Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

News and events in the media and political arena relating to firearms.

Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by mickb » 08 Jul 2019, 6:35 am

Just thought it might be interesting for the younger members, for those of us who recall earlier times to relate instances of relative gun freedoms. This is not a nyah! nyah! post, since the past is the past and we are all in the same boat. But I think its also important for new generations to be able to cast into perspective the differences of the past, and also see that less laws did not necessarily meaning life was a bloodbath of mass murders, stolen guns and terrorism.

So kicking it off, I grew up in the late 70's and 80's. I shot a lot of guns growing up. Not sure when licences did come in but in QLD by the time I was owning my own guns you did need a gun licence, though not everyone bothered. It was more if you actually wanted to buy a gun from a shop you got one.

The licence was like a car learners, you did a short quetionaire and sat it in the cop shop that day, and off you went. Bought whatever you want over the counter in any shop and took it home. Guns were stored in wardrobes or the back of utes, stuff like 410's and powerheads rolling around the bottom of a tinny. Seems unsafe but no one locked up powertools, knives or the spearguns either so there you go, no kids went on murdering sprees with any of it.

You could order ammo over the phone, no problems mailing it. Also ordering all sorts of stuff from the US was easy. Projectiles didn't need an import licence at that stage. The US state department prior to 9/11 was much less uptight about exports.

There was less stigma around guns, we would shoot 22LR in backyards, the only complaint was sometimes noise( as opposed to terrorist threat as it would be now lol).

Pellet rifles were still common kids toys. I remember visiting my uncles place when I was 10. I found an old air rifle in a shed I was exploring, belonged to him when he was a kid in the 60's. My 8 yr old brother and I shot all the ammo we could find, once we ran out, we went around shooting spiders out of their webs just with the puff of compressed air. :lol: I think we wrecked it, but no one cared, it was a rusty old toy

At school I remember the 'big kids' sometimes bringing 22LR and pellet rifles to show and tell in the class.

I remember cruising in the back of tray back utes, standing up in the back(the normal method to get large numbers of kids anywhere lol) with all my cousins and a few mates holding on, 22LR's in the tray on the way to a shooting trip. No one had heard of bike helmets then either of course.

Two stories from my relatives a generation or two earlier. 303's going at auction, selling off units like old army vehicles. wish I could have been there in those days, I would have bought the lot! My older uncles riding their pushbike into town as young kids to pick up dad's order of high explosive for the farm.:)

Any other old farts feel free to chime in :)
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Re: Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by TassieTiger » 08 Jul 2019, 7:32 am

Australia's population in 1970 was 12.3 million.
Australia's population now is 25 million.
Australia's expected population by 2030 will be 30 million.

I also recall buying a .22 at a family market and the seller even cycling a few rounds to prove it worked.
I recall fire work fights of the which would have impressed the hell out of anyone in Bagdad and some house fires as a result.
I recall seat belts not being mandatory, I recall open speed limits on gravel highways.

All of these things were a lot of fun for those that didn't get injured or die...and they taught real world lessons...of responsibility.
However - the same rules do not apply any longer. Common sense is gone. Self responsibility is gone.

I'm not glad that gun laws were implemented the way they were - but I'm glad that guns laws exist with the amount of complete and utter idiots that are now out there in the Australian populace. Spend much time on the road ? The amount of wankers that jump out at a set of traffic lights with a weapon - just to confront someone that looked at them wrong - is ever increasing...to highlight one example.

The good ole days were just that - the good ole days - but in my opinion, the same rules back then could now never ever work today - there are too many irresponsible idiots, there are too many lawyers, not enough common sense, too much bull#$%^ in todays world - I am constantly amazed at this current generations inability to do the even the basics...
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Re: Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by Bills Shed » 08 Jul 2019, 7:48 am

I remember buying rifles and ammo from Kmart and taking ammunition to school and swapping it with other kids. No one was scared and it was a normal part of life.

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Re: Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by JSS » 08 Jul 2019, 8:28 am

I can remember going into the local gun shop most weekends anywhere from about 10-12 years old and buying my own ammo, that was in the mid 80's and was a small town where we had a farm
I only ever bought .22 or 12g ammo as they were the only guns i was allowed to wander around with on my own all day at that age. Still remember when i was 13 i was allowed to take out my M1 carbine, which was my favourite of the 20 odd gun collection i inherited from my grandfather, when i walked into the store and asked for a couple of boxes of .30cal the owner asked "oh new gun hey? righto tell me all about it.". It's funny it felt like a real right of passage that day lol.

Our farm was on both sides of a dirt road so i used to have to cross it all the time to get into the mountains, i remember one time, it was just after some goose went nuts with an M1 & they tried to ban that particular gun, i was walking across the road as the local copper (who everyone knew & was a good bloke) came driving over the hill. He pulled up & asked "what the bloody hell i was doing with that" to which he got the standard answer "goin' shootn''. He said you're not supposed to have them anymore, Being cheeky i replied with a smile "it'll take more than that revolver you've got to get this one." He just laughed and told me to hurry up and get over the bloody fence & to have a safe day.
A smile and a wave and we went on our merry ways. It was a better time, but as has been said times change, and i'm also glad things aren't that easy anymore considering the w@nkers we have around these days.
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Re: Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by Madang185 » 08 Jul 2019, 9:33 am

The "laws" to prevent citizens having arms predates gunpowder
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Re: Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by trekin » 08 Jul 2019, 9:41 am

TassieTiger wrote:Australia's population in 1970 was 12.3 million.
Australia's population now is 25 million.
Australia's expected population by 2030 will be 30 million.

I also recall buying a .22 at a family market and the seller even cycling a few rounds to prove it worked.
I recall fire work fights of the which would have impressed the hell out of anyone in Bagdad and some house fires as a result.
I recall seat belts not being mandatory, I recall open speed limits on gravel highways.

All of these things were a lot of fun for those that didn't get injured or die...and they taught real world lessons...of responsibility.
However - the same rules do not apply any longer. Common sense is gone. Self responsibility is gone.

I'm not glad that gun laws were implemented the way they were - but I'm glad that guns laws exist with the amount of complete and utter idiots that are now out there in the Australian populace. Spend much time on the road ? The amount of wankers that jump out at a set of traffic lights with a weapon - just to confront someone that looked at them wrong - is ever increasing...to highlight one example.

The good ole days were just that - the good ole days - but in my opinion, the same rules back then could now never ever work today - there are too many irresponsible idiots, there are too many lawyers, not enough common sense, too much bull#$%^ in todays world - I am constantly amazed at this current generations inability to do the even the basics...

Yes, but which came first, the irresponsible idot wankers, or the nanny state laws that allows them to willingly pass self responsibly over to some one else?
mickb wrote:Just thought it might be interesting for the younger members, for those of us who recall earlier times to relate instances of relative gun freedoms. This is not a nyah! nyah! post, since the past is the past and we are all in the same boat. But I think its also important for new generations to be able to cast into perspective the differences of the past, and also see that less laws did not necessarily meaning life was a bloodbath of mass murders, stolen guns and terrorism.

So kicking it off, I grew up in the late 70's and 80's. I shot a lot of guns growing up. Not sure when licences did come in but in QLD by the time I was owning my own guns you did need a gun licence, though not everyone bothered. It was more if you actually wanted to buy a gun from a shop you got one.

The licence was like a car learners, you did a short quetionaire and sat it in the cop shop that day, and off you went. Bought whatever you want over the counter in any shop and took it home. Guns were stored in wardrobes or the back of utes, stuff like 410's and powerheads rolling around the bottom of a tinny. Seems unsafe but no one locked up powertools, knives or the spearguns either so there you go, no kids went on murdering sprees with any of it.

You could order ammo over the phone, no problems mailing it. Also ordering all sorts of stuff from the US was easy. Projectiles didn't need an import licence at that stage. The US state department prior to 9/11 was much less uptight about exports.

There was less stigma around guns, we would shoot 22LR in backyards, the only complaint was sometimes noise( as opposed to terrorist threat as it would be now lol).

Pellet rifles were still common kids toys. I remember visiting my uncles place when I was 10. I found an old air rifle in a shed I was exploring, belonged to him when he was a kid in the 60's. My 8 yr old brother and I shot all the ammo we could find, once we ran out, we went around shooting spiders out of their webs just with the puff of compressed air. :lol: I think we wrecked it, but no one cared, it was a rusty old toy

At school I remember the 'big kids' sometimes bringing 22LR and pellet rifles to show and tell in the class.

I remember cruising in the back of tray back utes, standing up in the back(the normal method to get large numbers of kids anywhere lol) with all my cousins and a few mates holding on, 22LR's in the tray on the way to a shooting trip. No one had heard of bike helmets then either of course.

Two stories from my relatives a generation or two earlier. 303's going at auction, selling off units like old army vehicles. wish I could have been there in those days, I would have bought the lot! My older uncles riding their pushbike into town as young kids to pick up dad's order of high explosive for the farm.:)

Any other old farts feel free to chime in :)

Qld introduced life time long arm licences in 1990, hand guns required licencing from around the '30's-'40's. Getting a long arm licence was as you described, or send your application of to Brisbane by snail mail. At the same time a ban on importing military firearms, modified to semi only, was introduced, this lead to firearms such as the AK being reinvented, and sold, as the Maegun.
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Re: Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by bladeracer » 08 Jul 2019, 10:11 am

I haven't found any Aussie firearms laws prior to 1958, but it's possible firearm offences were included in other Acts before they needed an Act of their own.
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Re: Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by Wm.Traynor » 08 Jul 2019, 11:53 am

In the mid-sixties you could not shoot on Sunday. "Military" ( e.g. 303 ) calibres were illegal or banned or somesuch. Full-bore shooters must have been exempt however for reasons I probably never new even then. ( They shot five quid Lee Enfields in 303 ). Somewhere along the way, someone saw sense and those provisions were scrapped but it took decades from their inception, so the moral of the story is, "Don't get your hopes up". But I'm surprised and happy that the numbers of shooters has increased since '96 :thumbsup:
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Re: Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by trekin » 08 Jul 2019, 2:31 pm

Wm.Traynor wrote:In the mid-sixties you could not shoot on Sunday. "Military" ( e.g. 303 ) calibres were illegal or banned or somesuch. Full-bore shooters must have been exempt however for reasons I probably never new even then. ( They shot five quid Lee Enfields in 303 ). Somewhere along the way, someone saw sense and those provisions were scrapped but it took decades from their inception, so the moral of the story is, "Don't get your hopes up". But I'm surprised and happy that the numbers of shooters has increased since '96 :thumbsup:

It was because we, QRA/NRA fullbore shooters, had a exemption uder the Defence Act, as it was then considered paramilitary training.To join the QRA back then required undertaking the Oath of Alegiance, the same as when you joined up. Also, Queens shoots paid a cash prize, as did a lot of club comps, and some people were able to make a good sideline just by doing the circuits winning these prize comps, and it was tax free.
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Re: Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by RoginaJack » 08 Jul 2019, 4:11 pm

Yep, back in the good old days, the only people permitted 303's were Farmers, Professional fisherman and "members of the local "Full Bore " clubs. Along came the 7.62 Omark and that exiled the ol 303.
We lived in Moree and come weekends we chased pigs with a semi-auto 22, a fox terrier, cattle dog (Qld. Blue Healer) and the older brother.The extractor didn't work and shells had to be flipped out with a screwdriver.Made for some very interesting moments; trying to stick the barrel in the pigs ear, foxy hanging off pigs arse, big brother trying to grab a leg and the Healer grabbing any leg it could get hold of and all this while trying to flip spent shell out with a screwdriver.. :x

Really liked Moree, cut through the railway yards to the bore baths each night for a swim and bath. Got me out of cutting wood for the chip heater!

Used to shoot feral pigeons of the wheat along the railway lines by the sugar bag full. Rugged life, free range pork and pigeon breasts for dinner each night. For a change of diet, fresh fish from the Mehi or Gwydir rivers.

Hand gun permits were required from the 1920's and just goes to show how licencing of firearms have failed with drive buys, armed robberies, etc all carried out with hand guns.
(Sigh) :(
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Re: Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by Patriot » 08 Jul 2019, 4:38 pm

Yep
I remember when my grandfather died in 1991 we cleaned out his wardrobe and found an old 303 and ammo, this was in inner city Brisbane. He was a locomotive driver for Queensland Rail and was stationed in Richmond in the 50s, he used to stop the train in the outback and go shooting with his colleagues. When he transferred back to Brisbane he just put it in the wardrobe, apparently he got out one night to scare off the ‘Ether Man’ who was prowling around his neighbours place in the 60s,when the coppers turned up they gave him a pat on the back for it.
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Re: Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by pomemax » 09 Jul 2019, 12:40 pm

Pistol dealer" means a registered
pistol dealer under the Pistol
License Act, 1927-1946.
can not find any ref to long arms
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Re: Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by xDom » 09 Jul 2019, 12:46 pm

Patriot wrote:Yep
when the coppers turned up they gave him a pat on the back for it.


That's great. :thumbsup:
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Re: Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by pomemax » 09 Jul 2019, 1:22 pm

The world was a different place back in the 60s /70s even the 80s then it changed .
We had a prowler peeping in windows in the 70s young wife at home with 2 kids me working till 1130 at night she called the cops just as i got home she was talking with 2 cops ,One the biggest man i have ever seen He said to me "I love it when i catches them" then jokingly put his hand on my head his fingers on one ear thumb on other My first thought was i bet they dont .
The Other cop more senior said to me do you own a 22, yes Winchester semi auto good load it for her. Then he turns to my Mrs and says if they try to get in shoot the bugger then fire a warning shot through the roof we cant tell witch one you fired first .l To this day i cant figure if he was joking I tend to figure he was not
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Re: Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by Elmer » 09 Jul 2019, 4:14 pm

I remember in the early eighties doing work experience in the firearms dept of Super Elliots in Rundle st Adelaide I was only 15.
The owner told me to take a 12g coach gun to Sportsgoods in Pirie st .
So I did , walking through the heart of the city at lunchtime with a naked shotgun (not wrapped or in a gun bag) with the price tag hanging off it.
No one stopped me nor did they give a rats as I walked unchallenged to Sportsgoods.....do that these days and I would make the news.
I used to when I was a teenager catch the bus into town with my .22 in a gun bag , once again , no one cared or lost bladder control.
What a sad sad world we live in today, Iam now 53 and am so glad I have experienced growing up in a world where you allowed to be a kid.
I feel sorry for the kids today, they wouldn't know what it was like to experience the excitement and build up to cracker night, or going down to the local park with your air rifle knocking off starlings and spoggies.
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Re: Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by xDom » 09 Jul 2019, 4:48 pm

This is a great YouTube clip from the 70's. Shows peoples attitudes back then.

https://youtu.be/1YyXUzEyR38


I love the bit at the beginning when, what looks like a cop just looks at him and then carries on, gold!


This morning I gave my 7 year old son a cheap 3-9 scope to mess around with. I said he could have it to play with. I reckon if I was given that as a 7 year old, I would've been wrapped, as he was.

He's been showing his mates out the front and was talking about taking to school for show and tell.
I'm in two minds, I could just see some hysterics from some screaming parent?
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Post by Stix » 09 Jul 2019, 7:47 pm

Well ive just got the same yarn to tell as all you boys...same age group dictates that i guess...

Growing up in the 70's-80's, i rekon every third or more home had either a 22 or an air rifle, or both...!!, either behind the parents bedroom door or stuffed in Dads side of the wardrobe... :thumbsup:

Everyone knew i shot stuff growing up, so all the kids at school used to all rave about their dads gun stuffed in the wardrobe, & here is the thing...!!!...We all knew where Dad kept the ammo...!! YEp...!!...Even the boys that werent supposed to know where he kept it, knew where it was... :shock: :shock: :lol: :lol: :lol:

And just to go against the grain of popular beliefs of today, i dont recall seeing any names that i went to school with in the headlines for having shot anyone...!!!...Go figure... :unknown:

Things were different...Hell i remember the old mans shed, all the guns on racks mounted on the wall...with the various configerations of Wini 92's in 32-20 levers taking pride of place...!!
I knew where the key was hidden for the shed, & you know to this day i dont know if my mother even knew that i knew where it was...

I know the old man did...i was playing darts in there one night after school & missed the board & hit a window, & to my utter amazement it didnt break the window--just left a hollywood type hole in the glass with the cracks radiating out--to this day the old man doesnt believe me that i wasnt shooting the air rifle or a 22 in the shed...!!,,he knows i wasnt that stupid--but if you saw the window youd think as he does...!! :lol:

I remember as a young lad--probably adolescent heading into teens, a couple of the blokes in the street used send the message out thorough their sons or neighbours that their air rifle was missing spoggies &/or starlings...so id head up the road the following Sat or Sun if wasnt playing sport & check the sights & shoot a target in their yard...
Id check it by putting out some bread on their back lawn & wait for 5 mins & pop an incoming spoggy or 2...sometimes the blokes would say to stay a while & shoot a few more if i didnt have to run home straight away & they'd get their missus to make me a Milo & vegemite sandwich... :lol: :lol: :lol:
I used to look up to those blokes & felt important & respected, not to mention have a sense of pride that i could help them out--imagine that today--a young fella feeling proud because Mr Jones made him a milo for sorting out his gun... :lol: :thumbsup:
(I didnt do anything to the rifles-these blokes just couldnt shoot..!! i just adjust the slide on the front sights to its closest setting... :thumbsup: )

How good was it eh...none of those blokes were shooters, they just had a rifle because it was what we were founded on, & mostly from our great grandfathers having to feed the mouths with bunny meat to ride the depression they had to endure...!!...to have a rifle was a right of passage, & despite the laws being so relaxed back then, we all had sensibility--not one of those blokes would have tolerated me being an idiot & shooting birds off the neighbours roof...our sensibility was founded on respect, & having to (or not wanting to) endure the wrath of our parents & feel the shame of doing stupid things with guns...

Could you imagine the average 27 y/o fella now having to go out & feed his family from hunted meat--because of necessity :o -- :unknown: --yea right...!!
...what...shoot a gun...no way... guns are dangerous... :roll:

I remember my target air rifle--peep sight would take out a pin head at 10 metres, so i used to head shoot starlings (perfect size head for target peep sights :thumbsup: ) out to 15 or more metres as easy as pi$s...it actually got boring...

And Elmer...!!...i used to work in Rundle street, & got to know the bloke running the gun dept in Super Elliots very well-boy did he have the contacts...!!!...maybe even your mate in that gun shop knows of him...?? :unknown:
Anyway, i too remember walking down Rundle Street or Mall with a rifle over your shoulder & no one blinked...
Once if i remember correctly i walked a rifle to the cop shop in Vic square wrapped in a towel with the stock & barrel poking out...

The world, particularly this country has gone mad...we'll give a madman a drivers licence, but anyone who has a gun must be half a brain cell removed from a Psychopath... :crazy:

I remember decades ago, "someone" being pulled over by a copper on a country dirt road because their tail lights werent working..., they were obviously shooting bunnies & had a silencer screwed onto the end of the rifle...(this was in the day when you could own them but officially not use them... :roll: )...
The copper said to this handsome young sharp shooter to pack it in for the night go back to camp & replace the fuse & resume tomorrow night...

Sensability & responsability...what ever happened... :unknown:
The man who knows everything, doesnt really know everything...he's just stopped learning...
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Re: Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by Elmer » 09 Jul 2019, 7:49 pm

xDom wrote:This is a great YouTube clip from the 70's. Shows peoples attitudes back then.

https://youtu.be/1YyXUzEyR38


I love the bit at the beginning when, what looks like a cop just looks at him and then carries on, gold!


This morning I gave my 7 year old son a cheap 3-9 scope to mess around with. I said he could have it to play with. I reckon if I was given that as a 7 year old, I would've been wrapped, as he was.

He's been showing his mates out the front and was talking about taking to school for show and tell.
I'm in two minds, I could just see some hysterics from some screaming parent?

Hysterics from a screaming parent?,sad to say but you are dead right.
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Re: Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by duncan61 » 09 Jul 2019, 8:30 pm

Drove from Townsville to Perth April 1983 and called in to a hardware store at Mt Isa and bought a Boito shotgun and a box of OO/SG off the shelf for personal protection no questions asked and then gave it to a buddy who had a licence when I arrived.Too easy.Rimfires and 12 bores were no issue back then
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Re: Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by Sergeant Hartman » 09 Jul 2019, 10:09 pm

Hmm I don't have such awesome stories seeing I was a wee twinkle in my parents eyes during the mid 70s.

But growing up I too knew where the old double barrel and its ammo was. He also had a revolver and later a pistol for personal protection, when put and about it was nearly always on his person. I was given a diana air rifle that was gutless to say, thus sorta lost any interest, but fud spend a plenty of time hunting sparrows.

But times have changed, now people are different this some types if rules are deliberately required..... not that many (dills) obey them.
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Re: Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by Roo farmer » 09 Jul 2019, 11:08 pm

Stix wrote:How good was it eh...none of those blokes were shooters, they just had a rifle because it was what we were founded on, & mostly from our great grandfathers having to feed the mouths with bunny meat to ride the depression they had to endure...!!...

Could you imagine the average 27 y/o fella now having to go out & feed his family from hunted meat--because of necessity :o -- :unknown: --yea right...!!
...what...shoot a gun...no way... guns are dangerous...:


Everyone is complaining about how bad the drought is. But I don't know anyone eating rabbits. Very few willing to eat kangaroo even. Makes you wonder.
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Re: Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by mickb » 05 Aug 2019, 12:47 am

I forgot where I put this. Great posts guys, it feels like breathing fresh air recalling those eras. Good to hear about times earlier than my own era too. Also goes to show laws do not always equal lawfulness, and a lack of laws do not mean chaos. As important are resources and culture. You have enough of these, people manage themselves which much less laws. And adding laws doesn't fix a sliding culture.
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Re: Earliest gun laws or lack thereof

Post by Madang185 » 05 Aug 2019, 10:20 am

The Australian Government(s) can pass all the so called Gun Laws that they like but it will have zero impact on criminal misuse. The Police have admitted to me that they know Licensed Firearm owners are not the problem. The media are unwilling to admit that there is a difference because it will not provide them with the headlines that they want.

To the uneducated who claim that the problem can be resolved by total banning look at what has occurred overseas. Following Huddersfield in 1997 the UK banned all handguns. In the first year after the bans handgun related crime rose by 46%, a figure never published or mentioned by any media. Police in the UK continue to discover such firearms from eastern Europe still in the manufacturers grease!

Australia's real problem is that just 3% of the containers that come into the country are x-rayed. The author would suggest that the odds are in the criminals favour. Politician and the various Government departments do not know how to combat this fact and continue to blame licensed shooters to divert attention.

Pathetic!
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