Newbie options - for pigs & feral dogs?

[ScottyD]

plus one for .243W

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Ok, thanks duncan61

Sounds like its settling between the .243 and the .308

[ScottyD]

I'm not going there.....

If I was starting out I would stay away from lever actions, big bores like 45/70s and old military rifles. A nice modern bolt action will build confidence and allow you to hit things with precision. Ruger also make a mini Mauser action if you like the look of the control feed M70 Winchester. Ruger have really picked up their act in regards to their barrel making. On this forum, others will tell you about some outstanding results they have had with their Rugers.

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Hmmm, it does sound like a simple solid bolt action is going to be the go

I've heard good things about Rugers, although haven't looked at them much yet

[SCJ429]

No, you don't have Razorbacks prowling around. An 80 kilo pig is a pretty big pig for me and I would have no qualms shooting it with a 243. I shot one about this size a while ago with a 7mm Rem Mag and it did not much more damage than I have seen with the 6mm. Of course the extra power is handy for difficult shots or when you don't hit them exactly where you planned to. Keep the ranges sensible and place your shots and the 243 is fine for heart lung or brain shots.

[ScottyD]

No, you don't have Razorbacks prowling around. An 80 kilo pig is a pretty big pig for me and I would have no qualms shooting it with a 243. I shot one about this size a while ago with a 7mm Rem Mag and it did not much more damage than I have seen with the 6mm. Of course the extra power is handy for difficult shots or when you don't hit them exactly where you planned to. Keep the ranges sensible and place your shots and the 243 is fine for heart lung or brain shots.

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OK, that's a big pig so it gives a bit of perspective. Sounds like range would be key if I went the .243 route (just noticed the Model 70 is available in .243 too )

[ScottyD]

Ok, I've just spent most of my nightshift researching the venerable .243

I'm sold, I reckon that's going to be the way to go for me. Now to get my licence out of the way and get on with it all.

Thanks everyone for your insights and guidance. I'll let you know what I wind up with when I finally get to make the purchase.

[bigrich]

For availability and cost of ammo if you don’t reload 308 for pigs would be a good choice and is available in a wide range of rifles. The recoil in most rifles with decent weight is comparable to 303 . 223 is the same for lighter game. For a flat shooting rifle that will do it all a 243 is a good choice, but pick your shots on larger game. My own do all is 6.5x55 but I reload . I own three model 70’s and love them, but if you’re looking for a out of the box no fuss quality rifle with very good accuracy and trigger get a tikka T3 . For the money they are fantastic. A laminate stock for a 308 will have a bit more weight and make it more pleasant to shoot. A synthetic/stainless 243 would be a great carry rifle if you plan on hiking up in the hills. My favourite rifle’s however are timber stocked model 70’s in 222,243 and 6.5x55 (custom build) , that’s just me. We’re spoilt for choice compared to 30-40 years ago , deciding on what you want will be the hardest thing

[bigfellascott]

Just get the 308 cheap to run, ammo's available in every gun shop I've ever been in and a good variety of projectile options too.

KISS!

[SCJ429]

Just get the 308 cheap to run, ammo's available in every gun shop I've ever been in and a good variety of projectile options too.

KISS!

You don't think that the 222 is a good choice for a bloke starting out with his first centrefire?

[bigfellascott]

Just get the 308 cheap to run, ammo's available in every gun shop I've ever been in and a good variety of projectile options too.

KISS!

You don't think that the 222 is a good choice for a bloke starting out with his first centrefire?

No not for use on pigs I don't.

[bigrich]

Just get the 308 cheap to run, ammo's available in every gun shop I've ever been in and a good variety of projectile options too.

KISS!

You don't think that the 222 is a good choice for a bloke starting out with his first centrefire?

No not for use on pigs I don't.

That’s why I suggested 243, bit small for the bigger pigs , if he picks his shots it should get the job done with the right projectiles, but more than adequate for smaller game without developing a accuracy destroying flinch. If he’s new to shooting or hasn’t done it in a long time, 243 is probably a good option and has reach for smaller stuff at distance . Or get a. 223 and a 308

[Archie]

I would say .243 most flexible, although the .223 is more pleasant from a recoil point of view and significantly cheaper to feed. Just a risk that .223 could end up being a bit underpowered for bigger pigs. The ammo I use for my 223 is about 60-70 cents a round from memory, but the 243 stuff is closer to the $2 mark. Depends on exactly what ammo you use of course, but the cost difference does add up over time if you are shooting a lot. One way to look at is, if you shoot 2000 rounds of 223 vs 243, you probably saved enough to buy yourself a new rifle and scope.

If you do go for a .223, be sure and check the twist rate. I have a varmint rifle with a 1:12 twist using light bullets that are perfect for foxes, but you will want something heavier for pigs, and that likely means going for 1:8 sort of thing so you can get accuracy with heavier projectiles.

[bigfellascott]

People go on about recoil way too much I reckon, it's like anything - you soon get used to it if you do it often enough, as for it buggering up your ability to shoot accurately well I guess some will be affected by recoil some won't but I'm sure they will be good enough to get the job done on pigs.

God knows how anyone in the army ever managed to hit the bullseye using larger cal CF's - it's like anything else we do for the first time, at first it's a bit weird and uncomfortable at times but once you do it often it becomes the norm and something you don't really take much notice of.

If the Op's worried about recoil out of a 308 just use the 125gn Sierra Factory ammo or the 130gn TNT speers the recoils quite comfortable using those lighter projectiles in a 308 (heavier projectiles = more felt recoil as a rule) also get a sporting profile barrel not a varmint one for hunting on foot or off-hand shooting and if you are really sensitive to recoil get yourself a good recoil pad of the factory one isn't doing the job, parchmar do good recoil pads as do plenty of others.

Also recoil off a bench rest is different to recoil shooting off-hand in the paddock, something to keep in mind (More noticeable off a bench than it is in a paddock shooting off-hand) and the other factor to consider is you are only shooting 1 shot in general at an animal, not 10, 20 or 30 or more shots like you do at a range so felt recoil and it's after-effects are really non existent compared to shooting at paper targets for hours on end

Same goes for costs of ammo, if you are only taking a hand full of shots a yr cost really does become irrelevant, if you are shooting at a range most weekends well then cost will factor into one's thinking but then again cal is irrelevant if most of your shots are only 100m or 200m at a range, cost would be more of a factor then I would think along with barrel life etc etc etc etc

As usual people way over complicate things - KISS!

[bigrich]

All good and valid points BFS , I myself don’t have any issues with the 308 . I was just trying to answer the “one gun to rule them all “ question of the OP with consideration that he hasn’t shot in a while . If he gets into reloading the 243 he could do everything he wants and have a lot of reach for smaller stuff. Then again, more guns , more fun ! I’ve decided against building up a 358 for a pig type scrub gun on my 243 model 70. It’s too nice as it is. Instead if got a m98 Mauser sporterized 8x57 on the way !

Let the good times roll ! LOL

[bladeracer]

Just get the 308 cheap to run, ammo's available in every gun shop I've ever been in and a good variety of projectile options too.

KISS!

You don't think that the 222 is a good choice for a bloke starting out with his first centrefire?

I think .222Rem could be an okay choice for somebody that is already experienced shooting pigs with heavy stuff, not for starting out.

[duncan61]

I am with you BFS.If recoil from a .243 is an issue take up golf.There is not a pig in the world that will survive a neck shot from 100gn PSP .243 factory bullet.I have some factory 100gn Winchester failsafes in .243 and the wound on game is massive.I have taken out small pigs with my .222 with neck shots on the run while out culling but feel .243 a better option.I have never had a 308 but have used it in the military and have been with other shooters that have them again feel its a bit to much for rabbits cats and foxes where it falls straight into the .243 wheelhouse.To the O.P. I purchased a HOWA in .243 for some one else who did not go through with the deal and now its mine and I love it.It was $700 brand new with a scope that worked and it shot 40mm groups at 100 metres straight out the cardboard box it came in.With cleaning between shots.That is good enough for vermin control.There is a lot of factors when hunting live game uphill downhill have you got a rest is the grass long its not bench rest its action.I have one theory that others may not agree and that is if you dont fling some lead at it it wont fall over.

[bigfellascott]

Just get the 308 cheap to run, ammo's available in every gun shop I've ever been in and a good variety of projectile options too.

KISS!

You don't think that the 222 is a good choice for a bloke starting out with his first centrefire?

I think .222Rem could be an okay choice for somebody that is already experienced shooting pigs with heavy stuff, not for starting out.

[duncan61]

These things will penetrate.Mild steel 10mm plate at 100 metres equals 18mm hole

IMG_0300.JPG (905.73 KiB) Viewed 4953 times

[bigfellascott]

A 22.250 using a 55gn Super Roo put a hole in this Hardox Plate. (I think it was at 80m or something like that, All the other splash marks are from a 308, 223, 222 and 338lap.

[duncan61]

put a 230gn Failsafe in the 338LP and see what it does.The 22/250 does go hard

[Oldbloke]

If the Op's worried about recoil out of a 308 just use the 125gn Sierra Factory ammo or the 130gn TNT speers the recoils quite comfortable using those lighter projectiles in a 308 (heavier projectiles = more felt recoil as a rule) - KISS!

+1

[bigfellascott]

put a 230gn Failsafe in the 338LP and see what it does.The 22/250 does go hard

Yeah can’t remember what projectile was used in the lap - 208gn seems to ring a bell but I’m really not sure tbh.

[bigrich]

so many opinions, so much choice

[Col]

ScottyD

FWIW as an all round calibre the 243 is hard to go past. I started out with a Win Mod 70 in 243 in the early 80's as my first centrefire and have shot numerous roos and pigs with it. The barrel on that rifle has worn out and I now use a T3 243 (Stainless varmint) and this will take down anything that I need to, even the odd red deer that is coming in.

With regards to pigs I reckon that if you hit a pig with a 243 it is curtains, even if you have to take a follow up shot,. 1 good hit will really ruin their day. I use either 80 gn SPBT or 95gn SST projectiles for all my shooting and if purchased at the right price reloading under $1/shot is easy. Factory ammo is also readily available.
In the last few years I have purchased a Howa 1500 223 and a T3X 308., however the 243 is still my goto everyday gun.

The 223 is a bit light for the pigs unless hit in the right spot and the 308 is too heavy for the roos. As most of my shooting is from the ute and when working in the paddock (moving stock etc) most of the game I shoot (roos and pigs) are opportunity shots, so the 243 is the best suited to each job.

So for a starting centrefire I dont reckon you can go past the old 243.

Good luck with the purchase.

[GQshayne]

I could not say how many pigs I have shot with a .243Win. Started using one in 1985. I do hear people say it is too small for big pigs, but I will disagree. I wonder if they have used a .243 themselves sometimes. I have shot plenty of big pigs with it, many with only one shot. It is also a good choice for dogs, as it has a good trajectory, which 30/30 etc do not have. Good calibre to cover both in my opinion.

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Cheers GQshayne

There's another nod to the .243. How big would you say the biggest pig was that you shot with that calibre? And can I ask, how quickly did it drop?

Around the 100kg mark on occasion. I have had plenty of them drop on the spot with chest shots, which is where I aim on running game, with pigs this is most of the time. Hit any pig in the chest with the right bullet out of a .243 and it will drop. Many of them will not even need a finishing shot by the time you walk to them. I have hit them at 200 metres too, and the result is the same. One advantage the .243 has, is that it can be used on a range of things, depending on the ammunition you use or load yourself. You can use light projectiles for foxes, bit bigger for wild dogs, and a bit bigger again, (around the 90gn mark for me) on pigs. And of course, you can use very strongly constructed projectiles too if you feel the need.

It is a good all-round cartridge. What I like about it aside from versatility, is the trajectory. It shoots flat, so using it in the field is great, as holdover is something I rarely need to worry about at the ranges I shoot. Plenty of other calibers will do the same of course, but as an example, the .308 uses the same case as the .243, so the lighter bullet will be faster and shoot flatter in the same size case.

I think there are a number of choices you could make here, but you won't go wrong with the .243.

[bigrich]

I could not say how many pigs I have shot with a .243Win. Started using one in 1985. I do hear people say it is too small for big pigs, but I will disagree. I wonder if they have used a .243 themselves sometimes. I have shot plenty of big pigs with it, many with only one shot. It is also a good choice for dogs, as it has a good trajectory, which 30/30 etc do not have. Good calibre to cover both in my opinion.

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Cheers GQshayne

There's another nod to the .243. How big would you say the biggest pig was that you shot with that calibre? And can I ask, how quickly did it drop?

Around the 100kg mark on occasion. I have had plenty of them drop on the spot with chest shots, which is where I aim on running game, with pigs this is most of the time. Hit any pig in the chest with the right bullet out of a .243 and it will drop. Many of them will not even need a finishing shot by the time you walk to them. I have hit them at 200 metres too, and the result is the same. One advantage the .243 has, is that it can be used on a range of things, depending on the ammunition you use or load yourself. You can use light projectiles for foxes, bit bigger for wild dogs, and a bit bigger again, (around the 90gn mark for me) on pigs. And of course, you can use very strongly constructed projectiles too if you feel the need.

+1 . 32 odd years ago when i first got into this shooting game 243 was one of the most popular calibers around for general purpose use. it was known as a farmers gun because it was the rifle in the ute to do it all . at least around my part of the country . folks further north naturally packed bigger firearms , 303 or 30-06 mils -surps being popular . we are spoilt for choice these days and with modern powder and a great range of projectiles the older stuff can be made to shoot much more accurately . i used to modify swede military ammo for good results back in the day cause ya didn't have a lot of choice back when . spoilt for choice i tells ya

JMHO

[Die Judicii]

Just get the 308 cheap to run, ammo's available in every gun shop I've ever been in and a good variety of projectile options too.

KISS!

Precisely what I said at the beginning of this thread Scottie.

[Die Judicii]

100_5229.JPG (738.85 KiB) Viewed 5108 times

I never thought about checking this one,,,,,
Anyone hazard a guess at her weight ????

[bigrich]

75 kg . So what’s the prize if ya guess the correct weight

[bigfellascott]

60-65kg would be my guess.

[deanp100]

35 kg but that is the biggest gun I have ever seen.