Reimbursement of confiscated firearms?

[I've Got AUGtism]

I'm a young, autistic (Level 1 also know as Asperger's) man who is anxious about but wanting to get a firearms license for target shooting. The only reason I haven't made an application yet is because thanks to 7(2) of Firearms Act 2015 people can be denied a license due to any "mental illness" which may make them unsafe to possess firearms. I wholeheartedly believe I am safe to own firearms and that my autism is irrelevant to this however it doesn't matter what I believe as I'm not the one approving the application. I emailed SAPOL firearms branch about whether I should tick yes on the mental illness box on the form and the person who responded said that I do have to tick yes. This post isn't about the application process (I'll most likely make another one regarding that) but instead about the following scenario I thought of:

Say I get my firearms license and over the course of some years spend $3000 on firearms excluding ammo costs. $3000 has been taken from my bank account however I still own the items with which that money bought. The legislation gets updated, reinterpreted or through some other means it is determined that my autism legally prohibits me from holding a firearms license and thus my firearms are confiscated. In this situation am I given $3000 in compensation or have I lost both my money and the items I exchanged that money for? Is this the sort of thing that you could get insurance for? Have I misunderstood something and my thought process is flawed?

Thanks for any responses you may have!

[No1Mk3]

I'm a young, autistic (Level 1 also know as Asperger's) man who is anxious about but wanting to get a firearms license for target shooting. The only reason I haven't made an application yet is because thanks to 7(2) of Firearms Act 2015 people can be denied a license due to any "mental illness" which may make them unsafe to possess firearms. I wholeheartedly believe I am safe to own firearms and that my autism is irrelevant to this however it doesn't matter what I believe as I'm not the one approving the application. I emailed SAPOL firearms branch about whether I should tick yes on the mental illness box on the form and the person who responded said that I do have to tick yes. This post isn't about the application process (I'll most likely make another one regarding that) but instead about the following scenario I thought of:

Say I get my firearms license and over the course of some years spend $3000 on firearms excluding ammo costs. $3000 has been taken from my bank account however I still own the items with which that money bought. The legislation gets updated, reinterpreted or through some other means it is determined that my autism legally prohibits me from holding a firearms license and thus my firearms are confiscated. In this situation am I given $3000 in compensation or have I lost both my money and the items I exchanged that money for? Is this the sort of thing that you could get insurance for? Have I misunderstood something and my thought process is flawed?

Thanks for any responses you may have!

Your thought process is flawed, but only insofar as a lack of legal knowledge. If you are determined to be to be ineligible to own firearms in future due to changes in medical conditions your firearms are not confiscated but you will be required to dispose of them, such as sell them to a dealer. If you choose to challenge the decision to suspend/cancel your licence you will need to pass possesion of your firearms to another licenced entity such as a friend or dealer (who charge storage) until the matter is determined. There is no-one who will insure such a thing, and you will have to suffer the loss between new price and 2nd hand value, as many others have when their licence has been suspended then cancelled for various reasons.

[womble]

Your first paragraph is equally flawed.
Autism is not a mental illness.
Rendering your second paragraph invalid.
Your 3,000 dollar budget over the course of several years would take great discipline or possibly you’re just Scottish.
Scottish is not considered a mental illness either, although one could argue it should be.

[bigrich]

Your first paragraph is equally flawed.
Autism is not a mental illness.
Rendering your second paragraph invalid.
Your 3,000 dollar budget over the course of several years would take great discipline or possibly you’re just Scottish.
Scottish is not considered a mental illness either, although one could argue it should be.

OCH, HOOT MON ! whot's dat ye be seyin' 'bout scots , ye wee pillock !

[I've Got AUGtism]

I'm a young, autistic (Level 1 also know as Asperger's) man who is anxious about but wanting to get a firearms license for target shooting. The only reason I haven't made an application yet is because thanks to 7(2) of Firearms Act 2015 people can be denied a license due to any "mental illness" which may make them unsafe to possess firearms. I wholeheartedly believe I am safe to own firearms and that my autism is irrelevant to this however it doesn't matter what I believe as I'm not the one approving the application. I emailed SAPOL firearms branch about whether I should tick yes on the mental illness box on the form and the person who responded said that I do have to tick yes. This post isn't about the application process (I'll most likely make another one regarding that) but instead about the following scenario I thought of:

Say I get my firearms license and over the course of some years spend $3000 on firearms excluding ammo costs. $3000 has been taken from my bank account however I still own the items with which that money bought. The legislation gets updated, reinterpreted or through some other means it is determined that my autism legally prohibits me from holding a firearms license and thus my firearms are confiscated. In this situation am I given $3000 in compensation or have I lost both my money and the items I exchanged that money for? Is this the sort of thing that you could get insurance for? Have I misunderstood something and my thought process is flawed?

Thanks for any responses you may have!

Your thought process is flawed, but only insofar as a lack of legal knowledge. If you are determined to be to be ineligible to own firearms in future due to changes in medical conditions your firearms are not confiscated but you will be required to dispose of them, such as sell them to a dealer. If you choose to challenge the decision to suspend/cancel your licence you will need to pass possesion of your firearms to another licenced entity such as a friend or dealer (who charge storage) until the matter is determined. There is no-one who will insure such a thing, and you will have to suffer the loss between new price and 2nd hand value, as many others have when their licence has been suspended then cancelled for various reasons.

Ah I see. I was under the impression that if I were to suddenly be deemed unsafe to own firearms then they wouldn't rely on me disposing of them myself. Thank you for answering!

[I've Got AUGtism]

Your first paragraph is equally flawed.
Autism is not a mental illness.
Rendering your second paragraph invalid.
Your 3,000 dollar budget over the course of several years would take great discipline or possibly you’re just Scottish.
Scottish is not considered a mental illness either, although one could argue it should be.

I should have quoted the legislation in full, that's my bad.

7(2) of the South Australian Firearms Act 2015 reads:

A person who has a physical or mental illness, condition or disorder, or in relation to
whom other circumstances exist, that would make it unsafe for him or her to possess a
firearm or ammunition is not a fit and proper person for a purpose under this Act.

While I believe my autism would not make me any more unsafe than others, one of the Senior Adjudicators of SAPOL's firearms branch deemed that I must "tick yes of having an (sic) condition"
The question on the PD303 that is being referenced:

Do you have a physical or mental illness, condition or disorder which may render you unfit to hold a firearms licence?

And so while it may not make me unsafe I guess autism could make some people unsafe and therefore my autism triggers the application question but not the actual legislation itself. It is however one letter between "could" and "would" that is causing this difference which is why I was thinking if the legislation was edited/reinterpreted or something along those lines.

Also the $3,000 example was just because I haven't done too much looking at pricing. I don't want to get too ahead of myself haha.

[Wapiti]

I just read your OP and I won't make fun of you or doubt your sincerity. I think that picking apart your question (hopefully genuine) is pretty pathetic.
Because I get exposed to this quite often from a business and professional capacity, even if from outside, I completely understand your hesitation and what you've already done to make things hard for yourself.
None of this is medical advice nor is it in any way a legal determination, as you will see.

For a start, asking the opinion on your condition from a government employee who isn't a health professional, and someone who has no right to basically make an assessment on whether you have a condition or not that would/could preclude you from owning firearms was a bad move.

Secondly, why would having Aspergers make you NOT a fit and proper person to own firearms from a legal standpoint? You should not self-assess this diagnosis as it relates to owning and using a firearm.
Have you a medical professional with which you have a previous relationship with (i.e. health history, regular doctor you see) that you could've/should've gotten advice from first? YOU MUST HAVE, if you have been diagnosed with this condition.
Yes I know this could be difficult, but is always a problem that individuals make for themselves unfortunately.

What I see is a person here who is understandably nervous about their personal condition due to erroneous laws and information and is also concerned that if down the track is deemed unsuitable to keep their possessions by some completely unqualified politically agenda driven public servant, you would lose those possessions with no compensation.

The loss of possessions thing... not necessarily. I believe there is always an option should that occur, for you to give any firearms to a nearby dealer for sale to someone else for a small fee if that ever eventuated. You wouldn't become a criminal because of a medical condition; you may just become illegible under the law.

[alexjones]

There was a bloke in a wheelchair in NSW who they said was not fit and proper. Any ailment ill be used against you.

[womble]

Could should may.

Yes it's not ideal.

Autism won't automatic disqualify. It would be assessed case by case.

Sapol has directed you to check the box. So that's what you do.

Then when you sit your licence they will discuss it with you privately. Likely ask for a letter from a treating psychiatrist.

I wouldn't have that letter prepared in advance.
But if or when asked for it I would get it sorted and submitted promptly.

That's how I think it will play out anyway.

Just do as they ask, upfront and honest.

Best of luck

[bladeracer]

I'm a young, autistic (Level 1 also know as Asperger's) man who is anxious about but wanting to get a firearms license for target shooting. The only reason I haven't made an application yet is because thanks to 7(2) of Firearms Act 2015 people can be denied a license due to any "mental illness" which may make them unsafe to possess firearms. I wholeheartedly believe I am safe to own firearms and that my autism is irrelevant to this however it doesn't matter what I believe as I'm not the one approving the application. I emailed SAPOL firearms branch about whether I should tick yes on the mental illness box on the form and the person who responded said that I do have to tick yes. This post isn't about the application process (I'll most likely make another one regarding that) but instead about the following scenario I thought of:

Say I get my firearms license and over the course of some years spend $3000 on firearms excluding ammo costs. $3000 has been taken from my bank account however I still own the items with which that money bought. The legislation gets updated, reinterpreted or through some other means it is determined that my autism legally prohibits me from holding a firearms license and thus my firearms are confiscated. In this situation am I given $3000 in compensation or have I lost both my money and the items I exchanged that money for? Is this the sort of thing that you could get insurance for? Have I misunderstood something and my thought process is flawed?

Thanks for any responses you may have!

The question is do you have a mental illness "that may make it unsafe for you to own firearms", not simply do you have a mental illness. All you should need is a letter from a professional that is treating your illness stating that he does not believe you to be a threat to yourself or anybody else. Since you have already told SAPOL that you have a mental illness you probably need to tick "yes" and supply a doctor's letter. Lots and lots of people get firearm licences without any issues despite having various mental illnesses. There are only some specific illnesses that might prohibit a licence, even clinical depression is okay.

If the law changes making it illegal to own your firearms then generally we do get some compensation. If your circumstances change prohibiting you from owning firearms then it would likely be on you to dispose of them for whatever you can get for them. The same thing can happen with your driver's licence, and probably most other types of government permissions.

Forget about the money. Buy whatever you want for whatever you want to spend on it. Eventually you might want to sell it so you'll get some return on it. If you actually enjoy shooting you will likely spend a whole lot more on ammo than on the firearms, and the ammo is pretty much all "wasted" money that you get zero return on. The firearms you can probably recoup most of your purchase prices when you sell them so don't worry about it. You will also likely spend a lot more than $3000 I've spend more than $5000 just on ammo this year already.

[Wapiti]

I just went over this with my wife who deals with this all the time - and Aspergers IS NOT a mental illness, it is a diagnosed f**king syndrome.
And it's a very common and normal condition. I bet most really anal, intelligent people that have it, have no idea they do.
It does not make you a danger to anyone else and it is NOT a disorder but a syndrome.

FFS do not take the advice of people off a forum who have NFI, including myself. See your GP for a heads up.
There should be no reason you even need to discuss it with anyone else legally.

This is such a shame and really is terrible what's going on here.

[Bugman]

I am a member of a club that has a member with diagnosed Aspergers. I would shoot next to that person any day of the week. They have had no problem with the powers that be in the many years I have known that person. To what degree the Aspergers is? I don't know and it really is none of my business.

[5-0]

just to clarify, yes you are required to tick yes.
Autism by itself isn’t classed as a mental illness in Australia. It’s considered a neurodevelopmental condition, not a psychiatric disorder. When it comes to applying for a firearms licence in South Australia under section 7(2) of the Firearms Act 2015, what matters is whether any medical condition (including autism) would make it unsafe for someone to possess or use a firearm.

Having autism doesn’t automatically disqualify you. SAPOL might ask for a medical or psychological report depending on your circumstances, but plenty of people on the spectrum are able to get a licence if they’re assessed as safe and responsible. It’s really about the individual, not the label.

If you are granted a licence and the laws change, generally you will be allowed to dispose/sell your firearms within a given time period, much like when a certain firearm that was once legal become illegal. Its not a given, but how it happens in practice.

[womble]

Maybe we should disqualify these autistic blokes because they have an unfair advantage in matches.

[I've Got AUGtism]

Thank you everyone for answering my question and reassuring me on the autism aspect. I think I'll go back to the firearm club I've been to once more so that I can say I've done 3 "come and try" days, have a conversation with my OT and then maybe also a GP in regards to any letter(s). After that I think I might just go for it and apply. One thing that might be even better though is if I join said club as a member since I don't need a license to join if I have an approval letter from the Registrar. Only issue is I can't find anything about getting a letter. Does anyone know how to get one? The firearm club's website also says a " 'fit and proper person' check " could be used but again I can't find anything online about it.

If anything I've said is wrong or could be a bad idea, please let me know!
Thanks again for your responses

(I'll post these questions as a new topic if that would be the better way to go about it)

[Oldbloke]

Maybe we should disqualify these autistic blokes because they have an unfair advantage in matches.

We need to remember. You are born with Autism. Not his fault.

In Victoria, you tick the NO box. But States seem to vary.

I'd like to wish the OP good luck.

[I've Got AUGtism]

Maybe we should disqualify these autistic blokes because they have an unfair advantage in matches.

We need to remember. You are born with Autism. Not his fault.

I think he was making a joke. I thought it was funny at least

I'd like to wish the OP good luck.

Thank you!

[Oldbloke]

"I think he was making a joke. I thought it was funny at least"

I was unsure.

[Robin]

Autism affects many people, and some may not even be aware they have it. Since autism presents differently in each individual, some may show little to no outward signs—Bill Gates is often cited as an example—while others may experience more noticeable challenges. This variability is similar to ADHD, where some individuals manage well while others struggle significantly.
If you're asked to indicate whether you have autism on a form, it's important to be honest if you've been diagnosed. A good approach is to obtain a doctor's letter stating that there are no medical concerns preventing you from holding a license, which can help clarify your eligibility and streamline the process.

[Oldbloke]

It's important to remember each state is different.

In Victoria you tick the No box if your autistic. That's a fact, at least it was 2 years ago.

[Wapiti]

Your medical history is private. Public "servants" ( ), with NO professional medical experience, and intent on looking for bogus reasons to put people down have no right to your medical history or diagnosis.

[Wapiti]

Good people can think for themselves.