The best since Bradman...

[gordicans]

"Plus if you notice there aren't too many real good fast bowlers... like malcom marshal, waqar unis or wasim akram"

An old girlfriend of mine f*cked Wasim Akram in the back of a Datsun 1200 outside Selenas in the Cross ... just say'n

[bigfellascott]

True... cuz not many people can do it without help.

Plus if you notice there aren't too many real good fast bowlers... like malcom marshal, waqar unis or wasim akram. The latter two I think started the reverse swing band wagon... without sandpaper

Probably used dirt like a lot of em did and probably still do, they love one side of the ball shiny and the other with the lacquer removed to change the balance to get the different swings they like (perhaps they should just bring a ball out with a lacquered side and one without save all this cheating!

[TassieTiger]

Terry Alderman wasn’t fast but could swing it 2ft if the breeze was in his face.

[Stix]

Stix I think most people have a perception of Bradman being the nice guy on and off the pitch, was he a good sportsman in his era ??? his off field persona from what i gather was a bit of a khunt especially when cricketers pushed for decent pay as the sport transitioned to the professional era

The whole Steve Smith saga has been overplayed to death, pushing the rule book has been going on since adam and eve and the penalty he payed was way out of proportion.

Ive never researched Bradman so its interesting to hear that sbout the Don given what we're led to brlieve in folk law...

Yes pushing the rule book has gone on for ever as you mention...its only natural for one to want any advantage to win....but outright cheating to me is beyond ethical...i mean i can live with pushing the boundaries using pitch dirt as sn abrsisive...but caught red handed with sand paper is so beyond the stretchiest of boundaries, its a fuking joke... ...and then to cry on national TV...FMD... ...i mean he's earned more money in one year than dozens of less fortunate will in all their lifetimes combined...and to cry like a baby, as if he only just suddenly realised what great mistake he made is just the epitomy of such obvious pathetic two faced acting to me... ...& hence i wonder why we accept this as 'normal'...


I gather you mean his penalty is way out of proportion by way of it being to big a penalty...?

I guess the penalty is all relative to how one percieves things...
For example...an average working class JoBlo can potentially loose a job, & then everything they've ever worked for due the dishonest deceipt & corruption that is prevelant in their employers high flying executive jobs...(& sport such as cricket), yet the perpetrators continually get away with rewards for causing such devastation to others...

Anyway...i think its interesting what we are, as a society, programmed to believe is acceptable...

Im sure if you trustingly welcomed me into your home & i behaved as Steve Smith has & somehow deceitfully lied to & cheated you, id be out on my arse, never to be welcomed back--EVER...
Yet, we somehow accept that its ok when its done at the hoghest levels of our society...such as Banking, Politics & elite sport, just to name a few.

Not argueing with you either...just bouncing thoughts of varying perspectives around...

[tom604]

going by a few of the replies we should allow betting on the outcome of the game,,,,by the players,,,after all everyone's doing it and if they cheat too much,well, give them a year off then straight back to the trough. before smith and co at least we had the moral high ground now we are just like the rest ,cheaters

i understand why they did it,(to win?) and if it was a war i would applaud them but its not, its a game and they are cheats

only slightly fishing

[xDom]

Agree with your comments. I think it comes down to sports stars being up on pedestals.

It’s conditioned into us that they are elevated above the rest of us.

[Stix]

Bill, pretty right there- read up on Chapelli on his dealings with the Don- or Bill O Reilly-or Jack Fingleton-thing is this for me- why the hell as a society do we stick sportsman up on a pedestal for stuff other than their sporting ability- sure if they happen to have another successful sphere in their lives then they can be taken seriously in that too. Australians and the cricket community in particular were pretty shocked by the whole sandpaper scandal but (and i think I can say this after many years of A Grade cricket, coaching and junior rep involvement) it was on the cards. The general behaviour standards even at a junior level are pretty poor these days and one of the main reason I stopped being involved was because of the stupid, inane and downright nasty so called banter that has become all too commonplace on the field, even at a club level. Smith has been pretty repentant (and has recieved a far greater punishment than many overseas players copped for similar offences) and should just be left to play cricket- and we as a society should judge him on that and probably that alone.

PaddyT...im surprised to hear you say Smith "should just be left to play cricket- and we as a society should judge him on that and probably that alone"....especially after you having experienced what you have, & removing yourself from that culture--presumably because you're disgusted by it...

Not having a crack...but i dont get that...its almost as if you're saying you despise it so bad you cant live it, but think its ok for others to be rewarded for it...
Not sure if im missing something there mate...

The thing is, if we accept this attitude at the highest levels of society, is it not fair to hold this attitude at ALL levels...?
I mean where do we stop...do we just judge someone who invaded the home of an elderly person & terrorised & stole from them, on the fact that they also hold down a 9-5 job & pay tax...?

Im not trying to be smart...just asking where the line is drawn for unscrupulous deceitful behaviour...?

I have no doubt we are all brainwashed & indoctrinated to believe this behaviour is "morraly acceptable", or we wouldnt be getting fukd over by the narcassistic governments that rule us with such insulting levels of theivery & corruption every single day--& really, for what benefit...??... ...a better way of living... ...

The corruption in cricket obviously runs deeper than Smith& the 2 or 3 others caught...but i dont fully understand why we see it as being acceptable...

[Stix]

"Plus if you notice there aren't too many real good fast bowlers... like malcom marshal, waqar unis or wasim akram"

An old girlfriend of mine f*cked Wasim Akram in the back of a Datsun 1200 outside Selenas in the Cross ... just say'n

Of all the comments i didnt expect to hear, i didnt expect to hear that one the most...!!!
What a cracker...!!!

[Member-Deleted]

Now that's what I call ball tampering if there ever was

[trekin]

Tbh in don't care.

It basically comes to what the society likes... they only like it if team Australia is winning. So when you are winning you go do whatever you want.

Maybe the comparison is regarding his batting and not his behaviour. But even then wether he did the crime or the crime just happened under his watch he did his time and repented/apologised.

And umm want it Australia under Greg Chappell who bowled the infamous underarm delivery. I think people now a days just like to get angry to get angry

Although unsportsman like, underarm bowling was not banned or illegal at the time, so hardly cheating. However, the controversial discions of the two Australian umpires, in that same match, on three occasions prior to "the infamous underarm delivery" were deemed as and neither man would ever officiate another international cricket match, funny how we rarely hear about that through.

[PaddyT]

Stix I guess you missed my first point-As a society we somehow put a cricketer (and lets face it lots of other sports stars) up on pedestals they simply dont belong on- because at the end of the day they are good at sport and probably thats about it!If we put someone who is young, not worldly wise and then expect them to better than everyone else then surely they are being set up to do stupid things. The cricket culture of today is merely a reflection of wider society (kids are told from a young age they can do anything and be anything, when reality is they cant) and I left the game because I didnt need to accept the BS that goes on in the real world in my precious recreation time as well(plus I was getting too bloody old to bowl anymore and I fricken hate standing in the field if i cant bowl). Sports stars should only be taken seriously for their sport- not other aspects of their lives, sure Smith should of been punished and his punishment was fair enough (I dont believe he should ever be considered for Captain again). It is a shame that politicians arent punished in the same way for corrupt behaviour and criminals seem to get off lightly these days and I cant really see pollies legislating for harsher punishments for their own indiscretions - look at the resistance to a Federal ICAC. Smiths crime was in the game of cricket and he was punished by the game of cricket- I would also imagine he lost some sponsorship dollars too-do we punish him elsewhere too? BTW you raise some excellent points so well done

[Stix]

Ah ok PaddyT...

I didnt miss your first point...but i did...lol...

I missed the points together--or i only understood them as individual points... ...i know what i mean anyway...

But...i understand what you mean now--thanks for the explanation...
Its a very obvious point too...& i completely missed it...

Now i get the point, i think its a good wise one actially...
Seriously, that puts some perspective on the saga for me, & actially helps it to sit easier... (mind you i dont dwell on it...!!... )

You are dead right...the extended responsibility society puts on these young un-worldly types is generally too much, especially given their lack of life experience...

Cheers for that...you've made me a wiser man...!!... (probably not hard to do... )

.

[SCJ429]

Bradman was twice as good as anyone else in his era, had five years off at the peak of his powers for WW2. He also had to deal with the bodyline series. Smith gets knocked out by the single short delivery he had to face. Yes Bradman was twice as good as Smith.

[bigfellascott]

Bradman was twice as good as anyone else in his era, had five years off at the peak of his powers for WW2. He also had to deal with the bodyline series. Smith gets knocked out by the single short delivery he had to face. Yes Bradman was twice as good as Smith.

It would be great if we could really see how Bradman compares to players of this era, I'm not convinced he would be as good, all the technology today that is available to work out how batsman and bowlers operate and how to best get them out etc, would be an interesting comparison for sure.

As for Smith being knocked out he wasn't, this day and age they have to be removed for OHS reasons, I'm sure if it was around in Bradmans day the result would have been the same.

[AZZA'S HJ47]

Dont get me wrong i dont watch cricket and i cant stand it for that matter. However u dont recall Bradman ever being caught up in "cheating scandals" I dispise cheats regardless of sport.

[Member-Deleted]

I don't agree with what smith and his cohorts have done but lets be serious he got punished maybe paid for his actions but he will always be punished as he will go down in history as the captain that cheated and that is not something i'd like to live with so I honestly think he has paid his dues to cricket and now it's up to him to get on with it I was and still am disgusted with what they have done but how much do you punish someone he will have a life time of shame hanging over his head so lets see how he goes

[bigfellascott]

The Aussies win the Ashes! Well done to all the players for a fantastic Series and Smithy for winning the Ashes for us!

[Sergeant Hartman]

And in date say Smith for captain is now very likely

[Bill]

Well done boyz !!

Paine is growing into the job, Id be inclined to keep him in place for the rest of the year and the summer test series.

Smith played his best cricket without the C beside his name

[bigfellascott]

Well done boyz !!

Paine is growing into the job, Id be inclined to keep him in place for the rest of the year and the summer test series.

Smith played his best cricket without the C beside his name

Bloody oath Bill, Steve seems to play better without the added pressure, I agree leave it as is.

[Stix]

Well done boyz !!

Paine is growing into the job, Id be inclined to keep him in place for the rest of the year and the summer test series.

Smith played his best cricket without the C beside his name

Bloody oath Bill, Steve seems to play better without the added pressure, I agree leave it as is.

Id have thought he'd felt plenty of pressure on return...
But then to think aboit it, probably far less pressure than playing & as a cheating captain...

[Bill]

Well Paine did something neither Ponting or Clarke was able to achieve so he should be given the gig a bit longer

[TassieTiger]

Well Paine did something neither Ponting or Clarke was able to achieve so he should be given the gig a bit longer

Given crickets heirach How much influence does a captain really have over a cricket teams performance ?

[bigfellascott]

Well done boyz !!

Paine is growing into the job, Id be inclined to keep him in place for the rest of the year and the summer test series.

Smith played his best cricket without the C beside his name

Bloody oath Bill, Steve seems to play better without the added pressure, I agree leave it as is.

Id have thought he'd felt plenty of pressure on return...
But then to think aboit it, probably far less pressure than playing & as a cheating captain...

Sounds like something a Pommie Loser would say.

[Stix]

Well done boyz !!

Paine is growing into the job, Id be inclined to keep him in place for the rest of the year and the summer test series.

Smith played his best cricket without the C beside his name

Bloody oath Bill, Steve seems to play better without the added pressure, I agree leave it as is.

Id have thought he'd felt plenty of pressure on return...
But then to think aboit it, probably far less pressure than playing & as a cheating captain...

Sounds like something a Pommie Loser would say.

& that sounds like something a "win at all & any costs" redneck would say...

My earlier point isnt said from a negative view point...
I say that because i think its true...

He would have done a lot of mental & physical exercise while being away...& returned with full support to just concentrate on cricket...

And look what happens--Steve Smith has demonstrated that when you can focus your skill on doing the right thing, instead of putting so much energy into doing the wrong thing...you end up with the same desired outcome, only in a more efficient & morraly sound way...

There's a pretty obvious message in that i think...for all walks of life...

[bigfellascott]

What performance gains were achieved with the other 2 cheats who would have gone through the same treatment? Steve Smith was always a brilliant player and probably always will be.

Smiths results aren't anything to do with some Pommie Theory, they are to do with him wanting to be the best he can be and get back to being the best he can be/was before all this rubbish started (they weren't the first to ball tamper trust me) it's something that's been going on for many many years going by all the others who have been busted doing it using all manner of things from (dirt in the pocket - Mike Atherton Pommie Capt at the time) Sth African Captain Faf du Plessis used a lollie in his ball tampering efforts, Sachin Tendulkar was accused of scuffing the seam of the ball, later found innocent, theres been incidents of zippers being used to scuff up the ball and god only knows how many other attempts have been made of the years to effect the way the ball plays when it comes to cricket, our mob were the latest and sure as s**t won't be the last trust me.

Cheers mate, enjoy the pint of bitter and bacon butty

[Stix]

I wassnt...& didnt suggest others had a performance gain...
Youre either suggesting stress factors & mental/emotional resillience has no factor in someones performance, or missing the point that, that is what im suggesting...or both...

Either way...im not argueing with you, against you, or anyone bigfella...i just made a comment...

Yes clearly they werent the first to attempt to cheat...they just happened to be the last, & if i may say so, the most stupid--i mean really...dirt in the pocket is atleast trying to conmceal it...but sand paper in the hand...FMD..im sure that will be added to a dictionary somewhere as a definition of "STUPID"...&.you sound like youre defending it as being above board because everyone else does it.. ...youre entitled to think what you want & i respect that...mate...

Smiths results--pommie theory...???...i dont know what your on about there...

And i should add, i make the best bacon sanga's...you dont know it but you wish you could have one...or threee..!!--aint nothin wrong with a good feed of bacon n eggs in fried bread over the flaming coals of mallee roots after a morning stroll with the shottie...or a pint or 3 while chomping on charcoal grilled kill rigging up the spotty for a night of foxing..so i most certainly will enjoy my pint of bitter and bacon butty.

Oh...& for the record if you're suggesting im a pom because you interpret a point of discussion as "whinging"... i should point out my heritage is haggis...yep...bending romans over for thousands of years, & wandering the highlands with only a skirt on the bottom half...& i must still have it in me cos i still wear short shorts for work outside every single day of the year & continually answer "NO" to the same people with the question of "arent you cold"......

Enjoy the cricket