Newbie options - for pigs & feral dogs?

[duncan61]

put a 230gn Failsafe in the 338LP and see what it does.The 22/250 does go hard

[Oldbloke]

If the Op's worried about recoil out of a 308 just use the 125gn Sierra Factory ammo or the 130gn TNT speers the recoils quite comfortable using those lighter projectiles in a 308 (heavier projectiles = more felt recoil as a rule) - KISS!

+1

[bigfellascott]

put a 230gn Failsafe in the 338LP and see what it does.The 22/250 does go hard

Yeah can’t remember what projectile was used in the lap - 208gn seems to ring a bell but I’m really not sure tbh.

[bigrich]

so many opinions, so much choice

[Col]

ScottyD

FWIW as an all round calibre the 243 is hard to go past. I started out with a Win Mod 70 in 243 in the early 80's as my first centrefire and have shot numerous roos and pigs with it. The barrel on that rifle has worn out and I now use a T3 243 (Stainless varmint) and this will take down anything that I need to, even the odd red deer that is coming in.

With regards to pigs I reckon that if you hit a pig with a 243 it is curtains, even if you have to take a follow up shot,. 1 good hit will really ruin their day. I use either 80 gn SPBT or 95gn SST projectiles for all my shooting and if purchased at the right price reloading under $1/shot is easy. Factory ammo is also readily available.
In the last few years I have purchased a Howa 1500 223 and a T3X 308., however the 243 is still my goto everyday gun.

The 223 is a bit light for the pigs unless hit in the right spot and the 308 is too heavy for the roos. As most of my shooting is from the ute and when working in the paddock (moving stock etc) most of the game I shoot (roos and pigs) are opportunity shots, so the 243 is the best suited to each job.

So for a starting centrefire I dont reckon you can go past the old 243.

Good luck with the purchase.

[GQshayne]

I could not say how many pigs I have shot with a .243Win. Started using one in 1985. I do hear people say it is too small for big pigs, but I will disagree. I wonder if they have used a .243 themselves sometimes. I have shot plenty of big pigs with it, many with only one shot. It is also a good choice for dogs, as it has a good trajectory, which 30/30 etc do not have. Good calibre to cover both in my opinion.

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Cheers GQshayne

There's another nod to the .243. How big would you say the biggest pig was that you shot with that calibre? And can I ask, how quickly did it drop?

Around the 100kg mark on occasion. I have had plenty of them drop on the spot with chest shots, which is where I aim on running game, with pigs this is most of the time. Hit any pig in the chest with the right bullet out of a .243 and it will drop. Many of them will not even need a finishing shot by the time you walk to them. I have hit them at 200 metres too, and the result is the same. One advantage the .243 has, is that it can be used on a range of things, depending on the ammunition you use or load yourself. You can use light projectiles for foxes, bit bigger for wild dogs, and a bit bigger again, (around the 90gn mark for me) on pigs. And of course, you can use very strongly constructed projectiles too if you feel the need.

It is a good all-round cartridge. What I like about it aside from versatility, is the trajectory. It shoots flat, so using it in the field is great, as holdover is something I rarely need to worry about at the ranges I shoot. Plenty of other calibers will do the same of course, but as an example, the .308 uses the same case as the .243, so the lighter bullet will be faster and shoot flatter in the same size case.

I think there are a number of choices you could make here, but you won't go wrong with the .243.

[bigrich]

I could not say how many pigs I have shot with a .243Win. Started using one in 1985. I do hear people say it is too small for big pigs, but I will disagree. I wonder if they have used a .243 themselves sometimes. I have shot plenty of big pigs with it, many with only one shot. It is also a good choice for dogs, as it has a good trajectory, which 30/30 etc do not have. Good calibre to cover both in my opinion.

---

Cheers GQshayne

There's another nod to the .243. How big would you say the biggest pig was that you shot with that calibre? And can I ask, how quickly did it drop?

Around the 100kg mark on occasion. I have had plenty of them drop on the spot with chest shots, which is where I aim on running game, with pigs this is most of the time. Hit any pig in the chest with the right bullet out of a .243 and it will drop. Many of them will not even need a finishing shot by the time you walk to them. I have hit them at 200 metres too, and the result is the same. One advantage the .243 has, is that it can be used on a range of things, depending on the ammunition you use or load yourself. You can use light projectiles for foxes, bit bigger for wild dogs, and a bit bigger again, (around the 90gn mark for me) on pigs. And of course, you can use very strongly constructed projectiles too if you feel the need.

+1 . 32 odd years ago when i first got into this shooting game 243 was one of the most popular calibers around for general purpose use. it was known as a farmers gun because it was the rifle in the ute to do it all . at least around my part of the country . folks further north naturally packed bigger firearms , 303 or 30-06 mils -surps being popular . we are spoilt for choice these days and with modern powder and a great range of projectiles the older stuff can be made to shoot much more accurately . i used to modify swede military ammo for good results back in the day cause ya didn't have a lot of choice back when . spoilt for choice i tells ya

JMHO

[Die Judicii]

Just get the 308 cheap to run, ammo's available in every gun shop I've ever been in and a good variety of projectile options too.

KISS!

Precisely what I said at the beginning of this thread Scottie.

[Die Judicii]

100_5229.JPG (738.85 KiB) Viewed 5101 times

I never thought about checking this one,,,,,
Anyone hazard a guess at her weight ????

[bigrich]

75 kg . So what’s the prize if ya guess the correct weight

[bigfellascott]

60-65kg would be my guess.

[deanp100]

35 kg but that is the biggest gun I have ever seen.

[SCJ429]

I would take that sow on with a 243. What were you using?

[bigfellascott]

I would take that sow on with a 243. What were you using?

I'd take it on with a 222 if it was standing still that is.

[Blr243]

I recommend a 243 with 87 vmax projectiles for your dogs and pigs It has the power to take bigger pigs and the flat traj for dogs at distance. And it’s an accurate caliber that’s comfortable for anyone to shoot

[Daz243]

My Tikka t3 243 has a steady diet of 87 v-max reloads. I have mainly using it on foxes out to 350m and the fox still looks messy at this distance. Also pigs have a bad day with the 243.
It is a good general purpose centrefire to own if you never own another c.f.

[bigfellascott]

270's another great cal for sorting out pigs and dogs etc etc.

[snag]

For a self-confessed noobie, you won't go past a .308 bolt action with a 3-9x40 scope. The "Holden Ute" of farm guns.

[Oldbloke]

For a self-confessed noobie, you won't go past a .308 bolt action with a 3-9x40 scope. The "Holden Ute" of farm guns.

Yep, and in this case load it with 130gr bullets.

A lot of talk here about trajectories. I dont have the info here. Did some home work in the area about 12 months ago. My conclusion was that for most cartridges,
(222, 223, 243, 270, 308, 30-06) up to about 220 meters very little differance & not worth worrying about for most hunting situations. Thay are all within about 2 inches.

[bigfellascott]

For a self-confessed noobie, you won't go past a .308 bolt action with a 3-9x40 scope. The "Holden Ute" of farm guns.

Yep, and in this case load it with 130gr bullets.

A lot of talk here about trajectories. I dont have the info here. Did some home work in the area about 12 months ago. My conclusion was that for most cartridges,
(222, 223, 243, 270, 308, 30-06) up to about 220 meters very little differance & not worth worrying about for most hunting situations. Thay are all within about 2 inches.

+1 I generally just put the X-hairs on top of their shoulder line and send em if they are out around 200m, people making hunting way harder than it really has to be I reckon - KISS is what I live by.

[GQshayne]

Agreed fellas, that is why I mentioned it. BUT, we do have to acknowledge that the listed cartridges above are all pretty flat shooting. My old 30/30 certainly was not.

[SCJ429]

For a self-confessed noobie, you won't go past a .308 bolt action with a 3-9x40 scope. The "Holden Ute" of farm guns.

My opinion is that the best step up from a rimfire to a centrefire is to get a 222 or 223. The best platform to learn the fundamentals of marksmanship is with a smaller friendly centrefire. A new shooter needs to practice a lot with something they are comfortable with and builds confidence.

I learned to shoot with a rimfire and then went to a 303 with a metal butt plate. Not ideal and I wish my Dad had a Tikka in 222 or similar back then. I was mentoring a bloke who bought a Tikka T3 in 22/250, that rifle was the best thing you could give a bloke starting out and he now has the confidence and skill to make some excellent shots while hunting.

I agree that the 222 is not well suited for pigs but would be perfect for the foxes, feral cats and dogs that the OP mentioned he wanted to hunt.

[ScottyD]

Wow, so any good suggestions and considerations. Thanks heaps everybody.

I spoke about this topic with the bloke who is helping with our house fence, who is amazingly switched on with all things rural. He immediately suggested .223, citing the flinching issue.

I admit I’m torn between .243 and .308, but my gut is telling me the .243 could be the best option at this point. I’m not adverse to recoil, and I agree with comments that I should be able to train through any potential flinch reflex (I intend to train a lot with all of my rifles to the point of ‘unconscious competence’ before I take any shots at any animal). I am curious about the .308, and I can see myself getting one further down the track anyway. As pointed out a number of times, the .243 should get the job done quite well, and would be well suited to a lot of other sized quarry.

[Die Judicii]

I would take that sow on with a 243. What were you using?

There are a number of factors involved in the taking of this sow,,,, some of which may help the OP.

1) It was taken with a 22/250 using 55Gr Sierra Blitzking projectiles.

2) It was less than 50 meters away when hit the 1st time (before I got it in the thermal, it actually walked past me.)

3) It took 3 rounds through the heart/lungs before it fell over

4) I honestly don't know what she weighed, but it was a hell of a struggle for both the landowner and myself to get her onto the ute tray.

5) I wished I'd taken the .308 out that night,,,,,, instead of the 22/250

[SCJ429]

What sort of damage did you do with the rounds that hit the heart and lungs? Did you open her up and have a look?

Was she just standing there after the first hit or was she running?

I have used a 22/250 a bit myself and anytime I have hit the heart, with 55 grain Vmax, the animal has not moved off more than half a dozen metres.

[Die Judicii]

What sort of damage did you do with the rounds that hit the heart and lungs? Did you open her up and have a look?

Was she just standing there after the first hit or was she running?

I have used a 22/250 a bit myself and anytime I have hit the heart, with 55 grain Vmax, the animal has not moved off more than half a dozen metres.

I'll give her this much,,, she was tough.
1st shot put her on her front knees,
Then she got up and started running.
2nd shot she fell over sideways, and then got up again and staggered about 10 metres.
3rd shot put her down and gave some frantic thrashing sideways.

I didn't open her up, but I doubt there was anything except mush in the chest cavity.
I think she blew most of the bits of lung/heart out her nostrils, cos when i went to inspect, there was a massive pool of frothy blood and pieces of meat on the ground at the end of her snout.

I had a similar experience many years back when I shot a boar up in the mountains in NSW.
I hit him at full gallop at a distance (paced out) of just on 300 metres with a .303 psp
Got him in the boiler room, and he ran another 150 metres before going down.
He musta been running on pure adrenalin, cos we opened him up, and mostly mush just flowed out of the chest.

He had been eating clover that was growing in a thick patch where water drained down off the edge of a bitumin road.
When we rolled him over, he still had a gob full of clover.

[TassieTiger]

I’m not offay with pig hunting - no one has the balls to release em in Tassie - lol.
But I hear and read a lot of different stories about some pigs falling to a Shanghai and a river pebble and others that swallow a 338 and spit it back at you...has me thinking left of field.

Is it possible that wild pigs (not unlike their farmed cousins) have hard / soft areas on their hides - like really hard. We had a farmed pig once that slept continuously in the exact same place and on the exact same side - when time came to harvest her, the side she slept on was insanely difficult to skin, like benchmade knife really, really struggled - whilst the other side was easy...I think a bullet impact would have had vastly different results depending on which side bore the impact. Just a thought.

[bigrich]

I’m not offay with pig hunting - no one has the balls to release em in Tassie - lol.
But I hear and read a lot of different stories about some pigs falling to a Shanghai and a river pebble and others that swallow a 338 and spit it back at you...has me thinking left of field.

Is it possible that wild pigs (not unlike their farmed cousins) have hard / soft areas on their hides - like really hard. We had a farmed pig once that slept continuously in the exact same place and on the exact same side - when time came to harvest her, the side she slept on was insanely difficult to skin, like benchmade knife really, really struggled - whilst the other side was easy...I think a bullet impact would have had vastly different results depending on which side bore the impact. Just a thought.

boar shoulder sheilds are a genetic thing , but i guess it's plausable that the skin would be tougher on hard used areas just like calloused hands from lots of manual labor in a human . russian boar in europe are supposedly very tuff cause they fight each other with their tusks and develope thick tuff sheilds . that would explain why some europeans like to use 9.3x62 for boar nathan foster in NZ likes to use a 35 whelen for pigs , just saying .....

[Oldbloke]

Seems to me if the OP wants 1 gun then 243 is the go. Other wise 223 & 308.

[GQshayne]

I’m not offay with pig hunting - no one has the balls to release em in Tassie - lol.
But I hear and read a lot of different stories about some pigs falling to a Shanghai and a river pebble and others that swallow a 338 and spit it back at you...has me thinking left of field.

Is it possible that wild pigs (not unlike their farmed cousins) have hard / soft areas on their hides - like really hard. We had a farmed pig once that slept continuously in the exact same place and on the exact same side - when time came to harvest her, the side she slept on was insanely difficult to skin, like benchmade knife really, really struggled - whilst the other side was easy...I think a bullet impact would have had vastly different results depending on which side bore the impact. Just a thought.

Some pigs do have a tough shoulder plate for sure. You can also happen to be taking on a pig that has been wallowing in the mud, and have a dried crust half an inch thick on your target spot. They are also pretty tough, especially when the adrenalin is going. Hit them in the wrong spot, even with 30 cal stuff and you can expect to get a poor result.