US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

News and events in the media and political arena relating to firearms.

Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by TassieTiger » 04 Jul 2019, 9:18 pm

I recently watched an online auction of firearms in the US thinking - this will be cool, see what the firearms we wish we could buy - actively sell for...
Well an old 9mm Uzzi - second hand, 2 spare clips and shoulder strap sold for...

Ready?

$15,000 US...

M16? Yep $11,000 US...

To my knowledge - These are not historical or rare firearms...
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by Strangedog » 04 Jul 2019, 10:06 pm

Well said Patriot. America has a long history with guns, I think it will always be that way.
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by wanneroo » 05 Jul 2019, 12:27 am

mickb wrote:I notice when the subject of gunlaws come up on Aus/nz forums on the big international forums, it becomes a bit of a pising ground for americans telling us we all roll over too easily, and how if it happened to them they wouldnt stand for it. With the NZ situation, its all on again.

I agree the US is far superior in resisting gun laws They have the consitution but more importantly financial muscle and numbers to tell anti's, left wing orgs and international groups like the UN to go to hell.

But one thing the US guys dont like to mention. Their 50 states and 3000 counties have thousands of different gun restrictions that they didn't stop. Including the gun control acts of 1934 and 1938 requiring tax stamps( federal permission) to buy machine guns, silencers and short barrel rifles.etc. Not to mention they just added another 210 changes just after the sandy hook shootings. Unless I am severely mistaken, there wasn't much in the way of physical resistance to any of it .Folks in the US largely comply like the rest of us.


Actually folks in the USA don't largely comply at all to many of the recent state gun laws in places like New York and Connecticut. It's estimated only a few percent of people that were supposed to register their "assault rifles" did so.

You actually named it without realizing it. We've got 50 different states here and the population of Australia could fit in the whole Los Angeles metro area. There are always some comparisons that are never going to work.

I think the difference between here and down under is we split by force from the UK while Aus/NZ did not, hence our governmental systems are different and it's much easier to railroad people in a parliamentary system with few checks and balances.

Also in the end with 1996-1998, did Australians really comply completely with the new laws? It's estimated perhaps 2/3rds of the firearms that should have been turned in did not get turned in.
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by wanneroo » 05 Jul 2019, 12:30 am

xDom wrote:There seems to be an opinion in the US that Australians can’t get guns full stop. It fits into their narrative that any restrictions at all will lead to total confiscation and complete tyranny.
As much as I enjoy firearms, I don’t think their system is the way to do things.


I've never heard that at all from any gun people, you aren't pushing unsupported positions are you like Tucker :lol: ?

What we DO talk about is that registration leads to confiscation.
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by wanneroo » 05 Jul 2019, 12:35 am

sungazer wrote:Wrenchman dont take this as an attack. However I do find it a little funny watching shows like Wardens and some others. There are so many rules and restrictions that are enforced with some pretty heavy handed attitudes and penalties. I am sure it has to be this way again because of the size of the population as if you start letting it slide it could be an ecological disaster if everyone could take as many deer as they wanted for example. We do have some similar rules like minimum calibre of a 270 for a Sambar deer but we dont have officers going around checking and extracting bullets from animals for forensic purposes.

We are starting to see some issues with Lead this is all about ranges and shotguns ATM it may progress we will have to wait and see.

Even in the US there are some places that have very strict gun laws to the point of places like New York where it is a total ban?

In general I think we are actually more free in Aus but things are changing with government owned land so again it will be not so interesting to see what happens. I certainly feel free-er here than when I lived in the US


You'll never have an issue with a game warden in the US if you are hunting legally in season.

There are a few localities with very strict gun laws but they are mostly leftist hellholes and I doubt you or I or anyone else here would want to live in those places, gun laws or not.

I think what I found with being more "free" in Australia is less people, less levels of bureaucracy and less supervision by government in more rural areas, but having said that the amount of nanny state stuff in Australia seems growing by the month, so enjoy while you can.
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by wanneroo » 05 Jul 2019, 12:45 am

marksman wrote:having relatives who live in America has given me a bit of an idea on what they believe in America
it was not that long ago that they could not buy 22 rimfire ammo at the local gun store, lots of trouble with getting handgun ammo as well
if you wanted ammo you got it couriered to you or waited in line at the gun store parking lot when the ammo arrived and it was sold off the back of the truck, it never made it into the store
people were grabbing whatever ammo they could even if they didn't own that caliber rifle or handgun
gun stores had reloading machines in the back pumping out ammo as fast as they could and it sold as quick
what I remember being told was that the people feared what Obuma was going to do with gun laws so the people were stocking up
they were not ever going to just hand in there guns like we did
if you honestly think the US has not already taken guns off the citizens you are kidding yourself :crazy:


That was the 2013 ammo panic after Sandy Hook and IMO was a bit irrational as people just starting buying and then more people got panicked so more bought and pretty soon more were buying and then the shelves were getting stripped bare or retailers raised prices significantly. obama was the best gun and ammo seller we've ever seen. Probably about 120 million guns were sold during his two terms.

I took up reloading to ensure I always had a supply of ammo.

Now we have an ammo glut with ammunition sellers going out of business and ammunition companies struggling as well.

There are a lot of radical democrats and Antifa types that just dream of a violent civil war, government overthrow of Orange Man Bad, but I can tell you there are many, many people that are like I triple dog dare you to do that. I don't think those people want to go there. Rural America controls the flow of water, power, fuel, food and other resources into cities. We cut that off and it will be zombie land in New York City in a week.
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by wanneroo » 05 Jul 2019, 12:48 am

TassieTiger wrote:I recently watched an online auction of firearms in the US thinking - this will be cool, see what the firearms we wish we could buy - actively sell for...
Well an old 9mm Uzzi - second hand, 2 spare clips and shoulder strap sold for...

Ready?

$15,000 US...

M16? Yep $11,000 US...

To my knowledge - These are not historical or rare firearms...


There are around 180,000 transferable machine guns out there and since 1986 they have increased in value, supply and demand.
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by wrenchman » 05 Jul 2019, 1:54 am

sungazer our gun laws and hunting laws have nothing to do with each other tradition animal population and human density do.
it will change state to state but if you showed up with what you hunt with in aus or nz you would be good to go just read the regs and most the time if you do do some thing they will just warn you if its a mistake and man up when asked.
i was hunting rabbits in kentucky i got checked and was informed when hunting small game the shot gun was only allowed to hold 3 shells mine held 5 so i put a plug in the gun and it did say this in the regs i didnt read.
in some states you cant hunt big game with semi auto rifles and in most camps are frowned on.
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by bigrich » 05 Jul 2019, 6:05 am

thanks for the info on the US WRENCHMAN and WANNEROO , some people over in oz "hear things" about the US , as i'm sure some people in the states "hear things" about "straya" there are many states in the US , all with different laws and attitudes, the laws in oz vary too. as a shooter there's no way i'd move to WA :roll: . over here the two major supermarket control the food supply , not farmers. in the US there are laws against cartel type behaviour that we don't have that a national party senator is crying out for. in oz , our food and petrol are controled by corporate cartels . electricity supply we were promised was supposed to be cheaper after being privatised, but what a joke that turned out to be .and don't get me started on the banks . i've seen on the news that heads of companies in the US can be sent to jail for improper practices. that's a extremely rare thing in oz . there's pro's and con's with the lifestyle of each country , from a recreational hunting and firearm lifestyle view i don't think we have it too bad in oz. but we need stronger representation to protect what rights we do have . and that's the problem, the aussie firearms owners are not united under a strong lobby group like the NRA , the leftists in this country carry on at the drop of a hat . the uproar in the media over the"one nation set up" was rediculous . the other problem in australia is the "can do" attitude of our colonial forefathers has been replaced with apathy and a "my one vote won't make a difference" attitude . where's the leftie labor party now ? not in power because enough people had a gutfull of lefty crap and voted for someone they considered a conservative . ya gotta wonder about the media in oz , they were pushing a labor victory before the election even started .

okay , rant over .

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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by Sergeant Hartman » 05 Jul 2019, 9:02 am

Very nice speech patriot :clap:

But you forget Australia doesn't give its citizens any rights.. gun ownership is a privilege and you have to do your part.

Secondly as said already, in us the people saying they will rise up if the government will come 4 their guns, every few months close their eyes and put their head under the sand while the government breaks down the 2nd amendment bit by bit, by taking away their rights one small law at a time. Go check the restrictions in California or NY.
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by bigrich » 05 Jul 2019, 10:41 am

Ziad wrote:Very nice speech patriot :clap:

But you forget Australia doesn't give its citizens any rights.. gun ownership is a privilege and you have to do your part.

Secondly as said already, in us the people saying they will rise up if the government will come 4 their guns, every few months close their eyes and put their head under the sand while the government breaks down the 2nd amendment bit by bit, by taking away their rights one small law at a time. Go check the restrictions in California or NY.


that's absolutely right ziad. in australia it is a privilage to use/own guns, one that we need to be vigilant about in political and social representation, the later of which is not mentioned in the media unless it's in a negative light. we as a group need to be seen as 99.9% responsable as a group . it's harder to get permission to hunt on private land these days from halfwit poachers and other disrespectful types doing the wrong thing by landowners . i know of a few cases first hand that p!ss me off .california and new york are probably not my first choices anyway . the mid west and north west are more to my liking from what i know of the US

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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by Patriot » 05 Jul 2019, 10:51 am

Ziad wrote:Very nice speech patriot :clap:

But you forget Australia doesn't give its citizens any rights.. gun ownership is a privilege and you have to do your part.

Secondly as said already, in us the people saying they will rise up if the government will come 4 their guns, every few months close their eyes and put their head under the sand while the government breaks down the 2nd amendment bit by bit, by taking away their rights one small law at a time. Go check the restrictions in California or NY.


Yeah, thanks mate.

Australia’s constitution does guarantee some rights, the right to vote, freedom of religion, the right to move around the commonwealth, and to have your property confiscated “ on just terms”.

If a person possesses a firearms license, does that not give them the right to own any firearm they wish in the categories they are licensed for?

Much like a driver license gives you the right drive any vehicle in the class you are licensed for.

So, if you obey the law your right to firearms under your license conditions won’t be infringed.

The US states of California and New York have some laws that are out of step with the rest of the union but most of these relate to pistols and the concealed carrying of those pistols. In New York the laws mainly apply to the New York City limits and not to the rest of the state.

There is much legal opinion in the US that the restrictive laws are unconstitutional, and a lot of the laws are set to be challenged in the SCOTUS which has a conservative majority at the moment.

Americans have a long and distinguished history of standing up for liberty and freedom and defeating tyranny and oppression they will not stand idly by while their God given right to bear arms is under attack.
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by TassieTiger » 05 Jul 2019, 11:04 am

Patriot wrote:
Ziad wrote:Very nice speech patriot :clap:

But you forget Australia doesn't give its citizens any rights.. gun ownership is a privilege and you have to do your part.

Secondly as said already, in us the people saying they will rise up if the government will come 4 their guns, every few months close their eyes and put their head under the sand while the government breaks down the 2nd amendment bit by bit, by taking away their rights one small law at a time. Go check the restrictions in California or NY.


If a person possesses a firearms license, does that not give them the right to own any firearm they wish in the categories they are licensed for?

Much like a driver license gives you the right drive any vehicle in the class you are licensed for.

So, if you obey the law your right to firearms under your license conditions won’t be infringed.


Americans have a long and distinguished history of standing up for liberty and freedom and defeating tyranny and oppression they will not stand idly by while their God given right to bear arms is under attack.


Not quite correct mate.
IF you have a firearms license, that then allows you to APPLY for any firearm in the category for what your licensed - does not guarantee approval and many are knocked back due to appearance laws (dont get me started), calibre, amount of firearms one already has, etc.
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by Patriot » 05 Jul 2019, 11:55 am

TassieTiger wrote:
Patriot wrote:
Ziad wrote:Very nice speech patriot :clap:

But you forget Australia doesn't give its citizens any rights.. gun ownership is a privilege and you have to do your part.

Secondly as said already, in us the people saying they will rise up if the government will come 4 their guns, every few months close their eyes and put their head under the sand while the government breaks down the 2nd amendment bit by bit, by taking away their rights one small law at a time. Go check the restrictions in California or NY.


If a person possesses a firearms license, does that not give them the right to own any firearm they wish in the categories they are licensed for?

Much like a driver license gives you the right drive any vehicle in the class you are licensed for.

So, if you obey the law your right to firearms under your license conditions won’t be infringed.


Americans have a long and distinguished history of standing up for liberty and freedom and defeating tyranny and oppression they will not stand idly by while their God given right to bear arms is under attack.


Not quite correct mate.
IF you have a firearms license, that then allows you to APPLY for any firearm in the category for what your licensed - does not guarantee approval and many are knocked back due to appearance laws (dont get me started), calibre, amount of firearms one already has, etc.


Ok, thanks for pointing that out mate.
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by sungazer » 05 Jul 2019, 5:50 pm

Its not hard to build up quite a cache. There are a lot on people on this forum that have more guns than you would probably think. They only ask you for a reason its not hard to have a reason. Like I really like the look of that one. This new one is just like the other one but different. I need several of the exact same gun as a backup is required for team shooting ect.
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by Sergeant Hartman » 06 Jul 2019, 12:41 pm

What I mean it's a privilege, you ask for permission to be able to acquire firearms and then ask again to have the privilege to own a particular firearm as per the conditions set out in your license.

Compared that to as you said right of freedom of religion... but even then I would say many people would reckon that right is eroding lately. The way we go I think eventually we might become a police state..... but that's a completely other topic
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by xDom » 06 Jul 2019, 1:54 pm

Patriot wrote:
Ziad wrote:their God given right to bear arms is under attack.


You sure you're not American?!
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by Patriot » 06 Jul 2019, 9:55 pm

Definitely not American cobber
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by Pennsylvania Yank » 27 Jul 2019, 8:10 am

mickb wrote:I notice when the subject of gunlaws come up on Aus/nz forums on the big international forums, it becomes a bit of a pising ground for americans telling us we all roll over too easily, and how if it happened to them they wouldnt stand for it. With the NZ situation, its all on again.

I agree the US is far superior in resisting gun laws They have the consitution but more importantly financial muscle and numbers to tell anti's, left wing orgs and international groups like the UN to go to hell.

But one thing the US guys dont like to mention. Their 50 states and 3000 counties have thousands of different gun restrictions that they didn't stop. Including the gun control acts of 1934 and 1938 requiring tax stamps( federal permission) to buy machine guns, silencers and short barrel rifles.etc. Not to mention they just added another 210 changes just after the sandy hook shootings. Unless I am severely mistaken, there wasn't much in the way of physical resistance to any of it .Folks in the US largely comply like the rest of us.


I'm an American. I didn't own or even hold a gun until I was in my late 20's. I bought my first handgun in the late 80's after watching the Movie "Lethal Weapon" (Yes, it was a Beretta 9mm). I bought my first so-called assault rifle in 1992 for the sole reason that my ruling government told me that soon I could not own one. I have watched the gun control movement grow and also grow more vitriolic and insane with each passing year.(coinciding with the growing insanity of the American Left in general during that same time period) I myself have grown from a casual shooter, to a competition shooter,to gun collector, to a gun rights advocate.

There are 3 factors that make the US unique and more able to resist the globalist and leftist inspired gun ban efforts. 1.Our unique gun culture, 2.Our Constitution, and 3.The NRA and other gun rights organizations. This is not to say that Australians or others are banned from owning any guns because we all know that is not true, BUT it is essentially true in SOME countries like the UK..This is where the worldwide gun ban movement is headed.

There are no more braver people than Australians and New Zealanders. This has been proven time and time again. This has nothing to do with weakness,and everything to do with the worldwide Left's ability and efforts to disarm populations in exchange for promises of peace and security, but in actuality is nothing more than about control.

Lastly, there is a propaganda effort being undertaken to try and convince people that Americans who value gun rights, and the NRA, are opposed to all gun restrictions. That is simply not true.
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by Tank » 27 Jul 2019, 12:02 pm

Does it matter what ‘they’ think. We’re the ones that live under those laws....
I couldn’t give a flying toss what someone 12,000 miles away ‘feels’ about ‘our’ legislations....so why is it important?
Last edited by Tank on 27 Jul 2019, 12:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by RoginaJack » 27 Jul 2019, 12:03 pm

:clap: :clap: :clap: Well said Sir and bloody well put too.
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by wrenchman » 27 Jul 2019, 12:12 pm

it should not tank
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by Member-Deleted » 27 Jul 2019, 12:16 pm

Pretty close to the point Pennsylvania Yank and another thing I for the love of me can't understand how countries can send people to war and kill thousands of innocent people as well as enemy with guns and when the people return then treated as potential criminals because they own or want a gun here in Australia they are trying to remove and ban guns that look or are similar to military weapons yet have passed the legal process to obtain now I think that is law Bastardry in both cases I don't mean that guns should be willy- nilly and anybody can have any gun we already have laws in place there is no reason to tighten them if these people think by taking peoples guns then they are delusional it never has and never will because most deaths are caused by non registered firearms or criminal activity lets look at snake bite it kills just as many if not more people than guns in Australia yet snakes are protected by law here to cap it off people don't get a say in the handing down of gun laws we are at the governments mercy not very democratic I say but that's the way the governments run of late I just wish we could get a politician with balls and be practical to go with it we may have a chance of fair play from the politicians then but I;m not holding my breath
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by Stix » 27 Jul 2019, 12:20 pm

Tank wrote:
wrenchman wrote:i do not think it is fair to compare us to aus / nz our citys with the gun crimes have greater populations then aus/ nz and its gang crime and i no they like to tell you that assault guns are the problem but they are less then 1% of any gun crime they just put those on the news.
i dont think it is also fair for me to say a bad thing about aus or nz shooters the us realy does have a gun culture i can go right now to a hand gun range and i will see almost as many woman as men the ladys are some of the best shooters and they train hard.


Does it matter what ‘they’ think. We’re the ones that live under those laws....
I couldn’t give a flying toss what someone 12,000 miles away ‘feels’ about ‘our’ legislations....so why is it important?

I agree your sentiment to a point...
But im not sure why you've quoted wrenchman here & not the OP tank... :unknown:
Wrenchman is just in the conversatiin & doesnt seem overly worried about what his fellow US gun owners think of our laws... :unknown:
Or have i missed something...?
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by Tank » 27 Jul 2019, 12:30 pm

Fair call Stix.
Apologies Wrenchman I wasn’t singling you out on this....
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by flutch » 27 Jul 2019, 12:37 pm

kiwis and aussie do roll over too easy, they/we do cuck ourselves severely, we dont demand enough and we Fudd ourselves out of relevance with lawmakers... our lack of freedom with gun laws and home/self defence is completely the result of such fuddery
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by Tank » 27 Jul 2019, 2:15 pm

What shape would you have things?
What part of current ownership laws aren’t meeting your satisfaction?
Is it state based ‘fuddery’?
How are you affected by current legislation negatively at this moment?
I’ve got a safe full....shoot whenever I like....handgun, rifle, shotgun.
I’m really interested to know what we’re ‘lacking’?
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by flutch » 27 Jul 2019, 2:46 pm

Tank wrote:What shape would you have things?
What part of current ownership laws aren’t meeting your satisfaction?
Is it state based ‘fuddery’?
How are you affected by current legislation negatively at this moment?
I’ve got a safe full....shoot whenever I like....handgun, rifle, shotgun.
I’m really interested to know what we’re ‘lacking’?



lots missing: semi's, castle doctrine, conceal carry, self defence laws that implicate firearms, no right to possess, too much arbitrary costs and delays in purchasing/licensing (some states worse than others) including things like appearance laws and calibre restrictions etc. the list really does go on and on and on

Personally, no longer allowed semi automatics, with no justification, I am not a criminal, not criminally inclined, nor have I harmed anyone, nor do I have any intention to so there is 0 justification in removing my access to what is a recreational implement and a means to control feral introduced species on my friends and families properties. Much the same with suppressors/moderators, there is no reason to not allow such a OHS device as it is integral to hearing protection and in all reality do not "silence" a firearm yet here we are kept from owning them for completely arbitrary reasons, same as kevlar vests etc etc etc... not just that but the arbitrary re-categorisation of firearms into categories that has no legislative relevance, aka does not legally meet that requirement just like the 7 shot adler being put into category C without there being anything in law allowing such a thing, the police acting as though they're above the law as per usual, they are not law makers they are law officers, they dont decide what the law is, yet we allow them to why?

As for the FUDD's they are other shooters who are happy with others being left without so long as they have THEIR guns and can go shoot how THEY want to... theyre the people who deny others genuine needs and wants and align themselves with the draconian lawmakers and lefty gun grabbers by proxy validating the idea that people dont have a right to own things.
Last edited by flutch on 27 Jul 2019, 4:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by Stix » 27 Jul 2019, 4:11 pm

Tank wrote:What shape would you have things?
What part of current ownership laws aren’t meeting your satisfaction?
Is it state based ‘fuddery’?
How are you affected by current legislation negatively at this moment?
I’ve got a safe full....shoot whenever I like....handgun, rifle, shotgun.
I’m really interested to know what we’re ‘lacking’?


Where is it that you shoot handgun rifle & shotgun whenever you like...?
Unless access to private land, im unaware of anywhere to shoot even a centrefire rifle whenever you like within coowee of Adel... :unknown:
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Re: US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

Post by Member-Deleted » 27 Jul 2019, 4:42 pm

Well flutch it's because we are out gunned when it comes to law making the gov makes the laws and the police have a say in the making of laws therefore when a law is passed the police are there to uphold the law the police have more say in law making than the citizen right there we are out gunned this is where I can see things could be better with more input from the gun owners or bodies supporting gun ownership so being a more level playing field for us to just disregard the law would be foolish in no uncertain terms the gun laws as they are today as I see are ok for me but there are a lot of people that would like access to more types of guns , guns that most have had for years and never had legal problems let alone used them for illegal purposes yet have had them taken from them this is where the problem lays laws made on little or no practical thought mostly made for seeking political votes there is no doubt in my mind that if the shooting bodies and gov of the day had sat down and had a practical and logical talk the police would not have got the power they now have in deciding gun laws but that was not to be gov BS prevailed again so you ask why do we let them well they have the law on their side so until we get a more logical, practical, fair , truthful and non corruptive Gov then the gun laws will not change the part I don't like with a passion is that all gun owners now come under the umbrella of being a potential criminal very distasteful on the Governments part for doing so :thumbsup:
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