Tougher Laws in W.A?

News and events in the media and political arena relating to firearms.

Tougher Laws in W.A?

Post by Gamerancher » 24 Mar 2017, 11:12 am

So I'm watching late night television last night and a news bulletin shows a story with the W.A. police commissioner calling for tougher gun laws for all due to a very organised break-in at a gun shop where about 130 handguns were stolen. WTF!!! :unknown:
You blokes in W.A know anything about this?
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Re: Tougher Laws in W.A?

Post by Daddybang » 24 Mar 2017, 11:32 am

Yeah saw this on the news this morning. Doesn't just want tighter storage regs also wants to limit the number of firearms owned on a license. Trying to post a link but not sure how to on my phone. ...grab ya ankles and brace ya selves WA lafos :twisted:
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Post by BluEsky » 24 Mar 2017, 11:43 am

Gamerancher wrote:So I'm watching late night television last night and a news bulletin shows a story with the W.A. police commissioner calling for tougher gun laws for all due to a very organised break-in at a gun shop where about 130 handguns were stolen. WTF!!! :unknown:
You blokes in W.A know anything about this?


:? So he wants to Punish and Penalize the citizens who did Not commit the Crime? :wtf: :crazy:

:D
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Re: Tougher Laws in W.A?

Post by Gamerancher » 24 Mar 2017, 11:52 am

Looked like an inside job to me. Knew where and what the security measures were, knew exactly where to cut into the strong room, just sayin'.
Message to W.A police, how about doing your f*cking job instead of blaming and punishing people who had nothing to do with it!!!
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Post by Gun-nut » 24 Mar 2017, 1:45 pm

Everyone should be flooding this fool with letters and emails, even if he doesn't read it he should have his inbox full to the brink.
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Post by knowsnothin » 24 Mar 2017, 2:44 pm

the commish says

Mr O'Callaghan said the case showed the regulation of firearm shops needed to be strengthened.
"The gun shop is completely compliant and they haven't done anything wrong, but I guess the concern for me is that whether that level of compliance is sufficient," he said.
"We know the offenders got through some corrugated metal on the outside of the building and then cut through the brickwork straight into the room where the guns were."

His beef is with gun shops. If what he describes is accurate it seems a little lite-on for safe storage of hundreds of handguns.

i have to have mine in steel.
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Post by Daddybang » 24 Mar 2017, 3:15 pm

knowsnothin wrote:the commish says

Mr O'Callaghan said the case showed the regulation of firearm shops needed to be strengthened.
"The gun shop is completely compliant and they haven't done anything wrong, but I guess the concern for me is that whether that level of compliance is sufficient," he said.
"We know the offenders got through some corrugated metal on the outside of the building and then cut through the brickwork straight into the room where the guns were."

His beef is with gun shops. If what he describes is accurate it seems a little lite-on for safe storage of hundreds of handguns.

i have to have mine in steel.


He also goes on to say that the private storage needs to be strengthened and the amount of firearms on private licenses needs to be looked at. . If anyone can link the full article it would be great. ..I'm computer dyslexic. .. :thumbsup:
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Post by knowsnothin » 24 Mar 2017, 3:56 pm

true . he also added

"There needs to be threshold on the number of firearms a single person can have on their firearm's licence," he said.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-03-23/p ... news_perth
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Post by bigfellascott » 24 Mar 2017, 9:37 pm

knowsnothin wrote:the commish says

Mr O'Callaghan said the case showed the regulation of firearm shops needed to be strengthened.
"The gun shop is completely compliant and they haven't done anything wrong, but I guess the concern for me is that whether that level of compliance is sufficient," he said.
"We know the offenders got through some corrugated metal on the outside of the building and then cut through the brickwork straight into the room where the guns were."

His beef is with gun shops. If what he describes is accurate it seems a little lite-on for safe storage of hundreds of handguns.

i have to have mine in steel.


Do you really believe that just because yours are locked up in a steel safe they are some how better protected from Crims? Those pricks only have to hold a gun or knife to ya and it's there's and I'm sure it wouldn't take much for a battery operated angle grinder to cut through the side of one.

If the crims want em they will get em.
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Post by Title_II » 25 Mar 2017, 1:51 am

When exactly did a handgun become a cursed relic that must be kept in Fort Knox, and when did theft of 100 handguns become worse than theft of 100 cars?

People have been brainwashed. Forget the laws, the problem here is the mindset.
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Post by SomeoneElse » 25 Mar 2017, 7:59 am

Mr O'Callaghan didn't seem to have much to say about
- break and enter
- destruction of property
- theft
- illegal possession of handguns
You know... all the illegal aspects of this incident.

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Post by Ed9362 » 25 Mar 2017, 8:16 am

Title_II wrote:When exactly did a handgun become a cursed relic that must be kept in Fort Knox, and when did theft of 100 handguns become worse than theft of 100 cars?

People have been brainwashed. Forget the laws, the problem here is the mindset.



all that happens when they hit Australian shores
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Post by Cryptic » 25 Mar 2017, 11:21 pm

1st push will be for a more fortified security at gunshops and ranges then next push they will say oh the public storage is still limited so we better tell them to put them into the new fortified sites.
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Post by 1886 » 27 Mar 2017, 9:33 pm

In my opinion there is an issue that was not raised and certainly wouldn't be by the Commissioner.

He indicated the shop had an inspection visit around 2 years ago and was passed etc.

What wasn't told is the thief's apparently were able to enter the "safe" but by keeping low behind the shelves they were not able to be detected by the alarm system sensors and thus able to strip the shelves etc !!!!!!

HUH, so why was it passed. It could also be said why didn't someone in the shop realise this and place the sensors or add more appropriately.

Also raises the question did the thieves know this beforehand !!

Now because of this balls up all WA shops may get penalised in some later fashion and possibly even LFAO/s.
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Post by stuva » 14 Jul 2017, 11:54 pm

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Post by Oldbloke » 15 Jul 2017, 4:38 pm

WOW, Those requirements for dealers in hand guns must be close to what largeish banks use.
At a guess a lot of dealers will drop hand guns of the shelves.
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Post by bladeracer » 15 Jul 2017, 6:53 pm

stuva wrote:Here is the latest from WAPOL after this breakin https://www.police.wa.gov.au/Site/Links/Firearm-Dealers--Handgun-Security-FAQs



A certified compliant strongroom or a safe in a secure room, with a keypad and anti-tamper relocking mechanism, an alarm system, and CCTV. Seems like any business with $50k or more worth of firearms would probably already have such security wouldn't they?

Did the shop have this stuff in place when they were breached?

I remember seeing a statement from the shop owner explaining that it was orchestrated by an employee who had all sorts of problems that the Police should've been after him for before they ever licenced him to work in gunshops.
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Post by bladeracer » 15 Jul 2017, 6:54 pm

Oldbloke wrote:WOW, Those requirements for dealers in hand guns must be close to what largeish banks use.
At a guess a lot of dealers will drop hand guns of the shelves.



None of the three local dealers nearest me keep handguns.
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Post by Oldbloke » 15 Jul 2017, 7:19 pm

Oops, I miss read the last on safes. Strong room OR as safe.

Still a high standard.

No mention of increasing penalties for firearm thieves?
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Post by Jandamurra » 18 Jul 2017, 3:34 pm

Gamerancher wrote:So I'm watching late night television last night and a news bulletin shows a story with the W.A. police commissioner calling for tougher gun laws for all due to a very organised break-in at a gun shop where about 130 handguns were stolen. WTF!!! :unknown:
You blokes in W.A know anything about this?


This copper wants tougher laws, but not for all.
I can safely assume he didn't call for politicians to lose their right to conceal carry a handgun for self-defence.
One would think that in WA, the toughest part of Australia for gun laws, the politicians would show a bit of solidarity with the public and give up their own guns.
Whenever I see a politician, I wonder if they're "carrying".
Because if they are, that makes them the greatest hypocrites of all time.
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Post by bladeracer » 18 Jul 2017, 5:30 pm

Jandamurra wrote:I can safely assume he didn't call for politicians to lose their right to conceal carry a handgun for self-defence.


Do you have a link to this "right"?
Concealed carry is really only concealed from the general public, anybody that knows what to look for can usually pick out that somebody is carrying a handgun, especially when they're wearing a suit. Can you imagine the look of consternation Howard would have on his face if he knew he had a gun under his control :-)
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Post by Jandamurra » 27 Jul 2017, 3:18 pm

bladeracer wrote:
Jandamurra wrote:I can safely assume he didn't call for politicians to lose their right to conceal carry a handgun for self-defence.


Do you have a link to this "right"?
Concealed carry is really only concealed from the general public, anybody that knows what to look for can usually pick out that somebody is carrying a handgun, especially when they're wearing a suit. Can you imagine the look of consternation Howard would have on his face if he knew he had a gun under his control :-)


Wrong. I don't have a link.
I normally am pretty good with providing links. I decided not to do so here because do you honestly think the copper in question would have mentioned how politicians are allowed to "carry"?.
You wrote
Concealed carry is really only concealed from the general public .
Perhaps, but this is beside the point. I was talking only about the way politicians are allowed to concealed carry, no more and no less. I wasn't advancing any argument about how effective it was, or whether professionals can detect it, or anything else: only that it's rank hypocrisy for them to do so while denying the public the same, and rank cowardice for this cop not to mention it.
Similarly with this
Can you imagine the look of consternation Howard would have on his face if he knew he had a gun under his control,
how many politicians choose to exercise the option is the important thing, not whether this or that politician avails themselves of it.
We need to start regularly writing to politicians and asking them if the concealed carry. If they do, they have absolutely no right to deny others the means for personal defence.
Remember, you and I literally aren't allowed to have hair spray if we say it's for personal protection, let along pepper spray, let alone guns.
Doesn't that make you feel special?
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Post by bladeracer » 27 Jul 2017, 4:03 pm

Jandamurra wrote:Wrong. I don't have a link.
I normally am pretty good with providing links. I decided not to do so here because do you honestly think the copper in question would have mentioned how politicians are allowed to "carry"?


Do you have any evidence at all then that "politicians are allowed concealed carry"?
I have known only three Aussie civilians licenced for concealed carry, all many years ago, all in WA.
One was/is a high-profile jeweler/pawnbroker who struts around wearing hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of gold jewelry. His carry guns were a beautiful pair of 4006's when I knew him, but he had an extensive collection.
One was a licenced private investigator who did a lot of work for diamond merchants as a courier. His carry piece was an ancient P08 Luger.
The last was an old nutter that simply got licenced many decades earlier and just maintained it for no reason I could ascertain. I never handled his carry piece but it appeared to be some sort of Saturday Night Special revolver of ancient origin.
It's quite possible that I've known others that were licenced but never made it known to me.

Schedule 3 of the Act in Victoria does not list politicians as being exempt from requiring a licence to possess a handgun. Even Police, military and the Director of the Office of Police Integrity can only carry while on official duty.

Schedule 2 of the Act in ACT adds nothing about politicians.

Regulation 113 of the Regulations in NSW allows Police officers to be in "possession" of their service firearm while they are off duty. It does not allow them to carry it concealed though.
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Post by Jandamurra » 05 Aug 2017, 11:01 am

I don't see how citing legislation refutes anything I say because exceptions can and will be made if authorities wish to do so.

I was under the impression that permission to carry can be obtained from the police by certain persons such as politicians-not the general public of course.

Legislation, which you were I must admit quite specific in citing, doesn't necessarily come into it.

IMHO it would be a great idea if people starting asking politicians about this. Even if a direct answer cannot be obtained, the way they react would be instructive.
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Post by bladeracer » 05 Aug 2017, 5:17 pm

I think your "impression" is unfounded in fact and you should probably stop perpetuating this myth.

If you ask them about their right to carry they will ask you what on earth you are talking about.

If you ask them if they carry they will answer no, it's illegal.
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Post by Daddybang » 05 Aug 2017, 10:37 pm

bladeracer wrote:I think your "impression" is unfounded in fact and you should probably stop perpetuating this myth.
If you ask them about their right to carry they will ask you what on earth you are talking about.
If you ask them if they carry they will answer no, it's illegal.


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Post by 1886 » 05 Aug 2017, 10:41 pm

Exactly and not too mention it would serve no purpose as most politicians couldn't hit a cow up the arse with a handful of wheat.
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Post by Jandamurra » 08 Aug 2017, 2:51 pm

@bladeracer, Daddybang and 1886

I'm not perpetuating a myth, only attempting to establish the facts.
Merely citing legislation does not always indicate what is actually allowed. Bladeracer has therefore not answered the question of whether politicians are allowed to carry merely by indicating it isn't expressly permitted in statutes.
In my last comment, I made it clear I thought it was a good idea if people asked politicians whether they had some sort of exemption to carry.
Ask, got that? Not accuse, but ask. See the difference?
But yes, I definitely have the "impression" they do have an exemption. This impression has not been formed without reason-
-I have read or taken part in several debates about this topic, and no-one until now has expressly said that it is only a myth. The issue has been sidestepped, joked about or ignored, but no one has ever come out and denied it until now. Why not?
-Other countries do have special legislation for politicians, such as Germany.
-Politicians are capable of being total hypocrites on this matter for example this woman:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O_8fkyJC6mw
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Post by 1886 » 09 Aug 2017, 12:53 pm

What has any of this got to do with this post which is "Tougher laws in WA" which relates to increased safe and security measures required by dealers who deal in handguns.

Nothing to do with conceal or carry or politicians but I can assure you there are no such provisions or exemptions in WA's laws.
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Post by Gwion » 09 Aug 2017, 1:39 pm

1886 wrote:What has any of this got to do with this post which is "Tougher laws in WA" which relates to increased safe and security measures required by dealers who deal in handguns.

Nothing to do with conceal or carry or politicians but I can assure you there are no such provisions or exemptions in WA's laws.


Because some members link everything back to some sort of orchestrated conspiracy and have major shares in the tin foil industry. It must be contagious because I sometimes wonder if theses members turn up purely to stir the pot and make Aussie firearms owners look like a bunch of raving loons... :unknown:
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