn't have a first aid kit on hand. I did........... Didn't save a trip to hospital, micro-surgery and physiotherapy but it made a difficult situation easier and reinforced to me the need to have a FAK readily available

Ohh and yes, I still can't get my head around a paramedic not having a first aid kit handy at all times. Strikes me as downright stoopid.


Agree on all counts.. :thumbsup:

The several paramedic's I know live and breath it, I can't say I have ever seen them to be more than 10 feet away from a FAK, so I guess I'm a little surprised about that... Bloody lucky you had yours handy though :thumbsup: Hope your boys fingers are are as good as new :drinks:



Yeah, came as a bloody big surprise to me that a paramedic wouldn't be prepared.

My boy lost some flexibility and dexterity but its pretty good all things considered. The outcome could have been very, very much worse. We are counting our blessings really.
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Homer » 30 Jan 2018, 9:26 am

Lorgar, my Fist Aid kit comprises a few Band Aids, a Compression bandage, a bottle of OP Rum and a .45.

Hope that helps

D'oh!
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Lorgar » 30 Jan 2018, 12:57 pm

tom604 wrote:fully agree, but you cant carry everything when your going for a longish stroll, too heavy and you may not take it. the red cross makes a four wheel drive kit that with an addition of a couple of snake bite bandages will keep you alive till you get help (i have that one in the car at all times) if your going remote/alone a plb is a good thing to carry, even if it takes help too long to get to you they will at least find your body :unknown: :violin:


My objective is to just have a comprehensive kit in the truck, it's not something I'd carry with me and I don't want a variety of kits for different purposes. Just want something solid available should the worst happen on a trip.

I have a PLB already too :thumbsup:
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Lorgar » 30 Jan 2018, 12:58 pm

Mitch wrote:This is all well and good, but do you know how to use everything properly. No use having stuff if you can't


Answered here already.

viewtopic.php?f=70&t=9105&start=18#p147918
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Lorgar » 30 Jan 2018, 1:00 pm

Bent Arrow wrote:Ohh and yes, I still can't get my head around a paramedic not having a first aid kit handy at all times. Strikes me as downright stoopid.


That's a bit harsh. Just because he's a paramedic doesn't mean he has to shoulder everybody else's responsibility to take care of themselves.

If he's in a position to help, that's great, but people are responsible for their own well being. If you're not prepared, and you're reliant on others to take care of you, then you get what you get and have no right to complain IMO.

We don't expect tyre fitters to carry around spare tires and change them for everyone they pass just because they work in that industry, do we. If you puncture a tyre and end up stuck on the side of the road because you aren't carrying a spare that's on you.

Don't get me wrong, what happened to your son obviously sucks, I'm not pointing fingers or having a go at him or anyone else, but it's certainly not the paramedics fault, or his responsibility.

I'd be thankful he was there, not criticizing him for not having a kit on him.
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Lorgar » 30 Jan 2018, 1:00 pm

Homer wrote:Lorgar, my Fist Aid kit comprises a few Band Aids, a Compression bandage, a bottle of OP Rum and a .45.


Rum! That's what my kit is missing :lol:
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Gamerancher » 30 Jan 2018, 1:45 pm

I recommend that everyone should do at least "basic" first aid training. Also, even if you have done one in the past, a refresher is always a good idea. A lot of techniques and practices change over time, ( CPR, stroke and snakebite treatment are ones that come to mind ), you need to keep up to date.
If you are even contemplating going somewhere "bush", where there 'aint help within 10 minutes it could save yours or a loved ones life. Most first aid coarses are relatively cheap and even more advanced ones aren't that expensive. Ask where you work, a lot of companies will pay for your first aid training. What price a life?
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Bent Arrow » 01 Feb 2018, 9:01 pm

Lorgar wrote:That's a bit harsh. Just because he's a paramedic doesn't mean he has to shoulder everybody else's responsibility to take care of themselves.

If he's in a position to help, that's great, but people are responsible for their own well being. If you're not prepared, and you're reliant on others to take care of you, then you get what you get and have no right to complain IMO.

We don't expect tyre fitters to carry around spare tires and change them for everyone they pass just because they work in that industry, do we. If you puncture a tyre and end up stuck on the side of the road because you aren't carrying a spare that's on you.

Don't get me wrong, what happened to your son obviously sucks, I'm not pointing fingers or having a go at him or anyone else, but it's certainly not the paramedics fault, or his responsibility.

I'd be thankful he was there, not criticizing him for not having a kit on him.


If you think so, thats fine....... In my opinion the particular circumstances make it very difficult to justify him not having a first aid kit... The paramedic was staying at his own, relatively remote shack on the river with his wife and two kids, and had invited several of his daughters friends (including my daughter) to stay overnight in celebration of his daughters birthday. The day after the sleep over, we drove out to pick up my daughter and the unfortunate accident occurred whilst we were there. I'd think that a paramedic that doesn't have a first aid kit in either of the two cars that he and his wife had used to drive the group of kids there, or have a kit in the dwelling is rather unusual. I'm not expecting a random stranger to be equipped to deal with an unfortunate set of circumstances. The paramedic had voluntarily taken charge of a group of young children on his property and in my opinion was inadequately prepared. Im not holding a grudge, and I don't blame him for the accident, but do think he should have had at least a basic first aid kit readily accessible. If you disagree then so be it
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Re: Building a proper first aid kit

Post by Member-Deleted » 01 Feb 2018, 9:58 pm

Up here in the north west we have a basic rule for taipan bite if bitten miles from anywhere you carry a 1m piece
of string place it on the ground stand over it with feet 1m apart then bend over as far as you can and kiss your
arse goodbye because you aint going to make it back

On a serious note I am a firm believer of first aid box's but it comes to a point of what do you want to prepare for
If you want a perfect aid box you would need a ute to carry it
I have been tied up with first aid in one way or another all my working life and the main things I find you need to control
aid in the bush are bleeds ,breaks, falls, bites ( snake ) and other, heat, cuts, sprains, and one a lot of people forget anything
to do with the eyes ie open pad for anything protruding from the eye, open pad is a circular pad split with a small hole for
the protruding objects
I dare say I have missed something but once you set out what you want to prepare for there are products available from
various places to accommodate your needs

cheers
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