Foil sarking on a roll with no attached fibreglass

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Foil sarking on a roll with no attached fibreglass

Post by Blr243 » 03 Feb 2020, 3:46 pm

Yesterday I was a pproched by a customer who wants a quote to insulate her 3 m by 3 m garden shed ... she has a visitor coming soon that does not like air conditioning ( for whatever reason I don’t care and I don’t know how long he intends staying ) I think the visitor is her brother ...... so she wants a quote to use foil to insulate the inside of her garden shed ......this is Australia in 2020 not a nazi concentration camp. ..I think in Australia we look after our dogs better than this ....... am I missing something or is this the silliest thing you have ever heard ?
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Re: Foil sarking on a roll with no attached fibreglass

Post by marksman » 03 Feb 2020, 4:35 pm

foil insulation was the reason there were deaths from the K Rudd "Home Insulation Program" 2009 and of course the standards were not followed eg.. apparently stapling the foil into electrical cables in the houses roof cavities caused electrocution deaths and electrical fires, l'm sure someone else will know more about this than me, l had my home insulated for free in this scheme with wool and its great :thumbsup:
in your climate it is an acceptable insulator but if it were me in a 3m x 3m garden shed l would be looking into something different, maybe wool and timber walls
but your right "we look after dogs better than this" :unknown:
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Re: Foil sarking on a roll with no attached fibreglass

Post by Blr243 » 03 Feb 2020, 5:06 pm

Exactly. Got to be a space separating the two. Otherwise it’s just metal to metal and heat will conduct/ transfer
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Re: Foil sarking on a roll with no attached fibreglass

Post by Stix » 03 Feb 2020, 5:44 pm

Id imagine your biggest issue up there is moisture BLR...

Youre right, in a thermal break is best, and necessary to properly insulate...and if the temp hits dew point inside that room (that will be different to what is forecast by the BOM as it is its own climate in the shed), you have liquid water on the inside of the walls...add a breathing human & you have stale moist air...that equals problems..so you ideally need to vent this space to get rid of the moisture--all a little excessive for a garden shed...and.just foil will do nothing--or SFA anyway--it wont stop the immense radiant heat from .42 sheet steel in the sun, & by itself is incapable of retaining any heat...

Then when you seal the room, you have rising moisture from the ground to deal with (unless there is a membrane)...this creates issues with mould etc...

But then i dont really know your climate...

Ventilation is your friend...But if she is insistent, just make sure you dont break any rules & take the money i guess...

Id make it known you are not aware its going to be used as a habitable space--in other words, as far as you're concerned she just wants to make life a little more comfortable for her mower, hammer & screwdriver set... :)

Just remember It is a class 10 building, & for it to legally be a class 1 habitable space, you need more than a roll of foil sarking... :thumbsup:

Im a believer that the insulation ability of foil wrap is entirely dependant on the system of insulation used, so to go by the stated values of the product alone is simply just denial...or ignorance...or both... :)

The way energy certificates are issued in our country is nothing more than a fuking joke & just a cover for greeny pushing Uni grads & bureaucrats who are insistant on being right--these "energy efficiency" requirements & listed ratings are in actual fact mostly worthless the way we construct normal housing here..

:drinks: .
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Re: Foil sarking on a roll with no attached fibreglass

Post by Blr243 » 03 Feb 2020, 6:23 pm

In qld we have heat and moisture ...I have managed to get her of my case by advising her against it I even contemplated that maybe it's too hot in there for her crop because who puts their family in a hot garden shed in QLD mid summer ?:::::: your right about the r e latlvly New energy certification garbage ... just another thing to force up the cost of housing
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Re: Foil sarking on a roll with no attached fibreglass

Post by Potatoes » 03 Feb 2020, 6:25 pm

I check the csr redbook which is a free download and suggest a lightweight wall and ceiling system from that. Look for a system with a high energy efficiency rating or insulation with a high r value (not to be confused with Rw which is an acoustic rating). If they are just after foil because they are doing it on the dodge, there are plenty of foil faced insulation products. Maybe they could also consider sandwich panel (like coolrooms) or eps greenboard systems.

Also consider ventilation. Bca require (don’t quote me on this) about 5% Of the floor area to be able to be opened for fresh air or else an alternative solution, like ventilation fan in a duct.

Disclaimer: all care but no responsibilty because i am not a professional in this area. For proper advice speak to a building certifier. Like the earlier advice, the use is commensurate with a residential use, (class 1 i believe is a detached dwelling). Codes and standards exist for a reason.
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Re: Foil sarking on a roll with no attached fibreglass

Post by bladeracer » 03 Feb 2020, 7:55 pm

Rose lived in her brother's garage for a year or two when she arrived in Perth. She just lined it with heavy cardboard from a white-goods shop. No insulation, but she framed the walls with 75x50 timbers so there was a good air gap. She lined the bottom of the roof trusses so there was a lot of flow in the roof space. It was a free-standing steel shed, seven by six meters. Ten years later we moved it to one of her house blocks.

When I built my office here I used sizalation and batts in the floor, walls and ceiling with 6mm fibro external and 19mm chipboard flooring internal claddings (floor, walls and ceiling), and my doors are double thickness 19mm chipboard. The underside of the floor is also lined with fibro.

We both hate air-conditioning. When we lived in the bus for two years we taped sizalation ovrr all the windows in the inside, which made a huge difference in the summer.

I would batten the shed first so you have an air gap, and vent the roof and wall cavities.
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Re: Foil sarking on a roll with no attached fibreglass

Post by marksman » 03 Feb 2020, 8:15 pm

egg cartons is something else l have seen done that will soundproof and helps a bit with temp :drinks:
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Re: Foil sarking on a roll with no attached fibreglass

Post by Potatoes » 03 Feb 2020, 9:53 pm

marksman wrote:egg cartons is something else l have seen done that will soundproof and helps a bit with temp :drinks:


Egg cartons don’t have the mass to attenuate sound from outside to inside and will only moderately reduce the reverberation time at speach frequencies (echo) at best. Better of with polyester. Its cheap, better for thermal and has low moisture retention. Some of it is stiff enough to be daubed onto walls.
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Re: Foil sarking on a roll with no attached fibreglass

Post by pomemax » 03 Feb 2020, 10:07 pm

May be its whats she want to aid with the growing of a crop of some sort.
( reflecting the grow lights down )
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Re: Foil sarking on a roll with no attached fibreglass

Post by Blr243 » 04 Feb 2020, 11:30 am

On the subject of crop. I’m pretty sure in a newspaper one day I read about somebody growing in a ceiling space but at night time the light shone thru his roof tiles so everybody in the street and anybody driving by could see. Not the sharpest tool in the shed.
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Re: Foil sarking on a roll with no attached fibreglass

Post by Blr243 » 04 Feb 2020, 11:31 am

Thanks to all for taking the time to advise
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