US opinions of Aus/NZ gunlaws

[TassieTiger]

Very nice speech patriot

But you forget Australia doesn't give its citizens any rights.. gun ownership is a privilege and you have to do your part.

Secondly as said already, in us the people saying they will rise up if the government will come 4 their guns, every few months close their eyes and put their head under the sand while the government breaks down the 2nd amendment bit by bit, by taking away their rights one small law at a time. Go check the restrictions in California or NY.

If a person possesses a firearms license, does that not give them the right to own any firearm they wish in the categories they are licensed for?

Much like a driver license gives you the right drive any vehicle in the class you are licensed for.

So, if you obey the law your right to firearms under your license conditions won’t be infringed.


Americans have a long and distinguished history of standing up for liberty and freedom and defeating tyranny and oppression they will not stand idly by while their God given right to bear arms is under attack.

Not quite correct mate.
IF you have a firearms license, that then allows you to APPLY for any firearm in the category for what your licensed - does not guarantee approval and many are knocked back due to appearance laws (dont get me started), calibre, amount of firearms one already has, etc.

[Patriot]

Very nice speech patriot

But you forget Australia doesn't give its citizens any rights.. gun ownership is a privilege and you have to do your part.

Secondly as said already, in us the people saying they will rise up if the government will come 4 their guns, every few months close their eyes and put their head under the sand while the government breaks down the 2nd amendment bit by bit, by taking away their rights one small law at a time. Go check the restrictions in California or NY.

If a person possesses a firearms license, does that not give them the right to own any firearm they wish in the categories they are licensed for?

Much like a driver license gives you the right drive any vehicle in the class you are licensed for.

So, if you obey the law your right to firearms under your license conditions won’t be infringed.


Americans have a long and distinguished history of standing up for liberty and freedom and defeating tyranny and oppression they will not stand idly by while their God given right to bear arms is under attack.

Not quite correct mate.
IF you have a firearms license, that then allows you to APPLY for any firearm in the category for what your licensed - does not guarantee approval and many are knocked back due to appearance laws (dont get me started), calibre, amount of firearms one already has, etc.

Ok, thanks for pointing that out mate.

[sungazer]

Its not hard to build up quite a cache. There are a lot on people on this forum that have more guns than you would probably think. They only ask you for a reason its not hard to have a reason. Like I really like the look of that one. This new one is just like the other one but different. I need several of the exact same gun as a backup is required for team shooting ect.

[Sergeant Hartman]

What I mean it's a privilege, you ask for permission to be able to acquire firearms and then ask again to have the privilege to own a particular firearm as per the conditions set out in your license.

Compared that to as you said right of freedom of religion... but even then I would say many people would reckon that right is eroding lately. The way we go I think eventually we might become a police state..... but that's a completely other topic

[xDom]

their God given right to bear arms is under attack.

You sure you're not American?!

[Patriot]

Definitely not American cobber

[Pennsylvania Yank]

I notice when the subject of gunlaws come up on Aus/nz forums on the big international forums, it becomes a bit of a pising ground for americans telling us we all roll over too easily, and how if it happened to them they wouldnt stand for it. With the NZ situation, its all on again.

I agree the US is far superior in resisting gun laws They have the consitution but more importantly financial muscle and numbers to tell anti's, left wing orgs and international groups like the UN to go to hell.

But one thing the US guys dont like to mention. Their 50 states and 3000 counties have thousands of different gun restrictions that they didn't stop. Including the gun control acts of 1934 and 1938 requiring tax stamps( federal permission) to buy machine guns, silencers and short barrel rifles.etc. Not to mention they just added another 210 changes just after the sandy hook shootings. Unless I am severely mistaken, there wasn't much in the way of physical resistance to any of it .Folks in the US largely comply like the rest of us.

I'm an American. I didn't own or even hold a gun until I was in my late 20's. I bought my first handgun in the late 80's after watching the Movie "Lethal Weapon" (Yes, it was a Beretta 9mm). I bought my first so-called assault rifle in 1992 for the sole reason that my ruling government told me that soon I could not own one. I have watched the gun control movement grow and also grow more vitriolic and insane with each passing year.(coinciding with the growing insanity of the American Left in general during that same time period) I myself have grown from a casual shooter, to a competition shooter,to gun collector, to a gun rights advocate.

There are 3 factors that make the US unique and more able to resist the globalist and leftist inspired gun ban efforts. 1.Our unique gun culture, 2.Our Constitution, and 3.The NRA and other gun rights organizations. This is not to say that Australians or others are banned from owning any guns because we all know that is not true, BUT it is essentially true in SOME countries like the UK..This is where the worldwide gun ban movement is headed.

There are no more braver people than Australians and New Zealanders. This has been proven time and time again. This has nothing to do with weakness,and everything to do with the worldwide Left's ability and efforts to disarm populations in exchange for promises of peace and security, but in actuality is nothing more than about control.

Lastly, there is a propaganda effort being undertaken to try and convince people that Americans who value gun rights, and the NRA, are opposed to all gun restrictions. That is simply not true.

[Tank]

Does it matter what ‘they’ think. We’re the ones that live under those laws....
I couldn’t give a flying toss what someone 12,000 miles away ‘feels’ about ‘our’ legislations....so why is it important?

[RoginaJack]

Well said Sir and bloody well put too.

[wrenchman]

it should not tank

[Member-Deleted]

Pretty close to the point Pennsylvania Yank and another thing I for the love of me can't understand how countries can send people to war and kill thousands of innocent people as well as enemy with guns and when the people return then treated as potential criminals because they own or want a gun here in Australia they are trying to remove and ban guns that look or are similar to military weapons yet have passed the legal process to obtain now I think that is law Bastardry in both cases I don't mean that guns should be willy- nilly and anybody can have any gun we already have laws in place there is no reason to tighten them if these people think by taking peoples guns then they are delusional it never has and never will because most deaths are caused by non registered firearms or criminal activity lets look at snake bite it kills just as many if not more people than guns in Australia yet snakes are protected by law here to cap it off people don't get a say in the handing down of gun laws we are at the governments mercy not very democratic I say but that's the way the governments run of late I just wish we could get a politician with balls and be practical to go with it we may have a chance of fair play from the politicians then but I;m not holding my breath

[Stix]

i do not think it is fair to compare us to aus / nz our citys with the gun crimes have greater populations then aus/ nz and its gang crime and i no they like to tell you that assault guns are the problem but they are less then 1% of any gun crime they just put those on the news.
i dont think it is also fair for me to say a bad thing about aus or nz shooters the us realy does have a gun culture i can go right now to a hand gun range and i will see almost as many woman as men the ladys are some of the best shooters and they train hard.

Does it matter what ‘they’ think. We’re the ones that live under those laws....
I couldn’t give a flying toss what someone 12,000 miles away ‘feels’ about ‘our’ legislations....so why is it important?

I agree your sentiment to a point...
But im not sure why you've quoted wrenchman here & not the OP tank...
Wrenchman is just in the conversatiin & doesnt seem overly worried about what his fellow US gun owners think of our laws...
Or have i missed something...?

[Tank]

Fair call Stix.
Apologies Wrenchman I wasn’t singling you out on this....

[flutch]

kiwis and aussie do roll over too easy, they/we do cuck ourselves severely, we dont demand enough and we Fudd ourselves out of relevance with lawmakers... our lack of freedom with gun laws and home/self defence is completely the result of such fuddery

[Tank]

What shape would you have things?
What part of current ownership laws aren’t meeting your satisfaction?
Is it state based ‘fuddery’?
How are you affected by current legislation negatively at this moment?
I’ve got a safe full....shoot whenever I like....handgun, rifle, shotgun.
I’m really interested to know what we’re ‘lacking’?

[flutch]

What shape would you have things?
What part of current ownership laws aren’t meeting your satisfaction?
Is it state based ‘fuddery’?
How are you affected by current legislation negatively at this moment?
I’ve got a safe full....shoot whenever I like....handgun, rifle, shotgun.
I’m really interested to know what we’re ‘lacking’?

lots missing: semi's, castle doctrine, conceal carry, self defence laws that implicate firearms, no right to possess, too much arbitrary costs and delays in purchasing/licensing (some states worse than others) including things like appearance laws and calibre restrictions etc. the list really does go on and on and on

Personally, no longer allowed semi automatics, with no justification, I am not a criminal, not criminally inclined, nor have I harmed anyone, nor do I have any intention to so there is 0 justification in removing my access to what is a recreational implement and a means to control feral introduced species on my friends and families properties. Much the same with suppressors/moderators, there is no reason to not allow such a OHS device as it is integral to hearing protection and in all reality do not "silence" a firearm yet here we are kept from owning them for completely arbitrary reasons, same as kevlar vests etc etc etc... not just that but the arbitrary re-categorisation of firearms into categories that has no legislative relevance, aka does not legally meet that requirement just like the 7 shot adler being put into category C without there being anything in law allowing such a thing, the police acting as though they're above the law as per usual, they are not law makers they are law officers, they dont decide what the law is, yet we allow them to why?

As for the FUDD's they are other shooters who are happy with others being left without so long as they have THEIR guns and can go shoot how THEY want to... theyre the people who deny others genuine needs and wants and align themselves with the draconian lawmakers and lefty gun grabbers by proxy validating the idea that people dont have a right to own things.

[Stix]

What shape would you have things?
What part of current ownership laws aren’t meeting your satisfaction?
Is it state based ‘fuddery’?
How are you affected by current legislation negatively at this moment?
I’ve got a safe full....shoot whenever I like....handgun, rifle, shotgun.
I’m really interested to know what we’re ‘lacking’?

Where is it that you shoot handgun rifle & shotgun whenever you like...?
Unless access to private land, im unaware of anywhere to shoot even a centrefire rifle whenever you like within coowee of Adel...

[Member-Deleted]

Well flutch it's because we are out gunned when it comes to law making the gov makes the laws and the police have a say in the making of laws therefore when a law is passed the police are there to uphold the law the police have more say in law making than the citizen right there we are out gunned this is where I can see things could be better with more input from the gun owners or bodies supporting gun ownership so being a more level playing field for us to just disregard the law would be foolish in no uncertain terms the gun laws as they are today as I see are ok for me but there are a lot of people that would like access to more types of guns , guns that most have had for years and never had legal problems let alone used them for illegal purposes yet have had them taken from them this is where the problem lays laws made on little or no practical thought mostly made for seeking political votes there is no doubt in my mind that if the shooting bodies and gov of the day had sat down and had a practical and logical talk the police would not have got the power they now have in deciding gun laws but that was not to be gov BS prevailed again so you ask why do we let them well they have the law on their side so until we get a more logical, practical, fair , truthful and non corruptive Gov then the gun laws will not change the part I don't like with a passion is that all gun owners now come under the umbrella of being a potential criminal very distasteful on the Governments part for doing so

[flutch]

defeatism: noun
the attitude, policy, or conduct of a person who admits, expects, or no longer resists defeat, as because of a conviction that further struggle or effort is futile; pessimistic resignation.

the LGBT lobby despite popular opinion (very operative phrase there) is very small in Australia, yet through not FUDDing themselves they have accomplished all things and changed popular opinion of themselves in the eyes of the general public despite all the same drawbacks that were objectively an issue for average punters still being more than prevalent now... i.e. the child sex proliferation, STD and drug use rates, mental health issues and suicide. Yet due to being unapologetic and cleverly pushing their agenda as one (Hence LGBT+ as they were all separate demographics prior) and not taking no for an answer they have managed to infiltrate popular opinion despite no scientific evidence for most of their claims and no reason for anyone to have to actually care or relate.

Point is, that they are in smaller numbers than firearms owners and those who's lives are intertwined with firearm owners, therefore the community at large is more intrinsically meshed with firearms than LGBT people and their issues, yet we allow popular opinion to counter us instead of uniting and rallying against the misinformation and lobbying for what we most want, this is the entire issue.

[flutch]

I have seen a lot of people shoot down others when they express desires for gun rights, conceal carry, castle doctrine etc etc etc etc, and well they all use the same illogical and factually flawed iteration, and that is they imply that "those days are long gone", not only is this Class A defeatism and utter fuddery it is also factually inaccurate as many many many nations and states and populaces have restored their rights in this regard, I have personally visited one that has been disarmed not only once but twice by occupying governments that both took away the rights to own as well as castle doctrine. this nation in question now has the right to own a firearm though vetting is required to maintain that you haven't been "stripped" of that right due to criminal affiliation/actions/convictions, as well as the right to defend their homes and person and families and neighbours/community with firearms. the only days that have gone by the wayside is aussie men having a spine.

[on_one_wheel]

defeatism: noun
the attitude, policy, or conduct of a person who admits, expects, or no longer resists defeat, as because of a conviction that further struggle or effort is futile; pessimistic resignation.

the LGBT lobby despite popular opinion (very operative phrase there) is very small in Australia, yet through not FUDDing themselves they have accomplished all things and changed popular opinion of themselves in the eyes of the general public despite all the same drawbacks that were objectively an issue for average punters still being more than prevalent now... i.e. the child sex proliferation, STD and drug use rates, mental health issues and suicide. Yet due to being unapologetic and cleverly pushing their agenda as one (Hence LGBT+ as they were all separate demographics prior) and not taking no for an answer they have managed to infiltrate popular opinion despite no scientific evidence for most of their claims and no reason for anyone to have to actually care or relate.

Point is, that they are in smaller numbers than firearms owners and those who's lives are intertwined with firearm owners, therefore the community at large is more intrinsically meshed with firearms than LGBT people and their issues, yet we allow popular opinion to counter us instead of uniting and rallying against the misinformation and lobbying for what we most want, this is the entire issue.

Drawing queers as a comparison to gun laws is like comparing apples and Lego.

It's PC to be a LGBT advocate
It's not PC to be a gun advocate

Guns are bad, queers are colourful

MPs burst into song at gay marriage bill

images (4).jpeg (41.87 KiB) Viewed 4460 times

They got their way simpmy because it was the PC thing to do.

[flutch]

dear f*** me wholly with a peeled capsicum more defeatism

It never used to be PC to like the debauchery of faggotry as it were.... its a movement we fail to grasp as a collective that we need to emulate.

[Member-Deleted]

Defeatism is not at the core here no gun owner has given up as implied just modern common sense we have to achieve our outcome legally and looking sensible to those that don't own guns other wise it won't only be the law makers we have to contend with it will all the non gun owners as well and it would be futile for the gun owners to gain a decent out come if this doesn't explain things and you have an answer to getting change on gun laws then feel free to enlighten the forum members to its content there are people that talk about Defeatism, Fuddy, Dudddy, no back bone , no spine and so but have no answer to the problem or cure to fixing it as they are tied to law as most common sense thinking people are so by all means feel free to point out the answer Cheers

[Stix]

I get what what flutch is saying...

Look at it from the point of view that we (gun owners as a collective) stood by & let society strip us of our civil rights by way of taking a selection of guns from us...& all for power & political gain...!!...absolutely no sensible or practicle proven principles what so ever...!!

Many gun owners these days wont even admit in public that they have, own or shoot guns for fear of being persecuted, being labelled as 'dangerous, &/or for offending others...

The many affiliations that we subscribe to, constantly do us injustice by infighting, & exercising egotisticsl power trips & "negotiate" terms for us that only suit a small minority, thus further surrendering us to the tyranny of idiots.

Remember only 25 years ago, how many households had a 22lr, either bolt repeater or a semi, either stuffed in Dads side of the wardrobe or leaning behind the door of the parents bedroom & the only beings that got shot were the neighbours cat that continually shat in the garden...

The answer is a collective voice...but we dont have the balls to speak up or do what is required...

How often do we see the fashionable LGTZQYPG crowd demonstrating for their rights...?... (very often)...

How often do we hear GCA in mainstream media sprooking their outlandish lies in propoganda form...?... (again, very often)...

But what do we hear...?...at best maybe one of the many firearms affiliations state on our behalf that they are offended... (hhmmm)...

How often do we march in demonstration in support of our rights to be able to posess & use a 12g semi auto...?...never...!!...!!...!!

I dont get that he's being directly insulting, rather he's just making a valid point...

You're right in that we are restricted by the laws we have, but we should stand up to them & we dont...

[Member-Deleted]

Yeah Stix I understand mate but saying ''As usual its aussie men having a spine'' big statement which to me put a tag on all of us not a selected few maybe it should have been worded a little better and yes I agree some men don't and yes we can't get our s$it together as one on the subject of gun laws and yes he has pretty much hit the nail on the head but with all that said what does he suggest other than what everyone has said on this forum for the last year about gun laws and if he has an
answer to this then we would like to know before calling aussie men spineless there are many reasons why people don't speak up and they're not all spineless

[Member-Deleted]

OK Flutch we are talking about the same thing but probably my head is in a different place so i'll leave it there because you do have a valid point but I don't agree about Australian men or at least not all Australian men not having a spine to do something I for one will do what it takes ''Legally'' that is to keep my rifles even if it was to march the street although i'd be in a wheel chair when doing so, so good talk Cheers ''and you to Stix''

[Stix]

Ill push you...but you'll have to sit my gun on your lap as well...

[Member-Deleted]

How big's this gun of yours we need room for ammo the chair has solid rubber tyres so won't get a flat if fired upon

[Stix]

My gun is same size as yours..but i could bring a Tikka lite i spose...

But just where are we going that we may get fired upon...?...
...and...
Im glad your tyres are solid & wont go flat, but im not so solid (im full of air as you know.. ) so i will go flat if fired upon...

[Sergeant Hartman]

No gun users have no unity that's right esp compared to LGBT. And its made worse by

1) some firearm users participate in illegal activities, also by destroying/damaging property while spotlight in private property and parks etc. Get the public against all firearm owners.

2) the peak bodies have traditionally been very rigid in protecting their turf....but now that they are trying to benefit the whole community many people will not support them cuz the people are too stuck up in the past.

3) many people, esp on online forums have a misconception that firearms in Australia was ever a right, it never was. Also they are very vocal in abusing the other side (any firearm owner that doesn't agree with whatever they say) but more importantly apart from bitching and moaning haven't done a single constructive thing...

they are happy to bitch about those who are doing something, but refuse to get off their lazy arse to do anything themselves. And finally they want it all their way.. no compromises. Not sure how that will work. The apathy is from you as well mate... but it might be hard to see


Lastly the fact is there is no unity among the firearm owners, but a huge amount of unity among the LGBT community..... and that my dear is the difference