SA gun seizure

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SA gun seizure

Post by dugachelli » 05 Aug 2019, 9:46 pm

Interesting report on ABC NEWS just in regarding a South Australian police raid on a individual who had allegedly was in possession of “dozens of firearms” of which some of them were supposedly illegal ( August 5th 2019).

“Dozens of semi-automatic rifles, handguns, insecure ammunition, a crossbow, silencer and gunpowder were among items allegedly found by South Australian police at an Adelaide Hills property.”

Also the police allegedly seize 32 registered firearms, and charge a 53 YO Brukunga man.

The bit that caught my eye was that amongst the seizure was “illegal reloading equipment” ???
So my question is when is reloading equipment illegal?
I have lots of reloading equipment and so is it possible that they are suggesting that you should only the calibres that you are registered for and not any that you are not registered for.
For example my son owns a hornet and I don’t and he gets me to clean his cases for him so I have some hornet empty cases and some dies for him to use, am I in possession of illegal reloading equipment?
In WA you can be charged for having illegal ammunition, stuff you aren’t licensed for, do you think that includes reloading equipment as well?

What you think.
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Re: SA gun seizure

Post by bladeracer » 05 Aug 2019, 10:02 pm

dugachelli wrote:The bit that caught my eye was that amongst the seizure was “illegal reloading equipment” ???
So my question is when is reloading equipment illegal?
I have lots of reloading equipment and so is it possible that they are suggesting that you should only the calibres that you are registered for and not any that you are not registered for.
For example my son owns a hornet and I don’t and he gets me to clean his cases for him so I have some hornet empty cases and some dies for him to use, am I in possession of illegal reloading equipment?
In WA you can be charged for having illegal ammunition, stuff you aren’t licensed for, do you think that includes reloading equipment as well?

What you think.


WA is likely the most problematical as they firstly only allow you to possess ammunition for firearms listed on your licence, and secondly, they include components as ammunition - bullets and brass. In WA you cannot possess a .224" bullet unless you have a licence for something that shoots .224" bullets. Likewise you cannot possess .223Rem brass unless you specifically own a .223Rem chambered firearm. I believe this has been a problem for people that form their own brass, wanting to buy .308Win brass to make their own 7mm-08 or .243 for example.

I don't believe WA has any restriction on possession of reloading dies for cartridges you don't own, but I left there five years ago so it may have changed.

Your specific example, if you are not co-licenced for his Hornet you are not allowed to be in possession of Hornet brass.
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Re: SA gun seizure

Post by dugachelli » 05 Aug 2019, 10:20 pm

Thanks for quick reply....... interesting though, I wasn’t aware, but fore warned is fore armed.
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Re: SA gun seizure

Post by duncan61 » 05 Aug 2019, 10:50 pm

It seems to vary with which police you deal with.When I had my safe inspection around Christmas time I asked about empty brass as I had my polisher out and was told brass is not ammunition and I am permitted to keep powder and projectiles in the shed.I had to get a small safe from Bunnings to secure live ammo which I did.Its probably written in the fine print somewhere and I think I have seen it that all components are regarded as ammo but i still scrap damaged empty cases with my plumbing brass.I also asked about my collection which goes from catshot to 416 Rigby which are fired brass with the shot primer in and a projectile and polished cos I like to look at them and again it was not an issue.The big deal is storage of firearms and ammo.Loading gear is fine.My press is bolted to my BBQ on the back patio
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Re: SA gun seizure

Post by TassieTiger » 05 Aug 2019, 10:50 pm

bladeracer wrote:
dugachelli wrote:The bit that caught my eye was that amongst the seizure was “illegal reloading equipment” ???
So my question is when is reloading equipment illegal?
I have lots of reloading equipment and so is it possible that they are suggesting that you should only the calibres that you are registered for and not any that you are not registered for.
For example my son owns a hornet and I don’t and he gets me to clean his cases for him so I have some hornet empty cases and some dies for him to use, am I in possession of illegal reloading equipment?
In WA you can be charged for having illegal ammunition, stuff you aren’t licensed for, do you think that includes reloading equipment as well?

What you think.


WA is likely the most problematical as they firstly only allow you to possess ammunition for firearms listed on your licence, and secondly, they include components as ammunition - bullets and brass. In WA you cannot possess a .224" bullet unless you have a licence for something that shoots .224" bullets. Likewise you cannot possess .223Rem brass unless you specifically own a .223Rem chambered firearm. I believe this has been a problem for people that form their own brass, wanting to buy .308Win brass to make their own 7mm-08 or .243 for example.

I don't believe WA has any restriction on possession of reloading dies for cartridges you don't own, but I left there five years ago so it may have changed.

Your specific example, if you are not co-licenced for his Hornet you are not allowed to be in possession of Hornet brass.


If I’m going out shooting with a few friends and they have a caliber I don’t and vice versa, well agree that if you want to shoot a bunch - pick up your own ammo for the rifle of your mate, that you want to shoot and use that for the weekend / shoot...but In WA - you can’t do that ? Does that mean in wa - you can’t really “legally” trial another caliber before committing to buy? As you’d not be licensed...
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Re: SA gun seizure

Post by Tank » 05 Aug 2019, 11:57 pm

Your specific example, if you are not co-licenced for his Hornet you are not allowed to be in possession of Hornet brass

I have no idea which piece of legislation tells us we can’t possess ‘brass’ of a caliber you don’t have a registered firearm for.....

Sorry....but that’s not the case in SA Blade.
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Re: SA gun seizure

Post by bladeracer » 06 Aug 2019, 12:21 am

TassieTiger wrote:If I’m going out shooting with a few friends and they have a caliber I don’t and vice versa, well agree that if you want to shoot a bunch - pick up your own ammo for the rifle of your mate, that you want to shoot and use that for the weekend / shoot...but In WA - you can’t do that ? Does that mean in wa - you can’t really “legally” trial another caliber before committing to buy? As you’d not be licensed...


In WA you can use a firearm under the supervision of the registered owner, but you can't borrow it, as in take over responsibility for it. You have to have the firearm added to your licence for that. And you can't legally buy or possess ammo for a firearm not listed on your licence.
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Re: SA gun seizure

Post by bladeracer » 06 Aug 2019, 12:22 am

Tank wrote:Your specific example, if you are not co-licenced for his Hornet you are not allowed to be in possession of Hornet brass

I have no idea which piece of legislation tells us we can’t possess ‘brass’ of a caliber you don’t have a registered firearm for.....

Sorry....but that’s not the case in SA Blade.


I know it's not the case in SA, largely because SA is not WA :-)
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Re: SA gun seizure

Post by duncan61 » 06 Aug 2019, 12:23 am

In the 3 years I have been on this forum this brass is ammo has come up a few times.All shooting in W.A. is done on private property sometimes in remote places.I remember that there is a clause where a firearm owner can give an employee a firearm to do a specific thing like cull stock or vermin as long as they are on the property its all good.I would not be worried about having a bit of brass.It always seems to be people from other states that get a stiffy for W.A. gun laws but everyone I know here is good with it.I went handgun shooting last week and it was a friendly club looking to encourage new members.I have never attended some of the ranges that get mentioned on this forum but it all sounds very political
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Re: SA gun seizure

Post by trekin » 06 Aug 2019, 2:18 am

So, will the 30 odd 'registered firearms' be returned to there owners??
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Re: SA gun seizure

Post by bladeracer » 06 Aug 2019, 6:53 am

trekin wrote:So, will the 30 odd 'registered firearms' be returned to there owners??


I thought they were registered to himself?
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Re: SA gun seizure

Post by Tank » 06 Aug 2019, 9:42 am

SA Gun seizures is the title.....
So what’s WA got to do with the OP?
Just saying....
Brass is not ammo regardless of state legislation....
The perp was probably an associate biker....
so I don’t particularly give 2 s*#ts if the cops give anyone’s guns back.
The media can call anything illegal...they’re no authority....I wouldn’t read too much into their BS....
Too much hysteria people.
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Re: SA gun seizure

Post by Sawyers » 06 Aug 2019, 10:55 am

TassieTiger wrote:
bladeracer wrote:
dugachelli wrote:The bit that caught my eye was that amongst the seizure was “illegal reloading equipment” ???
So my question is when is reloading equipment illegal?
I have lots of reloading equipment and so is it possible that they are suggesting that you should only the calibres that you are registered for and not any that you are not registered for.
For example my son owns a hornet and I don’t and he gets me to clean his cases for him so I have some hornet empty cases and some dies for him to use, am I in possession of illegal reloading equipment?
In WA you can be charged for having illegal ammunition, stuff you aren’t licensed for, do you think that includes reloading equipment as well?

What you think.


WA is likely the most problematical as they firstly only allow you to possess ammunition for firearms listed on your licence, and secondly, they include components as ammunition - bullets and brass. In WA you cannot possess a .224" bullet unless you have a licence for something that shoots .224" bullets. Likewise you cannot possess .223Rem brass unless you specifically own a .223Rem chambered firearm. I believe this has been a problem for people that form their own brass, wanting to buy .308Win brass to make their own 7mm-08 or .243 for example.

I don't believe WA has any restriction on possession of reloading dies for cartridges you don't own, but I left there five years ago so it may have changed.

Your specific example, if you are not co-licenced for his Hornet you are not allowed to be in possession of Hornet brass.


If I’m going out shooting with a few friends and they have a caliber I don’t and vice versa, well agree that if you want to shoot a bunch - pick up your own ammo for the rifle of your mate, that you want to shoot and use that for the weekend / shoot...but In WA - you can’t do that ? Does that mean in wa - you can’t really “legally” trial another caliber before committing to buy? As you’d not be licensed...

If some accidentally leaves spent brass from a calibre you dont own in your vehicle you can be charged for it.
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Re: SA gun seizure

Post by bladeracer » 06 Aug 2019, 1:17 pm

Tank wrote:SA Gun seizures is the title.....
So what’s WA got to do with the OP?
Just saying....
Brass is not ammo regardless of state legislation....
The perp was probably an associate biker....
so I don’t particularly give 2 s*#ts if the cops give anyone’s guns back.
The media can call anything illegal...they’re no authority....I wouldn’t read too much into their BS....
Too much hysteria people.


Did you actually read the post, at all?
"In WA you can be charged for having illegal ammunition, stuff you aren’t licensed for, do you think that includes reloading equipment as well?"
The article mentioned "illegal reloading equipment" apparently, the OP was curious what that might refer to.
As he is in WA, that makes WA-relevant answers particularly useful to him.

If, as in WA, the state legislates that bullets and brass are classified as "ammunition", then it is indeed ammunition, and you'd be a fool to disregard the law.

If any stolen guns (I didn't see any mention of stolen guns in the article I read) happened to have been stolen from you you wouldn't care if they were returned?
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Re: SA gun seizure

Post by on_one_wheel » 06 Aug 2019, 2:09 pm

I guess this thread makes one thing clear.

Firearms laws vary from state to state.
What applies in WA doesn't necessarily apply in SA

It's best to do your own homework by reading your own states regulations and legislations.

I'm in SA, I keep hard copies of both of the act and the legislation, I can't find anything specific to reloading equipment in either regs. or the legislations. They don't appear to be restricted items.

The article I read didn't mention "illegal reloading equipment" it just grouped the whole lot, legal to own or not, together as a "haul"
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News reports have to be taken with a grain of salt, quite often the reporter or writer adds their own spin to advance their personal agenda.
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Re: SA gun seizure

Post by Oldbloke » 06 Aug 2019, 2:21 pm

"News reports have to be taken with a grain of salt, quite often the reporter or writer adds their own spin to advance their personal agenda."

Spot on. Or they dont have a clue. Many things in this world are specialised. And reporters are only specialised in talking BS.
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Re: SA gun seizure

Post by marksman » 06 Aug 2019, 8:09 pm

Oldbloke wrote:"News reports have to be taken with a grain of salt, quite often the reporter or writer adds their own spin to advance their personal agenda."

Spot on. Or they dont have a clue. Many things in this world are specialised. And reporters are only specialised in talking BS.


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Re: SA gun seizure

Post by elnino » 06 Aug 2019, 11:05 pm

if you look at the pictures posted by SAPOL it would appear that the count of seized firearms was in the hundreds. there is a literal steel cage crate full! Media reported 'over 300' in total which looks plausible.

this also coincides with several arrests over a 2012 shooting/murder here in adelaide and is possibly linked but that is pure guesing. there is also the possibility he was just a (illegal) collector. There are no reports that this person had any intention of going crazy with them but he could have been a dealer on the black market too.

As for SA laws, ammo is not classed as such until it is complete. primers and powder have seperate requirements but a shell is a shell and a bullet is a bullet. not classed as ammo until a firable round from my understanding. even air rifle pellets no longer need a license to aquire.

the only restriction on posessing ammo is that it is stored securely and not more than 12 months supply. suitable firearm posession is irrelevant but might put you under undue scrutiny.
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