ssaa fractured

[bigrich]

hey fellas, i've received a email to say that ssaa qld has been suspended from the national organisation over qld not passing on membership fees to the national body . delving deeper , qld ssaa has been very proactive in becoming more independent in general, and starting it's own lobby group . i don't like the organisation becoming divided , as politically this is not good for shooters. but i'm thinking personal ego's and problems with the old guard in the organisation have brought this about . just as well i'm also a shooters union member....

[mchughcb]

I have heard this 1 month ago from the SSAA directors. It affects SSAA qld members only. They are suspended not expelled. They owe money to National. The members will have to make their voice heard if this is the direction they want to take.

[bigrich]

I have heard this 1 month ago from the SSAA directors. It affects SSAA qld members only. They are suspended not expelled. They owe money to National. The members will have to make their voice heard if this is the direction they want to take.

well , this is the thing, there's two (or more) sides to every argument . thought i'd post about it on this forum for discussion

[Wapiti]

I think it's a positive step. I've never seem more political information and push to inform us on what's going on, I believe I'm seeing twice weekly info sharing, contacts for politicians and suggestions to get on board with.
Never saw this from SSAA National. Not since prior to 1996 where political information was a big part of their publications. Then SSAA got what it wanted, p1ssed on the rural people and refused to give them a voice as to why the certain gun bans were counter-productive, and set in motion it's "join our club or f**k off" attitude.
Having said that, we're still paying members in the hope of something good coming from it eventually.

[mchughcb]

I have heard this 1 month ago from the SSAA directors. It affects SSAA qld members only. They are suspended not expelled. They owe money to National. The members will have to make their voice heard if this is the direction they want to take.

well , this is the thing, there's two (or more) sides to every argument . thought i'd post about it on this forum for discussion

What will happen if they split, target shooters won't be able to compete nationally. The national pays for the best to compete overseas wont be able in Qld. The cost of insurance will go up as the Natonal gas more bargaining power.

[bigrich]

I have heard this 1 month ago from the SSAA directors. It affects SSAA qld members only. They are suspended not expelled. They owe money to National. The members will have to make their voice heard if this is the direction they want to take.

well , this is the thing, there's two (or more) sides to every argument . thought i'd post about it on this forum for discussion

What will happen if they split, target shooters won't be able to compete nationally. The national pays for the best to compete overseas wont be able in Qld. The cost of insurance will go up as the Natonal gas more bargaining power.

apparently qld members still have all privileges still available at this time. i think the issue is qld branch is not getting their fair share of monies from membership fees , and inaction from the national organisation politically . inaction , or very little action, exposed weakness to act in it's members interests in WA . qld has been setting itself up to be more independent for some time . i think the "old boys club" that runs this organisation has had it's day, and if there's a shake up to reinvigorate the organisation, that might be a good thing. besides having ranges , what does ssaa do for it's members ?
i've seen much more action from shooters union

[Billo]

Go and ask your local branch how much money has been returned from SSAA Qld.....

[bigrich]

Go and ask your local branch how much money has been returned from SSAA Qld.....

can you please clarify the context of money returned ? what money and returned to who ? i understand qld ssaa has with held it's qld membership fees from national , about 1 million apparently

[Wapiti]

Cut and paste from an email I received yesterday.
Make of it what you will.

"We are aware that SSAA National (SSAA Inc) has emailed many members across our state and nationally claiming to have established a rival Queensland shooting organisation. The email contains many false statements and its aim appears to be an attempt to hijack membership funds from Queenslanders.

We will seek legal advice and respond to SSAA National to make it clear that we will not sit idly by when outside parties attempt to defame and interfere with the functions of our independent organisation. SSAA Queensland is the largest, financially sound and self-reliant shooting and hunting organisation in Australia with more than 75 branches statewide. We are not under the control of SSAA National and they have no right to misadvise our 80,000 members.

Put simply, SSAA National has misused its finances, reduced membership benefits and not provided the level of service that we expect for our members. We have ceased paying them for services that we now provide our own members, as they were simply not up to the task. Instead of restructuring their budget to match their reduced income and reduced responsibilities, they appear to be panicking and now attempting to hijack Queensland shooters’ membership fees without offering ranges or state benefits. Their actions display a disregard for Queensland and will go down in history as malicious and self-destructive.

For us and our members nothing has changed, nor will it. SSAA Queensland remains your genuine reason to have a firearms licence. We will continue to provide the ranges to shoot at and the disciplines to compete in. We also now offer Australia’s largest circulation shooting, hunting and outdoors print magazine The Report at no extra cost to most of our members. We lobby for your sport and recreation at the state and federal level and provide $20 million in public liability. We have established the Australian Shooters Alliance and the Australian Institute of Legislative Action which provides us with the ability to reach federal legislators and work with other likeminded organisations like the USA’s National Rifle Association. While being a state-based organisation, we now have national and international reach and influence.

And when you pay your membership fees to be a member it stays in your state, rather than being funnelled away to prop up another group. We are here to stay, and we are here for you.

We will continue to update members on our website and have also put a Q&A section under the News section.

Jeff Ross,

SSAA Queensland President"

[Billo]

Go and ask your local branch how much money has been returned from SSAA Qld.....

can you please clarify the context of money returned ? what money and returned to who ? i understand qld ssaa has with held it's qld membership fees from national , about 1 million apparently

Its a simple question, ask the branch how much money they recieved this year from SSAA Qld

[Bugman]

Seems SSAA skullduggery is evident in most states. NSW SSAA have been busy buying up ranges or attempting to undermine existing ranges/clubs etc in order to
control as much as they can. Maybe not always, with good intent. Am I still a member? yes.........at present.

[bigrich]

Go and ask your local branch how much money has been returned from SSAA Qld.....

can you please clarify the context of money returned ? what money and returned to who ? i understand qld ssaa has with held it's qld membership fees from national , about 1 million apparently

Its a simple question, ask the branch how much money they recieved this year from SSAA Qld

That makes things a bit clearer. I’ll make some enquires when I get the chance. Not sure I’ll get a straight answer from ssaa…..

[mchughcb]

SSAA Qld owes money to the National. They can pay or get suspended or expelled.

Pretty simple.

[CJRBOLTGUN1]

National needs to go for good and we all need to amalgamate under one organisation that has only the members best interest in mind.

[bigrich]

SSAA Qld owes money to the National. They can pay or get suspended or expelled.

Pretty simple.

read the above post by wapati . maybe not so simple

[Tinker]

Seems SSAA skullduggery is evident in most states. NSW SSAA have been busy buying up ranges or attempting to undermine existing ranges/clubs etc in order to
control as much as they can. Maybe not always, with good intent. Am I still a member? yes.........at present.

Could you elaborate on that? What have they done to undermine existing ranges & clubs?

[bigrich]

wow , quite a topic . i don't think ssaa hierarchy are immune to ego's, internal politics and power struggles based on control of the organisation and the considerable finances and assets that are involved. if there's any truth to the email that wapati posted from jeff ross , the ssaa qld president , elements of this organisation needs to take a good look at itself and whether or not they are serving the members as they deserve to be served . i started this topic to try to get more information and answers to some of my concerns, only to open a can of worms . i think some of the senior ssaa should go into politics judging by some of the allegations some forum members are raising . if their not careful they may get in big trouble legally , and that's definitely not what shooters in this country need

[Fester]

While the govts, media and top cops plan to take our guns, our major representative org that is run by greedy self-interest Fudds step up the fight with each other.

Who loses, their own members.
Qld target shooters, who shoot at the national level, now have to pay their Qld SSAA fees, as well as pay the new national membership fee to compete in other states.

[Wapiti]

May be, but that may be the price you have to pay.
We both here are SSAA members separately, as well as Shooters Union members each too.
We do not need the SSAA for our firearms, we need them for our business issues so have PP/OC classes and hope we never have to use a rifle range ever again, but we still contribute for the very reason that WE ALL need to be a part of it.

Anyone commenting here that isn't an SSAA member is the enemy of the sport and has absolutely no credibility in my opinion.

There is no way that the information sent out to all Qld members by Jeff Ross is BS, putting anything in writing that is not true would be insane and open the door to vicious personal litigation.
On the contrary, it puts in writing out there for all to see what's happening, membership and legal-wise and I think this bloke actually has balls and we will continue to support someone who tells it like it is.

[mchughcb]

wow , quite a topic . i don't think ssaa hierarchy are immune to ego's, internal politics and power struggles based on control of the organisation and the considerable finances and assets that are involved. if there's any truth to the email that wapati posted from jeff ross , the ssaa qld president , elements of this organisation needs to take a good look at itself and whether or not they are serving the members as they deserve to be served . i started this topic to try to get more information and answers to some of my concerns, only to open a can of worms . i think some of the senior ssaa should go into politics judging by some of the allegations some forum members are raising . if their not careful they may get in big trouble legally , and that's definitely not what shooters in this country need

I personally know 2 national board members and shoot with them regularly plus I've had dinner with current president. They have put way more into the sport than they get out. I've watched them organise and run national events. If the QLD state wants to breakaway that's fine. If they want to stay or go then they pay what they their outstanding fees then do what they like.

[mchughcb]

Here's some more

https://youtu.be/pTVQGMAsEmA?si=b9y7EdCrfc6MYUEp

[bigrich]

Here's some more

https://youtu.be/pTVQGMAsEmA?si=b9y7EdCrfc6MYUEp

thanks for posting that, it was enlightening to the current ssaa situation .i get the politics reloaded emails/links myself . just hadn't checked my emails recently . unity from a national organisation is what shooters need , the current situation shouldn't be happening . i may have to join ssaa national to have liability insurance if i go hunting outside of QLD . i'll have to investigate this further

[Wapiti]

The perpetual problem is people - people have mouths and those mouths lie.
Everyone says they have the best ideas and the biggest egos to boot.

We'll probably never know what is the truth exactly, I'm only going off what I've seen in print. But as I said, I can't imagine an individual is going to be throwing around lies to the members he represents.

Each state has it's issues with government and facilities, it should be up to each state to achieve for it's members. I for one have no desire to have my membership fees or part of, to be going to an ineffectual collage of fat arses who have proven they have sat idly by and done nothing for shooters except keep their salaries rolling in.

I'm wrong? I can tell you all that I have seen NOTHING political from this "National" disgrace till SSAA Qld set up it's political arm and started informing us twice-weekly what is going on, as well as working to be involved in as much official govt firearms advisories and advice as possible. We're yet to see anything from it, but it's thousand-percent more than we've seen from SSAA National, which is NOTHING.
The silence from SSAA National has for years proven itself to be like a leech feathering it's own nest. All we ever got from them was a hopeless magazine of ads and articles that are basically ads, by people who do not represent a slice of our demographic.

SSAA Qld is setting itself up and maybe even modelling itself on Shooters Union, which is a lot more useful to shooters and farmers who've been used by SSAA National as a money fund to feed their faces out at dinner, and set itself up cleverly with the current laws to keep the money flowing.

[Wapiti]

Looks like there's some real backstabbing going on here from National towards our Qld sub-branch and it seems that there are some real bitterness coming our way.
Shame because it doesn't help and plays into the anti's hands easily. I hate the word Fudd, because people throw it around at anyone who they disagree with but it seems there are some rusted-on people in SA that get nervous when results from others make them look like career compromises.

Cut and paste email from today:

"Several members have contacted us about SSAA National (SSAA Inc) reaching out to them and even misleading them into joining a newly formed Queensland shooting company registered in South Australia. If this has happened to you, please let us know.

Let us be clear: all SSAA Queensland members have always been, are currently, and will continue to be covered by public liability. Claims have been made about a new organisation providing public liability insurance, but SSAA Queensland has managed its own protection for many years in conjunction with some of the same companies SSAA Inc use.

SSAA Queensland will continue to recognise SSAA membership from other states and territories at all of our ranges. We welcome shooters from across the country to our clubs, events and state championships. We also remain committed to representing Queensland nationally and internationally, just as we did recently when our state team placed third overall at the World Action Pistol Championships.

We urge shooters in Queensland to act very carefully when joining or renewing their membership. If renewing online, please make sure you are using the SSAA Queensland website.

Several members have been misled and pushed into joining the recently made ‘Queensland Hunting and Shooting’ organisation by inadvertently going to the SSAA Inc website member’s section. This is incorrect and does not equate to joining or renewing with SSAA Queensland In fact, we asked Queensland Weapons and Licensing, and they said they had not heard of the new organisation and therefore it’s unlikely to count as a genuine reason.

Regarding the claim by SSAA Inc that SSAA Queensland owes $970,000: we categorically reject this figure. The last service fee paid to SSAA Inc more than covered the period they refer to. These figures have been thoroughly reviewed and verified by independent accountants, and we stand firmly behind them.

SSAA Queensland remains the largest, most financially secure and self-reliant shooting and hunting organisation in Australia, with more than 75 branches statewide. We are an independent association, and we implore SSAA Inc to stop misinforming our 80,000 Queensland members.

The SSAA is structured similarly to Australia’s motoring organisations. Just as the NRMA, RACQ and RACV are state-based associations that collectively form the Australian Automobile Association (AAA), SSAA’s state and territory branches are the only members of SSAA Inc. Individual shooters join their state association, not the national office. That’s why no individual member is a member of SSAA Inc.

We urge SSAA Inc to reconsider its direction and instead refocus on supporting shooters and working collaboratively.

As we have said repeatedly, this is not about a “breakaway”. SSAA Queensland simply no longer requires several of the services offered by SSAA Inc and is financially capable of making decisions that are in the best interests of Queensland shooters.

SSAA Queensland will not be bullied or intimidated. We will continue working for our members and getting on with the job – not playing political games.

Jeff Ross,
President SSAA Queensland"

Personally, I'm happy to back what I'm getting from Qld SSAA - I get nothing but nothing from National.

[bigrich]

thanks for posting wapati . if things don't get resolved soon , it sounds like the only people to get anything out of this will be lawyers

[GQshayne]

I will be considering not renewing my membership when the time comes. Am I an enemy of the sport???? Not in my view. I do not wish to be associated with an organisation that gives a good impression of being a rabble. If they do not sort their mess out I will leave them.

[bigrich]

I will be considering not renewing my membership when the time comes. Am I an enemy of the sport???? Not in my view. I do not wish to be associated with an organisation that gives a good impression of being a rabble. If they do not sort their mess out I will leave them.

i respect your view and opinion mate , in practical terms the only thing stopping our state guv'ment trying a WA tightening of our laws is the numbers that ssaa have in QLD . whilst not impressed with the current situation with ssaa infighting , at least there are signs with the formation of advocate groups to lobby on shooters behalf , that things are maybe changing for the better with ssaa QLD . i'll remain a qld ssaa member, but i staunchly support shooters union , as they have been leading the way for defending shooters rights .

[GQshayne]

I will be considering not renewing my membership when the time comes. Am I an enemy of the sport???? Not in my view. I do not wish to be associated with an organisation that gives a good impression of being a rabble. If they do not sort their mess out I will leave them.

i respect your view and opinion mate , in practical terms the only thing stopping our state guv'ment trying a WA tightening of our laws is the numbers that ssaa have in QLD . whilst not impressed with the current situation with ssaa infighting , at least there are signs with the formation of advocate groups to lobby on shooters behalf , that things are maybe changing for the better with ssaa QLD . i'll remain a qld ssaa member, but i staunchly support shooters union , as they have been leading the way for defending shooters rights .

I agree, but if this mess continues they will lose credibility. And we do not need that from one of our best known advocacy groups. Lets hope it does not come to that.

[mchughcb]

I have not Met Mr Ross nor have I seen the books to confirm the monies supposedly owed. I cannot believe QLD can get cheaper insurance rates than the national which is over far greater members. I will talk to the board members once again to understand any rebuttal to Mr Ross' statement.

[mchughcb]

Who do I thank for the SSAA gunsales and maintenance?