Weapons Licensing QLD wanting rates notice now

[Mim Lawrence]

Anyone applying for a 10yr licence renewal? New online form doesn't just want the property details for rural use of licence (pest control) and a letter signed by the said land-owner... NOW WLB want an upload of the land owner's rates notice! Invasion of a third party's privacy! Is this just in place to see who delivers just because no one has challenged its validity?! It's WLB job to make the verification. There's a lot of extra information on a rates notice than just name and address being a land owners ourselves. Thoughts?

[Daddybang]

Absolute breach of privacy and our rights(and I'm not meaning as shooters but simply as Australian citizens. This f@#ken idiocy that we call a government in this state has to go.
Just another example of palashmuck and co sh@tting on landowners.

[bigrich]

Absolute breach of privacy and our rights(and I'm not meaning as shooters but simply as Australian citizens. This f@#ken idiocy that we call a government in this state has to go.
Just another example of palashmuck and co sh@tting on landowners.

ugly anna palace-chook is a poor excuse for a premier. leftist labour poster child who made it out of the commie party state owned tractor factory

[Stoney]

Has anyone also noticed PTA applications has inevitably increased in QLD? A little advice. PTA's will increase and increase and increase until the average man cannot afford it. Effectively the Government isn't disarming you, they are just passing on costs. What costs? That's how you are going to be f*cked by the Government. Win, win for them. Money plus disarmament.

[Stoney]

Absolute breach of privacy and our rights(and I'm not meaning as shooters but simply as Australian citizens. This f@#ken idiocy that we call a government in this state has to go.
Just another example of palashmuck and co sh@tting on landowners.

ugly anna palace-chook is a poor excuse for a premier. leftist labour poster child who made it out of the commie party state owned tractor factory

Spot on Comrade

[bigrich]

dah, esteemed comrade palace-chook has face dat was wun ova by traktor , dah ?

[Member-Deleted]

calm your tits. maybe there is no new sinister "big brother" information grab happening here [ the state and federal governments already have all your information, and i do mean ALL]
could this actually be only an attempt at identity verification.., it would be only too easy through publicly accessible websites to find any land owner's name, then bodgy up a letter from said land owner giving you permission to shoot on their land. it is a bit harder to bodgy up a realistic rates notice from that council that includes the unique property account number allocated by council [the authenticity of which is easier to verify].
rather than sh*tting on them for trying to ensure that licences are actually going to people who are and intend to remain LAFOs maybe we should applaud the Queenslanders for trying to do it right, unlike e.g that sh*tshow called WA where you can buy a landowner permission letter [signed by some coot you'll never meet] at your LGS

[bigrich]

calm your tits. maybe there is no new sinister "big brother" information grab happening here [ the state and federal governments already have all your information, and i do mean ALL]

is not big brudah comrade, is ugly anna big zister

could this actually be only an attempt at identity verification.., it would be only too easy through publicly accessible websites to find any land owner's name, then bodgy up a letter from said land owner giving you permission to shoot on their land. it is a bit harder to bodgy up a realistic rates notice from that council that includes the unique property account number allocated by council [the authenticity of which is easier to verify].
rather than sh*tting on them for trying to ensure that licences are actually going to people who are and intend to remain LAFOs maybe we should applaud the Queenslanders for trying to do it right, unlike e.g that sh*tshow called WA where you can buy a landowner permission letter [signed by some coot you'll never meet] at your LGS

looking at these facts, the other side of the coin isn't a bad argument, and your right about WA's insane laws

[Daddybang]

It's got f@#kall to do with the government wanting my info but more telling me that I have to give someone my rates notice if they are using my property for their license. F@#k applauding anything these arseholes.do. .

[Member-Deleted]

Ok, let's look at that for a sec...
(a) it';s just a rates notice, not the friggin Da Vinci Code;
(b) how does WLB know that Johnny Rambo who's applied for a licence and PTA for a fully sick 338 WM in tacticool chassis actually has permission to use your property for his licence? Because he gives them's a letter allegedly written and signed by you as landowner? Frankly i don't think a rates notice copy goes far enough. maybe the local copper has to visit the landowner and ask did you give this bloke permission?

you're lucky daddybang, i take it you have some acres you can shoot on and haven't had to work at it to find a block to hunt on...the rest of us have had to make the connections with farmers and prove we're trustworthy precisely because so many other c*nts in the past have ruined it for us with their conduct

i'm not sticking up for this government, not the LNP, Labour, Greens or any politicians...none are worth feeding. I'm just saying the days when you could buy a firearm at Kmart without a licence are over. Like it or not the world we live in now in this country means we are licenced and regulated. This simple request to have additional proof of the landowner's identity who has given permission to someone to use their property (perhaps as justification for their licence) is not unreasonable or intrusive or a breach of privacy [for which there is none... governments Google, Facebook etc already know you better than your family]

[Daddybang]

Sorry bbss but I think ya misunderstand me... I own my own property (only eighty acres). Now this govt dept is telling me I have to hand over paperwork that can be used to build an identity (things like that do happen) to allow someone to shoot on my property. (If tyey are using that as their genuine reasin) if Wlb want to confirm my identity and validity of the property letter I supply then they have several options to do so (as ya correctly said they already have access to my info) including sending police out to see me face to face. Just my opinion

[Member-Deleted]

! It's WLB job to make the verification. There's a lot of extra information on a rates notice than just name and address being a land owners ourselves. Thoughts?

1. Yes, it is WLB's job to make the verification and that's what this is an attempt to do, cheaply and easily. If the local copper has to make the 2 hour round trip to the land owner to verify, who do you think is going to pay for that in their application fees?

have you got a better way to verify the land owner's permission was actually given?

2. what extra information is on a rates notice that could possibly concern you? the lot and plan description? I can get that from PD Online or the Titles office (all publicly accessible) The rateable land value, as assessed by the Valuer General? many real estate websites. How much you've been asked to pay that quarter/half year as rates? a paid search from the council (@$100, if i'm that interested). Your full names? the publicly searchable electoral roll..

A rates notice doesn't have your tax file number, medicare number, date of birth or any other true identifiers, so what "secrets" are being revealed exactly?

If we're going to have these tin foil hat threads can we at least have a decent conspiracy theory?.

[Member-Deleted]

Daddybang,
not having a go at you or the OP although looking back it is clear i have been "typing angry".

But it's just a rates notice, not a request for blood and DNA profiles (yet). There are other ways to verify identity, but for each of them the user will pay. I for one thought this was a remarkable low key, sensible (and cheap) solution from a government department

[Gaznazdiak]

Jee-zuss,
QLD, perfect one day, WA the next.
Condolences guys.

[bladeracer]

Why does it even matter if you have a landowner willing to let you shoot on a property just so you can own a firearm? If you can't find somewhere to use a firearm that's your problem, shouldn't be of any interest to the authorities at all. Lots of shooters travel to other places to shoot as well, places that don't require written permission from landowners. What exactly would be the threat to society if every Qld licence holder decided they wanted a .338 Lapua in their safe?

[Member-Deleted]

I can see where you are coming BBSS but why all the fuss again we are being condemned as criminals before a crime is committed
When I got my licence the land owner gave his land acreage ,Ph number ,and the shire his land was in and then signed the papers
I sent them away to the WLB it was checked out by them the WLB and I received a licence
So as far as I'm concerned they don't need any more info as they already have the landholders info why now the rates notice this could cause
some people to loose their shooting property as some land owners won't hand stuff like that to people after signing the original papers

I see what you are saying about people forging paper work but a check and a phone call from WLB to the phone number given on the paper work
of the land holder would soon clear things up
I myself won't have a problem but I can't say that for everybody
I personally think this would be a waist of time for both WLB and law abiding gun owners and we can go on for ever making laws to make it harder to
own a gun but they have to stop accusing innocent people of being potential criminals when there is so much corruption in the law makers arena itself
how much effort is being put into taking the guns off the crims
Look up the history of Australia where the government used returned service men and their guns to clean up rival and ethnic groups who they saw as a threat to the stability of the government
I watched a documentary the other day and was appalled at what the gov had done to the Japanese in broom and then there was another in Brisbane
And this info was let out by the gov only a couple of years ago

So do I think the WLB has ulterior motives a big ''YES'' how could you trust the governments of today
EXAMPLES _______ WOMD and committed Australians to fight overseas, KIDS OVERBOARD episode , Infighting in Gov dismissing the Prime minister
on several occasions
Why wouldn't people be distrustful toward gov's and Pollies and the WLB
Just my opinion

[bigrich]

i'm with DB on this, why do they need a rates notice ? is this a department creating more rules and regulations in order to justify it's existance/budget ? look at the beuacratic monster workshop health and safety has become ! i've had pen pushing office jonnies try to tell me the safe way to use machinery they've only seen pictures of !.and more and more paperwork .more and more beurocracy . i would like to hear a valid reason explained for this. ya know guys, if shooters had a senate elect, they probably wouldn't be trying this on . JMHO

[Stoney]

i'm with DB on this, why do they need a rates notice ? is this a department creating more rules and regulations in order to justify it's existance/budget ? look at the beuacratic monster workshop health and safety has become ! i've had pen pushing office jonnies try to tell me the safe way to use machinery they've only seen pictures of !.and more and more paperwork .more and more beurocracy . i would like to hear a valid reason explained for this. ya know guys, if shooters had a senate elect, they probably wouldn't be trying this on . JMHO

An ANRA would be a God send for Australian shooters mate.

[Member-Deleted]

Why does it even matter if you have a landowner willing to let you shoot on a property just so you can own a firearm? If you can't find somewhere to use a firearm that's your problem, shouldn't be of any interest to the authorities at all. Lots of shooters travel to other places to shoot as well, places that don't require written permission from landowners. What exactly would be the threat to society if every Qld licence holder decided they wanted a .338 Lapua in their safe?

It matters if your genuine reason when applying for a licence is rural/recreational (i.e. hunting), because then you need to already have a place to hunt with landowner permission. It's not unreasonable for a check to be made to ensure the farmer actually did give permission and it's not fraudulent. Maybe a phone call is a sufficient check, as Daddtbang mentioned, and I take his point that some landowners may be turned off by having to provide paperwork. I was responding to the OP's view that a request for a copy of a rates notice was somehow an invasion of (non-existent) privacy

Where are these places that don't require written permission from landowners.to go and shoot (apart from SSAA and gun club ranges)? There is no legal shooting on Crown land in Qld. Yes we could be like lots of shooters who travel to other places to shoot as well, but the commute to NSW or Vic is a bitch.

If every Qld licence holder decided they wanted a .338 Lapua in their safe there is no problem - the point there would be they are already licenced, and have demonstrated a "genuine reason" as required by the current laws, so either they are target or gun club members or have landowner permission. If you can't find somewhere to use a firearm that's your problem true and perhaps it shouldn't be of any interest to the authorities at all but it is ... because their logic is if you don't have somewhere to shoot it i(range or property), why do you need a gun?

The threat to public safety might come from the Martin Bryant type who is neither a target shooter and club member, nor an actual hunter with a property to hunt on, but actually just wants a .338 Lapua in the safe so he can take it out and stroke it. I don't know about you but I am less worried by "the government" than I am about people who really love guns, but don't actually participate in the sport, either by hunting or shooting at a range. They generally own a lot of camo gear and love conspiracy theories.

[dpskipper]

I think I might chip in here.

All the farmers I know (at least in SA) only let trusted people shoot on their property. Such as their family friends or hunting buddies from their trusted long time mates. They don't just let any city slicker start blasting. So if you asked them to give a copy of their rates notice to a hunter using the land, they wouldn't mind because that person is already a trusted individual and they know them well.

YMMV in other states.

[Member-Deleted]

Jesus BBSS that's a big statement '' less worried about governments than people that just like guns''
Mate it sounds like you are painting everybody as the government does who in the hell wants a 338 Lapua just because they can for a start in Qld you need to give a good reason to get a permission slip because of its large caliber this I know from experience
And as for the Martin Bryant type well mate since then we have gone through stringent measures by the government to eliminate the prospect of
someone like him getting his hands on a licence at all so the threat to the public is minimal and back then a licence was not required if you remember
And don't forget he was known to police and let slip through the net
And some people like to collect guns in a workable state but never fire a shot that's one reason to own a gun but that doesn't make them dangerous
in any way shape or form
Mate honestly you are entitled to your opinion and it demands respect but please mate try not to paint people as possible nasties as the government does on a regular basis

[bladeracer]

And some people like to collect guns in a workable state but never fire a shot that's one reason to own a gun but that doesn't make them dangerous in any way shape or form.

Absolutely true GDB.
I'm forming brass tonight for a rifle I bought from a lifetime collector who never fired any of his firearms in decades of owning them, lots and lots of them.

People that love guns are no danger to anybody, they screw up and lose what they love the most.

[Daddybang]

I think I might chip in here.

All the farmers I know (at least in SA) only let trusted people shoot on their property. Such as their family friends or hunting buddies from their trusted long time mates. They don't just let any city slicker start blasting. So if you asked them to give a copy of their rates notice to a hunter using the land, they wouldn't mind because that person is already a trusted individual and they know them well.

YMMV in other states.

Gday DP
Yep I only let people I trust shoot on my property...... Unfortunately its people who I've trusted in the past (including family members) who have screwed me over the worst. Not even shooting related I once had a trusted friend who used some personal papers including a rates notice and tax return to rip off five grand!!. So people can call me paranoid if they like I prefer to think of it as security conscious.!!

[Member-Deleted]

Jesus BBSS that's a big statement '' less worried about governments than people that just like guns''
Mate it sounds like you are painting everybody as the government does who in the hell wants a 338 Lapua just because they can for a start in Qld you need to give a good reason to get a permission slip because of its large caliber this I know from experience
And as for the Martin Bryant type well mate since then we have gone through stringent measures by the government to eliminate the prospect of
someone like him getting his hands on a licence at all so the threat to the public is minimal and back then a licence was not required if you remember
And don't forget he was known to police and let slip through the net
And some people like to collect guns in a workable state but never fire a shot that's one reason to own a gun but that doesn't make them dangerous
in any way shape or form
Mate honestly you are entitled to your opinion and it demands respect but please mate try not to paint people as possible nasties as the government does on a regular basis

I can't tell if you didn't read what was written or just chose to selectively misquote me.I actually wrote I don't really trust people who really love guns, but don't actually participate in the sport, either by hunting or shooting at a range. Mate, we all like guns on this forum, many of us own a couple or more and from what I can tell use them often.
I think you do know the sort I was talking about... they're the reason just about every gun club has a "no camo clothing" rule at the range.

as for the 338 Lapua in every safe, ask Bladercer about that one...I was just replying to his post

[Sergeant Hartman]

Govt dept create this work to justify their existence and to get workers to have something to do.

Had a work safe guy come to my farm, glad my quadbike was private. But a couple things I could see he was making it up as he went along... cuz every time he mentioned the issue his solution was different. So I finally asked him tell me exactly how high you want the rungs on the ladders (on feed silos) removed till to satisfy you.

[Member-Deleted]

I didn't misquote you mate you said in short '' You don't trust people with guns that don't participate in shooting sport and or hunting and shooting at the range
and I said in short there are people that are like that and they are called '' Collectors ''now why are they in the class of not being allowed to own guns
in your mind ?
As far as the 338 I don't have to ask Bladeracer I read your posting and commented on it which is what the forum is for
Mate i'm not taking the piss out of you I am just giving my opinion to your opinion and I think your opinion is too much of a statement in painting
people that have selective hobbies into a possible nastie
As far as camo clothing at ranges that is possibly to try and have a respectable dress type whilst there but i'm not sure
Many people wear camo for all sorts of reasons but there has been times that people have committed crimes whilst wearing camo I agree
And mate I do know what you are talking about but I say it as I see it not how people want me say it also I wasn't selective it was the bits that I
respectfully disagreed with
So mate thanks for the debate that's what this forum is about and I respectfully agree to disagree with some of your post as you do mine so
alls good but we both have good points

Cheers

[Member-Deleted]

That's right DB a rates notice can be used in the 100 point scheme to borrow money in conjunction with a car licence ,gun licence,
marriage licence, you get what I mean all important documents so why put people through the hassle of asking farmers for their rates notices when
the information they have now can trace the farmer and his land I thought computers were to make things easier nowadays
I smell a rat

[bigrich]

Forums are about debating and expressing points of view. We all have common ground on a lot of stuff, but lately some folks seem to taking things too seriously and too personally on some topics . I’m not having a go at anyone, just stating a observation. . We’ve all got a interest in firearms in one form or another, and a lifestyle to go with it. From the collector, to the professional, to the man on the land , to the “f” class shooter at the range. United we stand , divided we fall. My sermon for today, reverend von krico , The order of the devout rimfire

[Member-Deleted]

AMEN to that Father Von Krico couldn't have said it better myself
May the shooting gods be with you

[bigrich]

AMEN to that Father Von Krico couldn't have said it better myself
May the shooting gods be with you

Yay verily brother bushy, blessings upon you and your righteous rem mag. May all your ballistic tips fly straight and true to smite the evil of the ferals. Amen