Interstate firearms sale.

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Interstate firearms sale.

Post by Sockeye » 03 Jun 2022, 8:07 am

I am going through the process of selling rimfire rifle from Qld to NSW.

Do I need to wait until the buyer provides a proof of PTA or I can ship the rifle to his dealer to be held until he gets the PTA?

Is there a guide of some sort with recommended or mandatory steps?

Thanks
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Re: Interstate firearms sale.

Post by deanp100 » 03 Jun 2022, 8:17 am

Just get your dealer to send it off as soon as he pays you. You don’t care if he gets a pta or not. Your dealer takes it off your license. End of story.
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Re: Interstate firearms sale.

Post by bladeracer » 03 Jun 2022, 1:53 pm

Sockeye wrote:I am going through the process of selling rimfire rifle from Qld to NSW.

Do I need to wait until the buyer provides a proof of PTA or I can ship the rifle to his dealer to be held until he gets the PTA?

Is there a guide of some sort with recommended or mandatory steps?

Thanks


Whether the buyer has a PtA doesn't matter to you. Once he's paid you, you deliver the firearm to your dealer who sends it to his dealer. He can't collect it from his dealer until he gets a permit, that's his issue not yours - once you deliver it to your dealer it is no longer licenced to you.
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Re: Interstate firearms sale.

Post by Pendous » 03 Jun 2022, 4:45 pm

I agree with the two posts above.

No you don't need to wait for their PTA.
Yes send it after you have received payment.

Get the firearm to your dealer ready for transport.
When you receive payment from buyer settle any payment you have with your dealer and advise them to get it on its way to the nominated receiving NSW dealer.
This is the quickest way to get it done.

The NSW buyer gets their PTA application happening while the firearm is in transit.
Receiving NSW dealer transfers it to NSW registration.
Buyer presents their PTA and any associated fees to the receiving/transfering NSW dealer, takes ownership and is issued a registration from NSW Firearms Registry at a later date.

Unsure for QLD but to my knowledge no notification will be sent to you.
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Re: Interstate firearms sale.

Post by Sockeye » 03 Jun 2022, 6:01 pm

Thanks you gents. All clear now.
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Re: Interstate firearms sale.

Post by deanp100 » 04 Jun 2022, 4:37 pm

Pendous wrote:I agree with the two posts above.

No you don't need to wait for their PTA.
Yes send it after you have received payment.

Get the firearm to your dealer ready for transport.
When you receive payment from buyer settle any payment you have with your dealer and advise them to get it on its way to the nominated receiving NSW dealer.
This is the quickest way to get it done.

The NSW buyer gets their PTA application happening while the firearm is in transit.
Receiving NSW dealer transfers it to NSW registration.
Buyer presents their PTA and any associated fees to the receiving/transfering NSW dealer, takes ownership and is issued a registration from NSW Firearms Registry at a later date.

Unsure for QLD but to my knowledge no notification will be sent to you.

Yep in Qld and I expect everywhere else there is no notification of what happens to the gun. Once you sign it to your dealer it vanishes from your thoughts.and possession.
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Re: Interstate firearms sale.

Post by Pearse » 18 Feb 2023, 9:38 am

From what I can see above, a firearm is NOT transferred into the purchasers name when it is transferred from State to State, it is transferred to and in the name of the dealer ? When is the firearm "acquired "? after presentation of a PTA ? Would anyone know someone in the Legal profession that might prove this ? There is a case that has been judged that if not appealed will change the above for everyone. Thank you for any response.
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Re: Interstate firearms sale.

Post by bladeracer » 23 Feb 2023, 9:10 am

Pearse wrote:From what I can see above, a firearm is NOT transferred into the purchasers name when it is transferred from State to State, it is transferred to and in the name of the dealer ? When is the firearm "acquired "? after presentation of a PTA ? Would anyone know someone in the Legal profession that might prove this ? There is a case that has been judged that if not appealed will change the above for everyone. Thank you for any response.


Some states do apparently allow you to use an interstate PtA, particular if you live along the border, like Albury/Wadonga. But generally the law requires a firearm to leave one state while listed on a dealer's books, and arrive in another state onto another dealer's books before being transferred to a shooter's licence in that state.

I would expect that the firearm would not be "acquired" by you until you have presented a valid PtA to the dealer and he has transferred the firearm off his register onto your licence. Outside of WA, we can of course borrow firearms, which leads to situations where I might borrow a firearm from my interstate brother to use in my home state, decide I want to keep it and he agrees to sell it to me. Technically, I believe I have to return the firearm to a dealer in his state, who can then send it to a dealer in my state before I can have it transferred to my licence. As I said though, some states allow some crossover. If I were in Wodonga and my brother in Albury I could get a Victorian PtA, and collect the firearm from the Albury dealer. I don't know whether I could simply do the transfer at my Wodonga dealer though with a NSW-licenced firearm.

A few years ago, when permits took a few days to come through, I would buy a firearm and take it home, before my dealer even applied for a permit for me. This was entirely on the trust of my dealer that I was honest, legal, and that I would have no difficulty with the permit. Technically, I was out shooting with a borrowed firearm, that I had not yet "acquired". I believe this is still happening but in recent years I've been happy to wait as I have to write a letter to Firearms explaining why I need another CatB firearm before they okay the permits.

If you want a legal interpretation contact one of the firearm lawyers - Simon Munslow, Ross Williamson, Karrie Louden and others.
Last edited by bladeracer on 23 Feb 2023, 10:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Interstate firearms sale.

Post by No1_49er » 23 Feb 2023, 10:12 am

Pearse wrote:From what I can see above, a firearm is NOT transferred into the purchasers name when it is transferred from State to State, it is transferred to and in the name of the dealer ? When is the firearm "acquired "? after presentation of a PTA ? Would anyone know someone in the Legal profession that might prove this ? There is a case that has been judged that if not appealed will change the above for everyone. Thank you for any response.

Who cares?
OP asked about a process of transferring dealer to dealer, interstate, and the purchaser having to obtain a PTA.
All that matters to the vendor is that, having received payment, they surrender the firearm to their dealer and indicate to whom it is to be sent. At that stage, the dealer notifies Qld WLB that the firearm is no longer in the possession of the vendor - it's off his records.
Qld dealer then sends to NSW dealer. It is now the responsibility of the purchaser to present a PTA to his NSW dealer and takes possession.

To keep things tidy, the vendor should ask Qld WLB for an updated list of the firearms that are recorded as being in his possession. It used to be done as a matter of course, but you have to ask now. Check the list thoroughly for any errors. I have had occasion to find several, some of which proved problematic to resolve. Keep thorough / accurate records - the day might well come that you need them.
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