Are you allowed to shoot on RU2 Zoned Land? (NSW)

[Real_Thor]

Hey There Guys,

Just wondering if anyone knows whether or not you're allowed to shoot on land zoned RU2 Rural Landscape?

Am in NSW.

Thanks in advance .

[straightshooter]

Forum advice on these matters often isn't worth the paper it's written on!
Go speak with your local police officer as he(she) will be the person that responds in the event of a complaint.
Things to consider are size of property, calibers to be used and the prospect that a projectile might leave the bounds of the property concerned.

[Gamerancher]

Considering the prevalence of "green" minded folks in that area, ( I'm assuming you are referring to the Blue Mountains ), be prepared for a LOT of complaints.
Check with the local council as to "allowed" uses.

[Communism_Is_Cancer]

Considering the prevalence of "green" minded folks in that area, ( I'm assuming you are referring to the Blue Mountains ), be prepared for a LOT of complaints.
Check with the local council as to "allowed" uses.

There was a case in QLD of a bloke who was legally shooting on his property and the neighbours kept calling the cops to say there is a bloke shooting. The police told the neighbour after a few callouts that he would be charged for making a false police report if he calls again. Gunfire in rural areas is not suspicious but rather common.

[dpskipper]

Gunfire in rural areas is not suspicious but rather common.

Thats about to change. In regional vic in the Ballarat and surrounding areas, lots of mates I know are fed-up with the new "f-lockdown" arrivals who are escaping Mad Dan from the city, and imposing their stupid way of life around the old timers. A clay target club I know has effectively been shutdown from incessant noise complaints, even though the club has been around for decades.

[boingk]

A clay target club I know has effectively been shutdown from incessant noise complaints, even though the club has been around for decades.

Unfortunately this is as much a case of shooters lacking balls as it is blow-ins getting irritated.

Won't go any further as I don't know the specifics, but I'm yet to be corrected.

[Oldbloke]

Yeh, that sh1ts me. Essendon airport was closed due to noise complaints and so called danger of crashes by people who moved into the area.

Pathetic.

[straightshooter]

Yeh, that sh1ts me. Essendon airport was closed due to noise complaints and so called danger of crashes by people who moved into the area.

Pathetic.

Yes, as in all these sorts of affairs that is the cover story that the congenitally compliant were intended to swallow and I suppose did. I am sure the now redundant land was subsequently put to good (and profitable) use and the usual behind the scenes cronies danced to the tune of the cash register kachinging.
Much the same was planned for Bankstown airport quite a few years ago with the usual relentless media campaign. That is until somebody worked out that the land was unsuitable and thus unprofitable for residential development due to it being swamp land hastily converted to an airfield in WW2.

[Gamerancher]

Communism_Is_Cancer Wrote, "There was a case in QLD of a bloke who was legally shooting on his property and the neighbours kept calling the cops to say there is a bloke shooting. The police told the neighbour after a few callouts that he would be charged for making a false police report if he calls again. Gunfire in rural areas is not suspicious but rather common."

I live on my farm in Western NSW, surrounded by larger properties and unexpected gunfire around here is actually suspicious. My neighbours will let me know if they will be out doing any shooting, if I hear gunshots at night and no-one has told me they'll be out, it usually means w*ankers from town out trespassing.
I've had a stud bull, two cows and a three month old calf shot by ar$eholes blasting away illegally with a spotlight over the 20 odd years I've been here.
I've been out in the paddock fencing and had shots go off 100 yards away from me in the bush on my property, tell me that's not suspicious!
Unfortunately there is a lot of entry points for them to sneak in due to our houses being many kilometres apart.
So, please, don't lecture me in what is "common" in rural areas.

[Oldbloke]

Essendon still exists. They must have just restricted the flights in some way. Worked beside it a few years ago. Hardly any flights.

Resized_tempFileForShare_20210905-130805_336565499520675.jpeg (250.69 KiB) Viewed 7994 times

[Yes]

To bring the discussion back to your question... Let's break it down a little.

Minimum land for rimfire in NSW, when applying for Geniune Reason Landholder (vermin/Hunter on own land), is 5 acres. It's 40 acres for centerfire permission. This is checked using SixMaps when you apply through the registry portal. You need to supply a rates notice or the like and the details of the property. Technically, this means if you bought a 5 acre property and it was infested with bunnies, you could legally shoot till your heart's content (rimfire). So, first step to jump over is land size.

Next hurdle is... what are you shooting? You can't just throw up targets and go blasting, unless you're sighting in or testing ammo, only time you can punch paper (legally at least). So RU2, are you hunting? What are you hunting? Vermin control, what vermin? That's the only options you have to legally shoot.

If you are somewhere near more "city minded folks" you're not going to have a good time of it if there's nothing to hunt and little by way of vermin. They'll make noise complaints, and state they fear for their safety. And unless you can show your varminting or hunting they'll be in the right. Also, to be honest, depending on the size of the land, I'd likely agree with the safety part - if the block is on the smaller side and flat terrain people would be justified in being concerned. 5 acres is very small, I was surprised by this, I think it's 20 acres in WA for rimfire, which is a little better in my opinion.

With that said, a lot of this down to proximity to neighbours, but also who your neighbours are. Both of these cease being an issue if you have a big property. In my experience, I've got 80 acres of RU1, with neighbours who are both shooters. The shape of my land (high hills on all sides), plus the distance they are away from me (about a km), means they need to be outside with good wind to hear most of my shooting - and certainly can't claim they feel in danger (not that they would) as it would be almost impossible for a bullet to leave my boundaries - I'd actually have to try.

Added to the good size and shape of my property, is that I have a harm kangaroo licence/quota, and there's a lot of foxes as everyone around me are sheep/cattle farmers (always a dead one to feed the foxes).

Finally, it's rural... And most rural places are OK with shooters and shooting if they know who's doing it. Gamerancher's experience sounds like it is outsiders he's annoyed at (totally understandable) - and also states that his neighbours let them know if they will be shooting - nothing wrong with this either.

[bladeracer]

To bring the discussion back to your question... Let's break it down a little.

Minimum land for rimfire in NSW, when applying for Geniune Reason Landholder (vermin/Hunter on own land), is 5 acres. It's 40 acres for centerfire permission. This is checked using SixMaps when you apply through the registry portal. You need to supply a rates notice or the like and the details of the property. Technically, this means if you bought a 5 acre property and it was infested with bunnies, you could legally shoot till your heart's content (rimfire). So, first step to jump over is land size.

Next hurdle is... what are you shooting? You can't just throw up targets and go blasting, unless you're sighting in or testing ammo, only time you can punch paper (legally at least). So RU2, are you hunting? What are you hunting? Vermin control, what vermin? That's the only options you have to legally shoot.

If you are somewhere near more "city minded folks" you're not going to have a good time of it if there's nothing to hunt and little by way of vermin. They'll make noise complaints, and state they fear for their safety. And unless you can show your varminting or hunting they'll be in the right. Also, to be honest, depending on the size of the land, I'd likely agree with the safety part - if the block is on the smaller side and flat terrain people would be justified in being concerned. 5 acres is very small, I was surprised by this, I think it's 20 acres in WA for rimfire, which is a little better in my opinion.

With that said, a lot of this down to proximity to neighbours, but also who your neighbours are. Both of these cease being an issue if you have a big property. In my experience, I've got 80 acres of RU1, with neighbours who are both shooters. The shape of my land (high hills on all sides), plus the distance they are away from me (about a km), means they need to be outside with good wind to hear most of my shooting - and certainly can't claim they feel in danger (not that they would) as it would be almost impossible for a bullet to leave my boundaries - I'd actually have to try.

Added to the good size and shape of my property, is that I have a harm kangaroo licence/quota, and there's a lot of foxes as everyone around me are sheep/cattle farmers (always a dead one to feed the foxes).

Finally, it's rural... And most rural places are OK with shooters and shooting if they know who's doing it. Gamerancher's experience sounds like it is outsiders he's annoyed at (totally understandable) - and also states that his neighbours let them know if they will be shooting - nothing wrong with this either.

The land size is _only_ for genuine reason when applying for a licence, it is not a legal requirement for shooting on property. No state has a legislated minimum land size for shooting. You can shoot on a quarter-acre block as long as it is safe to do so.

I shoot very regularly so it would actually be odd if my neighbours did not hear gunfire for a few days.

[disco stu]

I can confirm what bladeracer said-I've checked about a small property with a deer problem and was told there is minimum size to shoot on, but it's up to me to ensure it is safe to do so. I can't remember the zoning requirements though, but I'm pretty sure anything rural is fine.

Best bet is to ring the local police and talk to the licensing officer

[Yes]

Agreed - that's why I made it clear it was licensing I was referring to, and I also agree that we can shoot on much smaller plots of land, safely (well, maybe not everyone!). But I maintain that the 5/40 acres outlined in the Genuine Reason would be the absolute minimum I'd consider for rimfire/centrefire. I don't think it is arbitrary that licencing have those numbers as a hurdle - it is something that Joe Average can use as reference point.
Put it another way - shooting my low powered air-rifle in the backyard here of my inner Sydney home would be 100% safe, how do you think that would work out for me with the law? While there is no official size, 5/40 is a fair starting point, then as I say, location location location (oh, and having something viable to shoot at helps!).

[bladeracer]

Agreed - that's why I made it clear it was licensing I was referring to, and I also agree that we can shoot on much smaller plots of land, safely (well, maybe not everyone!). But I maintain that the 5/40 acres outlined in the Genuine Reason would be the absolute minimum I'd consider for rimfire/centrefire. I don't think it is arbitrary that licencing have those numbers as a hurdle - it is something that Joe Average can use as reference point.
Put it another way - shooting my low powered air-rifle in the backyard here of my inner Sydney home would be 100% safe, how do you think that would work out for me with the law? While there is no official size, 5/40 is a fair starting point, then as I say, location location location (oh, and having something viable to shoot at helps!).

I used to shoot my air-rifle in the backyard in Perth when I was a kid without any issues, but we also shot .22LR competition on the school oval at Wesley College.

We have a rifle range in the heart of Traralgon here now in Victoria, literally in the middle of the town.

None of these places are rural, but as a general rule, as long as you live rurally you can shoot in your backyard with whatever you want, as long as you can do it safely.

[bladeracer]

Agreed - that's why I made it clear it was licensing I was referring to, and I also agree that we can shoot on much smaller plots of land, safely (well, maybe not everyone!). But I maintain that the 5/40 acres outlined in the Genuine Reason would be the absolute minimum I'd consider for rimfire/centrefire. I don't think it is arbitrary that licencing have those numbers as a hurdle - it is something that Joe Average can use as reference point.
Put it another way - shooting my low powered air-rifle in the backyard here of my inner Sydney home would be 100% safe, how do you think that would work out for me with the law? While there is no official size, 5/40 is a fair starting point, then as I say, location location location (oh, and having something viable to shoot at helps!).

I used to shoot my air-rifle in the backyard in Perth when I was a kid without any issues, but we also shot .22LR competition on the school oval at Wesley College.

We have a rifle range in the heart of Traralgon here now in Victoria, literally in the middle of the town.

None of these places are rural, but as a general rule, as long as you live rurally you can shoot in your backyard with whatever you want, as long as you can do it safely.

This is Traralgon, population around 30,000.

Traralgon Small Bore Rifle Club 1.JPG (275.62 KiB) Viewed 7914 times

As you zoom in you find the rifle club in the centre.

Traralgon Small Bore Rifle Club.JPG (293.04 KiB) Viewed 7914 times

They shoot Wednesday evenings.

Traralgon Small Bore Rifle Club 2.JPG (159.74 KiB) Viewed 7914 times

The range shoots from south to north, away from Shakespeare Street.
The range is open-air, no roof.

[Apollo]

"bladeracer" What you did in WA nor what you did as a kid has no bearing on what you can do in NSW on RU2 Zoned land. To you and others that are not in NSW and don't know the local laws... Why, really why are you tossing in comments you know completely nothing about... Really...!!!!

Are you still a Kid...??

I was a kid about 60 years ago and yes, in NSW I use to shoot in my back yard.... in Surburbia BUT that was 60 years ago.... today, you'll get locked up.

[pomemax]

Where about in NSW are you living I have a friend who has a RU2 block on the outskirts of Sydney He got into a world of hurt shooting Indian miners with air rifle. Seems even tho its RU2 inside the Greater Metropolitan area you still cant shoot on it.

[bladeracer]

"bladeracer" What you did in WA nor what you did as a kid has no bearing on what you can do in NSW on RU2 Zoned land. To you and others that are not in NSW and don't know the local laws... Why, really why are you tossing in comments you know completely nothing about... Really...!!!!

Are you still a Kid...??

I was a kid about 60 years ago and yes, in NSW I use to shoot in my back yard.... in Surburbia BUT that was 60 years ago.... today, you'll get locked up.

Enjoying your rant?

The comments I'm "tossing about" are correct, even in NSW, are you suggesting they are not?

That was 1980 to 1983. I only mentioned it in response to the statement about using an air-rifle in a back yard

Chill out

Oh, I mentioned about Traralgon as we are all well aware that we cannot shoot in built-up areas, ever...except sometimes we can

[bladeracer]

Where about in NSW are you living I have a friend who has a RU2 block on the outskirts of Sydney He got into a world of hurt shooting Indian miners with air rifle. Seems even tho its RU2 inside the Greater Metropolitan area you still cant shoot on it.

Did he get into trouble specifically _for shooting on the property_ or were there other problems?

[Apollo]

Where about in NSW are you living I have a friend who has a RU2 block on the outskirts of Sydney He got into a world of hurt shooting Indian miners with air rifle. Seems even tho its RU2 inside the Greater Metropolitan area you still cant shoot on it.

I am around the Bathurst area.... I am still working out really what an "RU2" class is really. This to me is something new other than Town or Rural...Zoning laws that are affecting a lot of people that have land....

I really don't want to get into a s**t fight over this but I am rather surprised here on a lot of topics that are state specific that people from other states have a lot to say about BUT don't really have a clue or local knowledge.

If you are in another state, keep your bloody mouth shut if you don't know the facts....

My own property is just classed as Rural... well, as best I know and haven't looked at my last Rate Notice nor advised if it's anything different.

The real old story was that anything outside the "Speed Sign Limit" was Rural.... BUT around here Council have stopped sub-dividing anything less than 250 Acres... Maybe there are new Zone Names... I'm not interested.

What get's up my nose is those that aren't in the same State poking their nose into something they know Fusk All About....

End of rant....

[Apollo]

Best I can tell is that "RU2" Zoned Land is "Low Density Residential" and the operative word is "Residential" so, without legal advice I'd say NO you can't legally discharge a Firearm on that property. It's not RURAL....

As has been said .... speak to the Local Area Command Police Officer and ask, then keep a record of the comments.

I wouldn't and don't care where a Range may be located.... Got nothing to do with the question and a "Range" comes under a specific licence...

Plenty of Indoor Ranges in the middle of a city...

[pomemax]

No for discharging a fire arm in the Metro area and he lived on 5 acre in Silverdale Near the Range yer all the rules are different now compared to when we were kids the cops emptied out his safe Took nearly 12 moths and Heaps of $ to get them back
I think the area he was saying he could not shoot in was from Berowra North The Victoria Bridge (Penrith), West and south down to Camen way This is just what he told me Blanket ban on discharge unless your at a range or have pest control contract .

[Apollo]

Sydney even though Silverdale area / Camden then I think you'd need to be careful and ask the Cops... Ranges are different and licenced.

I'm glad I left Sydney near 50 years ago.... What a rat race.

[bladeracer]

What get's up my nose is those that aren't in the same State poking their nose into something they know Fusk All About....

End of rant....

You don't have to live in a state to know its laws, especially around firearms. I suggest everybody learn the firearm laws in any state they're likely to visit.

[bladeracer]

Best I can tell is that "RU2" Zoned Land is "Low Density Residential" and the operative word is "Residential" so, without legal advice I'd say NO you can't legally discharge a Firearm on that property. It's not RURAL....

As has been said .... speak to the Local Area Command Police Officer and ask, then keep a record of the comments.

I wouldn't and don't care where a Range may be located.... Got nothing to do with the question and a "Range" comes under a specific licence...

Plenty of Indoor Ranges in the middle of a city...

Certainly, if RU2 zoning is residential then shooting is definitely out.

[bladeracer]

No for discharging a fire arm in the Metro area and he lived on 5 acre in Silverdale Near the Range yer all the rules are different now compared to when we were kids the cops emptied out his safe Took nearly 12 moths and Heaps of $ to get them back
I think the area he was saying he could not shoot in was from Berowra North The Victoria Bridge (Penrith), West and south down to Camen way This is just what he told me Blanket ban on discharge unless your at a range or have pest control contract .

If it was zoned RU2, and RU2 is residential, then he probably got what he deserved.

[disco stu]

I'm not up on zoning, but if it's residential it's R, rural is RU.

I just did a quick Google search and was hard to decipher off government pages, but I did see this from another site:

"Please note that if you are residential then your zoning is one of the following:

R1, R2, R3, R4

If you are rural then your zoning is one of the following:

RU1, RU2, RU3, RU4, RU6, or R5"
Plus I saw references of people with 100+ acres zoned ru2, so that is much bigger than low density residential

But still, a conversation with licensing first is the best bet

[Yes]

Honestly - this place.

Firstly, "Bladeracer" - and I say this with a little cheeky nudge in the ribs, you do like to be a contrarian and have the last word don't you? I guess that's why your post count is unfathomably high.

Providing evidence of a Registered and Licenced range you can shoot on in a built up area is like comparing Eastern Creek Raceway to the M4 Motorway I ride on to get to the track. I do 300km/h on my S1000RR on the track, yet the M4 is only a couple of hundred metres away. You know the difference? I'm sure you do, so I won't explain it - I hope that puts an end to the rifle range obsession. Oh and yep, a lot has changed over the last 40 years; absolutely, some of the things you did as a kid you can't anymore (who'd have thought!).

RU2 is NOT residential... it is "Rural Landscape" - it is still zoned for primary industry, but has different caveats on what you can and can't do with the land - there's more restrictions on the care of the land and what you can produce than there is with RU1. RU1 is "Primary Production" - that's the top of the food chain (hey that's kinda punny). There tends to be a correlation with zoning and land size (but not always, as Disco Stu has stated) - i.e. RU1 tends to be the larger properties, then it works its way down in size from RU1 through to RU6 - but it also depends where it is located, closer to the major cities tends to mean that small hobby farm blocks are zoned RU2/4 (RU4 is "Rural Small Holdings") - still zoned rural, but it's likely you have Starbucks in walking distance from these zonings. So, just because somewhere is Rural Zoned (RU1 through RU6) doesn't mean you can automatically shoot there with impunity (even if you think it is "safe to do so" Bladeracer).

Let me just add that we need to keep in mind that this forum is open to the public - and sometimes people come across this forum looking for information and well, they're not that bright, and they read things like "as long as you live rurally you can shoot in your backyard with whatever you want", and off they trot. Sure, who gives a fudge, their own fault if something goes wrong, right?

[bladeracer]

Honestly - this place.

Firstly, "Bladeracer" - and I say this with a little cheeky nudge in the ribs, you do like to be a contrarian and have the last word don't you? I guess that's why your post count is unfathomably high.

Providing evidence of a Registered and Licenced range you can shoot on in a built up area is like comparing Eastern Creek Raceway to the M4 Motorway I ride on to get to the track. I do 300km/h on my S1000RR on the track, yet the M4 is only a couple of hundred metres away. You know the difference? I'm sure you do, so I won't explain it - I hope that puts an end to the rifle range obsession. Oh and yep, a lot has changed over the last 40 years; absolutely, some of the things you did as a kid you can't anymore (who'd have thought!).

RU2 is NOT residential... it is "Rural Landscape" - it is still zoned for primary industry, but has different caveats on what you can and can't do with the land - there's more restrictions on the care of the land and what you can produce than there is with RU1. RU1 is "Primary Production" - that's the top of the food chain (hey that's kinda punny). There tends to be a correlation with zoning and land size (but not always, as Disco Stu has stated) - i.e. RU1 tends to be the larger properties, then it works its way down in size from RU1 through to RU6 - but it also depends where it is located, closer to the major cities tends to mean that small hobby farm blocks are zoned RU2/4 (RU4 is "Rural Small Holdings") - still zoned rural, but it's likely you have Starbucks in walking distance from these zonings. So, just because somewhere is Rural Zoned (RU1 through RU6) doesn't mean you can automatically shoot there with impunity (even if you think it is "safe to do so" Bladeracer).

Let me just add that we need to keep in mind that this forum is open to the public - and sometimes people come across this forum looking for information and well, they're not that bright, and they read things like "as long as you live rurally you can shoot in your backyard with whatever you want", and off they trot. Sure, who gives a fudge, their own fault if something goes wrong, right?

First, I disagree with both opinions. Second my post count is high because I've put a lot of useful material into this forum to help people

I wasn't comparing the range with anything, merely making the point that because the law says we can't do something doesn't always mean that we can't. Likewise, I only mentioned the air-rifle shooting because it was mentioned by somebody else...

It certainly makes more sense to me that RU2 is rural, not residential. It wasn't me that suggested it wasn't rural...

Whether you can shoot on RU2 though comes down to specifics, which are hard to determine.
Genuine Reason for hunting on private land only requires "rural property" - https://www.police.nsw.gov.au/online_services/firearms/licences/pages/recreational_hunting_vermin_control_genuine_reason

Genuine Reason NSW.JPG (79.22 KiB) Viewed 7852 times

The letter for authority to hunt on private land issued by NSW Police doesn't mention anything about property even being rural.
https://www.police.nsw.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0019/131194/RHVC_Letter_of_Authority.pdf

Having gone through the Firearms Act and Regulations, and the Crimes Act, can you direct me to any law stating that you can't shoot on land zoned as RU2?