Winchester Powder

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Winchester Powder

Post by rustypic » 05 Mar 2017, 11:47 am

Hi People,
I am brand new to this site and would like to pick your brains. I have some Win 748 powder and need to load some .308 shells using Hornady 168grain and Sierra 165grain projectiles, I also have Win 760 to load some .243 shells (suggestions for projectiles welcome), any loads you can give me to dabble with for these will be much appreciated. I am not a newbie to reloading and have been shooting and reloading for 40 years I just need some fresh advice.

I have searched this site but can't seem to find anything (am wondering if it is owned or sponsored by ADI :lol: )

Cheers, Russ
I wondered why the ball was getting bigger. Then it hit me.

22 Win LA
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243 Win 70 Featherweight
308 Savage 10/110 Trophy Hunter
Couple of Shotties but miss my 5 shot semi auto :(
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by No1Mk3 » 05 Mar 2017, 6:00 pm

G'day Russ,
Due to the inconsistent availability of Win powders in many areas, ADI is certainly the most commonly used, and therefore discussed, powder range. I wish it were sponsored by ADI we might crack it for a discount! But to your question, from an old score book of mine, 308 with 168g, starting loads of 748 from 40.5 to a max of 46.5 in an Omark at 2750 fps. As for the .243, well what can I say? Rifle twist, barrel length, intended use? But as an idea, from a 1975 Winchester list for .243, using 760 powder, 75g proj 43.0, 85g proj 40.5 MAX. Nick Harvey lists 46.5 for the 75g and 44 for the 85g, and 40.0 for the 95/100 g as MAXIMUM,Cheers.
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by Apollo » 05 Mar 2017, 9:51 pm

If you want reloading information on Winchester Powders then go to the company that does the testing. http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/

Remember that Winchester Powders are "Double Base" and will give different results between hot and cold conditions.

I have no experience reloading for a .308W but with a .243W I did a fair amount of trials with Winchester Powder, heavier bullets like 100gr performed better with Winchester Powder during mild conditions but I switched to ADI Powders (AR2209 & AR2208) for a few certain bullets weights with by far more consistant results.

BTW. Hodgdon does all the load testing for ADI and it is their results that are published in the ADI Reloading Data.
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by rustypic » 06 Mar 2017, 1:15 pm

Thanks guys, I have the Hodgdon site bookmarked and have got the Harvey reloading book 9th edition, just thought I would get some other ideas, I actually just threw in the 243 as an after thought but it is a Win Model 70 XTR Featherweight (1980's) 20" barrel, 1 in 10 twist. I have Speer 85g BT Spitzer, Nosler 75g BT Spitzer, Hornady 70g Spire Point and Hornady 80g FMJ to hunt with mainly.
The 308 is a Savage Model 10 Trophy Hunter, 22" barrel, 1 in 10 twist. Pretty damn accurate straight out of the box, shoots federal 150g factory ammo .75" at 100yds with my old eyes :)
That's interesting about the load testing, if you want to know about Win powders you go to Hodgdon's website yet Winchester bring Hodgdon's powders into Aus and leave out some good ones, go figure !!
Cheers
I wondered why the ball was getting bigger. Then it hit me.

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22 Brno Fox K-Hornet
243 Win 70 Featherweight
308 Savage 10/110 Trophy Hunter
Couple of Shotties but miss my 5 shot semi auto :(
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by bladeracer » 06 Mar 2017, 2:29 pm

rustypic wrote:That's interesting about the load testing, if you want to know about Win powders you go to Hodgdon's website yet Winchester bring Hodgdon's powders into Aus and leave out some good ones, go figure !!
Cheers



Many Hodgden powders are made by ADI right here in Oz and exported to the US.
http://revivaler.com/hodgdon-powder-adi-australian-connection/
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by rustypic » 06 Mar 2017, 4:41 pm

WOW 'bladeracer', that explains it all. It seems I should have done more research on ADI.
I wondered why the ball was getting bigger. Then it hit me.

22 Win LA
22 Brno Fox K-Hornet
243 Win 70 Featherweight
308 Savage 10/110 Trophy Hunter
Couple of Shotties but miss my 5 shot semi auto :(
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by Apollo » 06 Mar 2017, 5:20 pm

You'll be even more amazed when you discover that ADI (Australian Defence Industries & Australian Munitions) are actually owned by a French Company, Thales.

Not to mention Lithgow Arms....
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by Tils » 06 Mar 2017, 8:45 pm

Apollo wrote:You'll be even more amazed when you discover that ADI (Australian Defence Industries & Australian Munitions) are actually owned by a French Company, Thales.

Not to mention Lithgow Arms....


They are indeed, but it is still made here in Australia.
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by duncan61 » 07 Mar 2017, 1:19 am

ADI powders seem to have everything covered for all my reloading needs
.22 winchester .22hornet .222 .243 7mm rem mag cbc 12g
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by Mitch » 07 Mar 2017, 5:05 am

Ive never used it myself, but those i know who have have always had great results with winchester powder
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by Oldbloke » 07 Mar 2017, 6:21 am

Apollo wrote:You'll be even more amazed when you discover that ADI (Australian Defence Industries & Australian Munitions) are actually owned by a French Company, Thales.

Not to mention Lithgow Arms....



True. But aussie brains and know how.
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by bladeracer » 07 Mar 2017, 7:58 am

Mitch wrote:Ive never used it myself, but those i know who have have always had great results with winchester powder



I wanted to try a Winchester ball powder in the .204 just because grain powder doesn't like to go through the narrow necks.
Buggered if I could get any though so I gave up on the idea.
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by rustypic » 07 Mar 2017, 10:24 am

Strange 'bladeracer' I have always used Winchester powders and have never had any trouble getting it, 296 & 680 for my K-Hornet 760 for the 243 and just purchased a tin of 748 for the 308 last week in Ballarat. Forgive my ignorance, but don't gun shops have to get their gunpowder through Winchester Australia ?
I wondered why the ball was getting bigger. Then it hit me.

22 Win LA
22 Brno Fox K-Hornet
243 Win 70 Featherweight
308 Savage 10/110 Trophy Hunter
Couple of Shotties but miss my 5 shot semi auto :(
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by bladeracer » 07 Mar 2017, 10:53 am

rustypic wrote:Strange 'bladeracer' I have always used Winchester powders and have never had any trouble getting it, 296 & 680 for my K-Hornet 760 for the 243 and just purchased a tin of 748 for the 308 last week in Ballarat. Forgive my ignorance, but don't gun shops have to get their gunpowder through Winchester Australia ?



I guess gunshops stock what their local customers are buying.
I would expect dealers would be getting Winchester powders directly from Winchester.
But ADI powders seem to be readily available where I've asked for it, except for one place.
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by Gamerancher » 07 Mar 2017, 10:58 am

Don't know about in Vic, but in NSW, ADI powders are now coming through NIOA.
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by RoginaJack » 07 Mar 2017, 3:37 pm

Actually, I've just read the adv. in the March Australian Shooter where Winchester has announced the We're Back and We're here to stay for Winchester and Hodgson Powders and available at your nearest Winchester Dealer.

There you go! :D
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by rustypic » 07 Mar 2017, 4:43 pm

Now we have that sorted has anyone got some loads for me ??
I wondered why the ball was getting bigger. Then it hit me.

22 Win LA
22 Brno Fox K-Hornet
243 Win 70 Featherweight
308 Savage 10/110 Trophy Hunter
Couple of Shotties but miss my 5 shot semi auto :(
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by rustypic » 08 Jun 2017, 11:42 am

Hi guys,
Just thought I would show you (brag) one of my results after going through the old trial and error method with my Win 748 powder. :D




2017_06_03_22_39_02_OneShot.jpg
2017_06_03_22_39_02_OneShot.jpg (448.07 KiB) Viewed 6672 times
I wondered why the ball was getting bigger. Then it hit me.

22 Win LA
22 Brno Fox K-Hornet
243 Win 70 Featherweight
308 Savage 10/110 Trophy Hunter
Couple of Shotties but miss my 5 shot semi auto :(
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by Cooper » 04 Jan 2019, 8:19 am

RoginaJack wrote:Actually, I've just read the adv. in the March Australian Shooter where Winchester has announced the We're Back and We're here to stay for Winchester and Hodgson Powders and available at your nearest Winchester Dealer.

There you go! :D


I struggled to find Winchester powder in stock. Ended buying some Win 748 from a country gun shop and also got some Hodgdon CFE223 to try. It would want to do something magical. Much easier to find ADI powders. Just wanted to try something different.
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by JimTom » 04 Jan 2019, 8:29 am

I have used a bit of 748 for my .308 with average results. Think I will stick with ADI.
Let us know how you go mate.
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by Cooper » 04 Jan 2019, 9:10 am

JimTom wrote:I have used a bit of 748 for my .308 with average results. Think I will stick with ADI.
Let us know how you go mate.


Will do. Going to try the Win 748 in the 223 and 204.
Will test the CFE223 in 223 and 6.5 Grendel.

The CFE 223 was $79 per pound (454 grams) and win 748 was $59 per pound (454 grams) so pretty sure I’ll be sticking to ADI also!
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by JimTom » 04 Jan 2019, 9:58 am

Cooper wrote:
JimTom wrote:I have used a bit of 748 for my .308 with average results. Think I will stick with ADI.
Let us know how you go mate.


Will do. Going to try the Win 748 in the 223 and 204.
Will test the CFE223 in 223 and 6.5 Grendel.

The CFE 223 was $79 per pound (454 grams) and win 748 was $59 per pound (454 grams) so pretty sure I’ll be sticking to ADI also!


Yep ADI a bit cheaper. Another reason to go with Aussie brand.
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by Oldbloke » 04 Jan 2019, 2:29 pm

"Yep ADI a bit cheaper. Another reason to go with Aussie brand."

Which I'm sorry to say is owned by the French company Thales.
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by JimTom » 04 Jan 2019, 2:47 pm

Oldbloke wrote:"Yep ADI a bit cheaper. Another reason to go with Aussie brand."

Which I'm sorry to say is owned by the French company Thales.


Unfortunately that is correct mate, I was aware, nevertheless, it is made here, so at least it may help provide some Aussies with jobs.
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by Oldbloke » 04 Jan 2019, 2:58 pm

JimTom wrote:
Oldbloke wrote:"Yep ADI a bit cheaper. Another reason to go with Aussie brand."

Which I'm sorry to say is owned by the French company Thales.


Unfortunately that is correct mate, I was aware, nevertheless, it is made here, so at least it may help provide some Aussies with jobs.



Correct. About 95% of the employees are locals.
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by TassieTiger » 04 Jan 2019, 3:15 pm

rustypic wrote:Hi guys,
Just thought I would show you (brag) one of my results after going through the old trial and error method with my Win 748 powder. :D

What happened? Did you call the flyer or just twitch on the trigger?


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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by JimTom » 04 Jan 2019, 3:22 pm

Oldbloke wrote:
JimTom wrote:
Oldbloke wrote:"Yep ADI a bit cheaper. Another reason to go with Aussie brand."

Which I'm sorry to say is owned by the French company Thales.


Unfortunately that is correct mate, I was aware, nevertheless, it is made here, so at least it may help provide some Aussies with jobs.



Correct. About 95% of the employees are locals.


Can only be a good thing for that town mate.
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by straightshooter » 05 Jan 2019, 6:24 am

rustypic wrote:Hi People,
I am brand new to this site and would like to pick your brains. I have some Win 748 powder and need to load some .308 shells using Hornady 168grain and Sierra 165grain projectiles, I also have Win 760 to load some .243 shells (suggestions for projectiles welcome), any loads you can give me to dabble with for these will be much appreciated. I am not a newbie to reloading and have been shooting and reloading for 40 years I just need some fresh advice.

I have searched this site but can't seem to find anything (am wondering if it is owned or sponsored by ADI :lol: )

Cheers, Russ


Try going on the the Hodgdon rifle reloading site. There is reasonable coverage of newer Winchester powders as well as IMR and Hodgdon relabelled ADI.
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by marksman » 05 Jan 2019, 10:38 am

what some are not aware of is that win 760 is H414/H4350 that is ADI 2209 :wtf: just rebranded, (source berger bullet reloading manual pg 109)
what other win powders are made by ADI that people are aware of :unknown:
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Re: Winchester Powder

Post by Rod_outbak » 05 Jan 2019, 9:26 pm

rustypic,

I have a Krcio M603 in .243, which was recently re-barrelled with a 1:10" twist hunting barrel(23.5"). The rifle is slightly lighter than a featherweight, but very similar in design/configuration, so similar to use. A mate has a featherweight from the mid 1980's in .243.

In my Krico, I've been using 87Gn V-Max Hornady projectiles. They have pretty good ballistics, fly well, and hit hard for most small-medium game. The fact that both Hornady and OSA load this same projectile in their factory .243 ammo lineup, probably means something...
I havent got my load data to hand for the 87 V-Max's, but I think it's at the top end of the recommended load range for AR2208.

I've used the 95 Nosler Ballistic Tips in front of 33.5Gns of AR2208, and absolutely no complaints, but the slightly lighter varmint-style projectile in the V-Max and the cheaper price, suited me...

These days, I dont get to shoot the Krico that much, but the 2 projectiles I bother to keep loading are the 87Gn V-Max, and the 58Gn V-max (for varminting).
The 58 V-Max is departing around 3800fps behind a load of 42Gns of AR2208 (ADI), and they are laser-straight for about the first 250 metres.

[NOTE: No doubt teaching grandma to suck eggs here, but dont use anyone else's loads without verifying them, and best to start at the recommended starting load for your powder manufacturer. I'm just supplying them to give you an idea of what I've been getting out of my rifle.]

Another note: When my mate (who owns the Featherweight) worked these loads up for me, he focused on a loading that was delivering the best groups, so he didnt even get around to checking them for speed. Of all of them, the 95BT's were the tightest grouping, from my recollection. I think they ended up being one ragged hole at 100m, which was pretty amazing for the ho-hum trigger on the Krico.
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