SK ammo question

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Re: SK ammo question

Post by bladeracer » 29 Aug 2021, 3:16 pm

Larry wrote:They are the 40gn I was referring to.


Thanks. The driving band must be a thou or two further forward, or the nose is slightly over bore diameter, I'll have to measure them up.
All .22LR ammo is one-inch in length maximum.
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by bladeracer » 29 Aug 2021, 3:23 pm

MtnMan wrote:just looked back through receipts. the CCI segmented HP subs is more expensive than the Eley.
Also from what I can gather the 40gr remington sub HP is no longer available. options are running out!


The CCI Segmented HP is expensive, and doesn't shoot any better for me than the standard HP, but the Quiet RN is the most accurate for me of the low-subsonic offerings.

Lots of stuff is unavailable just now and it will get worse.
The idea of improving the accuracy of whatever ammo you can find is likely in all our futures for a little while :-)
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by bladeracer » 29 Aug 2021, 3:28 pm

MtnMan wrote:out of all the high velocity stuff I've tried it shoots the best.


Have you tried CCI Velocitor or RWS HVHP?
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by MtnMan » 29 Aug 2021, 4:40 pm

No I haven't.
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by bladeracer » 29 Aug 2021, 5:31 pm

bladeracer wrote:
Larry wrote:They are the 40gn I was referring to.


Thanks. The driving band must be a thou or two further forward, or the nose is slightly over bore diameter, I'll have to measure them up.
All .22LR ammo is one-inch in length maximum.


Between the 40gn and 42gn it's certainly possible that the 42gn could engrave the rifling as it's a significantly fatter bullet than the 40gn forward of the driving band. Both driving bands are in the same place though. The 40gn bullet though looks similar to most other 40gn stuff so I can't see why it would be a problem in your rifle. In match chambers though I think it's not uncommon for the bullet to be seated into the rifling anyway, but you don't get that in yours with other ammo?

There is no specified difference between sporting and match .22LR ammo, but manufacturers do reduce the tolerances and make other adjustments if they can see advantages to them.

But a match chamber (this is also modified by various reamer manufacturers) is cut .175" shorter, so that all but the rearmost .030" of the driving band is actually sitting in the throat, and the throat is .1875" shorter, and .004" smaller in diameter.
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by MtnMan » 29 Aug 2021, 5:56 pm

does anyone in Australia sell a .22lr shell holder to fit an RCBS press?

I found an old towball that has the 7/8" thread that fits the press. wouldn't be too hard to machine a die out of it to swage a round nose into a HP. bit like the Waltz die.
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by MtnMan » 29 Aug 2021, 5:57 pm

I could make a shell holder too but if there was one available it would be cheaper than my time to make one.
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by bladeracer » 29 Aug 2021, 6:24 pm

MtnMan wrote:does anyone in Australia sell a .22lr shell holder to fit an RCBS press?

I found an old towball that has the 7/8" thread that fits the press. wouldn't be too hard to machine a die out of it to swage a round nose into a HP. bit like the Waltz die.


A towball might be quite hard.
I just use plain black steel bolts, 7/8"-14tpi.
They're cheap and soft.
I haven't seen a shellholder, but as reloading rimfire ammo for long-range competition is growing in the US there must be somebody making one.

Found this - https://fedarm.com/product/22lr-reloading-kit/
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by bladeracer » 29 Aug 2021, 6:39 pm

Ch4d do a .22LR shellholder part number "22LR".
Looks like a custom piece made to order though. No idea of price, it says standard price plus US$25, but I can't find a standard price for their shellholders.
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by bladeracer » 29 Aug 2021, 6:42 pm

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Re: SK ammo question

Post by Phil Lawlor » 29 Aug 2021, 7:02 pm

For information - My son has had his Ruger Precision 22lr now for just over 12 months. Maybe fired 600 rounds at targets at the range in this time. We tried a few different brands initially and found it really liked Eley Sport, with consistent 1/2 inch 5 round groups at 50mtrs. We then tried SK Match and SK Long Range. Wow, these rounds are awesome and he is getting tight groups at 75mtrs and 100mtrs consistently. Bad news is there are none available in either of the 3 gun stores up here in Townsville. They all have them on back order with no idea when the next shipment will arrive. I was fortunate to be away on holidays last week and called into a gun shop up in Marreba and they had a few boxs on the shelf. I brought 7 x box's of the Match and 5 x box's of the Long Range (all that he had on the shelf). Again these rounds are great for target shooting and these are what we have settled on. Hopefully the next shipment will not be far away, hopefully.
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by MtnMan » 29 Aug 2021, 9:08 pm

Already started making a shellholder. simply 2 washers with holes adjusted for perfect fit over the rim and the wall of the case. cut a slot in each then tack weld them to a shellholder I'll turn on a lathe.
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by MtnMan » 30 Aug 2021, 8:21 pm

picked up a box each of SK flat nose basic and Winchester super suppressed today. Both are solids but I plan to make a Waltz reprofiling die to turn them into HP's and see how it goes. The SK flatnose is very promising from the few groups I shot this afternoon and the Winchester might be more aptly named 'super impressed'. it shot really well and the 45gr bullets land in the dirt with a real wallop. Surprisingly they shoot about an inch higher than most of the other standard velocity stuff I have tried. Impressive considering they are a heavier bullet.
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by deye243 » 30 Aug 2021, 11:32 pm

The point of impact has nothing to do with the weight of the bullet it's all about barrel harmonics and yes I agree with you on the 45 grain bullet been using the cci suppressor for quite a while very good stuff
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by MtnMan » 31 Aug 2021, 6:41 am

The CCI suppressor shot ok out of my gun, not quite as good as the Win super suppressed. the CCI is 970fps vs the 1090fps of the Win, both with 45gr bullet.
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by deye243 » 31 Aug 2021, 7:36 pm

MtnMan wrote:The CCI suppressor shot ok out of my gun, not quite as good as the Win super suppressed. the CCI is 970fps vs the 1090fps of the Win, both with 45gr bullet.

I will have to try some .
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by MtnMan » 03 Sep 2021, 8:52 pm

Well, I finished making the reprofiling die and shellholder.
I'm very pleased!! Cost me nothing but some time on the lathe.
It swages a hollow point into solid ammo or creates a larger HP in HP ammo while simultaneously expanding the bullet diameter to .225". Hopefully there is no wind tomorrow so I can test shoot my new HP's.
This opens up a lot of hunting ammo choice. I'm keen to see how the SK flat nose basic shoots as a HP.
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by scoot » 03 Sep 2021, 10:01 pm

Pictures please......
Gotta have proof or it didn't happen :allegedly:
Honestly though, interested in what your up to. Seems like a cool experiment.
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by MtnMan » 04 Sep 2021, 9:59 am

I got good value out of this tow ball! I used the ball a few years ago to make a DIY window mount spotlight and now I've used the remaining shank to make a .22lr reprofiling die. 8-)

I honed the plunger to .2245" then honed the bore of the die until the plunger would clear it so it should be very close to .225".

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The shell holder is simply 2 washers with appropriately sized slots tack welded on top of a piece of steel I turned to duplicate the shellholders that fit my RCBS press.

Before and after-
Back row left to right-
45gr Win super suppressed solid, 40gr Win super speed solid,40gr SK flat nose basic solid, 40gr CCI quiet solid.

Middle row, L to R-
Eley 38gr subsonic HP, Win power point 40gr HV HP, Remington 40gr HP subsonic.

Front-
CCI subsonic 40gr segmented HP. Ready for detonation!!!! :twisted:

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Re: SK ammo question

Post by MtnMan » 04 Sep 2021, 10:12 am

The Eley sub HP is the only one so far that has experienced a noticeable improvement in accuracy. None have suffered accuracy degradation.

The main purpose I guess is turning solids into HP's. Which is great if you want the ability to turn any solid ammo that may shoot better in your gun, is easy to obtain or is cheap to buy into HP's.

It will be awesome for turning the CCI Quiet solids into HP's. Less ricochet risk and I get to shoot HP Quiets for the price of their solids which is $8.50/50pk vs $15.50/50pk for the Quiet segmented HP ammo. CCI can shove that where it doesn't shine! :lol:
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by scoot » 04 Sep 2021, 6:21 pm

:thumbsup: nice
I love seeing people use and developed skills to just make stuff happen. Unfortunately a dying art.
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by deye243 » 04 Sep 2021, 7:27 pm

Yes well done that man .
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by disco stu » 04 Sep 2021, 8:10 pm

Very nice, well done. I was intrigued if doing this would affect their flight to a large extent, so interesting to hear your reports on it also.

Are you worried about affecting the lube on them, or are you not touching that part? (Whatever it's called)
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by MtnMan » 07 Sep 2021, 7:48 am

I shot some stuff this morning in no wind to check accuracy after HP forming and weight sorting ammo.
The weight sorting could only be noticed definitively with the SK flat nose basic that I formed into HP's.
I sorted into 2 weight groups.

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Very annoying that one has to weight sort premium priced ammo to do this and half of it shoots like you expect. That's paying 4x the price with extra effort. Might try something else now......

As a side note the Eley Subsonic HP's shot no better than 1" at 50m in my gun.

The Winchester super suppressed is still worthy for a hunting round after forming into a HP.

The quest continues for an ammo that shoots those super tight consistent groups the old gold packet SK sub HP's would shoot......
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by MtnMan » 07 Sep 2021, 7:50 am

Forgot to mention that the top and bottom groups respectively on each page correspond to the weight sorted batches.
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by Wm.Traynor » 07 Sep 2021, 9:33 am

MtnMan wrote:Forgot to mention that the top and bottom groups respectively on each page correspond to the weight sorted batches.


That's fascinating, MtnMan :thumbsup: If you had not told us about the weight sorting, I would have assumed that your rifle had a scope/bedding/fastener problem, going by the groups with vertical dispersion.
Goes to show me what sort of rabbit hole I could have gone down.
Keep up the good work :) :thumbsup:
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by bladeracer » 07 Sep 2021, 3:59 pm

MtnMan wrote:Forgot to mention that the top and bottom groups respectively on each page correspond to the weight sorted batches.


Have you tried rim thickness batching? I didn't see any measurable improvement from weight batching even very cheap ammo.
I think shaping the bullet to a consistent size and shape offers the biggest improvement you're likely to get.
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by MtnMan » 07 Sep 2021, 4:51 pm

No I haven't done any rim thickness sorting. Thought I'd try weight sorting first.
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by MtnMan » 07 Sep 2021, 5:03 pm

I found a couple of mushrooms today also. The left one is a Winchester super suppressed 45gr DIY hollow point. It now weighs 44.9gr. the other one might be a Winchester power point or super speed HP.
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Re: SK ammo question

Post by bladeracer » 07 Sep 2021, 5:09 pm

MtnMan wrote:I found a couple of mushrooms today also. The left one is a Winchester super suppressed 45gr DIY hollow point. It now weighs 44.9gr. the other one might be a Winchester power point or super speed HP.
IMG_8252.JPG


Nice. What medium are they mushrooming in?
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