ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by pajamatime » 30 Jun 2015, 3:10 pm

Jonesy wrote:
KWhorenet wrote:
Jonesy wrote:Playing Devils Advocate......
Do you think having lever action Shotguns and guns like the Ruger Charger draw the attention of politicians and anti gun people?
I think it does, the few who want these style of Rifles and "Pistols" may do more damage to the majority of shooters in the long run.
Some members at my Club think the way some Ruger Chargers are modified to look like a .22 caliber AR15 does not help our cause with the mainstream.

Do we need lever action shotguns or will this sort of thing tighten the noose and take away some of the things we now have?

Just a thought.



I just don't get what looks have to do with anything? Not having a go at you. The whole idea about guns looking dangerous. If a gun is in the street it is dangerous most likely.

If it is out hunting, or at the range, or at home...what the fcuk does it matter.

Dude walking down the street toting a baseball bat, double barrel shotty, single barrel bolt gun,
big black betty boop gun.

What's the damned difference.

A d**khead is a d**khead.[/

Why do you "need" a lever action shotgun?
I love this sport but I have met more than my fair share of D***heads and Rambos and nut jobs at my Club and often at my local gunshop.
This sport/hobby can be a d***head magnet it seems.

People that want to modify Auto Pistols to resemble and shoot like Auto Rifles are stretching the boundaries in my opinion.
That's great, its all legal until the authorities decide it is not and then all of the people that have no interest in Ruger Charger semi auto rifles and lever action shotguns get to lose what they have and maybe that will be a semi auto cat H license.

You can not see how people having "Pistols" like this may draw unwanted attention to our sport?

http://cdn2.armslist.com/sites/armslist/uploads/posts/2012/01/29/289587_01__22_ruger_charger_640.jpg

Pushing the boundaries all the time will see a crack down on everything in my opinion.


That last part you quoted. I appreciate your 2 cents I really do.
But I think it has grown more obvious by now that the disarmament agenda is just that...a complete disarmament of civilian population regardless of the reason. People can try and slow it down by hiding in the shadows out of fear for a tyrannical government but at the end of the day they want it all and we are more effective on the front line then we are pretending it's not occurring or never going to. :) :D
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by pajamatime » 30 Jun 2015, 5:32 pm

ADLER AND LEVER-ACTION FIREARMS - A SPECIAL ANNOUNCEMENT BY THE NATIONAL PRESIDENT

http://ssaa.org.au/members/member-annou ... n-firearms
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by Spooner » 01 Jul 2015, 2:09 pm

Did it.
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by rsj223 » 01 Jul 2015, 4:12 pm

Email back from my local Poly
Thank you for your email regarding the classification of firearms. I appreciate the time you have taken to contact me.

High-capacity firearms, such as the Adler A110 shotgun, are already under active consideration by the national Firearms Policy Working Group, which is looking at the classification of firearms more generally under the National Firearms Agreement.
This working group is making recommendations to state, territory and federal police ministers on the classification of firearms as part the commonwealth review into the Martin Place siege.
Victoria Police have raised concerns that this weapon – and others like it – are no longer appropriate for a category A classification. The classification of firearms and other technical-related elements under the 1996 National Firearms Agreement, including firearms such as the Adler, will be included in these discussions.

The FWPWG will make recommendations to Police and Justice Ministers from all jurisdictions for their consideration in late 2015.

The Government will consult with stakeholders and carefully consider any recommendations that arise from FWPWG discussions, particularly concerning any changes to firearm laws and their implementation.

Thank you again for your email.

Yours sincerely
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by Newdave » 01 Jul 2015, 8:56 pm

These people are on another planet. The Martin place siege scum bag did not have a firearms license. The shotgun wasn't registered and they can't even trace when it came into the country.

So from that they get lets go after legal registered lever actions. Why would a terrorist even bother with a bloody Adler when there is already semi and pump action shotguns on the black market. Fact based policy when it comes to firearms is as rare as unicorns.
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by DML » 01 Jul 2015, 9:10 pm

rsj223 wrote:Email back from my local Poly...
...
Victoria Police have raised concerns that this weapon – and others like it – are no longer appropriate for a category A classification. The classification of firearms and other technical-related elements under the 1996 National Firearms Agreement, including firearms such as the Adler, will be included in these discussions.
...


Translated...
Victoria Police have raised concerns that this weapon - and other lever actions - are no longer appropriate for a Category A classification. The number of these types of weapons that are getting into criminal hands (0) is simply too high to ignore. We need to get them in to the same category as the pump action shotgun that the unlicensed Martin Place Siege gunman had possession of and was using for criminal purposes.

Another thing we're going to look at is putting yet another general ban on crime. You might not know this because you're just a voter, but us politicians have already implemented legislation that bans crime on more than 50 occasions. Unfortunately, these bans keep getting ignored by criminals, so we're going to keep doing the same thing and hoping for a different result.
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by Title_II » 02 Jul 2015, 4:31 am

Victoria Police have raised concerns that this weapon – and others like it – are no longer appropriate for a category A classification. The classification of firearms and other technical-related elements under the 1996 National Firearms Agreement, including firearms such as the Adler, will be included in these discussions.


I love it when they say stuff like this. I don't know about police in Australia, but apparently all police in the US support stricter gun control and you'll get the police chiefs on TV to say so.

Except for one thing. THEY DON'T. Police chiefs and union reps are politicians. In the largest survey ever of verified, sworn police in the States (~15,000) every single question was met with at least support for civilian gun ownership and carry, usually increased ownership and carry and less gun control, and none of the questions met with calls for greater gun control.

Here are the results:

http://police-praetorian.netdna-ssl.com ... y_2013.pdf

And here is some discussion:

http://www.policeone.com/police-product ... e-Summary/

It seems police never think what politicians and the media get them to say they think, at least in the States.
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by David Brown » 02 Jul 2015, 8:00 am

I think everyone should print this and send it to their state and federal members, senators and in particular their minister for police.

That is damning evidence and a far stronger case than I expected.
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by wayward » 02 Jul 2015, 10:17 am

Newdave wrote:Fact based policy when it comes to firearms is as rare as unicorns.


:thumbsdown: :| :cry:
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by pajamatime » 02 Jul 2015, 4:31 pm

Was not sure if this needs its own topic or not but here is the Qld petition I think

https://www.change.org/p/queensland-gov ... m=copylink
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by brisb » 03 Jul 2015, 3:56 pm

Done done.
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by chacka » 06 Jul 2015, 10:26 am

1,029 more to go.
More Than Just The Gun
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by 1290 » 10 Jul 2015, 8:10 pm

Over 10,000 petitioners..... lets see how Vic Parliament responds with this once presented, assuming the author will present to their member. Probably along the lines of... 'noting the petition'
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by beerd » 16 Jul 2015, 9:27 am

Probably more like noting it's in an email somewhere that no one read or brought with them :problem:
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by Jonesy » 17 Jul 2015, 10:21 pm

edited
Last edited by Jonesy on 18 Jul 2015, 8:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by sandgroperbill » 18 Jul 2015, 1:21 am

I can give you a reason why I need a lever action shotgun.

In the areas that I hunt i regularly carry a smaller caliber rifle (rimfire or .223).

Recently there seem to be more feral dogs, cats and pigs moving into the area. So i want a 12g to carry across my back in case i happen to come across a charging pig or aggressive dog while i have a rimfire.

So, i could carry a double barrel across my back with two rounds chambered (no thanks), or i could carry it empty, and have to hope i have enough time to load it and get the shot off.

OR i could carry a lever action with nothing in the chamber. A quick cycle of the lever and its ready to fire.

I have my name down for an adler for these reasons.

Is that a sufficient example?
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by sandgroperbill » 18 Jul 2015, 1:26 am

Simply because you have no current use for something does not mean that nobody else can justify it, and to think that is quite niaive and short sighted.

My firearms are tools, not weapons.
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by KWhorenet » 18 Jul 2015, 1:40 am

" I can not see why a Ruger Charger gets approved by the licencing Police in any category, "

A Cat H just like any other semi auto 22lr hand gun. What are you concerned about?

Robust debate is not a fight.

As for 'wanting borderline firearms', Mr NIOA the importer advertised a new version of an old design being the lever action gun. I would use it for what a 12g is designed for. Since it currently is legal and falls within my licence category, has the option of 20" and 28" barrel sets, looks good, will cover all my current and future shotgun needs and is priced right therefore I would like one. Why shouldn't I?

I don't see how something (lever action shotgun) that has been available and used for longer than you and I have been alive combined is me pushing the boundaries at all.

*EDIT: Just went back and read the replies you are refusing to reply to...I now see why you wont reply. People don't agree with your opinion and seem to have corrected you on the Ruger Charger thing. I guess discussing something vs making a one eyed statement without common logic or reasoning isn't your thing.

Please reply. I've thrown a couple of little jabs in there hoping to burr you up enough to want to back up your judgments instead of spouting and walking off. I would like to hear your reasoning for your 'anti' stance.
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by sandgroperbill » 19 Jul 2015, 1:28 pm

Or...

You could just go back and delete your post
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by Sam45 » 19 Jul 2015, 2:12 pm

sandgroperbill wrote:Or...

You could just go back and delete your post



:clap: :thumbsdown: I certainly signed it. Not into Shotties, but hey, if they want to try on that kind of garbage to my fellow shooters I'm all aboard :thumbsup:
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by sandgroperbill » 19 Jul 2015, 2:22 pm

Thanks, Sam.

My last post was in reference to jonesy who challenged us to give a single example as to how anyone could justify the adler, as well as stating the ruger charger and the adler shotgun were both testing our laws and that the charger could not fall into any existing category and therefore should not be approved.

When his stance was challenged and shown to be flawed, he simply went back and deleted his post.

Poor form.
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by Sam45 » 19 Jul 2015, 2:26 pm

sandgroperbill wrote:Thanks, Sam.

My last post was in reference to jonesy who challenged us to give a single example as to how anyone could justify the adler, as well as stating the ruger charger and the adler shotgun were both testing our laws and that the charger could not fall into any existing category and therefore should not be approved.

When his stance was challenged and shown to be flawed, he simply went back and deleted his post.

Poor form.


Welcome mate,

Yes i read his post and found it strange seeing he is on a forum with fellow shooters and then had a little rant and then deleted it... Not sure what he was trying to achieve.
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by sandgroperbill » 19 Jul 2015, 2:30 pm

On a bit of a side note, the most lethal firearm i have ever seen is a .22lr in the hands of farmers that only own .22s and shotguns. They know their rifles so well that they can successfully take shots you wouldn't imagine, and they only need the one shot.

These aren't weapons, though, they're simply tools of the trade.

It really annoys me that there is so much focus and wasted resources on more and more restrictions on legal firearms.

If only they would use these resources more constructively to reduce the black market imports, well then they may see real progress in reducing gun related crime.
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by Harts » 20 Jul 2015, 10:31 am

sandgroperbill wrote:These aren't weapons, though, they're simply tools of the trade.

It really annoys me that there is so much focus and wasted resources on more and more restrictions on legal firearms.


+1 for both comments.
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by 1290 » 20 Jul 2015, 1:33 pm

sandgroperbill wrote:On a bit of a side note, the most lethal firearm i have ever seen is a .22lr in the hands of farmers that only own .22s and shotguns. They know their rifles so well that they can successfully take shots you wouldn't imagine, and they only need the one shot.

These aren't weapons, though, they're simply tools of the trade.

It really annoys me that there is so much focus and wasted resources on more and more restrictions on legal firearms.

If only they would use these resources more constructively to reduce the black market imports, well then they may see real progress in reducing gun related crime.


Havent been out much hey SGB :lol:

I get the point.....and weapons..... anytime they refer to firearms possessed by the law-abiding, they use of the 'w' term is to denigrate us, because by definition a weapon is an object, ANY object, absolutely anything either inanimate or indeed animate, either intended to be used, or used, to injure another person. Yes, it can be a firearm, it can also be a baseball bat - but baseball bats are not generally referred to as a weapon....

INTENDED TO BE USED
or
USED
to injure a person (the person could even be themselves)

& I did say animate; if you pick up a dog and throw it at someone with the intention of injuring that person, then the dog became, as soon as you decided to pick it up - A WEAPON. Even the tards themselves could be classified a weapon, maybe a tard-a-pult :unknown: :thumbsup:

of course when these mofos refer to lawfully possessed firearms as 'weapons', what they are really saying is that the owner can not possibly be trusted with them, and may at anytime go postal...,
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by Jonesy » 07 Aug 2015, 5:56 pm

Quick reply to all the posts after mine rather than break down the various responses.
I deleted my post and did not reply because I realised I was on a Forum that was not in sync with my views and opinions on Firearms or
my view of the Sport in general.
Delete my account please, this forum is for the fringe members of our Sport and I do not want to be in that category.
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by valkyrie » 07 Aug 2015, 6:48 pm

Fringe members? Im sorry but everyone i have met on this forums seems very measured in their views
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by Jonesy » 07 Aug 2015, 9:48 pm

valkyrie wrote:Fringe members? Im sorry but everyone i have met on this forums seems very measured in their views


That is your opinion and you are welcome to it.
Many members of the same view agree with each other maybe?

Anyway done here.
It is a forum for persons of a certain persuasion and I am not part of that..
Enjoy yourselves guys.
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by Title_II » 07 Aug 2015, 10:22 pm

If you guys are the fringe then I must be Osama bin Laden :D

Where did I leave my fatwa...
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Re: ADLER petition - EVERYONE SIGN THIS

Post by pajamatime » 07 Aug 2015, 11:05 pm

Jonesy wrote:
valkyrie wrote:Fringe members? Im sorry but everyone i have met on this forums seems very measured in their views


That is your opinion and you are welcome to it.
Many members of the same view agree with each other maybe?

Anyway done here.
It is a forum for persons of a certain persuasion and I am not part of that..
Enjoy yourselves guys.


i enjoy me self in the shower...oh wait nvm
going out for a hunt... :silent:
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