Where can my gun be kept?

[Oldbloke]

No argument. But the general public read the forum. So we need to keep that in mind when we post. The word can be interpreted in many ways.
I don't use it for that reason.

[Title_II]

My bayonet is not a weapon, either. It's obviously designed for cutting my steak and opening packages. And my saber was designed for trimming tree branches Unfortunately my guns can't realistically be used for either of those purposes. The only thing they can do is kill or destroy. OK, enough on my end

[deye243]

so the government and the school teachers have won here Title_II ............. a weapon is a weapon is a weapon everyone needs get over it and apologise for nothing

you see that's most of the problem here in Australia the land of the apologist , the main problem is us and not being out there in their faces you see a lot of the laws

here say we can't do anything that will cause the public alarm and it has brainwashed most of the licence holders as well where they skulk around in the shadows

we are the new homos that can't find the door to get out there and be loud and proud

and no it's not this is the I see it and I'm not the only one .

[bigfellascott]

I take it the wife has a purse with your balls in it?

Man up and just put the bloody safe in your place somewhere and stop letting her push you around (if you let them they will run your life for you) time to man up, open the purse, re-attach the balls and start livin again.

Oh yeah welcome to the forum.

[<<Genesis93>>]

The 'weapon' argument is NOT as pedantic or silly or insignificant as some make out, has been covered ad nauseam around here....
apart from the FACT that we as mere civilians are specifically prohibited from owning guns TO KILL PEOPLE..... or in other terms 'self defence', which removed the 'possessing a weapon' part...

In Aus only law enforcement agencies, State/Fed Police, various (numerous) intelligence / corruption outfits....property protecting and person protecting guards...

And this is the important bit;

The term WEAPON is used in the pejorative sense (negative / insulting / disparaging ) by the media AND the grabtard class, toward the lawful firearm owners to describe 'our' lawful firearms and particularly those who possess them (you and I) in the negative "they are used to kill people" sense... THAT is their mantra; "they are only used to kill others" hence they must referred to them as weapons - rarely if ever as firearms...

Yes, term can refer to ANY implement (hammer, golf club, bottle drinking glass, a motor vehicle, literally ANYTHING) either possessed with the intention to or actually used to injure or kill another PERSON (I absolutely discount the animal link)

Yes, there is the WEAPONS Act in Qld.... concerning firearms - Just an official version of the above pejorative.

Yes, there is the Control of WEAPONS Act in Vic, other states, dealing with non-firearm 'weapons' such as knives (that we can not carry - with particular exceptions) based on the assumption that anyone 'carrying' a knife or multitude of other sharp/point/heavy/noxious/protective etc articles, are doing so solely to inure others....

And YES... our firearms could be used as weapons....but they are not (formally/legally) possessed AS weapons.

So me, personally, I never refer to my firearms as weapons, and discourage the use of the term - it's about education...you other guys might disagree and think I'm 'over thinking' it, thats fine, you can call your guns anything, even daisys if you like....

[Title_II]

And yet you call them "firearms." Where exactly does "arms" come from in the term "firearms?"

Perhaps you should start calling them "that pew pew pew thing." Wait - that might be too many pews, let's that call them "that pew thing."

Yes, term can refer to ANY implement (hammer, golf club, bottle drinking glass, a motor vehicle, literally ANYTHING) either possessed with the intention to or actually used to injure or kill another PERSON (I absolutely discount the animal link)

All of those "implements" have a purpose other than destruction. The only thing a gun does it put holes in people, animals, and things. Or, with the proper ammo, set them on fire and/or blow them up. They don't build a house, play a round of golf, get you a drink, or transport you from point A to point B. They only destroy and kill. And all of them were designed with that in mind, again with the exception of competition and training guns, which were designed to train and demonstrate expertise in destroying and killing.

I know I said I was bowing out but you just can't argue or rationalize your way out of this, and it was directed at me. I understand my mates over there live under difficult conditions, and I might not completely understand what it is like. But I've been here a while and I think I have some idea. So I can't tell you what to do, but I will tell you what I think.

[<<Genesis93>>]

We can have pew, also pew pew... but not pewpewpewpewpew.... (no semi autos)..

'fire' held by the 'arms'...like making 'fire'...propelling with fire?? whats the point?

I realise they were "designed to kill people"... thats the basis of their demented ideology...

I know exactly how to think.....I just refuse to comply with the nonsense programing of Ms. Rebecca Peters (&Co.) who you guys sent BACK to us recently...

[Title_II]

We can have pew, also pew pew... but not pewpewpewpewpew.... (no semi autos)..

'fire' held by the 'arms'...like making 'fire'...propelling with fire?? whats the point?

I realise they were "designed to kill people"... thats the basis of their demented ideology...

I know exactly how to think.....I just refuse to comply with the nonsense programing of Ms. Rebecca Peters (&Co.) who you guys sent BACK to us recently...

Fire held by the arms? Are you serious? "Arms" means weapons

[<<Genesis93>>]

We can have pew, also pew pew... but not pewpewpewpewpew.... (no semi autos)..

'fire' held by the 'arms'...like making 'fire'...propelling with fire?? whats the point?

I realise they were "designed to kill people"... thats the basis of their demented ideology...

I know exactly how to think.....I just refuse to comply with the nonsense programing of Ms. Rebecca Peters (&Co.) who you guys sent BACK to us recently...

Fire held by the arms? Are you serious? "Arms" means weapons

No I wasnt. .... not fully...

Arms from Armament.. Arma.. it is NOW meaning weapons... it has an origin

[Title_II]

OK, mate, you scared me for a moment And I know Americans are dumb, but I did take four years of Latin

I really want to get out of this because it's obviously touchy and I don't want to be a pain. Would appreciate nobody taking a serious go at me, I am a guest here trying to be on good behavior and don't want to be baited (not about you, Genesis). I want to help if I can but I don't want to upset my hosts.

[Supaduke]

Fire arms

IMG_0339.JPG (28 KiB) Viewed 6678 times

Now we know

You're welcome

[<<Genesis93>>]

OK, mate, you scared me for a moment And I know Americans are dumb, but I did take four years of Latin

I really want to get out of this because it's obviously touchy and I don't want to be a pain. Would appreciate nobody taking a serious go at me, I am a guest here trying to be on good behavior and don't want to be baited (not about you, Genesis). I want to help if I can but I don't want to upset my hosts.

There might just come a day.... when you guys DO indeed help us with your fiery arms once you sort out your business over there... you can come over here and back us with our revolution [flag ASIO],

THAT is the only way we'll sort out OUR mess.....

And it is quite touchy...the matter of gun control, because the more crime we experience, car jackings, armed home and business invasions... - the more and louder the gun control noise.

We sure do have our fair share of dumb... they mostly seem to be in government though

[bladeracer]

All of those "implements" have a purpose other than destruction. The only thing a gun does it put holes in people, animals, and things. Or, with the proper ammo, set them on fire and/or blow them up. They don't build a house, play a round of golf, get you a drink, or transport you from point A to point B. They only destroy and kill. And all of them were designed with that in mind, again with the exception of competition and training guns, which were designed to train and demonstrate expertise in destroying and killing.

Putting holes in things is not automatically "destruction", lots of other tools do the same for purposes of construction. We shoot animals to harvest them, not to destroy them - there is a difference.
They certainly do not _only_ kill and destroy.
Very, very, very few firearms held by non-military people ever get used to kill or destroy people, and a very, very large number never kill or injure any living thing. If that were their "only purpose" I can only say that there has never been any invention less fit for purpose than a firearm, with the obvious exception of politicians.

Warfare is the driving force behind almost all human evolution, a lot of the technological evolution aimed at designing more effective ways to kill people and destroy things - weapons. But when that technology is further evolved in time of peace it is no longer a weapon, the same with firearms. The first firearms were invented as weapons, and that was their only purpose. During peace time they became tools for training the skills of military people, although actually using those "training" firearms as weapons against actual people or materiel was very unlikely. When these training firearms evolved into more efficient training tools using very un-military cartridges, like .22LR, and even paintball and airsoft, their "only purpose" was certainly not to kill or destroy anything at all, ever.
Target shooting and hunting may well be handy training if you ever need to use firearms as weapons, but warfare or defence is certainly not the intent of pursuing those activities - it is merely recreational.

[Title_II]

All of those "implements" have a purpose other than destruction. The only thing a gun does it put holes in people, animals, and things. Or, with the proper ammo, set them on fire and/or blow them up. They don't build a house, play a round of golf, get you a drink, or transport you from point A to point B. They only destroy and kill. And all of them were designed with that in mind, again with the exception of competition and training guns, which were designed to train and demonstrate expertise in destroying and killing.

Putting holes in things is not automatically "destruction", lots of other tools do the same for purposes of construction. We shoot animals to harvest them, not to destroy them - there is a difference.

No, you shoot animals to KILL them. And NOBODY uses a gun to put the kinds of holes in things that are used for construction. Well, there may be some Yank video on youtube somewhere, but let's be reasonable and honest about this.

They certainly do not _only_ kill and destroy.
Very, very, very few firearms held by non-military people ever get used to kill or destroy people, and a very, very large number never kill or injure any living thing. If that were their "only purpose" I can only say that there has never been any invention less fit for purpose than a firearm, with the obvious exception of politicians.

Warfare is the driving force behind almost all human evolution, a lot of the technological evolution aimed at designing more effective ways to kill people and destroy things - weapons. But when that technology is further evolved in time of peace it is no longer a weapon, the same with firearms. The first firearms were invented as weapons, and that was their only purpose. During peace time they became tools for training the skills of military people, although actually using those "training" firearms as weapons against actual people or materiel was very unlikely. When these training firearms evolved into more efficient training tools using very un-military cartridges, like .22LR, and even paintball and airsoft, their "only purpose" was certainly not to kill or destroy anything at all, ever.
Target shooting and hunting may well be handy training if you ever need to use firearms as weapons, but warfare or defence is certainly not the intent of pursuing those activities - it is merely recreational.

What percentage of the guns that you own were not designed to kill something? I've been on this forum for years. Pretty much the only thing you do with weapons, for the most part, is kill things. It seems like target (killing) practice and competition (killing competitions) are pretty rare among my mates in OZ, with the exception of people that justify handgun ownership. Don't get me wrong, I have no doubt you mates enjoy it. But let's be honest.

Paintball and airsoft are not guns, and have no place in this discussion. But,incidentally, they are intended to simulate KILLING.

Every firearm I own is a weapon. And I shoot them frequently. Guess how many things with a pulse I have shot with a firearm in the past 10 years? ZERO. That does not change the fact that they are weapons. Most of you guys are killing stuff every chance you get, and you tell me you don't own weapons.

Just call them firearms if that works for you. That seems to be your preference. That still means you are calling them arms, and thus weapons.

I really should be leaving this alone, because I understand there is a cultural issue here. But my mates here keep responding directly to me, and the absurd denial is pushing one of my buttons, even though I realize it's a simple matter of cultural norm that probably started with a wink, nod, and a rash of BS some decades ago.

[Title_II]

If what I am saying is going to look bad in our culture in OZ, go ahead and delete it. I have no problems with that, seriously. I don't want to cause issues. But don't bullXXXX me. I would suggest thinking about why we may bullXXXX ourselves.

[bladeracer]

If what I am saying is going to look bad in our culture in OZ, go ahead and delete it. I have no problems with that, seriously. I don't want to cause issues. But don't bullXXXX me. I would suggest thinking about why we may bullXXXX ourselves.

I don't think that is the case at all.
We use the same letters in our alphabets, but our languages are quite different.
In the US perhaps "weapon" is the common term for what we commonly refer to as "firearms".
We simply have different definitions for the same words.

Similar to people that refer to bullets as projectiles.
A bullet, like anything else, becomes a projectile upon being launched - until then it is a bullet.

[Title_II]

I'm afraid of bullets. Or projectiles, if you prefer. I'm not afraid of words

[albat]

F__k Ive had GUNS since i was a kid

[<<Genesis93>>]

Putting holes in things is not automatically "destruction".......

No of course not, it can be more constructive than DEstructive.... With the current situation in Vic, many recipients would respond quite well to increasing their lead content

[brett1868]

OK, mate, you scared me for a moment And I know Americans are dumb, but I did take four years of Latin

I really want to get out of this because it's obviously touchy and I don't want to be a pain. Would appreciate nobody taking a serious go at me, I am a guest here trying to be on good behavior and don't want to be baited (not about you, Genesis). I want to help if I can but I don't want to upset my hosts.

Americans are not "dumb"....they are "Special"
You are not a guest, I think of you as "One of Us"

[Title_II]

Well, thank you...I think

[Gwion]

It's purely a matter of negative connotation for public perception. Talking about weapons has the connotation that we intend to kill, injure or main people with our firearms.

There is also the point of correctly describing an item. I have 20-30 knives laying around but I don't say "I need a weapon to cut this rope"; even though the kitchen knife is the most common murder weapon in Australia.

See how I used the word knife to describe the item and weapon to describe its use???

Same goes with firearms. Only weapons if used as such, regardless of design premise.

[Title_II]

It's purely a matter of negative connotation for public perception. Talking about weapons has the connotation that we intend to kill, injure or main people with our firearms.

There is also the point of correctly describing an item. I have 20-30 knives laying around but I don't say "I need a weapon to cut this rope"; even though the kitchen knife is the most common murder weapon in Australia.

See how I used the word knife to describe the item and weapon to describe its use???

Same goes with firearms. Only weapons if used as such, regardless of design premise.

Plowed ground

Some knives are obviously weapons. Some knives may be used as weapons. But bayonets and sabers are always weapons. Just like guns A rose by any other name

This thread has tried a dozen different ways to win a losing argument and a dozen more won't get the job done any better. There is absolutely no point I am missing here that needs to be explained to me. I laid out the facts right up front, and the truth can't be changed. Oh well, hope I haven't stepped on any toes

[bigfellascott]

Funny how they never described the car that killed 5 people in Melbourne as a "Weapon" even though it was used to kill people, yet if it had of been a firearm used it would have been "Weapon this Weapon that". Same with the box of matches or Lighter that was used to kill those people in the old peoples home, no mention of those being used as a weapon - gotta love the media.

[brett1868]

In times like these let us turn to the dictionary.

Weapon
noun
1. any instrument or device for use in attack or defense in combat, fighting, or war, as a sword, rifle, or cannon.
2. anything used against an opponent, adversary, or victim: the deadly weapon of satire.
3. Zoology. any part or organ serving for attack or defense, as claws, horns, teeth, or stings.

My understanding is that a rifle can only be classed as a weapon when used as a means of attack or defense against another person.

[Title_II]

Funny how they never described the car that killed 5 people in Melbourne as a "Weapon" even though it was used to kill people, yet if it had of been a firearm used it would have been "Weapon this Weapon that". Same with the box of matches or Lighter that was used to kill those people in the old peoples home, no mention of those being used as a weapon - gotta love the media.

We already covered this

In times like these let us turn to the dictionary.

Weapon
noun
1. any instrument or device for use in attack or defense in combat, fighting, or war, as a sword, rifle, or cannon.
2. anything used against an opponent, adversary, or victim: the deadly weapon of satire.
3. Zoology. any part or organ serving for attack or defense, as claws, horns, teeth, or stings.

My understanding is that a rifle can only be classed as a weapon when used as a means of attack or defense against another person.

And this you turkey

[brett1868]

And this you turkey

Gee...you are polite, most call me names that cannot be repeated but I consider myself more a clown then a turkey. If you're free June 27 - July 2 and can get to Raton NM it'd be great to catch up for a few drinks and a feed, always great to meet up other members.

[happyhunter]

JJD WTf , ask her if the garage is ok

Good idea. Tell her to move into the garage.

[Supaduke]

Man this thread took off on few tangents that's for sure

[deye243]

Man this thread took off on few tangents that's for sure

as all good threads do