Canada bans semi-autos

[Member-Deleted]

Who are you to say what other people need? I don't need a leather jacket made from 100% Italian goat but they are cool and I like them. Just because you don't need it does not mean other people do not want to have one. How people spend their currency should be of no concern to anybody.

I shot a few 50cal automatics over in Cambodia and Alaska and that is the coolest thing you can ever do. I never give up hope that one day it will be legal here too.

I’m no one to say. And I didn’t say.

You didn’t answer the question I asked.

The rant you have given suits your rhetoric.
It was expected and is ignored.
With attitude like yours it’s no wonder the powers that be ban things that are fun.

Put your tin hat back on and chill champ !

[Member-Deleted]

I can't really see the need for semi auto or full auto at all anyway

What can you do with one that a bolt/lever/straight pull can't?

I would like one too but personally can't see the reason to own one

l hated having to hand in my semi auto shotgun that was a great asset when shooting pigs, rabbits over ferrets, foxes and ducks
l also had great success with my 10/22 ruger on rabbits and foxes
Australia has never allowed the public to own full auto firearms ever dealers and collectors are the only ones that l know of who could

to answer "What can you do with one that a bolt/lever/straight pull can't?" you really have to have a go at them to see how much different it is to keep your sight on the animal and just pull the trigger, it is so much easier to keep on the animal, especially when you are hunting close scrub short distance
the problem with semi auto's or self loaders because there really is no such thing as a semi auto, its salesman talk is that you do not have to do anything after firing to be ready to shoot again and why the authority's dont want us to have them
the gun shops loved guys with self loaders because you would go through mare ammo
shooting a self loading shotgun is no different to shooting an under and over except the amount of shots that was why they are so good

I understand what your saying mate and I bet it sucked having to hand things back.

But still I ask what can they do that a repeater can’t.
Is it just the fun factor?

[Farmerpete]

I can't really see the need for semi auto or full auto at all anyway

What can you do with one that a bolt/lever/straight pull can't?

I would like one too but personally can't see the reason to own one

Have you ever hunted pigs in cane??
I have, your not shooting more than a couple of meters and that boar will kill you if you need to cycle another round manually not to mention you'd have to crawl a couple hundred meters to get out of the paddock it's why I jumped through the hoops for cat c, and didn't just go an a and b license. it's also why I take great care in the cleaning and maintenance of my hunting tools and don't cheap out on ammo.
I also remember when my dad owned a sks with a 30 shot mag he could get the whole sounder not just the lead boar.
the feral pig population has exploded since 96 all farmers know this we see it every day, we just can't prove it because no one did any science into the population size/density prior to the ban.
Of course if you're a range shooter you don't see the need for a farmer to own one but if your into hunting you'd understand why farmers NEED these TOOLS for eradication

[marksman]

"But still I ask what can they do that a repeater can’t.
Is it just the fun factor?"

no Denno not at all mate, its a better tool for the job at hand, the reason why pro's still have and use them instead of a manually operated firearm

[Stix]

[I understand what your saying mate and I bet it sucked having to hand things back.

But still I ask what can they do that a repeater can’t.
Is it just the fun factor?

Denno...
He's already answered your question, so obviously you DONT understand what he is saying.

Read his reply again...

With respect, judging by your reply to what marksman has said, id hazzard an educated guess youve never really hunted with a semi auto--sorry...a self loading shotgun.

Have you ever let the trigger go & KNOW before the primer ignites its a mistake...???
Do that with a shotgun & know your recoil & you can let another corrected shot crack out in an instant that--almost pushing the hasty shot out of the barrel...

A long shot on a duck...hesitant about range...?...rip 2 out in quick sucession spreading the pattern...sure you can do that with a double barrel, but not when your first shot(s) is/are fizzers.

Like marksman said...you need to hint with them...that doesnt mean go out for a couple hrs on a patch of bunnys...it means really go & hunt with them...

Even a 3rd shot in a 12g can double your bag on ducks & bunnys...!!...so if you can actually shoot & are smashing sky rats, good numbers of bunny's or ducks with 5+1 up the spout, you're gonna be an expert waterfowl cook by the following spring...!!

Again, you really need to use one to know what you can do with them, even with just follow-ups...

[Member-Deleted]

Thanks fellas.
I don’t hunt but can see what your getting at.
TBH I wasn’t thinking about hunting when I asked. I was thinking target.

I don’t really see why you’d need it for that.
Except for fun

[Oldbloke]

I have no need for a semi. But can see some would want one. The bar is too high. Needs to be lowered.

Ill get howled down on this. So not going to get into an argument. Hear goes. But often thought change the requirement to.
1. Get A & B licence initially. So no change there .
2. After say 3 years if you behave be able to buy some semi's. Like a probation period.

All manually operated firearms classified as B.

Thought it might be more palitable for the politicians. More sensible for us. But shooters normally jump on me for that saying it should be like US. I dont want to go down the path of the US.

Ill duck under the take now.

[Farmerpete]

Oldbloke that's a good option and would be a good outcome for shooters in Australia but as a kid I learned that if I wanted a puppy I should start by asking for a horse. That's why I still believe we should start the negotiations by asking for American laws Or better yet Swiss ones.

[Oldbloke]

Oldbloke that's a good option and would be a good outcome for shooters in Australia but as a kid I learned that if I wanted a puppy I should start by asking for a horse. That's why I still believe we should start the negotiations by asking for American laws Or better yet Swiss ones.

Im not saying thats how you would aproach any negotiations. Just saying seems a workable, sensible compromise/solution. I mean effectively banning 22 semi's is madness. Unfortunately laws are not always written using common sense.

[Grandadbushy]

Why can't self loading rifles be used for fun and used as an excuse to own one ? they have fun with fast cars, parachutes, snakes and many other dangerous things . one of the main things I see when looking at why they were banned , other than what they were used for at the time is that they were not registered, a lot of people had one and they were traded between people ie swapping this created an atmosphere of them being out there in unknown quantities and obtainable by anyone , but now with the gun laws and the registration system , '' even though it's not perfect '' it would be easier for the law to keep tracks on them and have a say in who has one , ''Not just ban them'' Yes they can be devastating when used in the wrong manner but so is a car, knife any tool but no matter what you do to prevent this there is always an ill informed, nut or sick person or persons to carry out this devastation no matter the tool used try and find solutions for them or remove them from society before banning the tool . This semi thing will always be there and be frowned upon by people that like to use them and will always seen as doing the right thing by the anti gun people or those that have no need for one but I don't parachute so should they ban them , No that would be crazy.

[Sergeant Hartman]

Apart from the reasoning of i want, 97% of shooters don't need a semi auto and those that do can get them in australia (just have to jump through some hoops).

Hunting with a semi auto shot gun, as you all explain can be accomplished with a over and under, if you had a fizzer then a semi can have a fizzer as well. The fact blast of the shot travels around 350m/sec and a shotgun has a range of less than 50m, the animal would have already started to move by the time 3rd shoot was fired and very likely you would miss anyway. Or you are saying your skills are that bad that you need 5 or 6 shots to hit your target. Considering the bag limits of ducks are not getting bigger in VIC atleast how many shots do you need to kill 3 or 5 ducks?

I thought hunting was about the experience, tracking an animal through wilderness until you finally get the perfect shot, if not then try again...not be a Rambo and just shot 1 million rounds through the forest and maybe kill something.

No wonder the shops loved it, compared to someone having 1 or 5 shots on a hunting trip all of a sudden its 100-200-500. And considering they make a profit of 30% on ammo they loving it. Esp if it was centrefire ammo as around $1/every 223 round... that's a lot of profit.

Yes my terminology or spelling might be crap. But you have no justification

[womble]

Well we're not all great shots like you.
I can easily let of 10 rounds trying to hit a rabbit with a shotgun at close range.

[Oldbloke]

I did have a 12g pump yonks ago. In my experience, generally speaking, if you miss the first shot you usually miss with 2nd and 3rd.

I have an U/O and a single. 90% of the time take the single.

[TassieTiger]

Apart from the reasoning of i want, 97% of shooters don't need a semi auto and those that do can get them in australia (just have to jump through some hoops).

Hunting with a semi auto shot gun, as you all explain can be accomplished with a over and under, if you had a fizzer then a semi can have a fizzer as well. The fact blast of the shot travels around 350m/sec and a shotgun has a range of less than 50m, the animal would have already started to move by the time 3rd shoot was fired and very likely you would miss anyway. Or you are saying your skills are that bad that you need 5 or 6 shots to hit your target. Considering the bag limits of ducks are not getting bigger in VIC atleast how many shots do you need to kill 3 or 5 ducks?

I thought hunting was about the experience, tracking an animal through wilderness until you finally get the perfect shot, if not then try again...not be a Rambo and just shot 1 million rounds through the forest and maybe kill something.

No wonder the shops loved it, compared to someone having 1 or 5 shots on a hunting trip all of a sudden its 100-200-500. And considering they make a profit of 30% on ammo they loving it. Esp if it was centrefire ammo as around $1/every 223 round... that's a lot of profit.

Yes my terminology or spelling might be crap. But you have no justification

If hunting was purely about the experience- why have thermals, night vision, etc - what about ppl who just want food?
As MM said - the ability to keep sights on a target without having to cycle seems to be the biggest advantage...and more ethical for a wayward first shot ?

[Sergeant Hartman]

Lol... you tried to keep your eye on the target with a 308 and no muzzle break... how is shooting multiple rounds helping reduce recoil

[Stix]

Lol... you tried to keep your eye on the target with a 308 and no muzzle break... how is shooting multiple rounds helping reduce recoil

See...there you go...!!...

Proof you put a stupid head on your face...

Those self loader shottys have hugely reduced amounts of recoil transfer back to your shoulder (edit...)..!!!

Im not gonna tell you why...ill let you google & absorb the reasons why, & maybe give you a little extra time to come back with a differing arguement.

You've actually just PROVEN you've never even fired one, let alone used one in the field...so if youre not interested in learning, why dont you stick your head in a bucket of oil instead of trolling this place...!!

[poid]

If you are happy to restrict based on "need" you can make a case for restricting just about anything.

[Sergeant Hartman]

Ahhh stix.. give us a reason ... not just attack the person.

I too want a billion dollars... but i don't need a billion dollars to be happy. And that's the difference

[marksman]

l think there is some bad info getting around

you cannot use a semi auto/ self loading shotgun for shooting animals unless you are a professional shooter or a farmer with an ABN in Vic
you can get a C class licence for shooting clays if you are and stay a member of a shotgun clay shooting club and have a crook back/shoulder ect... because of less recoil, recoil is what reloads the self loader, it is also allowable for children and small people to shoot clays because of the less recoil

your spot on Stix you have bought ziad undone in a very funny way

[Oldbloke]

"'Youre just a fudd...!!...with no idea what you're on about."

So, its this type of statement that causes arguments on forums.
I assume a fudd is same as anti?

He is simply expressing an alternate view to you.

Believe it or not, some firearm enshusiast dont want Australia to be like US. That means some checks and balances. And everyone here is entitled to a view without childish name calling.

PS. Ill just add. I know some people have left the forum over the last yr or so. . And that is the reason.

[Stix]

Im not attacking...you are...in your typical conceited way...

Read whats before you rather than dictate others' needs to them...!!

The brain dead arguement against SLR's based on "need", is just that, its brain dead & serves as nothing more than a masturbation session for the single minded...

You dont need a car...give me a reason why you should have the right to put so many others lives at risk every day in driving a car to purely to pander to your self righteous lazyness...get out of bed early & walk to work & stop being so entitled & outright lazy...!!

[Stix]

"'Youre just a fudd...!!...with no idea what you're on about."

So, its this type of statement that causes arguments on forums.
I assume a fudd is same as anti?

He is simply expressing an alternate view to you.

Believe it or not, some firearm enshusiast dont want Australia to be like US. That means some checks and balances. And everyone here is entitled to a view without childish name calling.

PS. Ill just add. I know some people have left the forum over the last yr or so. . And that is the reason.

The arguement is there to invoke the reaction in itself OB...you are actually having a go at the one calling out the baiter...!!

And you are not the only one who knows people have left because of this...
But im glad you finally mention it in a direct way--because i am not the only person who has been the reason people have left...!!!...

There are plenty times you bait people on here OB...so dont be so "im perfect & you are the reason this place is shyte"...!!

Ziad is smarter than his comments...i have demonstarted, as he has, points to his conceited attitude have alredy been made, yet he continues to troll with his antagonistic little baits...!!
Im just not afraid to call them out...!!...if he chooses to act in a "FUDD" fashion, with attitudes to match, he should be prepared to be called out...!!

& i edited out my name calling thanks... ...the rest is in humour, the very same humour his new avatar is intended to bring...so if that cant be tolerated, then maybe he should remove his avatar...

[Stix]

Anyway...im out of this for that very reason as well...

There are points put up for discussion earlier in this thread that give practicle examples for use of slr's...If people purposely ignore them & bait others for these reasons already given, & come in with snippets of twisted info as dismissive counter arguements, as happens every time this subject is raised here, & they are not seen as baiting, then what can i say.

And if it werent baiting, there would be recognition of valid reasons, if not for any other point than for confirmation &/or attempts to understand the counter side of the subjuct, thus resulting in whats known as a discussion...
Its surprisingly stimulating to take on board the understanding of others...but that is going to be lacking here given some of the recent entrants attitudes...

Cheers...enjoy the fuddery...

[Sergeant Hartman]

Mate i am not baiting. Just stating my opinion.

I haven't yet heard a reason that justifies it for a wants basis.

To get a cat D in Vic, you need to get insurance worth 5k or so and some paid contracts to show reason, if you do regular culling for some farmers they might be happy to pay for a couple hundred a year (maybe be creative abbot it)... other states its probably similaras well. Also if you are a primary producer there is a justifiable reason there. So it's hard but not impossible to get it if you really want to.

Obviously for most 5k is quite a lot of money. But really thinking about it, its about 100 bucks a week, most people who smoke spend more than that on smokes a week. And what's the point of getting a gun that you are too broke to shoot.

For almost all others, its just a want, to look cool... they might shoot it a few times as a novelty, but that will wear offoffer soon. Also the cost, that in 30sec of fun you spent $40 bucks worth of ammo. For someone who cannot afford 100 bucks a month on insurance won't be able to afford 100 bucks on ammo every time they wanna burrrrt

[marksman]

"'Youre just a fudd...!!...with no idea what you're on about."

So, its this type of statement that causes arguments on forums.
I assume a fudd is same as anti?

He is simply expressing an alternate view to you.

Believe it or not, some firearm enshusiast dont want Australia to be like US. That means some checks and balances. And everyone here is entitled to a view without childish name calling.

PS. Ill just add. I know some people have left the forum over the last yr or so. . And that is the reason.

FUDD ("Slang term for a very "casual" gun owner" Elmer Fudd) ssssshhhhhhhhhhhhhh its wabbit season

Oldbloke just to put my hand up for Stix because he is right in everything he said so not having a go at you but having a say
ziads carry on is seen by a heap of different people who may not see that ziad knows nothing about what he is saying in fact he is giving uninformed uneducated comments that others may take as truth, it does make ziad look like a FUDD
ziads little game is to bait people and l totally agree with Stix that he posts to provoke and cause sh!t

l do see you implying that Stix had anything to do with anyone leaving the forum as very sad in fact if you are talking about the guys who jumped ship and started their own forum, we did hear the rumors about what we (l mean the ones who didn't know about it) were called, l think it was bigots wasn't it
maybe you could introduce ziad over there and get him in the click

anyway some people dont suffer fools as well as others, sorry but guilty your honor

and l really think that if you think we would be turning Australia into America by allowing self loaders you do need some education

[TassieTiger]

I haven't yet heard a reason that justifies it for a wants basis.

As per previous x ? How many posts are you not going to acknowledge. A semi auto 223, can be more humane by allowing a faster follow up shot to a wounded animal - by allowing a shooter to retain his sights on the animal. The same can be said for clearing out a rabbit warren and almost any congregation where quick successive shots are needed. In your example of reply, You chose a 308 to try and emphasise your point...thus reinforcing what others have said re trolling.

From another angle - why does anyone need a lever action ? Why does anyone need a .3 caliber in this country? Etc etc etc etc...

[Oldbloke]

Mm. Just say i ng in general terms we need to have a bit of decorum. Not naming stix in particular.

I did not intend to target stix.

Secondly. I dont have any real issues with semis. I understand some would like them. I just think it shouldnt be open slather.

And whats wrong with being an ocassional shooter?

Sitting over a warren now. Lol some shooters are keen, others very keen. Takes all kinds.

[Farmerpete]

Sergeant Hartman you seemed to have missed my entire post on the last page detailing my experience on a farm shooting pigs. So I'll explain again

a semi auto centrefire is a very useful tool for a farmer to own. My dad had one it was good

Speaking as a farmer We try to spend as little time as possible chasing pigs etc out of our crops. None of us shoot for fun or excitement or even food. We shoot to get rid of a pest.

If I track down a sounder of pigs I want them all dead not just the lead boar. This is not possible with a bolt/lever/pump gun.

The reason I didn't go for a d cat license is the hoops needed to jump through to gain one were excessive. I would have needed to prove I tried poisoning the pigs...something I won't do (if you've ever heard an animal dieing of 1080 which I doubt you have you'd understand why)
sometimes I get lucky and can stalk close enough for the shotgun to net me 4 or 5
most times I get 1 and the pack just moves to the neighbors place until he shoots 1 and they move back

To make this clear MY GENUINE NEED IS ERRADICATION.

Since 96 there has been an explosion in feral pig numbers they have been linked to the destruction and drastic changes to the wet tropics native flora MAYBE that's enough of a reason for you to pull your city dwelling greenie head out and see what farmers have been seeing for years maybe not

[womble]

How does the genuine need differ from the paid contractor, to the volunteer giving up his own time and money to provide exactly the same service and meet exactly the same demand.
The demand is very real and very widespread. Farmers are struggling. I could give you a long list of areas overrun with invasive species.
It dose’nt. The only difference is that the contractor can provide a more efficient and timely service because he has the right tools for the job.

The only argument i can see to oppose this reasoning is that for some reason a volunteer is considered a person of lesser character and therefore a greater likelihood that he or she will travel to port Arthur and shoot up a cafeteria. ?

Please give me a better reason, a solid genuine reason ?

[womble]

Laws must be based in reason and not just the will of the legislator.
Our firearms laws are based on emotions. We have appearance laws ffs.
The laws should be for the common good. They should not merely benefit the interests of the lawmakers
or in our case a lobby group