When is,,, "enough is enough"

[womble]

So naive.
Neutrality means they can't offer support.
Which Is what putler wants and direly needs from them.
India is a military ally.
China could get around all sanctions.
It's known as proactive neutrality

I know our media keeps harking about AKUS and India. While the actions from their politicians and military is completely opposite.

India has been buying oil from Russia... for a big discount mind you. And China has been supplying them military equipment.

And now the bigger question is, has the media lost interest, or they don't want to report on how bad Ukraine is doing. They are slowly losing the war.

The best report today was that Ukraine has only gotten 10% of the military equipment promised by the Western governments. When poland has to come and say that on world media, means things are starting to get dicey

If China was supplying military aid to Russia we,d be in a very different situation right now. Direct violation of arms treaties.
They can supply commercial equipment, but not military.
The only aid India is providing is medical.
Yes they do still buy oil from Russia, because India is Russia’s bitch.
Russia knows it can’t succeed in Ukraine. They just can’t find a way to get out now without facing the consequences.
They reparations they will incur will last for decades to come.

[womble]

Pretty simple really
A nation at peace is being invaded by a foreign country. (Maybe you missed that part)
Resistance far greater than anticipated.

Hmm where were you when US/UK invaded Iraq, or even Afghanistan. Where were you when America yet again threatened and forced a democratically elected government in Pakistan.

Or is that because they are not white skinned with blue eyes..... as many media reporters said... how dare Russia invade a country like Ukraine they are white and civilised

Why the F do you keep raising Afghanistan? Has SFA to do with Ukraine.

It has plenty to do with Ukraine actually! Putin's old boys the USSR tried and failed dismally to take Afghanistan in the 80s...that war bled the Soviets dry and was arguably the biggest contributor to its dissolution. Were the Union not dissolved and Ukraine was under the Moskva thumb then Putin would be a very different man and the world a very different place.

By no means am I saying it would be a good thing. But to disregard the American war in Afghanisation, following the Soviets, as SFA to do with the modern conflict is the most narrow assessment of geopolitics and conflict politics I could imagine. The wasteful American folly of bravado in Afghan this century is going to be a very good juxtapostion to the wasteful russian folly in Ukraine

Solid parallels, but not the ones our Russian sympathisers are drawing. They don’t give any credence to Russia’s claim to Ukraine.
Only to Putin. And he’s wrong. He can’t change the past and rewrite today.

[cz515]

Why the F do you keep raising Afghanistan? Has SFA to do with Ukraine.

It has plenty to do with Ukraine actually! Putin's old boys the USSR tried and failed dismally to take Afghanistan in the 80s...that war bled the Soviets dry and was arguably the biggest contributor to its dissolution. Were the Union not dissolved and Ukraine was under the Moskva thumb then Putin would be a very different man and the world a very different place.

By no means am I saying it would be a good thing. But to disregard the American war in Afghanisation, following the Soviets, as SFA to do with the modern conflict is the most narrow assessment of geopolitics and conflict politics I could imagine. The wasteful American folly of bravado in Afghan this century is going to be a very good juxtapostion to the wasteful russian folly in Ukraine

Geoff, the thing is the old guy only likes those that agree with him. Others he either reports to moderators, gets other members to report on his behalf and ofcourse puts them down (is condescending) at every opportunity he gets.

[mchughcb]

Russia has been preparing for years.
There are major strategic economic and security objectives that are going to benefit Russia when this is concluded.

1. Push NATO back
2. More warm water ports for export in the black sea
3. Create a new economic zone in the Donbass with huge gas reserves
4. Fresh water to Crimea restored
5. Better economic deals signed with China and India
6. Set Brandon up to go broke defending Taiwan when China makes a play
7. Send Ukraine broke with no export ports and bleed the USA to pump up its economy to the tune of $6B per month.
8. Make the EU pay through the nose for gas while making them wear rainbow thunberg shirts for the inconvenience.
9. Stop Ukraine syphoning off free gas from the pipelines and selling it to the EU at a 4x markup

They may have got their nose bloodied but they are learning quick and coming back. If Zelensky doesn't negotiate they will be pulling him out of the bunker.

[Oldbloke]

Why the F do you keep raising Afghanistan? Has SFA to do with Ukraine.

It has plenty to do with Ukraine actually! Putin's old boys the USSR tried and failed dismally to take Afghanistan in the 80s...that war bled the Soviets dry and was arguably the biggest contributor to its dissolution. Were the Union not dissolved and Ukraine was under the Moskva thumb then Putin would be a very different man and the world a very different place.

By no means am I saying it would be a good thing. But to disregard the American war in Afghanisation, following the Soviets, as SFA to do with the modern conflict is the most narrow assessment of geopolitics and conflict politics I could imagine. The wasteful American folly of bravado in Afghan this century is going to be a very good juxtapostion to the wasteful russian folly in Ukraine

Geoff, the thing is the old guy only likes those that agree with him. Others he either reports to moderators, gets other members to report on his behalf and ofcourse puts them down (is condescending) at every opportunity he gets.

And you make completely unsubstantiated accusations about members who disagree with your opinions.

BTW, do you ever comment about firearms treated threads?

PS. I haven't changed my member name 3 times.

[on_one_wheel]

Russia has been preparing for years.
There are major strategic economic and security objectives that are going to benefit Russia when this is concluded.

1. Push NATO back
2. More warm water ports for export in the black sea
3. Create a new economic zone in the Donbass with huge gas reserves
4. Fresh water to Crimea restored
5. Better economic deals signed with China and India
6. Set Brandon up to go broke defending Taiwan when China makes a play
7. Send Ukraine broke with no export ports and bleed the USA to pump up its economy to the tune of $6B per month.
8. Make the EU pay through the nose for gas while making them wear rainbow thunberg shirts for the inconvenience.
9. Stop Ukraine syphoning off free gas from the pipelines and selling it to the EU at a 4x markup

They may have got their nose bloodied but they are learning quick and coming back. If Zelensky doesn't negotiate they will be pulling him out of the bunker.

Putin actually want to join NATO and desperately tried to create an alliance with the USA.
I wonder how things would have transpired had he got those things over the line.
I'm a little surprised the US didn't consider creating an alliance with Russia even if only for securing grain and oil. I'd bet Putin would have ditched China to get the deal signed.
Once bitten, twice shy perhaps.

[mchughcb]

Correct. Far easier to do deals with Russia. They were close to Europe and resource rich like Australia. Hell even their last Tsar was related to the Queen of England.
The destiny of Russia has always been strongly linked to the destiny of Europe.

[wanneroo]

Haha that's probably true.

Everytime i see someone complain about high prices of fuel and inflation, i do go umm have you considered that our governments are responsible for part of it by directly supporting the war.

Plus the money printing of the US etc etc etc

Not our governments.
There's barely any countries that support the war with Ukraine.
Cuba, Venezuela.. that's about it really.
No one else sees any justification for it.

Maybe. But India and China where 1/3 of the population lives are neutral, so that is more telling that some country like NZ and Australia virtual signalling like anybody even cares.

They way things are shaping up there are mini encirclements that are going to fall like a house of cards. Now its the Astol chemical factory, if they are not careful about 70,000 soldiers are going to be cutoff in the next few weeks and that will be the end of the Ukranian army.

I saw another article today, depending on who you believe either 1000 dead per day or 1000 taken out of action. Another month of this they are finished. I have been watching the propaganda, I notice no more tanks wars from the Ukranians because they are all gone. Notice their's hardly any more Javelin kills because either they are all gone or the Russians have wisened up to it. I do notice that the Russian air defense has wiped out a few more Ukranian jets which means their air defense system is working well, and that is the one thing they cannot afford to lose.

Encirclements. This is what the Russians do.

https://youtu.be/1CqGeAmVu1I

While part of the Ukrainian army fights in the east, the rest are getting quietly trained up by NATO and kitted out with new weapons.

Russians still do not have air superiority and in fact avoid flying over Ukie lines due to so many man portable surface to air missiles the Ukrainians have.

I'm still seeing plenty of Javelin and Stugna ATGM kills on Russian tanks on the open source twitter channels.

I think this thing has a long way to go before it's over. Could go on for years.

[womble]

Correct. Far easier to do deals with Russia. They were close to Europe and resource rich like Australia. Hell even their last Tsar was related to the Queen of England.
The destiny of Russia has always been strongly linked to the destiny of Europe.

Cocked that up didn’t they.
Cemented their isolation for the next generation to suffer

[womble]

The only way Russia holds Ukraine is full occupation with manned bases throughout all territories, while they endeavour to stamp out resistance.
They can’t do it. No country could. The resistance is global. Just a giant funnel we keep topping up when necessary.
He tried to bully all opposition into submission with nukes. Didnt follow through.
They have nothing now. No play to make and no way out.
And we have the time.
The trap was set and they walked right into it.
He’s not dealing with trumps hand picked morons anymore. He’s pitted himself against the worlds smartest strategists.
If we’ve given him any confidence it’s been intentional.

[straightshooter]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZmInkxbvlCs

[mchughcb]

They have used all their own artillery shells. Now they are down to nato and that's limited.
They say Russia is pounding at 75 000 rounds a day to 500 from ukraine.

https://youtu.be/VQZAcOvKens

[mchughcb]

Dig in deep they do.
Get cutoff they must.

https://youtu.be/I5l6LY0QShY

[on_one_wheel]

Quite a few items thin or gone from the supermarket shelves again locally, especially non perishables.
Looks like there's some mild panic buying going on with the media talking about food shortages from failed crops, war, covid related supply hangovers.
Learnt a new term yesterday "fear porn" it's what media thrive on and what the sheeple feed off.

Anyhow I'm off to buy a trolley full of Australian made toilet paper made from Australian paper pulp that's DOUBBLED in price in the last 12 months with a 2022 anual Q1 inflation rate was at 5.1%
Price gouging much ?

[womble]

Russian casualties, civilian women and children, none.
Ukraine, alot.
Have Russians always been such cowards historically ?

[straightshooter]

Unfortunately the Russians and the Ukrainians troll much the same depths of barbarity.
Read these if you are capable of uncurated thought.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massacres ... rn_Galicia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warsaw_Uprising

[mchughcb]

Russian casualties, civilian women and children, none.
Ukraine, alot.
Have Russians always been such cowards historically ?

Every time there's an industrial plant school, hospital seems the same story, hundreds of civilians, thousands of fighters trapped..

Or maybe they just fly 2000 sorties a day and just keep carpet bombing the place like NATO.

[mchughcb]

Unfortunately the Russians and the Ukrainians troll much the same depths of barbarity.
Read these if you are capable of uncurated thought.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massacres ... rn_Galicia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warsaw_Uprising

My friends mother who just died survived that as a girl. She said she doesn't like Russians but will pray for them if the nationalists ever came back. Lost her school friends burned in cellars.

[straightshooter]

Unfortunately the Russians and the Ukrainians troll much the same depths of barbarity.
Read these if you are capable of uncurated thought.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massacres ... rn_Galicia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warsaw_Uprising

I forgot this one:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katyn_massacre

[cz515]

Russian casualties, civilian women and children, none.
Ukraine, alot.
Have Russians always been such cowards historically ?

Every time there's an industrial plant school, hospital seems the same story, hundreds of civilians, thousands of fighters trapped..

Or maybe they just fly 2000 sorties a day and just keep carpet bombing the place like NATO.

Yeah i noticed that too. Using their own civilians as cover that's the first time i seen that

[cz515]

And you make completely unsubstantiated accusations about members who disagree with your opinions.

BTW, do you ever comment about firearms treated threads?

PS. I haven't changed my member name 3 times.

I don't understand what you mean by firearms treated threads. Is that some new clothes you wear.

3 times name change.... i dunno what you mean there as well. I think the forum allows members to change names so what's wrong with that. Next you will say how dare i change my undies every day, as if that's somehow bad

[Oldbloke]

"Firearms related"

[womble]

Nothing is flying over Ukraine

[womble]

Russian casualties, civilian women and children, none.
Ukraine, alot.
Have Russians always been such cowards historically ?

Every time there's an industrial plant school, hospital seems the same story, hundreds of civilians, thousands of fighters trapped..

Or maybe they just fly 2000 sorties a day and just keep carpet bombing the place like NATO.

Good point.
Where is Russia’s airforce. Where is the shock and awe, the blitzkrieg.
Do they even have a functioning airforce, because if they can’t control the skies this really is a waste of time.

[mchughcb]

Russian casualties, civilian women and children, none.
Ukraine, alot.
Have Russians always been such cowards historically ?

Every time there's an industrial plant school, hospital seems the same story, hundreds of civilians, thousands of fighters trapped..

Or maybe they just fly 2000 sorties a day and just keep carpet bombing the place like NATO.

Good point.
Where is Russia’s airforce. Where is the shock and awe, the blitzkrieg.
Do they even have a functioning airforce, because if they can’t control the skies this really is a waste of time.

Cause they just shoot missiles from the Black sea and blow up NATO training camps with foreign fighters in Lviv and risk SFA.

[on_one_wheel]

Yeah i noticed that too. Using their own civilians as cover that's the first time i seen that

That was a tactic used extensively in Afghanistan by the Taliban.
It made it extremely difficult to target the enemy without taking out civilians.

[mchughcb]

Yeah i noticed that too. Using their own civilians as cover that's the first time i seen that

That was a tactic used extensively in Afghanistan by the Taliban.
It made it extremely difficult to target the enemy without taking out civilians.

And by ISIS is Aleppo. Just put the civilian in cages or tie them to the roofs of where you are hiding hoping the pilots will see them and take pity and not drop a bomb on there while you are down stairs having dinner.

[womble]

Russian casualties, civilian women and children, none.
Ukraine, alot.
Have Russians always been such cowards historically ?

Every time there's an industrial plant school, hospital seems the same story, hundreds of civilians, thousands of fighters trapped..

Or maybe they just fly 2000 sorties a day and just keep carpet bombing the place like NATO.

Good point.
Where is Russia’s airforce. Where is the shock and awe, the blitzkrieg.
Do they even have a functioning airforce, because if they can’t control the skies this really is a waste of time.

Cause they just shoot missiles from the Black sea and blow up NATO training camps with foreign fighters in Lviv and risk SFA.

Then they will need functioning battleships and sailors that are not too scared to go
https://londonlovesbusiness.com/russian-sailors-stage-mutiny-and-refuse-to-carry-out-combat-duties-as-they-perceive-each-trip-to-the-sea-as-a-one-way-ticket/

Same problem that has plagued them throughout. Russian personnel don’t want to be there. Morale is at its lowest.
Nato is even stalling peace negotiations so we can finish the job properly.
Russia must be held to account for this aggression. Ukraine needs to be rebuilt. That will be their only mercy.

[womble]

Finland, Sweden and now this.
Putin is the best salesman for Nato ever
https://www.businessinsider.com/japan-attending-nato-summit-first-time-ukraine-invasion-prompted-2022-6?utm_source=reddit.com

[cz515]

Hang the f on. I just read that emanuel macrom and other European leaders bodyguard Ukraine butv travelled via train.

Is everyone sure the country is at war, or has the media, putin and zelensky etc doing a series of survivor Ukraine