Advice on noise cancelling earbuds for gunshots

[Wapiti]

Guys,

Can anyone provide any advice or update on what's available for gunshots in hunting applications?

Usually I use banded earplug-type hearing protection, just have to take the time to fit them from round my neck before taking a shot. That's ok when buggy or ute shooting, I just leave them in but it'd be nice to be able to hear conversation or sticks and stuff getting stuck under the vehicles.
I do like the hearing improvement from adjustable-microphone shooting muffs, but they are sweaty, bulky and restrict me getting behind a low scope properly, which I insist my field rifles have.

Questions I have are:
Do they cut out gunshots safely?
Do they still allow normal conversation or hearing yourself making noise in the bush on foot when turned on?
Is the volume adjustable without having a Phd in computer programming?
Easy to charge?
Easy to clean?

I have never used these things before, and imagine that they would be getting better and improving in useability. Maybe?

A preferred brand that's good would be very appreciated.

[No1_49er]

I use these https://goaxil.com/collections/ear-buds
USB-C recharging.
Yes, they cancel gunshot noise.
I have found that the minimum setting is very slightly above what I would call "ambient" - i.e. without their use. Great for the bush, even at minimum.
Yes, they are great for normal conversation.
Yes, the amplification can be increased, and the noise cancelling properties remain the same.
I don't recall that the product info' says as much but they "seem" to be reasonably waterproof. I forgot that I had put them in a shirt pocket which went through the wash. Dried them off, left in sun for a while - still good to go.
You can purchase replacement "grommets", of various sizes.

[Fester]

I have a pair slim class 3 type Howards, but I don't know if they really protect you from centerfire rifles up close.
Great for conversation and some bush noises, but not sure about some noises like a deer stepping on stuff in the distance.

I got the bulkier class 5 Howards as well as they can be found cheaper now.
At a range with big guns, and muzzle blasters, they are still not enough, and I wear plugs under.

I wear the plastic thing with buds around my neck, but it is annoying.
The protection is definitely better IMO.

I was thinking about wearing the light Howards again, as I only get one shot; I also have to fit the buds, so a snapshot could be missed.
I sometimes fit the one in the left ear to make it quicker or risk taking a snapshot.

The silicon pads can be got for about $35 from the Chinese web places, and are far superior, until one leaks lol

[Wapiti]

Thanks Fester, I think you're talking about slimmer earmuffs? Yeah, I want to give them a miss. The headbands always seem to clash with beanies, different caps, or those Kiwi fur-lined ear covering waxed cotton caps we use here so much in winter on buggies.
49er, thanks for the link, I will seriously look into those. Sounds what I'm after.
I've recently discovered from a life of metal trades and shooting that my hearing is seriously declining, and I find when using my different electronic muffs in the ute and walking out to find something, they really make it easier to hear how much noise I'm making.
I reckon buds would be great just to turn on, get the volume up a little and then any fast shots can just be taken without trying to get muffs or plugs in, which ruins some of the more important opportunities. Then, if I can't get the ears on, I know I will flinch at the terrible pain of the shot without anything there.

[Wapiti]

Hey are those Axil Bluetooth plugs available at any Aussie retailers or locally online maybe?

[morerams]

Try the Earmor M20T, seem to be reasonably priced.

[Fester]

The first Axil electronic plugs were a s**t product that shouldn't have been released.
Only got them for forest deer stalking and had to go back for a warranty swap.
When the replacement set failed, I got a refund and bought the big Howards, as the gun shop manager was really good.

Most normal and slimline muffs are class 3, and the noise cutting is only in the low 20 DB.
The bigger orange Protector brand and other good muffs are closer to 30 db so much better for rifle gunshots.
All those old shooters at the ranges are not deaf for no reason.
I was lucky to work in heavy industry and not lose much hearing.
The boilies used to smash big heavy railway containers with sledge hammers just near us.
We used muffs, but only when on the big pneumatic angle grinders and stuff.
My last 10 years were with production machinery, and that gave me 24-7 ringing but you get used to it.
You get used to gunshots, but at what cost.

Because of my sensitive hearing, shooting, work, bikes, and track days, I have tried just about all the affordable options and lots are not up for shooting, especially at big gun ranges and muzzle breaks.
The answer is the grey Skull Skrew plugs, electronic muffs turned up full, and you may hear range orders, but good luck having a conversation lol

I still wonder if exy hearing protection is much better, but not willing to pay on a gamble.

[Die Judicii]

Buds ??
Don't know if we are talking about the same thing or not,, but I bought a set of SoundGear (SG) electronic ear plugs.

When assembled and ready to slip into your ear they are only 14 mm long.
I used them several times, and found that they worked very well automatically blocking gun shots and then returning to the amplified normal sounds.

Excellent, except I've got old and buggered fingers,, so I packed them away thinking that I would be almost guaranteed to drop one or both in the long grass in the dark when first fitting them or if needing to put in a new battery.

Other than that I would recommend.

[Wapiti]

Buds, DJ, are what I believe now is the "hip" term for earplugs.
Get with the cool kids, man.

Festers points on Db ratings about plugs Vs Muffs are a good reminder of ratings and actually, how they don't bring the sound we experience down enough to actually stop hearing loss. 20Db? 30? Not enough.

Yeah I'm an ex-boily too, man the noise fitting and dogging tank shells.
I wore earplugs from the first day, hated them but they were essential. You could not physically cope with the noise without them, no wonder I'm getting hard of hearing.
Muffs did not work with welding and gouging hoods, or all the kinds of shields required for welding, cutting and grinding. Getting into specialised welding on exotic steels was the only way out of the big noise.

But the occupational shooting and hunting have topped it all off and is finishing me. The fact that we can't use sound suppressors and any further losses we suffer should be taken off the time on earth of the political pigs that deny us safety and respect. These failures do not contribute to a better human race, they only exist in places that where they can boss the rest of us around hiding behind a police force equally filled with low-quality bullies that in our world where skills are required to achieve, they would wither.
If I could bring a full-power rifle down to say, (+/-) 130Db with a suppressor, then take another 20-25Db off with plugs I can actually wear and use the rifle properly, I would be OK for a few shots a day at 105 Db.
But tiny minded, jealous and frightened men with tiny or inoperative penises and huge egos that have butt-drilled and dribbled their way into influence won't let me.

Don't know what to do now. By the sounds of things when quality issues pop up, it can be a right bitch. Or that what the glossy info-ads say are just that, what they hope the products actually are.
And all my google searches are only pointing to US suppliers.

[Wapiti]

Can anyone comment on the features of these? And do they fit within the price range of what others have used?
They also Bluetooth to tablets etc so could be used in aircraft too?

https://www.cleaverfirearms.com/Product ... &Brand=509

[Fester]

Buds, lol, I am not really that hip, man.
They sort of aptly describe the plastic headband types that I use when deer hunting, as they aren't even a proper plug shape.
Fitting plugs inside the ear canal properly cuts out a lot of extra noise.
I collected heaps in my last years as a Maint Fitter when the company claimed to have turned safety-focused.
The truth was that the huge Aus/USA company was having a hard time with workers comp, too many injuries.
They solved it with a "No lost time injury policy", company doctor sends every injured worker straight back to work on light duties.
Also employed extra safety glasses managers; the worst one was looking in blokes' ears and threatening them with the sack.
We just had to do most repairs after hours, as managers were not paid OT, so never there.

I wear the std green/yellow striped plugs with my many garden tools and riding bikes.
The orange ones do seem more effective for shooting, and do fine for shooting clays.

As Wapiti mentioned, I don't think we are cutting down the noise enough for gunshots, and now being shot with muzzle blasters at about 3' from bench ranges.

I would love to know the facts about the levels cut and what we really need.
Even the figures on the DB cutting are vague, and different from the USA, and Euro.

The pest control type property shooting brings in another angle, as many more shots could be fired compared to my hunting.
Also doing it on a regular basis.
It seems the Axils and other brands that may be from 2-$300 are still on the cheap side of things, so are they good enough?
I have never really heard reports on how higher-level electronic devices work, and what do they cost $800.

I also wonder what the muffs that paid ROs are wearing are, and are they much better than Howard's and stuff, cost also?
The only other option could be very exy electronic plug set-ups.

[Wapiti]

We have two pairs of Howard Leights, and two of the Walkers, and only one works anymore, and only amplifies and cuts the sounds on one side only now, a Walker.
But their ear cups (Walkers) are too small for me, even my Mrs thinks they feel like a child worked out the ergonomics.
I can only imagine the pain in the arse and the anger having earplugs 3-5x more expensive than them crack the s**ts, and put up with the ignorance of the distributors here as we aren't anywhere near a city.
I'll keep researching, maybe one of the lurkers here might pip up with some experiences.

I don't know how you buggers wear muffs over plugs, the thump of the trapped air in between drives me nucking futts. Other blokes out this way that shoot a lot all say the same thing.

[mickb]

How it works with hearing protection is technically none offer full protection in that even if you totally occlude the auditory canal( block the ears) sound still reaches the inner ear by bone conduction through the skull. particularly the face, teeth and bones around the ear. its how bone conduction hearing aids work, they put sound through the mastoid( the hard lump behind the ear).

Hearing protection still helps a lot of course, but science cant agree how much as the ratings for hearing protection are based around industrial noise, not high impulses like gunshots. Also there arewnt great studies showing how much hearing you lose even wearing muffs.

Generally the best protection is two sets, internal plugs and over the ear muffs, with decent clamping force as it reduces vibration around the ear. Also two sets dont double the protection rating, they add 5-10 DB to the top sets rating, for the reasons above, you can only block the ears so much, not the bone conduction. So a set of plugs at 25DB and a set of earmuffs at 30DB doesnt equal 55DB reduction its more like 35-40DB.

This is academic as most blokes wont tolerate two sets for hunting.

With electronic sets you go off the passive DB reduction rating. The cut out isnt really a cut out, its an illusion. The sound protection is passive, like wearing normal muffs, but the internal speakers make everything else sound louder. So they arent cutting out loud noise of the gun, they are just shuitting down the background noise amplifiers when the gun goes off.

[Wapiti]

Thanks Mick for that, it's a good bit of info how things work.

I've never been able to tolerate earplugs under muffs, there seems to be some sort of strange pressure caused between the air zone inside the muff cavity and the plug underneath, feels like some strange sort of pressure rise and fall in there. Not sure if that makes any sense but that's the sensation for me.

I ended up, after the initial posting of this thread and reading through it, I bought a set of ULTR X electronic noise cancelling buds, online from a big gunshop we buy from. They only have a rating of 26db, and I can definitely feel a better reduction that the banded ones I use now. Supposed to be 4-6db improvement and feels like a lot more.
They work like the electronic muffs but do not get in the way of stocks etc.
They also have that Bluetooth stuff to listen to music, and the noise-cancelling function like when on a plane etc.
So far so good.

I wasn't sure I'd like these - I make sure from a personal hygiene point of view my inner ears are clean so caring for them and cleaning is easier - and with anything going in and out of your ears from an infection perspective, you must clean them properly between use so you don't get a nasty inner ear infection. Even if they look clean.
people who wore/wear roll-up foam earplugs are told to make sure their hands are clean before using them, and to only use the foam ones once because they harbour infection in the foam. same deal with these, except the silicone parts don't absorb germs but they are still present if your hands are covered in bush germs, dirt, animal residue etc.
Anyway, they are doing what they are supposed to do, but require more care - cleaning after every use, storage in their charging case, more effort that muffs which you just turn off and hang up somewhere and walk off.
And hope a Redback doesn't find its way inside and cause a nasty incident.

Damn predictive text causing edits

[Bugman]

Me? I will talk to my audiologist for advice and go from there. Hearing is very precious for us all.

[Fester]

I have sensitive hearing and can feel how bad centerfire gunshots are.
I cringe when I see hunters using no protection, and seen all the old deaf blokes at ranges.
You do get used to it, but at what cost?

I have a kid that got ear infections, but luckily I never suffered from them, and loved the saltwater that he had problems with.
I now get more earwax, and keep using the plugs until they look disgusting enough to embarrass me into binning them lol.
I once went near deaf when the earwax thing started and created wax balls.
After the doctor managed to clear them, just, I walked out into the shopping plaza, and it was a buzz of noises, an amazing feeling.
I didn't even know, but blokes at work said they did notice that I couldn't hear.

I was lucky to keep great hearing, and long eyes for shooting through a lifetime working in heavy industry; now age will play out as that catches up on everyone.

They seem to use 2 ratings in general: class 3, and 5, from memory.
Even they are not exact, the USA, and Europe seem to have different noise reductions.

With the ranges now sending the blast sideways to the next bloke (big rear-vented brakes at 2m or less), I am not sure even using class 5 plugs plus class 5 muffs is really going to protect you. I have no other choice.
I don't go very often anymore, but not going to give up, as I love shooting.

I will look into these Ultra X ones as a hunting-type plug, as they sound Ok

[Wapiti]

So far so good, Fester.
I can't give you a long-term review, because I've only had them about 2 months I think.
They work just like the electronic muffs do, but for some strange reason, the shots from braked rifles (my culling/run-around rifles are all braked) seem markedly more subdued with these plugs. Perhaps its because there's no dead air capsule over my open ear canal like there is with muffs that sit (not quite) over my ears. Or are lifted by the stock on recoil.
I dunno, and don't care, I like them, and they allow you to walk around as normal, listen to amplified normal sounds if you wish, without the slippery sweat from awful muffs, and the continual pushing off my ears on awkward shots like muffs do.
You do need to realise that you must keep them clean, keep your ears clean, and look after them. You can't just chuck them in a box and walk off, like with muffs.
I don't reckon they would be good for lazy or grubby people.

[Fester]

I watched a vid and like the neat charger box, and has a few charges.
Can you turn it off to keep the plugs stored in the pack at all times to never lose them?

Plugs do seem a bit more effective than muffs for me.
Same with the higher-rated stuff that we need for gunshots.
From memory, the Class 3s may be about 24 Db reduction, but the class 5s are about 28.

You can notice straight away that the orange disposable plugs block more noise than the std yellow/green striped ones.
Then insert a set of Scull screws properly, and it's on another level of noise reduction.

Scull screws and the class 5 Howards tomorrow as you just don't know what will be beside you, and how close.

[Wapiti]

Yes you can sit them in the box to charge them, and store them securely.
Here they are clean in the charging case without the silicone ear inserts on them, they fit in there with your own personal size choice of those fitted.

UltrX.jpg (699.38 KiB) Viewed 112 times

I reckon, easiest way to keep them clean is to use those alco-wipes. That's what I do anyway.
I am also a fanatical personal-hygiene nut, so always keep my ears clean and free of those man-hairs that start growing in strange places as we get older.
The plugs do not get dirty visibly, but good practice is to clean them straight away before casing them. The disposable wipes make sure any germs from your hands from handling animals or any outdoor stuff, dust whatever is not going to be transferred to your ears and cause infections.

[Fester]

I used my dirty old set of skull screws, as thats what was in the console, I keep clean, and new wrapped ones in the car and range bag, but I pay for those buggers, so I can handle my own ear wax and looking grotty.

Got lucky, and the blokes space us down there, I think they know I like empty benches.
All deer hunters as neighbours so good talks and the closest thing to a blaster was a super light, short .308 with its stock radial break, they are nothing, even without divider boards.

I did see the wind on .223 as I put a big paper target at 300m.
Looked at Strelock on my phone and sent 5 CM rounds.
Both rifles printed respectable groups and spot on with dope.
The Creed was within the 9 ring but the .223 was blown about 7" sideways.

I couldn't even hit the small plate at 500 but it's been a while between drinks and I was lacking skill.
I couldn't even see hits at first, but improved through the day.
Not much plate painting goes on, so it's hard to call windage.
With the double range fees, a morning paint of the original sets of 500m plates would be nice.

[Wapiti]

You can't get a spotter mate?
A mate and I used to do a lot of that practice on the farm, on a 1000, range we made. Actually it went out to 1300 before the hill backstop ran out.
It's how we learnt to do everything in our heads, and using our eyes. All of that made a huge benefit to our daily shooting jobs, definitely I learnt that animal control should never mix with long range fantasy.
Anyway, when we swapped playing spotter for each other, we could track the bullet all the way down the huge curve as they fell, and see them put a hole in the target, splash on a plate, or where they hit and popped the balloons waving in the wind. Stapled to fallen logs at "trick" ranges. When everything's scripted amd paced out, learning stops right there.
It was amazing to be able to say, "5 inches left mate, correct for wind xxxxx..." "10kmh wind momentarily at the target, hold the shot" by sheer observation.
A massive difference and bonus to doing it on your lonesome.

[Fester]

Yeah, the best way to shoot long ranges would be on a suitable property with a couple of blokes.
Imagine the price of those spotting scopes, though.
I have a lower-priced one that could be used as it punches above its weight, but still can't see 22 cal holes in paper at 300m.

A great bloke who would give you the shirt off his back and helps new club hunters more than anyone I have ever met, walked over and left his Athlon with me to use after spotting for me on the last local range trip.
That thing was impressive for .22 LR holes at 200, and when questioned, he said it sees .223 holes at 300m, likely more depending on mirage. It was a $1,200 Athlon from memory, good value in my books.

Not being much into F-class shooting or long-range shooting school-type stuff, I just teach myself marksmanship skills.
The 500m bench range, and the sets of 4 different-sized plates are pretty ideal, apart from the dark grey gravel behind making splashes much harder than normal dirt.
It was ideal for self-training and to see hits, as there is a slight bit of flight time; near a second from memory, the bong noise takes several seconds.

Unless I do it once every 4-6 weeks, I do lose form and won't see hits in the morning, but generally come good with some time.
The rifle hasn't even been shot for months.

I was out of tune with range practice as pole-supported groups were not good, but the pole is on my wrong side.
I did a pool-que type hold and wound the scope zoomies down to get some improvement, but it does show how that the hunting shot must be a real steady picture and aim for sure, and closer is better.

The crowds dropped right off, and the bolt actions were packed back into the car.
With no one to shoot with ejected cases that can headshot blokes 3 benches down, and stacks of .22mag ammo that will be useless to me by next Xmas, I had a hoot with offhand practice with the CZ515, and 30-30 with near full cast loads, gas-checked loads that don't shoot low.

Offhand, on both rifles, I always finish with a routine, made possible at the big flat range, of sending one into the 50m mound, then working out, generally hit the 150 or 200, then it gets sketchy; often see a well short splash out around 400 or so, but put one on the big back mound behind 500m this time.
For me variety is what keeps shooting fun. When I was told that I should shoot rifles, triggers and scopes that were like clones of each other, I just about cringed and thought, how fkn boring.

The homemade Bummings dowel quad sticks came out, and most impressively, a fair group of 10 shots; if the few outer flyer types that made it look about 2" were removed, it would have been an oval group of about 1.5".
The sticks can be thrown out into position quickly, about 1 second, but it takes a further few seconds to set the rifle up.
Can flex the sticks a bit, or kick the rear leg for panning adjustment; vertical is as natural and quick as.
I shortened them about 1.5" to get downhill shots, but now need to bend or flex legs a touch; everything's a compromise, it seems.

I didn't really miss the range shooting much; see what happens next time if I am shooting more to form.

Next shoot is roos and carp bowfishing, as I set my hunting bow up for it, I hope it went low and slow enough.
If that doesn't go well, maybe the shotgun, but would have to ask permission to make it feel good to go, or take a look down the back swamp erea.
30 or 40 min with the 22s on spinners and exploding targets from under a shady tree feels so much like freedom, compared to rifle range these days.

Still got to clean rifles as I didn't touch them yesterday arvo.

Happy hunting and shooting blokes.

[Wapiti]

A good spotting scope is unreal for spotting game amongst the mountains and rocks and snow my unreal mates do in NZ.
They do not cut corners though, all have Swarovski's.
When you're charging a rich wannabe hunter up on the tops for $4k a day, you don't stuff around with anything marginal.
It depends on the budget, but not just the "gear" budget, the whole bloody experience, from the flights, the accommodation, the guiding fees, the trophy fee. Nobody serious scrimps on the optics, because lesser stuff misses the fine details, especially in terrible conditions.

Where is Athlon made?
Do Athlon make noise-cancelling earbuds? How did the thread get to this? Do the target shooters wear them?