Value priced .223 recommendation please

[matt4350]

Hi guys and ladies,

First post, please be gentle! I wish to draw on your knowledge and experience, if I may. Most of my experience is with service rifles but I'm keen to do a bit of feral hunting and plinking now.

I'm after a reasonably priced .223, up to $1000 but preferably lower. It will be used for goats, hopefully dogs, and the odd pig perhaps. I'm not likely to use it out further than 300 yards (wishful thinking ) My other big use is wasting ammo at the range, just for fun.

I'd prefer a bolt action, detachable magazine, shorter barrel (maybe 20"?), and a synthetic stock. Bonus if it has iron sights.

So far, I've identified Ruger (American Compact and Ranch Rifle), Mossberg (MVP), Remington (700 ADL), and Howa (1500 mini action).

I got to handle the American Compact, it seemed okay but not impressive, like it was a bit flimsy, but that's just an impression. I've read a bit on the MVP and the results are quite mixed in the reviews. Does Remington do the ADL in .223 with a 20" barrel, it seems not? My only rifle at the moment is a Howa 1500 .308, I've no problems with it so I assume the .223 version would be fine, but I'd be keen to know what others have experienced if they're after the same type of rifle.

Cheers to anyone who might give me the benefit of their experience/food for thought,

Matt

[nooman]

Under $1000 I would say Howa is best bang for your buck.

If you're willing to stretch your budget a few hundred dollars, I got to poke some paper with a Lithgow LA102 the other week and it is a fine rifle, I am starting to save up for one in .223 (once they finish sorting out the issues with it)

[Gaznazdiak]

Howa 1500.
No question, the best bang for your buck.
Got one, love it.

[Member-Deleted]

Howa 1500.
No question, the best bang for your buck.
Got one, love it.

+ 1 .

[southwest shooter]

Dgo buya Howa mini action and stop wasting time !

[JimTom]

Mate for under $1000 the Howa is the go as already stated. For circa $100 extra you could get a Tikka T3x. I have one in .223 and rate it highly.
If you are going to shoot pigs as well don’t discount moving up to a .243 as a bit of an all round caliber.

[MontyShooter]

Lithgow la102 would be my no.1 choice.
Tikka t3x no.2.
Howa are a good cheap functional rifle but their stocks let them down a bit.

[Gwion]

Lithgow la102 would be my no.1 choice.
Tikka t3x no.2.
Howa are a good cheap functional rifle but their stocks let them down a bit.

Howa is the only one in the OP's "sub $1k" budget.

For the OP's stated target species when hunting, I would suggest the Howa Mini Action in 6.5 Grendel. I personally think the 223rem is marginal on goats, dogs and pigs. Yes, it is capable with good shot placement and within reasonable range but all these species are tough/resilient animals. I just think the Grendel has a bit more punch for reliably ethical hunting.

Or even the Howa 1500 in 6.5CM. Good for both hunting and target work.

[JimTom]

Lithgow la102 would be my no.1 choice.
Tikka t3x no.2.
Howa are a good cheap functional rifle but their stocks let them down a bit.

Howa is the only one in the OP's "sub $1k" budget.

For the OP's stated target species when hunting, I would suggest the Howa Mini Action in 6.5 Grendel. I personally think the 223rem is marginal on goats, dogs and pigs. Yes, it is capable with good shot placement and within reasonable range but all these species are tough/resilient animals. I just think the Grendel has a bit more punch for reliably ethical hunting.

Or even the Howa 1500 in 6.5CM. Good for both hunting and target work.

Yes I agree that the .223 is a bit light on for the stated game.

[SHV]

I've got my Sauer 202 avalanche in 223 which is a great rifle but a little heavy for plinking and hunting ... when I saw Ruger American Ranch with 10 round AR style mag I couldn't help to buy it, got PTA already just waiting for SSAA St Mary's reopen to get it
compares to Howa mini action ultra light, similar weight but barrel heavier (with is good for plinking wont heat up too quick) , and Howa mini action varmint is a bit heavy especially front heavy, also the Howa mini's mag release lever will cause trouble in the field, it has to be shorten hopefully can solve the problem
Ranch is pretty, 10 round mag is standard AR mag cheap to get, pic rail comes with the rifle as well, accuracy wont be a problem with reload ammo I reckon

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[Cooper]

Go the Howa mini action in 223. I liked mine so much I bought one in 204 Ruger and then one in 6.5 Grendel.
The only negatives are the stock and magazine release. The stock foreend moves around when using a bi pod and the magazine release is a bit long and easily bumped and the magazine falls out.

Two of mine are in aftermarket stocks (Boyds and MDT) the Grendel is in the standard stock with an aftermarket cheek riser. The 6.5 Grendel is a great calibre. But certainly not for everybody. Factory ammunition not readily available. But it is very easy to load for and doesn't seem slightest bit picky about loads. Bought new brass, no load development easily around the 1 inch at 100 metres.

[bigfellascott]

Go the Howa mini action in 223. I liked mine so much I bought one in 204 Ruger and then one in 6.5 Grendel.
The only negatives are the stock and magazine release. The stock foreend moves around when using a bi pod and the magazine release is a bit long and easily bumped and the magazine falls out.

Two of mine are in aftermarket stocks (Boyds and MDT) the Grendel is in the standard stock with an aftermarket cheek riser. The 6.5 Grendel is a great calibre. But certainly not for everybody. Factory ammunition not readily available. But it is very easy to load for and doesn't seem slightest bit picky about loads. Bought new brass, no load development easily around the 1 inch at 100 metres.

Just trim the latch down a bit or install a firmer spring.

[Jon79]

I've got both the Howa 1500 and the Ruger American and cant fault either of them, yeah I was like you with the Ruger thinking it was a bit flimsy but I haven't had that thought once since having it out in the field.

if I was going to be doing a bit of walking I'd go the Ruger for sure as they are not as bulky or as heavy

[albat]

Dgo buya Howa mini action and stop wasting time !

this ,mini action stainless varmint, laser beam and quality for $765

[bigfellascott]

I own both Ruger and Howa rifles - Howa s**ts all over the Ruger for quality and accuracy, I won't go near Ruger again, once was enough for me.

[hunting99]

Howa 1500.

[brett1868]

I have the S/S Howa 1500 M/A, its a boring rifle in that it just makes single ragged hole groups. I like to reload and turn a sprayer into a tack driver and the Howa did it out of the box so it's in the back of the safe.

[sungazer]

The Howa's are well below the cost of a Tikka at about $600 a Tikka is going to cost about double. My Howa 1500 223 is only ok it is sub MOA but not a ragged hole. I have it in MDT chassis makes it pretty heavy but I am not hiking great distances with it. Its more my toy and prepper gun. For hunting the 243 is much more suitable being able to shoot 105 grn and it will ragged hole shooting 90 grn Target/Varmits

[axio]

Howa Mini action varmint in the 20" barrel, perfect for some casual target shooting or walking around with all day.

20" is handy in the scrub and the varmint barrel is not heavy (3kg without scope)

If you need budget but good optics look at the Bushnell AR series

[MJW380]

I picked up a Ruger American Predator in .223 when they were $599 a while ago, great carry around rifle, not weighty, plus the flush fit mag doesn’t snag on anything as well. Having said that, it doesn’t get much of a run because I have a standard Ruger American in .243 and find it to be a more suitable caliber for all size game.

[vmaxaust]

Hi guys and ladies,

First post, please be gentle! I wish to draw on your knowledge and experience, if I may. Most of my experience is with service rifles but I'm keen to do a bit of feral hunting and plinking now.

I'm after a reasonably priced .223, up to $1000 but preferably lower. It will be used for goats, hopefully dogs, and the odd pig perhaps. I'm not likely to use it out further than 300 yards (wishful thinking ) My other big use is wasting ammo at the range, just for fun.

I'd prefer a bolt action, detachable magazine, shorter barrel (maybe 20"?), and a synthetic stock. Bonus if it has iron sights.



Matt

Like everyone here, different opinions. After owning a CZ527 223 with 18" barrel I really wanted a change. This rifle was very accurate, light, open sights, but simply did not feed correctly. The magazines were the problem. Bought 3 of them and could never really get it right. You had to consciously push the rear of the bolt with your thumb to make it smooth feeding. I tried a friends as well and it was no different. He said I'm used to it and it works for him. I cannot stand lousy feeding.
I've fired plenty of Howa 1500's and simply don't like the weight balance. This is my own personal feel and nothing to detract from a good value bolt action rifle. I also did not like the mag release. Once again personal subjective opinion.
I have a Tikka T3 Super Varmint with 20" heavy barrel. This is a much more expensive rifle but is an excellent feeding, very accurate rifle but not for the field...too heavy.
I ended up buying two Ruger Ranch rifles with the rotary magazines. One in 300AAC and the other a 223. Light, 16.5" barrel, excellent accuracy to under 200 meters (where I do all my shooting). Some people call them flimsy. Well after cycling either of mine all day using 100's of rounds I would say the bolt action is virtually as bulletproof as the Tikka in the way it feeds with either calibre. Feed it fast or slow, the results were always the same, smooth positive feeding to rival any bolt rifle worth significantly more money.
I will also end up buying one of the Ranch rifles with the new AR mags. I have lots of those mags which I use in my Remington 223 7615 pump action. I'm hoping they feed as well as the rotary mags I have now.
When I looked at the Ranch rifle compared to many others on the market it's amazing how many opinions related to price, finish, cosmetics etc. While the Howa's are also low dollar good value rifles I think you really need to at least consider these Rugers.
Yes, they are not as polished, pretty or hand finished like many people like but just like their hand guns they are incredible value for money if you can live without the perfectly pretty deal. In the field or on the range they will reward you very well no matter how hard you use them. Ruger uses CNC equipment to the full extent in their manufacturing to save as much as possible on hand finishing using manual labour. If you need the pretty polished superb cosmetic look buy something else.

[SCJ429]

You could get yourself a Tikka Varmint secondhand for $1,000 easily. I am willing to put up my stock Tikka 223 against any other factory 223 that sells for under $3,000 in a shootout at 300 metres. Howa have a great little action but you need to get a decent barrel for it.

[Thom318]

I was originally looking at a Howas myself, but my dealer had a good deal on Remington 783s at the time, so I went with that. A few mates laughed, but were actually impressed with it when it turned up, even the no brand scope is half reasonable. Shoots well enough for me and has the 1:9 twist that I prefer. Only downside is I think it's ugly as sin, but it's meant to sit next to me in the tractor, so at least I won't cry if the Tupperware gets dinged up a bit

[Stix]

I have the S/S Howa 1500 M/A, its a boring rifle in that it just makes single ragged hole groups. I like to reload and turn a sprayer into a tack driver and the Howa did it out of the box so it's in the back of the safe.

Send it on over...!!
2 birds mate...buy a gun to challenge yourself & make room in the safe...

[matt4350]

Hi all,

Thanks so much for your thoughts, very much appreciated.

I'm thinking my best option may be the Howa mini action, I had a quick (non-firing) play and quite like it, definitely feels better in the paws than the Ruger. The stock is clearly not as good as the short action I already have, but it seems alright and I appreciate the light weight. A mod to the mag release would definitely be on the cards, but as I don't use a bipod the stock should be fine. That said, the Ranch is a likeable piece of kit also. I like the suggestion on the Tikka, found a Lite version for about $1000 but I'm thinking the $250 I save on the Howa would be well spent on ammunition. Probably should keep a bit aside for a scope too, and save the hassle of sharing one between 2 rifles. The Lithgow would be nice, maybe something to think about when I've a few more dollars.

Thanks also for the thoughts on alternate calibres, I was keen on .223 mainly because I'm familiar with 5.56 and its similarity. Seems to be readily available pretty much everywhere and comparatively cheap, I have no intent to reload. I'll likely be firing more rounds at the range than the ferals (trying to get the missus interested!), so based on your comments I may stick with the .308 for the hunt, at least until I'm sure of likely ranges and my shot-placing ability. I'll look at getting something like a .243 or the like later, when I'm a little more educated (and a little more flush!).

Anyone about who has used a Remington 783 with a short barrel? I had a play with a Varmint Pro, seemed quite alright but considerably heavier than the Howa. This is an issue for the lady in my life.

Again, many thanks. There's no substitute for the voice of experience! I shall be back soon and let you know what I've come up with.

Cheers,
Matt

[matt4350]

I was originally looking at a Howas myself, but my dealer had a good deal on Remington 783s at the time, so I went with that. A few mates laughed, but were actually impressed with it when it turned up, even the no brand scope is half reasonable. Shoots well enough for me and has the 1:9 twist that I prefer. Only downside is I think it's ugly as sin, but it's meant to sit next to me in the tractor, so at least I won't cry if the Tupperware gets dinged up a bit

Sounds good, is it the sort of thing you'd walk with for a few hours? Okay for a shorter female? Ugly rifle is fine, like you said, don't wanna cry if it gets dinged!

[bladeracer]

You could get yourself a Tikka Varmint secondhand for $1,000 easily. I am willing to put up my stock Tikka 223 against any other factory 223 that sells for under $3,000 in a shootout at 300 metres. Howa have a great little action but you need to get a decent barrel for it.

Or you could buy a new Ruger American Predator, and scope it, and buy some ammo for the same $1000.

How about an Enoughgun Challenge then
I would think a fair number of us have .223's, although perhaps some might struggle finding somewhere they can shoot 300m.
My Ruger American is totally stock currently, haven't even adjusted the triggers on any of them.
Maybe allow a bipod but no rear support, or no bipod either?
Shoot as much as you want but can only post your best three five-round groups?

[matt4350]

Go the Howa mini action in 223. I liked mine so much I bought one in 204 Ruger and then one in 6.5 Grendel.
The only negatives are the stock and magazine release. The stock foreend moves around when using a bi pod and the magazine release is a bit long and easily bumped and the magazine falls out.

Two of mine are in aftermarket stocks (Boyds and MDT) the Grendel is in the standard stock with an aftermarket cheek riser. The 6.5 Grendel is a great calibre. But certainly not for everybody. Factory ammunition not readily available. But it is very easy to load for and doesn't seem slightest bit picky about loads. Bought new brass, no load development easily around the 1 inch at 100 metres.

Thanks, these Howas seem to attract little criticism. What cheek riser do you use/recommend for the standard stock, I'd like to put one on the .308.

[bladeracer]

I picked up a Ruger American Predator in .223 when they were $599 a while ago, great carry around rifle, not weighty, plus the flush fit mag doesn’t snag on anything as well. Having said that, it doesn’t get much of a run because I have a standard Ruger American in .243 and find it to be a more suitable caliber for all size game.

The Ruger .223 is 8"-twist and will shoot 80gn bullets very well, which encroaches into .243 territory.

[SCJ429]

Don't get that Remington, you will be disappointed, for $90 your gunsmith can make your Tikka barrel any length you want. For accurate economic shooting a Tikka Varmint 1:8 twist shooting OSA ammo loaded with 69 grain SMK is hard to beat.