Building a vault/storeroom

[Kelsey Cooter]

Is this vault s purpose a walk in firearm storage area ie no steel safe required ?

Yeah blr, although both the vaults I've looked at they ended up keeping their rifles in safes still, purely because they already had the safes and its an easy way to keep them clean and protected. We all do western action so one mate had a few of his uberti's up on the wall on a timber rack, looked awesome

[Stix]

A vault" as i know it is just as hard to gain entry through the roof as through wslls...
So youll need to take this into account when building the riof of the vault under the roof of the shed...

BTW when i say brick laying course, i mean just mean a short course to get the right trowel skills...once you know how to use a trowel & get the mortar to the right consistancy,, provided your bubble stick is accurate/true, laying bricks is relativrly easy...if you're that way inclined...

And ifcourse, building block walls inside a shed is wasting space...but is well hidden...

[flutch]

I'd make a 2 piece steel form, steel inner for base of work and then outer Timber/ply also and pour heavily reinforced concrete on the inner. this will be more DIY friendly than a precast system, albeit you will need at least a few hands to help and good welding skills. but not impossible, build a support system into the roof of it so it doesn't want to fall in on your head. but yeah.....

a recent gun store robbery here in WA was possible due to using crappy little prefab wall panels, these have s**t all reinforcing in them, the material was easily and quickly cut with a demo saw. I on the other hand built a chemical shed out of an old municipal pool sediment filter which contained 1 and 1/4" thick rio bar and it took me and my off sider 3 days to chisel out the hole using a demo saw and jackhammer. The type of concrete matters too, less sand and more blu metal dust and you will have a much stronger mix, sand isn't always the best thing for compaction when making solid concrete. a good mix of bog and a pencil vibrator to make sure it settles into itself rock hard, then a good layer of paint on the inside to stave off rust and a good proper internally hinged door and you're in business. wouldn't be the cheapest but anyone trying to break in would spend more than enough time making a racket to arouse suspicions.

[Blr243]

I know somebody that was burgled. The burglars tied a chain around the safe and attached it to their vehicle and tried to drive off with it. Something I did think of in relation to the position of the door of your vault .....is it possible to position it in such a way that the corner of a bull bar of a sturdy 4 wd can’t drive into it at a 45 degree angle. Or maybe a sturdy 1 m high bollard in front might be useful. Or maybe I have just been watching to many action movies

[Kelsey Cooter]

And ifcourse, building block walls inside a shed is wasting space...but is well hidden...

Yeah this is a point that bothers me but I can't think of a better way of doing it as I dont want it to be a stand alone structure. And yeah I like that it makes it completely hidden

[Stix]

If i was your building contractor, id build it so that the slab is poured first & room is bricked up next.
Set it out precisely so the room is just inside the line of the bricks & is clad as part of the shed so you have a seamless run of cladding (so outside just looks like a shed)...
This will also give adequate space for ventilation behind the cladding to best minimise rust &/or moisture problems later on.

Again design it well...

Weigh up the cost of a concrete pump & basic formwork/sheeting for the roof/ceiling of the room...it may well be cheap enough to pour a concrete roof as well...
Try talking to a small formwork company, or one or 2 of their employees--they may do it as a side job for you cheaper...

Or if you're rich...fly me up there...ill build it for you, or supervise & consult...


Designed well, that roof of the vault could be used for storage of crap that you'll forgot you ever had in 20 years...

[Kelsey Cooter]

Yeah I love the idea of storing stuff on top. Both the vaults that I checked out had 5inch poured roofs and used it as storage area on top. One had been poored on formwork.
The other had laid roofing iron as a ceiling and poored the concrete on top, it looked terrible and I would of thought the concrete will eat out the iron and cause dramas.

[Kelsey Cooter]

Here's the shed I'm planning to build, with the vault/storeroom being in the bay with no roller door

[flutch]

If i was your building contractor,

If I was his contractor I would weld an entire hermetically sealed chamber with a well sealed door, out of steel plate and external ribbing/reinforcement. then I would set a form-work around it as I mentioned before and pour a 1 piece slab all the way around it top to bottom and sides all with continual reinforcement tying it all together as one piece. that way no one piece can be removed/beaten off/pry'd or pulled off of it. have a solid steel door and be done with it, no one would break into it without serious levels of dedication. and no moisture/air to worry about.

[Stix]

Flutch, not argueing, but im qualifying Kelsey as someone who doesnt have an endless budget for this build...

The fact he is asking guys on a shooting forum & costing out a kit form shed, & not engaging an award winning architect is a bit of a giveaway here...

And the construction method you describe is hellishly expensive if using contractors, & when it comes to risk management, is probably unnecessary for the brief...after-all he's a blike with a couple of rifles...not a top secret Aust Defence installation housing warheads...or trying to contain the new virus...

Or is he..

___

Kelsey...the roof sheeting used in the other vault is a common form of constriction, & is cheaper...you can often see it in multi storey commercial buildings like some carparks...and even aged care facilities etc...but it is often covered by dropdown ceilings that house all the services.
That steel sheeting spans a long way & can take a good load of concrete...
Yes over time, particularly if not well designed, the steel sheeting can rust, but it shouldnt degrade the concrete in any major way if it is poured & compacted properly.

The other benefit to solid masonry walls are no mucking around with fire ratings if builing on or near a boundary...

Youve got me all depressed now...wish i had the money to build something like that...

Keep us posted on the build...

[Sergeant Hartman]

I have an idea, find a army bunker or a nuclear missile silo. That are deep underground and literally bomb proof.....nik minute wrong country

But i do remember reading a property that came up 4 sale in Gippsland a number of years ago that actually had a ww2 bunker on it

[trekin]

https://www.versatiletanks.com.au/wine-cellars/ For some ideas.

[sungazer]

I would look at the cost of the formwork option (either made yourself or hire) vs the lay slab and besser block filled with concrete and reo. Like Stix has suggested and defitinatly on a concrete slab as Stix has also mentioned. You can put the first layer of bricks on the slab as it is nearly dried and push the reo into it. Again as Stix has mentioned this just cuts down the drilling and chemset. You are or should put in a concrete roof and really the best way I can think of it is to use form ply really well supported from the floor.I have seen it done in third world type countries and the use just tree type supports spaced at about every 500mm then set your reo and perhaps some steel beams and pour the concrete on top.

It Really is not as hard as it sounds. Using the formwork option Lay the floor slab first poke some reo into it where the walls are going. I made a steel frame first of the whole building but it wasn't necessary. I then welded reo between the posts and the put the form work around it all. I used a concrete pump truck for the walls as I was doing 5 cubic m at a time. But if you were doing it in smaller sections maybe not needed. I hired a vibrator and just dropped it down the walls as they were poured. leave some reo poking out the top of the walls to tie in the roof. Cut a lot of cheap 4*2 supports for the form ply. then put in your Reo and any steel girders depending on how strong you want it. You can also make like foundation beams in concrete across the roof. Look at underground car parks.
Tip brush all the formwork with diesel makes for easy removal and smooth finish.

[Kelsey Cooter]

Cheers sungazer, what internal size and height did you go for mate? And did you build a door or buy?

[sungazer]

I was building a set of stables for cattle as well as storage there is a lot of internal walls as well as external. Overall 20m*13m, The individual sizes are 4*4m

[Kelsey Cooter]

I was building a set of stables for cattle as well as storage there is a lot of internal walls as well as external. Overall 20m*13m, The individual sizes are 4*4m

Oh ok, and what did you do for a door?