“My Health Record” To opt out or not?

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“My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by Andrew1au » 03 Sep 2018, 6:51 pm

Most of you have probably seen the adds on TV. The Government are looking to consolidate our health records onto an online system that’s Controlled by them. The say that only people we authorise can access, but does that rule even apply for the Government as they are holding the info?
What if you spoke with a GP about Depression, Anxiety or similar and they use it to take away you firearms or deny a license renewal.

I realise I may sound like a conspiracy nut, but something does t feel right about it and I don’t trust them. What happens between me and my GP is my business. If I had a condition that was serious, then the hospital would already know, as a GP would have referred me to a hospital.

What’s everyone’s thoughts. Cheers.
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by yoshie » 03 Sep 2018, 7:23 pm

Me and the wife have already opted out, if they can't organise a census what makes them think they can organize our health records. Have you tried to deal with Centrelink lately? My wife has and on many occasions (childcare rebate) everytime she calls she simply can't get through, now were in trouble because we didnt inform them of a change if circumstances, the wife tried a dozen times. I have no confidence in any of the federal government agencies.
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Post by Daddybang » 03 Sep 2018, 7:30 pm

Nope just can't bring myself to trust anyone in Parliament on any side not to f@#k the dog with that type of info. :drinks:
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by pete1 » 03 Sep 2018, 7:30 pm

It might sound like conspiracy, but could happen.
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by Stix » 03 Sep 2018, 8:00 pm

Its not a conspiracy theory mate...it is definately one of many things that could happen...

You wait...it will get hacked, used & abused...in law, under the law, behind the law & probably accessed & used against the law by the law itself...!!

Be blowed if i trust em...already opted out...!!
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by tom604 » 03 Sep 2018, 8:08 pm

already out :thumbsup:
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by Sumo » 03 Sep 2018, 8:18 pm

I am well and truly a customer of the medical system. Talking to my oncology nurses recently, their view was that the benefits out way the possible risks. In the future when I present to hospital they will have access to information faster than before and will have the full picture. This can and will be lifesaving for some people. Generally I don't share my information with anyone that I don't have to, however in this case I am in. If I was young and healthy, I would probably opt out though.
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by Sarco » 03 Sep 2018, 9:22 pm

I am definitely opting out!
Concerns :-
Who is going to enter this data? If you think doctors, Your dreaming!, it will be low paid office staff who may or may not talk about your medical matters over a few drinks at the local on Friday/Saturday night.

Who can access the information? Anybody that has to enter new data or is authorised by your local doctor because he is to important/doesn't speak/read English well enough to do it!

Who is going to check the information and ensure it is correct - My guess is nobody!

While government departments have huge computer security regimes, what does you local medical centre have? If your lucky they will have a commercial off the shelf product that may or may not be kept up to date or be best practice!

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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by Oldbloke » 03 Sep 2018, 11:19 pm

Even though I like the concept I've opted out. Every man and his dog will have access. Including a few government agencies, that means hundreds of people.
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by Gaznazdiak » 03 Sep 2018, 11:53 pm

Andrew1au wrote:Most of you have probably seen the adds on TV. The Government are looking to consolidate our health records onto an online system that’s Controlled by them. The say that only people we authorise can access, but does that rule even apply for the Government as they are holding the info?
What if you spoke with a GP about Depression, Anxiety or similar and they use it to take away you firearms or deny a license renewal.

I realise I may sound like a conspiracy nut, but something does t feel right about it and I don’t trust them. What happens between me and my GP is my business. If I had a condition that was serious, then the hospital would already know, as a GP would have referred me to a hospital.

What’s everyone’s thoughts. Cheers.


You don't sound like a nut at all Andrew, you sound like someone who has a sensible worry about government interference in your information security.

I opted out on the morning of the first day possible. No government yet has been able to secure their own information, eg file cabinets full of classified documents sold in a second hand furniture shop, so I certainly wouldn't trust them with sensitive, private medical records.
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by Cryptic » 04 Sep 2018, 12:35 am

Opted out too. Not that it would have much as last doc visit was just short of 10 years ago and before that were few and far between so very little data to find lol.
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by Sergeant Hartman » 04 Sep 2018, 8:10 am

Firstly let me say I just recently went on a rant about this. So I will go again. Apologies if you seeing it again. Secondly about 5 years ago I was involved in this to introduce it to health care workers, also having a good IT background I suppose I understood both the good points and challenges this faced. Thirdly i opted in and honestly I would definately recommend everyone to NOT opt out.

The system is operated not by the government but by one of the big 5 consulting companies, Accenture. So while the is a risk of hacking like any online information, some of the best minds in the World are charged with safeguarding the information. Be sure for them apart from possible fines the reputational damage will be huge increase of a data breach.

Data is not entered manually, it's done by the medical software, this removes the human element and likely sources of mistakes as some doctors might call the same condition different names. Furthermore the penalties of unauthorized access are very stiff, this applies at medical practices, unauthorised access by their office staff for example, or other health care professionals, thre are audit systems in place to ensure a track is maintained who accessed the info and at what times.

The info entered is a summary of your visit, furthemore the doctors can enable the contents of a particular visit not to be uploaded, eg a under age person wanting birth control but doesn't want their parents to know, who have access to the child record.

Sure government agencies could have access, but they could still do the same, the age of privacy is gone as more and more ppl spend most of their days online, companies like facebook and google, apple etc collect more data about you and readily sell it to anyone wanting to pay. Furthermore the argument of health, life etc insurance companies is also null and void, one of the forms you currently fill up gives them permission to access all your health information. From personal experience the do extensive checks and if you miss even a small visit they will find it out and interface if a claim query it, and try and weasel out of paying if it's a finding that you should have declared but didn't thing. this way ensure you have given them everything.

Now tbh as usual the govt does a s**t job to promote the benefits of things like these. Even if you are a young and fit person there are benefits of the summary information. But people with chronic diseases benefit hugely, in Australia a lot of money and time is wasted when patients present at doctors and ED as they might miss some relevant information when filing out patient history questionnaire. Or when you forget the reports or cray at home. But imagine if you present at ED unconscious, suffer from a chronic condition. You might only need one thing, but they will need to take worst case and test for everything under the sun. Or if you have a bad reaction to a particular medication and they administer that to you. I could go on, but I run out of time.

Lastly tbh the security at most GP practices is unbelievably lax, the office staff do know the passwords of most GPs or worse everyone has same passwords. Most times especially in country areas or in smaller practices, it's either the practice manager or the brother of a doctor who knows about computers but no actual IT background who is responsible for managing their servers and setting up security. Other times they will employ a local ComptersRUs company who doesn't actually understand that health information and computer systems are different than thir grandma computer or the hairdressers computer. Do a search on news stories on Google of how many practices get hacked every year and even been held to ransom by hackers is huge. What's worse is only 1 in thousand get reported by the media.
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Post by duncan61 » 04 Sep 2018, 9:36 am

well written Ziad.I have been unwell for 2 weeks and booked online to see a G.P.at my local and it all went smoothly and now I have antibiotics and am on the mend.Our system is in good working order as far as I can tell
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by Daddybang » 04 Sep 2018, 10:53 am

It's not about the Health system its about having personal info stored on the internet and the possible (probable?) misuse of that info...let's face it some computer whiz is already sitting down figuring out how to hack it. :thumbsup: :drinks:
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by Gaznazdiak » 04 Sep 2018, 11:36 am

Daddybang wrote:It's not about the Health system its about having personal info stored on the internet and the possible (probable?) misuse of that info...let's face it some computer whiz is already sitting down figuring out how to hack it. :thumbsup: :drinks:
PS welcome back Duncan :welcome: :drinks:


Already is right, and for some time.
Medical records are the new credit card as far as ID theft is concerned.

Some disturbing reading below.


https://www.forbes.com/sites/forbestech ... cards/amp/

https://www.computerworld.com.au/articl ... pore-hack/

https://www.independent.co.uk/life-styl ... 33171.html
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by Sergeant Hartman » 04 Sep 2018, 1:22 pm

Looking at your first article, the info was stolen from a plastic surgeon practice. How good was his security.... actually I can tell you 8 out of 10 medical practices in australia, especially in country areas have so lax security that they won't even know if anyone in their practice looked at the data of their patients, let alone a hacker accessed the info.

Thus I would also say if the my health records was hacked you would hear about it on the media more so the local gp practice that got hacked. GPs are not IT ppl and they don't like to spend money, for a very long time very private patients info was being sent via emails to their colleagues in other practices, allied health professionals and specialists. Email is one of the most convenient but the most insecure and unreliable methods to send info. It's only recently that they have started to use secure encryption to send patient info and only because they were given huge financial incentives.

Anyway in the end the choice is yours. I can give gupt reasons and examples till I am blue in the face but if you are not willing to listen. There is no point.

It does annoy me in australia you need 3 pol to not understand something or be scared of something to object to it, and the government and councils say fk to the benefit to the community.
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by bladeracer » 04 Sep 2018, 1:30 pm

I'm out, at least until we see if it actually works and is used properly.
You can always opt in again in a few years time.
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by Gaznazdiak » 04 Sep 2018, 2:15 pm

Hi Ziad,
As someone living with a chronic condition, I have to visit doctors and specialists 15-20 times per year, so I understand the potential benefits of a centralized online records system.

I respect your knowledge and experience in this area, and I believe that what you relate about the efforts at security are as you say.

However, the attacks in England and Singapore were not on some regional GP practices running Windows 95, they were supposedly sophisticated government systems with no doubt similar levels of security as the one here, and they were compromised and defeated.

If it happened there, there is no reason to believe that it won't happen here.
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by tom604 » 05 Sep 2018, 6:22 am

bladeracer wrote:I'm out, at least until we see if it actually works and is used properly.
You can always opt in again in a few years time.



the question is ,can you opt back out? until you can i'm out :thumbsup:
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by straightshooter » 05 Sep 2018, 8:00 am

I can see that just about everybody has succumbed to a major misdirection in discussing this issue.
So you think 'you' own your medical records or you think your medical records are sacrosanct and only available to you and can't be hacked.
Think again.
Do you go to a bulk billing doctor, do you claim on medicare or a private insurer?
Of course you do and so do your medical records and of course they are available virtually on demand to many authorities.
I suspect this is more about devolving data input to closer to a 'user' level to enable doctor and patient surveillance in something a little closer to real time and thus reducing the administrative burdens in so doing.
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by trekin » 05 Sep 2018, 8:40 am

Data security risks aside, the regristry is now being used by QLD Health to force pensioners to use doctors and specialist that they want you use. Forcing a lot of pensioners to change specialist mid stream in treatment is not clinicly inducive to the wellbeing of the patient. In most cases, changing specialist means going back on a waiting list, going back though all the tests, and than, more than likely having to change treatment regime. QLD Health are doing this by refusing to pay the patient travel & accommodation subsidy to your preferred specialist if there is one closer. Private heath funds will be following suit.
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by Andrew1au » 05 Sep 2018, 9:40 am

bladeracer wrote:I'm out, at least until we see if it actually works and is used properly.
You can always opt in again in a few years time.


Yeah, this is what I’m thinking.
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by Andrew1au » 05 Sep 2018, 9:43 am

straightshooter wrote:I can see that just about everybody has succumbed to a major misdirection in discussing this issue.
So you think 'you' own your medical records or you think your medical records are sacrosanct and only available to you and can't be hacked.
Think again.
Do you go to a bulk billing doctor, do you claim on medicare or a private insurer?
Of course you do and so do your medical records and of course they are available virtually on demand to many authorities.
I suspect this is more about devolving data input to closer to a 'user' level to enable doctor and patient surveillance in something a little closer to real time and thus reducing the administrative burdens in so doing.


That’s quite different. If I claim my GP visit on Medicare, then the government can see that I went to a doctor. If I participate in this health record, they can see WHY I went to a doctor and the results of said visit.
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by bullzeye » 05 Sep 2018, 10:46 am

Alan Jones said to opt-out, so yep - that's what I've done :lol:
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by Sergeant Hartman » 05 Sep 2018, 11:39 am

Interesting, where did you read it.... don't say Andrew bolt or toby about or Pauline notHandsome said it


trekin wrote:Data security risks aside, the regristry is now being used by QLD Health to force pensioners to use doctors and specialist that they want you use. Forcing a lot of pensioners to change specialist mid stream in treatment is not clinicly inducive to the wellbeing of the patient. In most cases, changing specialist means going back on a waiting list, going back though all the tests, and than, more than likely having to change treatment regime. QLD Health are doing this by refusing to pay the patient travel & accommodation subsidy to your preferred specialist if there is one closer. Private heath funds will be following suit.
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by trekin » 05 Sep 2018, 1:30 pm

Ziad wrote:Interesting, where did you read it.... don't say Andrew bolt or toby about or Pauline notHandsome said it


trekin wrote:Data security risks aside, the regristry is now being used by QLD Health to force pensioners to use doctors and specialist that they want you use. Forcing a lot of pensioners to change specialist mid stream in treatment is not clinicly inducive to the wellbeing of the patient. In most cases, changing specialist means going back on a waiting list, going back though all the tests, and than, more than likely having to change treatment regime. QLD Health are doing this by refusing to pay the patient travel & accommodation subsidy to your preferred specialist if there is one closer. Private heath funds will be following suit.

Didn't need to read about it. Happened to the wife yesterday. Been seeing a cancer specialist for the last 5-6 years, specialist is 360 km round trip away, and now their saying they will no longer pay the subsidy to her preferred specialist because their is one 160 km closer (who we believe has been there thoughout here treatment). Also happened to me earlier this year, been seeing a specialist in Brissy, 12 hrs by car/ 13 hrs by car train, one of only two specialist in field here in QLD, second one is only 360 round away. Second one does not have very good reviews, and my family GP wont even give me a referral to see him as his repretation is that bad, but QLD health will now only pay subsidy if I go to him in the future. Their arguement is that with the registry the closer specialist will have all the imformation they need to continue treatment, which is fair enough if they did, but personal expierence proves what I said above about waiting lists etc.
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by Sergeant Hartman » 05 Sep 2018, 6:53 pm

Well tbh that's not really a my health record issue. But beaurocrats can be fkwits at times.... other times they got no idea of real world issues.... they likely can meet their kpi by saying a couple thousand dollars a year...... while other beaurocrats waste a few hundred thousand dollars come November cuz if they don't spend the money they won't get it all next year
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Post by trekin » 05 Sep 2018, 7:22 pm

Ziad wrote:Well tbh that's not really a my health record issue. But beaurocrats can be fkwits at times.... other times they got no idea of real world issues.... they likely can meet their kpi by saying a couple thousand dollars a year...... while other beaurocrats waste a few hundred thousand dollars come November cuz if they don't spend the money they won't get it all next year

So, some fkwit beaurocrat working for a govt dept abusing the registry to save a few bucks, while potentially putting patients health at risk, is different to some fkwit crim hacking the registry and holding patients to ramsom, how exactly? Except, if we are to believe you, the fkwit beaurocrat scenario is 100% more likely to happen. 100% more likely to have real world effects on real world people.
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by Sergeant Hartman » 05 Sep 2018, 11:14 pm

Mate, I am still unsure why you blaming my health portal. And yes Ihave being argumentative. So I'll finish here, hopefully it clears my point... being devils advocate.

Don't you think that a department employee talked with approving travel claims gets told, ok buster goes sane money so look at these forms and those in country areas who have longer than 100km trips, ar if they got an equivalent specialist closer, if so sent the claims and tell them to go the closer specialist.

Seeing I presume you fill out a paper or an online form, request to get data from there, cuz I don't think the my health record has the smarts to flag your location and your specialist location and then search for specialists that are closest to you. This type of matching is moe easiest to do by human
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Re: “My Health Record” To opt out or not?

Post by trekin » 06 Sep 2018, 5:59 am

Ziad wrote:Mate, I am still unsure why you blaming my health portal. And yes Ihave being argumentative. So I'll finish here, hopefully it clears my point... being devils advocate.

Don't you think that a department employee talked with approving travel claims gets told, ok buster goes sane money so look at these forms and those in country areas who have longer than 100km trips, ar if they got an equivalent specialist closer, if so sent the claims and tell them to go the closer specialist.

Seeing I presume you fill out a paper or an online form, request to get data from there, cuz I don't think the my health record has the smarts to flag your location and your specialist location and then search for specialists that are closest to you. This type of matching is moe easiest to do by human

"Firstly let me say I just recently went on a rant about this. So I will go again. Apologies if you seeing it again. Secondly about 5 years ago I was involved in this to introduce it to health care workers, also having a good IT background I suppose I understood both the good points and challenges this faced. Thirdly i opted in and honestly I would definately recommend everyone to NOT opt out."
Hardly fits the definition of a devils advocate.

Mate, I could debate with you this till the cows come home, but my time and energies are best spent elsewhere. However, be assured, there are plenty members of this forum who know where I'm coming from and understand the ramifications. These are the people who understand that their health and well being means more to them than the bottom line of some govt dept or the ROI for the shareholders of some consulting company with a contract with a dodgy government.
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