Building a vault/storeroom

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Building a vault/storeroom

Post by Kelsey Cooter » 13 Feb 2020, 7:07 am

So I've started getting quotes on building a shed, and my plan is to build a storeroom in one bay.

Any of you blokes builders or have built a vault or storeroom?

I'm looking for ideas for whats the cheaper way to go, block or precast concrete walls?

Checked out a mates yesterday, he built a block room and poured a concrete roof, he's using it as a storeroom at the moment but only needs to upgrade his door to make it a vault, I like that idea.
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Re: Building a vault/storeroom

Post by Potatoes » 13 Feb 2020, 7:34 am

Depending on how thick you want your wall, i would consider that precast panels would need to be put in place with a crane. For cast in situ panels, you have to consider cost of formwork. For this reason i would consider blockwork such as 190mm core filled blocks. You could also consider multiple layers of compressed CFC sheet, or hebel, but the hebel is aerated (or maybe lightweight filler, can’t remeber) to make it lighter.

If you are wanting to make it more sledgehammer proof, reinforced concrete panels would be better though. If this is the case i would also consider adhering conveyor belt rubber to the whole surface, as this would absorb impacts, but this wouldn’t be a super cheap addition.
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Re: Building a vault/storeroom

Post by Ziad » 13 Feb 2020, 8:16 am

Henrik is aerated concrete panels. You were right mate
Blame it on the phone auto correct
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Re: Building a vault/storeroom

Post by Blr243 » 13 Feb 2020, 9:03 am

I think there is a couple of versions of Hebel. One structural one not. Hebel I think can b smashed through with a sledge. Compressed sheet comes in 12/ 15/18/25 mm those sorts of thicknesses. If want blockwork and u don’t want to employ a brick layer consider the core filled drystack system. Remember the thief will aim for the weakest point. So all parts of the construction must force a thief to say I GIVE UP THIS IS TOO MUCH EFFORT
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Re: Building a vault/storeroom

Post by Gamerancher » 13 Feb 2020, 9:09 am

A mate in the U.S built a vault using "cinder-blocks" as they call them. He ran the reo-bar from the floor up inside the walls and filled the blocks with concrete as they went up.
It was then capped with an 8 inch thick reinforced concrete roof, ( which doubles as a floor for the indoor range he built on top! ), There are no windows at all. It has a bank-safe type door and he runs an air-conditioner and de-humidifier in it.
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Re: Building a vault/storeroom

Post by perentie » 14 Feb 2020, 7:42 am

20 years ago I built mine out of a precast concrete tank. I built our high set house over it. They bought it in with a crane truck and put the precast lid on it. I then cut the door with my 10 inch angle grinder and framed it out in steel angle. Made the door from 3/8 plate with concealed hinges.
Inside I fixed vertical wood strips then pegs into that to hold the guns. Bench all round for reloading gear etc.
I still have a safe in the house though for keeping a gun handy.
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Re: Building a vault/storeroom

Post by Die Judicii » 14 Feb 2020, 8:28 am

Potatoes wrote:Depending on how thick you want your wall, i would consider that precast panels would need to be put in place with a crane.


The "precast" panels used for buildings (tilt slabs) are actually lighter than the otherwise concrete,,, but you are correct, a crane is still employed.

If I was gonna build a vault I would consider using a "good" shipping container, then weld reo bars to the exterior, and cover its entirety in 6" of concrete.
Then all ya have to worry about is fitting a Bank vault type door outside of the shipping container door.
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Re: Building a vault/storeroom

Post by Kelsey Cooter » 14 Feb 2020, 12:16 pm

Die Judicii wrote:
The "precast" panels used for buildings (tilt slabs) are actually lighter than the otherwise concrete,,, but you are correct, a crane is still employed.

If I was gonna build a vault I would consider using a "good" shipping container, then weld reo bars to the exterior, and cover its entirety in 6" of concrete.
Then all ya have to worry about is fitting a Bank vault type door outside of the shipping container door.


I've heard the shipping container idea a few times, but I always wonder, by the time you buy a decent container thats not going to rust out in 10years, wouldn't it end up cheaper to just go with blocks
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Re: Building a vault/storeroom

Post by sungazer » 14 Feb 2020, 2:23 pm

For the shipping container idea you would either need to hire or build form work to hold the concrete up around it unless you were digging a hole to put it in. When I made a large cattle shed some 20 odd years ago, I hired a modular form work that could be clipped together so walls could be made. They were built around Reo and vibrated, It was a bit expensive but still the cheapest form of construction. A totally solid build that has stood the test of time not a crack to be seen.
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Re: Building a vault/storeroom

Post by Blr243 » 14 Feb 2020, 2:41 pm

Let’s end the dispute about coal harming the atmosphere..I think we should all get together this weekend and build Australia’s first steel reinforced concrete nuclear power station
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Re: Building a vault/storeroom

Post by Kelsey Cooter » 14 Feb 2020, 4:46 pm

Blr243 wrote:I think there is a couple of versions of Hebel. One structural one not. Hebel I think can b smashed through with a sledge. Compressed sheet comes in 12/ 15/18/25 mm those sorts of thicknesses. If want blockwork and u don’t want to employ a brick layer consider the core filled drystack system. Remember the thief will aim for the weakest point. So all parts of the construction must force a thief to say I GIVE UP THIS IS TOO MUCH EFFORT


Do you think the structural hebel would qualify for vault walls?
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Re: Building a vault/storeroom

Post by Kelsey Cooter » 14 Feb 2020, 4:46 pm

90 Vault

(1)The vault must be made of concrete or concrete blocks filled with concrete.

(2)The vault door must be made of steel and have—

(a)steel door jambs; and

(b)a combination lock or built-in deadlock; and

(c)hinges that are welded to the door and door jamb.
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Re: Building a vault/storeroom

Post by Blr243 » 14 Feb 2020, 5:40 pm

Hebel might have that info
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Re: Building a vault/storeroom

Post by Stix » 14 Feb 2020, 5:45 pm

Kelsey...

Brick or block is the option...

Moisture will be your enemy...so you will need to address this with either a relatively well sealed room with some way of removing humidity, or well designed cross ventilation system that will circulate air from all dead corners of the room.

If in a shed, you'll need to lay a membrane beneath the slab--its not an option--, or you may have long term moisture problems that even your standard waterproofing systems will not be able to stop without ultimately destroying the concrete.

If you know the position of walls before slab is poured, increase the depth of slab in those areas to a standard strip footing-300x300-- & throw in basic cage/ligature & bar set up through those areas as per min requirement for standard raft footing (house slab)...this will give you enough depth to chem set in starter bars/tiedowns later when the wall is built & not risk slab failure from point loads.

With all respect to the suggestions, forget the concrete covered shipping containers...thats just a very expensive exercise in guaranteeing a moisture & rust nightmare.

If you go & do a basic brick laying course, & get a little education of concrete slumps, aggregat sizes, no fines concrete & compaction, building something like Gamerancher's friend will be easily achievable, at a very good cost...!!
Or with a little more expense, what sungazer has done...

Pre plan the inside, & design the walls to suit, as the bricks/blocks are modular, & if well designed, you'll streamline the construction process saving even more money...like running conduit for cabling, water supply etc before filling.& its easy to build in secret wall compartments with besser block construction with un noticable doulbe skin wall, & under floor fire resistant nooks & tunnels to keep your illegal immigrant business flowing unnoticed...

There is a company out there that will design & deliver light weight hollow walls that consist of 6mm cement sheet skin with glued in thin steel skeleton...all you do is drop it on the ground, prop it (like a light weight tilt panel), slide the reo through it & fill with concrete--no form work required...
Sorry cant think of the name of it nor the cost,, but i have worked with it before but cant show you pics because it was a ADF build & i dont want a skud missile attack on my house... :)... :lol: ...(dont have any pics--couldnt take any tech devices on site... :thumbsup: )

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Re: Building a vault/storeroom

Post by Stix » 14 Feb 2020, 5:57 pm

Hebel power panel...you can scratch through it with a screwdriver, & the thin reo in it is powder coated...you need lots of glue & a few guys to construct...it can get messy, & very dusty when cutting.
If you dont understand how the top hat should be used properly, you're almost guaranteed to have the wall crank, so you'll need control joints...& unlike brick/block work, you cant lay in brick ties for movement--you rely solely on mastic & correct top hat installation for controlled movement...so the lateral support from one panel to the other is not a patch on what you'll get from a brick bond concrete filled wall with tied down starter bars running vertically.
I could be wrong, but im sure power panel walls need further mechanical lateral restraint--thats why they are used on framed homes, & not as independant structural wall.
However, depending on the size of the room, the roof/ceiling & any internal walls may offer the required restraint you need...
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Re: Building a vault/storeroom

Post by Kelsey Cooter » 14 Feb 2020, 7:40 pm

Bloody legend Stix thanks for the info.

Mate realistically I know I'm not going to go off and do a brick laying course, so in terms of using a builder, is block the cheapest option?

I'm outside of Proserpine and I'm told the cheapest way to get garage sheds built here is to buy a shed kit from Mackay and have a local builder erect it, so the plan is to build the vault/storeroom at the same time.

I've only just starting the planning this week, I've started getting quotes from shed companys, I'm looking at building a 3 bay gable 12m x9m (as I also have a ski boat I'd like to get out of my farm shed).
This week I've also checked out 2 vaults that mates have had built.

Sounds like the cheapest way to put a vault in the shed is to actually build the shed like normal, and have the block walls inside of the shed, as it works out cheaper than custom designing a shed where part of the outside wall is the block wall of your vault.

Obviously I'm not here hoping you blokes will design my shed/vault for me, I'm just chasing as many ideas and opinions as possible, as I'm wanting to build it right, make it look good and keep it as cheap as possible.
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Re: Building a vault/storeroom

Post by Blr243 » 14 Feb 2020, 8:10 pm

Is this vault s purpose a walk in firearm storage area ie no steel safe required ?
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Re: Building a vault/storeroom

Post by Die Judicii » 14 Feb 2020, 9:40 pm

Somebody forgot to mention the alarm system amongst other things, that you will also need to have built in,, or installed at a later date.
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