Gamerancher wrote:Depends on the rifle and the design of the bullet. Do you have a pic or maybe the dimensions of the bullet?
I shoot 560gr cast bullets out of a .45-90 CPA single shot, cartridge O.A.L would be too long for most lever guns. Even the 530gr bullet I used to shoot out of a .45-70 Sharps gave an O.A.L that wouldn't fit in a Marlin cowboy.
William "Buffalo Bill" Cody shot thousands of buffalo (bison) using the standard U.S army loading of 405gr lead bullet over 70gr of black powder in a Trapdoor Springfield rifle. Maybe look at replicating that load using smokeless.
I do hope you are the "big" part of bigpete, that's a lot of lead you need to motivate, you'll certainly notice the recoil shooting that much bullet out of a light weight lever-gun.
Gamerancher wrote:I've posted here before that you'll almost always find a sweet spot duplicating black-powder velocities in rifles that were designed for black-powder cartridges.
One I used to use in a Marlin Cowboy .45-70 for lever -gun silhouette was 20gr of 2205 behind a 370 RNFP cast bullet. Mild as hell to use and quite accurate out to the rams @ 200m.
I would add that 2205 is position sensitive when using light loads and would not recommend that load for hunting.
It's different when shooting at the range in competition where each shot is made in a controlled manor. Elevating the barrel while tapping the butt before each shot put the powder back against the primer for more consistency with the less than full case.
Supaduke wrote:Haven't hunted with it yet, but I have used a 325gr FTX projectile in front of 50gr of 2207. Punches holes in 12mm steel plate at 200m easily.
That load will drop any creature that walks this earth.
I have used 405gr projectiles and they gobble up quite a bit of case capacity to maintain an OAL that will cycle.
I imagine 500+gr projies will not leave much capacity left to get enough oomph for any sort of decent range. No science in that however , just something I have observed when reloading.
Gamerancher wrote:The Rossi Rio-grande in .45-70 is a Marlin 336 action clone. Lots of bad reviews re quality in the U.S. Advice would be to carefully examine it in shop before paying and taking possession.
Gamerancher wrote:The Rossi clone of the '92 Winchester is a pretty good gun, then again, it is a copy of the '92. Pretty sure they are only available in "pistol" cartridges, just like the original.
It is the "Rio-grande" that I've seen with the rubbish reviews.
I had a Marlin Cowboy in .45-70, it was a good accurate gun. I liked the long octagonal barrel and the rifle handled well. It's just that me and Marlins don't get on, ( bloody case comes out of the wrong place when ejected ). Sold it to a good mate who still uses it for lever-action silhouette.
Sorry bigpete but I never loaded it up for hunting like you require so unable to give a report. I can say that they are popular and are snapped up when advertised.
Gamerancher wrote: Reduced loads of 2205 can be position sensitive, so consistency in your loading and firing action is required. I think I also used a load of 16gr of Trail-boss with some success.
Gamerancher wrote:In reply to in2anity;
It was an 1895CB (Cowboy). 26" octagonal barrel with "Ballard" rifling. I had a Lee Shaver economy soule tang sight on it. I can't remember if the tang was pre-drilled or not. I had a 17A Lyman front sight on it and used a fine post insert.( CLAS rules dictate post front sight) ... Ran out of elevation for the 385m turkeys and 500m rams, aiming at trees on the hill to try to hit a target 'aint real conducive to accuracy.
Gamerancher wrote:I can basically catch the empty shell without looking. The same technique doesn't work with Marlins due to the side eject
in2anity wrote:Gamerancher wrote: Reduced loads of 2205 can be position sensitive, so consistency in your loading and firing action is required. I think I also used a load of 16gr of Trail-boss with some success.
Thanks GR appreciate it - I'm shooting rimfire silhouette myself these days (and am absolutely LOVING it btw, much more exciting than the UIT [Olympic style] prone discipline that I grew up with) - I want to move into centerfire silhouette down the track (hence the interest in an accurate 45/70). That's very interesting what you said about "position sensitive" powder. I've been shooting offhand all my life, and I always felt the powders / factories I happened to use always shot where the rifle was pointing when I pulled the trigger. For standing offhand, my 22 falls into this same boat - it shoots where I'm pointing.
Then along came Trail Boss (under a 30cal in a 336) - when I load TB, for some weird reason my offhand shots always seemed to fall low and to the right (with a benchrest zero). Do you feel TB can also be position sensitive? I kept putting it down to my sling being too tight, but maybe it's the characteristics powder? Also why 2205 for 45/70 instead of 2207 (like you use in a 30/30)?
bladeracer wrote:I think he's referring to the position of the powder in the case, not the position of the shooter. Reduced loads leave a lot of air space in the case. If you point the rifle downwards before firing, the powder will be at the front of the case against the bullet. If you point it upwards the powder will be dumped right against the flash hole. Generally, for target shooting the powder will lie along the bottom of the case. Consistency counts.
I never expect my shots to hit the same point from different rests. Between bags, bipod, sling support and field rests it's likely to change. Zero the same way you intend to shoot.
in2anity wrote:Yeah after re-reading, that just occurred to me actually, makes sense it's weird how the phenomenon only (seems to) exist when i use TB though, yet TB is a really fluffy powder, so you'd think it'd be the opposite.. Maybe it's a bit of cognitive bias on my end...
bladeracer wrote:Are you using magnum primers?
in2anity wrote:bladeracer wrote:Are you using magnum primers?
I've experimented with them to try and achieve better stabilisation, but I never concluded whether they affected the (apparent) anomaly I speak of. I still have a packet or two in my safe i think...