Shortening a 22 barrel

[bigrich]

i think how legal it is depends on which state you live in. i think in queensland it's just overall length of the firearm that's the issue.

Yes, but Mick and I are dealing with Victoria law.

sounds like it's all good for you guys. of coarse, you can always post the rifles to bigpete with some hacksaw blades . or if ya want to ship to QLD my grinder is still set up from doing the front sight removal on my winchester

[Shootermick]

i think how legal it is depends on which state you live in. i think in queensland it's just overall length of the firearm that's the issue.

Yes, but Mick and I are dealing with Victoria law.

That’s right Bladeracer, we are talking about Victoria here. I rang my gun shop yesterday and they said it was total overall length of the rifle rather than a specific barrel length, which I think might have been the law previously. They have their own gunsmith in the shop, but I spoke to the owner, and not the gunsmith directly.

[bladeracer]

i think how legal it is depends on which state you live in. i think in queensland it's just overall length of the firearm that's the issue.

Yes, but Mick and I are dealing with Victoria law.

That’s right Bladeracer, we are talking about Victoria here. I rang my gun shop yesterday and they said it was total overall length of the rifle rather than a specific barrel length, which I think might have been the law previously. They have their own gunsmith in the shop, but I spoke to the owner, and not the gunsmith directly.

That's not correct.
We have minimum overall length of 750mm, but we also have a minimum barrel length of 500mm.

[straightshooter]

In NSW there is a minimum length for the barrel, a minimum length for the length of pull and a minimum overall length. The firearm must satisfy all three restrictions concurrently.
It is fairly well established (Dr. G. Kolbe) that for 22LR standard velocity an 18 inch barrel allows the development of maximum velocity so for 22LR HV probably something like 20 inches may be appropriate. I would aim for one of those lengths in preference to absolute minimum legal length.
Also reducing the length of pull may be beneficial as for Shootermick's application overall length is as important as barrel length.
As for 'accuracy nodes', it is my understanding they are under the control of the tooth fairy. The tooth fairy hasn't been kind to me as he/she has stolen quite a few of my teeth so I don't think he/she will be any kinder in supplying me with beneficial 'accuracy nodes'.
Shootermick should read his state laws and regulations and determine for himself the ideal configuration without relying on hearsay opinions.

[bigrich]

I have seen a graph online that references optimum velocity of the caliber to the appropriate barrel length. Just one of the many aspects of this subject

[in2anity]

As for 'accuracy nodes', it is my understanding they are under the control of the tooth fairy. The tooth fairy hasn't been kind to me as he/she has stolen quite a few of my teeth so I don't think he/she will be any kinder in supplying me with beneficial 'accuracy nodes'.

Everything has harmonics; nodes simply refer to where you you have vibration and no vibration in a object. To a lesser or greater degree, changing the length of the barrel is obviously going to alter where the muzzle sits relative to a node or not. Granted it may be difficult/impossible to identify in some knock-about sporter 22lr - is this what your referring to with this toothfairy stuff? Overkill for a cheap savage?

[bladeracer]

In NSW there is a minimum length for the barrel, a minimum length for the length of pull and a minimum overall length. The firearm must satisfy all three restrictions concurrently.
It is fairly well established (Dr. G. Kolbe) that for 22LR standard velocity an 18 inch barrel allows the development of maximum velocity so for 22LR HV probably something like 20 inches may be appropriate. I would aim for one of those lengths in preference to absolute minimum legal length.
Also reducing the length of pull may be beneficial as for Shootermick's application overall length is as important as barrel length.
As for 'accuracy nodes', it is my understanding they are under the control of the tooth fairy. The tooth fairy hasn't been kind to me as he/she has stolen quite a few of my teeth so I don't think he/she will be any kinder in supplying me with beneficial 'accuracy nodes'.
Shootermick should read his state laws and regulations and determine for himself the ideal configuration without relying on hearsay opinions.

I'd stay with 16-18" for .22LR.
http://ballisticsbytheinch.com/22.html

[bladeracer]

That's not correct.
We have minimum overall length of 750mm, but we also have a minimum barrel length of 500mm.

https://enoughgun.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=76&t=6365

[bigrich]

good on ya for posting that chart blade .that's one i referred to in a earlier post . i found a similar one for 357 mag in a rifle and another graph that related barrel length to projectile caliber and speed .i dunno how to post links , i'm a bit of a luddite when it comes to this computer stuff . facinating this ballistics/firearms game

it also shows how the projectile speeds can vary up and down at certain barrel lengths which i also referred to in a earlier post as "accuracy nodes" , which is probably a incorrect term, but you guys get what i mean

[bladeracer]

good on ya for posting that chart blade .that's one i referred to in a earlier post . i found a similar one for 357 mag in a rifle and another graph that related barrel length to projectile caliber and speed .i dunno how to post links , i'm a bit of a luddite when it comes to this computer stuff

Trying to internet on a phone I wouldn't be able to post links, I can't even work out how to delete part of a quote without losing the whole thing If I feel a need to respond to something on the phone I'll come back later on the computer and edit it. I'm sure most of the angst of the current generation stems from a continual state of frustration from trying to internet on a phone.

[on_one_wheel]

Thanks to Blades chart, I'm feeling the need to get the hacksaw out now

[bladeracer]

Thanks to Blades chart, I'm feeling the need to get the hacksaw out now

I don't much mind what velocity the bullet is doing when it leaves the muzzle (two of my .22's have 25" barrels), but the less time the bullet spends connected to the rifle the better it's accuracy is likely to be.

[Shootermick]

I think bladeracer is on the money regarding the laws, unfortunately... It seems one can’t shorten a barrel to a desired length, if that length is under 20” within the law quite that easily, but you can buy a gun off the shelf with a factory fitted shorter barrel and be completely legal and above board. This has been a popular topic nonetheless, and other people obviously have thought about having the job done.

[on_one_wheel]

This is the best that I can find for SA in the way of a guide for legal lengths.
Looks like it's a 400mm barrel length and 750mm overall length.

20190627_205151.jpg (2.46 MiB) Viewed 15673 times

[bigrich]

Ahhh well. If factory short barrels are okay, maybe you fellas should consider a 16” barreled columbian 30-06 Mauser ? Fix those rabbits right up but the muzzle blast is lengendary

[perentie]

I’ve got a Savage B 22 FVSS, it’s the 21 inch stainless varmint model. Put maybe 100 rounds through it and it shoots really well. My only issue is the barrel length, I do a lot of shooting out of the ute window and the 21 inch barrel is just a bit awkward. I’m thinking about taking it to a smith to have 5 or so inches knocked off it. Anyone had a barrel shortened? What is involved and how much risk is there that it’ll lose its accuracy or create any other issues? Cheers.

I bought a second barrel to cut to 16" for my JW21 to make it an even better break-down pack rifle.
The law allows us to own a 16" barrel rifle, but it doesn't allow us to shorten a barrel to less than 20".
I plan to write to the commissioner and ask for an exemption to allow me to shorten a rifle I already own rather than have to buy another one for the purpose.

If you're using a scope the barrel length won't matter, anything over 16-18" is wasted in .22LR.

I just bought a rifle in .357 mag with a 12 inch barrel. Its legal as its over 750 mm overall.

[bladeracer]

I just bought a rifle in .357 mag with a 12 inch barrel. Its legal as its over 750 mm overall.

But is it legal to cut a 20' barrel down to 12"?

[mickb]

good on ya for posting that chart blade .that's one i referred to in a earlier post . i found a similar one for 357 mag in a rifle and another graph that related barrel length to projectile caliber and speed .i dunno how to post links , i'm a bit of a luddite when it comes to this computer stuff . facinating this ballistics/firearms game

it also shows how the projectile speeds can vary up and down at certain barrel lengths which i also referred to in a earlier post as "accuracy nodes" , which is probably a incorrect term, but you guys get what i mean

BBTI's 22LR data is good. Be wary of their pistol cartridge data though. One test they only go to 18" because they only have an 18" encore to chop down. Another test they substitute different firearm types including using a 357 buntline( 18" barrel revolver ) which loses some velocity over a closed action with its cylinder gap. Have seen that one quoted so many times across the internet universe as proof an "18inch barrel loses velocity in a 357" and its plain wrong. 357 can still increase velocity past 20 barrels and with handloads of slower burning powders past 24".

[bigrich]

good on ya for posting that chart blade .that's one i referred to in a earlier post . i found a similar one for 357 mag in a rifle and another graph that related barrel length to projectile caliber and speed .i dunno how to post links , i'm a bit of a luddite when it comes to this computer stuff . facinating this ballistics/firearms game

it also shows how the projectile speeds can vary up and down at certain barrel lengths which i also referred to in a earlier post as "accuracy nodes" , which is probably a incorrect term, but you guys get what i mean

BBTI's 22LR data is good. Be wary of their pistol cartridge data though. One test they only go to 18" because they only have an 18" encore to chop down. Another test they substitute different firearm types including using a 357 buntline( 18" barrel revolver ) which loses some velocity over a closed action with its cylinder gap. Have seen that one quoted so many times across the internet universe as proof an "18inch barrel loses velocity in a 357" and its plain wrong. 357 can still increase velocity past 20 barrels and with handloads of slower burning powders past 24".

i think that's another variable . change barrel length , maybe change to a powder with a burn rate suitable to the new length . i get really good accuracy out of a 24" barreled 22 hornet with lil' gun . but the bore can foul up a bit and the velocity is down on what a mate gets with the same load as a 22" barreled BRNO . thinking i might look for a slower burning powder . worth looking into i suppose ....

[perentie]

I just bought a rifle in .357 mag with a 12 inch barrel. Its legal as its over 750 mm overall.

But is it legal to cut a 20' barrel down to 12"?

I dont see why not. Here in QLD there is nothing in the rego papers or on a PTA that gives barrel length on a Cat A or B. Who is to know how long it was.