Are Yanks Allowed Around These Parts?

[Eduardo]

Greetings from the United States, New York to be specific. Not sure if it's cool if I join this forum, if you're uncomfortable with it I'll respectfully bow out.
I’ve been lurking for a couple of days. I only recently have gotten into shooting sports, coming in on a year now. When I decided to get into shooting, I made it a point to learn as much as I could about it. I’m at the stage in my education that has me curious about the International gun enthusiast community, which is what brought me here. There seems to be this perception in the US that other countries have severe restrictions on guns and everyone is perfectly ok with it. The thinking is other countries live with it, why are you so stubborn? I got the feeling it was hogwash. I started looking at gun forums from other countries like Spain, Australia and a few others. This is the first forum I joined however. What I am finding is that you folks seem to suffer from the same constant barrage of anti-gun rhetoric as we do in the States. along with the same nonsensical laws. Living in New York, we have many restrictions on guns when compare to the rest of the USA. The anti-gun side is slowly overwhelming the gun rights advocates. We took a big hit this year right after the Newtown CT. shooting (I'm about 75 km from Newtown) although not as bad as you folks got it after the Port Arthur massacre.
Anyway, I just wanted to introduce myself. If you have any questions please feel free to ask.

[on_one_wheel]

Yes we sure do have some serious restrictions here in Australia, We genneraly take it laying down because by nature we are pretty easy going people, also our shooting lobby is weak due to the low numbers of members joined to the SSAA. The ever growing gap between city folk who have nothing but fear for firearms and country folk who use them as tools is widening.

[Blackened]

Greetings from the United States, New York to be specific. Not sure if it's cool if I join this forum, if you're uncomfortable with it I'll respectfully bow out.

Yes mate, you're welcome.

The more the merrier

[Eduardo]

Thanks for the welcome. I'd like to start with one clarification on my part. Is the ban on AU guns on all semi autos? Does that include handguns? I'm a bit confused because I think I have read about permits to purchase\own semi autos? Is there a website that lists out the restrictions so I don't have to keep asking repetitive questions? It just seems to me that some of what I have been reading is contradictory. Which makes sense here in the States since guns laws vary from State to State, just not sure how they work down under.

[on_one_wheel]

http://www.sapolice.sa.gov.au/sapol/ser ... rearms.jsp
Semi auto is not banned, but they can be difficult to aquire. The rules vary slightly from state to state in Australia. Its resonably straight forwad getting class A and B but getting class H is a little more involved and class C,and D is a little more restricted again.

[SendIt]

It just seems to me that some of what I have been reading is contradictory. Which makes sense here in the States since guns laws vary from State to State, just not sure how they work down under.

They vary from state to state here too, bit you're right... Plenty of it is contradictory.

Too many people making laws at the same time here without communicating with each other.

[chacho]

Is the ban on AU guns on all semi autos? Does that include handguns?

Short version is that to get a semi auto rifle, you must be using it for commercial pest control. e.g. be farmer with a huge property.

Can't get one for target shooting or otherwise.

Handguns is veeeeeery regulated. Have to have all sorts of club memberships and endorsements, attend a certain number of events with log books to keep your license and a whole tonne of stuff.

[Will]

As long as you don't rub your toys in our face, you're welcome

[Eduardo]

Uh oh, might be too late..
But I have the same issue here to a lesser degree. People in states that boarder NY can get anything they want. I'm restricted to the boring stuff.

As long as you don't rub your toys in our face, you're welcome

[Eduardo]

By US standards we're pretty restricted here. There's only a handful of semi-auto rifles we're allowed to purchase. If they have any characteristics of what they've classified as an "assault rifle" they're a no no. So, a Ruger Mini 14 with just a muzzle brake is off limits. AR15's\AK47's are completely off limits . Yet just across the boarder in Pennsylvania they can get pretty much anything they want. In NYC where I was born getting a handgun is next to impossible and if not, expensive. I moved to a part of NY that is less restrictive and was able to finally get a handgun permit after about 1 yr of going through the process. I had to appear before a judge and convince her that I was "worthy" of possessing a handgun. Every subsequent purchase has to be reviewed by a judge but you do not have to appear unless they request it. Rifles that are not semi-auto are still thankfully easy to purchase. Walk in, pick your rifle and go through a quick automated background check and walk out with your rifle.

Is the ban on AU guns on all semi autos? Does that include handguns?

Short version is that to get a semi auto rifle, you must be using it for commercial pest control. e.g. be farmer with a huge property.

Can't get one for target shooting or otherwise.

Handguns is veeeeeery regulated. Have to have all sorts of club memberships and endorsements, attend a certain number of events with log books to keep your license and a whole tonne of stuff.

[huccl]

I moved to a part of NY that is less restrictive and was able to finally get a handgun permit after about 1 yr of going through the process. I had to appear before a judge and convince her that I was "worthy" of possessing a handgun.

Geez really?

What is there to convince her of other than that you're not a criminal?

[Eduardo]

Actually I found the whole experience kind of humiliating, not what I was expecting at all. In NY, we have three levels of handgun permit.

1. Restricted, meaning you can have one at home and the range.
2. Employment, you can use it for work (i.e. security guard.)
3. Unrestricted, you can carry it concealed.

I went to the hearing expecting to justify my need for a unrestricted permit. The thought that I could be denied a restricted permit never crossed my mind. I have a squeaky clean record, served in the military and I own properties and deal in cash quick often in some less than safe areas. I wrote up my justification along with my qualifications in a letter to the judge as requested.
Once the hearing started it was evident that the judge had not bothered to read my letter. The tone was hostile right from the start, almost like she was angry at me for daring to request a permit. She bombarded me with what I thought were irrelevant questions, barely letting me speak. The opening question was, "Why do you want a handgun permit?". My response was, "self defense". I started to add to that statement but she cut me off saying, "you cannot use a gun for self defense in NY, you have to use legal means of self defense.". I thought to myself, "what does she expect me to use? Harsh language?". Long story short she did not let me even make my arguments, granting me a restricted permit with a tone like she was doing me a favor. And that's only because I had to jump in and explain my history a bit. My Dad was an Olympic Bronze medalist in marksmanship, I was prior military, I have an $8000 safe, etc.

I left there completely disenchanted, with a feeling that I was a criminal for daring to exercise my constitutional rights. Mind you it's not like this in other states, but it seems that the closer you get to cities like NYC and LA the harder it is to get a permit.

I moved to a part of NY that is less restrictive and was able to finally get a handgun permit after about 1 yr of going through the process. I had to appear before a judge and convince her that I was "worthy" of possessing a handgun.

Geez really?

What is there to convince her of other than that you're not a criminal?

[Hardcast]

G'day Eduardo, welcome aboard.

Just a question, when you come out of the Armed Forces over there, do you need to go through any training or examination, to aquire a firearm.
Over here it doesn't matter what you did in the Army etc., you still have to do a civilian test. Theory and practical. ??

[Eduardo]

They completely ignore service in the military. You still need to complete training but only to own a handgun. Training is only theory. The only exemption is for law enforcement which are more and more becoming the Samurai of feudal Japan in that they are treated like a higher class of citizen.

That being said, I would actually welcome some sort of practical examination requirement. Owning a gun is a serious responsibility. I have made it a point to take my education in this matter pretty seriously, as do many of my fellow gun owners. However I'm not sure how ubiquitous that sentiment is. I think the gun control effort in the US should focus more on education rather than restriction.

Or biggest concentration of gun violence are in the big cities that already have tight restrictions on guns. Our politicians can't seem to keep their eye's on the ball. It's not a gun violence problem, it's a crime problem. The gun violence problem is a symptom of the larger crime problem, not the cause. And how do you fix the crime problem? By fixing the economy of course. When people become desperate or disillusioned they turn to crime. The good news is that gun violence has been on a down trend since the 1994, down by 30% and continues to drop. This is despite record numbers of new gun owners.

G'day Eduardo, welcome aboard.

Just a question, when you come out of the Armed Forces over there, do you need to go through any training or examination, to aquire a firearm.
Over here it doesn't matter what you did in the Army etc., you still have to do a civilian test. Theory and practical. ??

[Manimal]

I left there completely disenchanted, with a feeling that I was a criminal for daring to exercise my constitutional rights. Mind you it's not like this in other states, but it seems that the closer you get to cities like NYC and LA the harder it is to get a permit.

We don't even get an appeal like that to pretend we're not being treated like criminals.

Our only option is nothing.