New Howa M1100 - 22 cal rimfire

[bigfellascott]

https://shootersdelight.com.au/product/ ... ack-stock/

[Sawyers]

Are these rebadged Hatsan Escorts

[bigfellascott]

Are these rebadged Hatsan Escorts

Not sure TBH I'd highly doubt it. Not sure the Japs would bother getting into bed with the Turks

[Wapiti]

I'd bet it's made in Japan, wow it'll be a success story I'll bet. They build stuff to super tolerances for working class money.

But I wish, there'd be more copies of the foolproof rotary BX-1 magazines from the 10/22 and Ruger American and 77/22, like the ones Browning and Savage do now.
C'mon Howa, you can do it. Wish wish

[bigfellascott]

I'd bet it's made in Japan, wow it'll be a success story I'll bet. They build stuff to super tolerances for working class money.

But I wish, there'd be more copies of the foolproof rotary BX-1 magazines from the 10/22 and Ruger American and 77/22, like the ones Browning and Savage do now.
C'mon Howa, you can do it. Wish wish

Yep it's Jap made alright, seen pics of the stamping on the side of the action, clearly states its jap made (which is what I figured it would be) I look forward to seeing how it shoots and functions, if it's good I might just buy one.

[SCJ429]

I'd bet it's made in Japan, wow it'll be a success story I'll bet. They build stuff to super tolerances for working class money.
sh

How do you define super tolerances? What are you comparing their machining to?

[bigfellascott]

How do you define super tolerances? What are you comparing their machining to?

They manufacture machining gear for a lot of diff companies, so I'd say they know a thing or two about it all.

http://www.howa.co.jp/en/products/machi ... ining.html

[Sergeant Hartman]

The 1500 isn't really made to super tolerances...If it was the bolt won't feel gritty. There won't be many people that have issues with firing pin hole being too big. Etc etc etc

[bigfellascott]

Are these rebadged Hatsan Escorts

[bigfellascott]

The 1500 isn't really made to super tolerances...If it was the bolt won't feel gritty. There won't be many people that have issues with firing pin hole being too big. Etc etc etc

No but it could be if they wanted to go that way, this way the rifle is made to be affordable, but I'm sure if people wanted to pay more they would only be too happy to do a bit of polishing of the races etc (any idiot can do that at home) I do it to all my rifles and all are slick as snot, I guess thats part of the diff in $$ you pay for say a Howa v Tikkler or any other comparable price points.

It's like the chinese, they will happily make things to diff standards, just depends on what you want to pay, pay less get less refinement, pay more and get more refinement.

[Sergeant Hartman]

Agreed. But I was replying to wapiti.

I do wonder how can they build a gun for the price they sell em at cleaners..

i mean it's built howa makes money. Legacy imports makes money, shipping cost to usa. Then shipping back to Australia. Cleaners make some money and they sell em for $399-$499.... granted it's the thinner barrel and OSA don't get their cut

[bigfellascott]

Volume I'd say would be the key along with efficient manufacturing practices, plus the fact they make a lot of different things not just hunting rifles

[SCJ429]

The quality of the machining is no better than other rifles at a similar price point like Winchester, Savage or Ruger. They are great for a $400 rifles but don't describe them as having super tolerances, that is insulting the intelligence of the readers here. My 110 year old Mauser has better quality machining than you will find on a Howa 1500.

Yes I understand you are a fan and there is nothing wrong with the Howa but try to be a little objective.

[sungazer]

To be fair on the other side as well the issue with small rifle primers is not restricted to Howa. It is across all rifles esp Rem 700 that shoot a small rifle primer and have a firing pin that is 0.80 or there about. The two just don't go well.

[bigfellascott]

To be fair on the other side as well the issue with small rifle primers is not restricted to Howa. It is across all rifles esp Rem 700 that shoot a small rifle primer and have a firing pin that is 0.80 or there about. The two just don't go well.

Never had any issues at all with any small rifle primers (I run well over max in my howa 204) what's the prob? I had one that pierced on the 222 CMC many years ago with old ammo but went on to shoot about another 1000 rds with it and never an issue since.

[Wapiti]

[/quote]How do you define super tolerances? What are you comparing their machining to?[/quote]

Ok, I haven't measure one. I'll quantify what I mean. I don't mean to ruffle any brand feathers.

But I say this, because Howa barrels are as accurate (group size wise) when shot by me, as anything 4-5 times the price, like my Sako 85 Stainless Varmint. The Sako has nothing, crow-in-tree-at-300m-wise, on the $500 20" Howa stainless varmint I have. I use this Howa, in a MDT LSS stock, from the house yard to a feeder at 265m at the feed stealing crows, with Aussie Outback 55gn Blitzking factories.
My mate has a Ruger American 223, and it's nowhere on the Howa, and the bolt feels like an M8 bolt going in and out of an M10 nut.
My Howas are smooth as silk, not a machining mark on them anywhere.
Sure, the trigger guard is an insult, made from old Nissan snorkels melted down, as are the plastic magazines. But, for the price, which budget gun is different with the use of $2 plastic?

I also have the 223 Mini stainless ultra light, and this thing shoots through ragged holes whilst weighing about the same as a bic biro. I'm amazed at this, and used to be a Howa brand snob. But not now. It gets smashed around in the feed truck, and i blow it out with an air hose quite a lot. But for the money, its incredible. There's a pig trap full of head shot roos that can't argue about it's precise tolerances, hence consistency.

I have a few guns to base my opinions on Howa, including HS Precision, Sako Trg's and 3 85's, as well as Rems, Rugers, Brno etc. I will say, I have not had two rifles that shoot so well so easy.
As an engineer, the simplest thing I know is that this doesn't happen without a factory putting a firearm together dead straight, without internal stresses, without the tolerances needed to behave the same every shot. And I saw these things for 400+ bucks something up at Redcliffe on special a few months ago. Outstanding.

It should upset me that a 6K rifle with a 2.5K scope can't shoot a group at 200m without mucking about with very expensive loads like these Howas I have can, with a little 2.5-8x36 VX3i. But it's actually a credit to them.

Apologies for the novel sized reply, trying to explain what I meant and why.

[bigfellascott]

I'm hearing ya mate, my Howas all outshoot rifles I have that are all at least 2 to 3 times the cost and have done so from day one (other than the 222 CMC) mind you factory ammo wasn't what it is today and with hand loads and me doing the right thing it can shoot in the .3 or smaller like they all have. Personally I wouldn't bother wasting money or more expensive rifles anymore, they have let me down in the accuracy dept compared to the howas (goes against the cry once buy once I know but in my experience to buy expensive is to cry harder once you see the diff between them accuracy wise, yes the expensive stuff is better finished but that soon pales in comparison to how they both shoot (owned sako and Ruger) don't own the sako anymore, it gave me the s**ts too much to bother keeping it, the ruger I still have but it will be shown the door as I don't really need it. Still own the Tikka but it will be shown the door if i can't get it too shoot better - haven't gotten around to reloading for it as yet but will one day I guess) still its good enough to put holes in pigs which is what it was bought for but as for groups it's s**t so far! Hopefully with handloads it will do better.

[Wapiti]

Agree Scott
I don't have any brand loyalty at all, there are different brands that have different models that appeal or suit certain needs.
One thing I like is a firearm that is scaled for the cartridge, with a lovely low mounted, slim scope that comes to the eye immediately.
But Howa certainly impresses for sure. Like the lovely small, made for the cartridge, Howa Mini.

Many other brands have a standard, largish (so weighty for the need) action suited to a 308 or larger, blocked out for smaller cartridges. They say, to save money. Look at a very popular rifle, the Tikka T3. A huge action, blocked out for 223, and even then, without much thought as the mag is so short you can't seat heavier pills out. No thought, yet how much, $1200? No comparison for size or slimness let alone price.

Howa takes the trouble to scale a small, light, tight action for the 222/223/204 size, and still sells them for half the price of a Tikka.
Same as the easy to machine, full diameter (re. Heavy) multi lug bolts that are cheaper to make (only minor machining for the action internals, no twin rails to machine in the raceway) on so many economy guns.
Howa take the trouble to have a light, slim bolt, machine twin lugs, mill the action to suit with virtually no machining marks internally and compete in price. Amazing.
I have an American Predator in 7.62x39 in which the bolt makes a zipping noise because of the machining roughness of the bolt and action. Doesnt affect use, but pretty poor really to me. They say they are made to a price point, well, it cost more than my Howas. I should have got a mini in this cal in hindsight, but the Ruger has a way better stock and bedding set up that you can't really improve on.

Hijacked thread, sorry. Be very interested in seeing the rim fire. I'll wait for the stainless version as I'm a slack bastard and don't want to worry so much about corrosion.

[bigfellascott]

Agree Scott
I don't have any brand loyalty at all, there are different brands that have different models that appeal or suit certain needs.
One thing I like is a firearm that is scaled for the cartridge, with a lovely low mounted, slim scope that comes to the eye immediately.
But Howa certainly impresses for sure. Like the lovely small, made for the cartridge, Howa Mini.

Many other brands have a standard, largish (so weighty for the need) action suited to a 308 or larger, blocked out for smaller cartridges. They say, to save money. Look at a very popular rifle, the Tikka T3. A huge action, blocked out for 223, and even then, without much thought as the mag is so short you can't seat heavier pills out. No thought, yet how much, $1200? No comparison for size or slimness let alone price.

Howa takes the trouble to scale a small, light, tight action for the 222/223/204 size, and still sells them for half the price of a Tikka.
Same as the easy to machine, full diameter (re. Heavy) multi lug bolts that are cheaper to make (only minor machining for the action internals, no twin rails to machine in the raceway) on so many economy guns.
Howa take the trouble to have a light, slim bolt, machine twin lugs, mill the action to suit with virtually no machining marks internally and compete in price. Amazing.
I have an American Predator in 7.62x39 in which the bolt makes a zipping noise because of the machining roughness of the bolt and action. Doesnt affect use, but pretty poor really to me. They say they are made to a price point, well, it cost more than my Howas. I should have got a mini in this cal in hindsight, but the Ruger has a way better stock and bedding set up that you can't really improve on.

Hijacked thread, sorry. Be very interested in seeing the rim fire. I'll wait for the stainless version as I'm a slack bastard and don't want to worry so much about corrosion.

I'm hearing ya mate, for the $$ and the performance you get from them they are hard to beat, I own a Ruger too, it doesn't really do it for me TBH, it was rough in the action and needed some polishing to bring it up to a suitable standard, the trigger was crap so it needed to be worked on and was an easy fix so that was good to see, solid rifle but there's better options out there for the $$$ IMO. I got this one as new 2nd hand of a friend for $700 with scope and a heap of reloads and components and reloading gear so can't really complain, it's an ok rifle but i just seem to go to the Howas as they are always reliable and I know they shoot well so hard to bother with something else if you aren't as confident in it's shooting abilities.

I rank it with the Tikka in the "project" category - rifles that need a bit of help to get em shooting better and if not out the door they can go!

[Mark223308]

looking forward to reading a review from a known source , Howa have been building for the military since before ww2 and are very good value for money , as Scott has pointed out commonly outshooting much more expensive rifles .

[bigfellascott]

looking forward to reading a review from a known source , Howa have been building for the military since before ww2 and are very good value for money , as Scott has pointed out commonly outshooting much more expensive rifles .

Same here, hopefully they will be good things, I wouldn't mind owning a 22 Howa if it is. Still got to get me a Mini Action, might trade the Ruger in for one one day.

[solarpak]

Hi Folks,
have run the rule over the new howa 1100 in .22LR - not too bad at all!
Shot a wide variety of ammo - standard velocity and HV (but no match ammo ) and shot very well indeed with the Winchester Power Point and Power Point 42 MAX - five shots easily into 20mm at 50m all day. All other ammo shot well too.

The polymer stock is ok - works well - but the TSPX chassis is also available for the 1100.

No dovetail on the receiver top - thus need to fit weaver style bases - or can source one piece rings/bases like what the rifle i shot had fitted.

Bolt travel was a bit rough initially but smoothed up with use

For the coin a good starter rimfire

C.

[jwai86]

Has anyone here purchased or used a M1100 recently? It seems like something that doesn't get reviewed a lot because there are many established alternatives to choose from.

[Lazarus]

I don't have one but if the M1500 is any indication it should shoot very well.

I have a 1500 and with the right load it's deadly.