Best value night vision scope deals

[ramshackle]

Looking to buy a night vision rifle scope. Please post here if you see what looks like a really good deal.

Differences between Photocathode, Digital and thermal (video)

Differences between IR night vision and thermal (video)



Some of the key websites to check (please suggest more!)

https://www.ozscopes.com.au/night-visio ... al-imaging
https://www.nighthunter.com.au/thermal-imaging
https://www.wolfeyes.com.au/thermal-nig ... -equipment
https://www.extravision.com.au/rifle-scopes.html
https://www.ozhut.com.au/sport-optics/n ... iflescopes

[Blr243]

If my scope was busted up or whatever I would be looking for specs first eg a scope that has 640 by 480 resolution, Then I would be looking for ( value for money ) as my second criteria Nb ...a scope purchased based on VALUE FOR MONEY might not cut it in the field. Forking out 7-8 thousand is painful ( I know this because I did it and because I seem to like pain I then spent the same $ on some thermal binos) ......but haveing a scope in the field that is lacking will hurt even more

[xDom]

What model are your binoculars?

I can appreciate that you can’t cut corners on thermal scopes but I reckon lower spec thermal monocular/binoculars have a use.
My thermal will show a blob which I then go on to identify through my night vision clip on.

[Blr243]

Pulsar accolade xp50 are my binos. I have heard before that nv is better for identification but I just can’t get any use out of mine ......it’s a pulsar 355 with after market wolf eyes Ir torch ...at what distance can u identity and take a clear shot with your nv clip on ?

[xDom]

This clip gives a bit of an indication of the potential of the PARD clip on.

https://youtu.be/JNwEcjONlR0

I think a lot of it comes down to the scope. I’ve got an Optisan 3-12x56 on my .223 and it performs on par with the video above.
I bought a cheapo Nikko Sterling with adjustable parallax for my .22wmr and it’s not much chop at all. I’m gonna get another Optisan for it.

[xDom]

I was reading about your Pulsar 355, apparently it runs the 940nm illuminator? Is this correct? From what I read up on before I bought my unit, this wavelength is not as far reaching as the 850 nm that is most commonly used in most hunting models.
The trade off being that the 940nm doesn’t emit any red light from the lens.

[Blr243]

Thanks for the clip. Good viewing. The nv 355 did come with a small Illuminator it’s compact but it is pathetic and offers minimal range Hence the clip on wolf eyes bigger torch. In two weeks I have another week to spend at my fav pig place so I will do a bit of nv testing. Im taking my bow too. Im going nuts about this next trip. Im like a zombie unable to focus on anything else ....got help anybody who chooses to employ me in the next couple of weeks They can try to talk to me but I’m likely to have my “far away “face on

[xDom]

Apologies to OP for slightly derailing his thermal thread.. BLR, I’m quite new to all this and I don’t wanna teach you how to suck eggs but if you’re not getting the performance you expect out of your NV is it possible your additional IR torch is of the 850nm and your clip on is a 940nm?

Another question, wouldn’t a $7.5k thermal scope eliminate any need for a NV clip on?

[Mark]

https://australianshootingservices.com.au/

[Blr243]

I bought the the nv scope for 2200. I don’t know the specs on the original illuminator that pulsar paired with the scope .. I was just told to get a bigger better one so I did and I have noticed the useful range has probably tripled ..... but I still struggled with it in the field. So I moved to thermal gear. I still take my nv scope on trips to the bush and I’m open to learning more about it I would rather get some use out of it than just give up and sell it

[ramshackle]

My impression is that the cheapest way of getting into thermal is to combine a thermal monocular (such as the $1000 Flir or $1200 Leupold below), which is much cheaper than a thermal rifle scope, and a Gen 2 or Gen 3 IR scope. Correct me if I am wrong.



Note: bear in mind I am a max. 150 metres rimfire shooter.

Also, is there such a thing as an entry level thermal scope? I'm seeing a lot of scopes that do everything for you except pull the trigger. I don't want to take pictures or movies, have a GPS reading, a wifi, a rangefinder, a picture-in-picture, etc.

[xDom]

Also, is there such a thing as an entry level thermal scope? I'm seeing a lot of scopes that do everything for you except pull the trigger. I don't want to take pictures or movies, have a GPS reading, a wifi, a rangefinder, a picture-in-picture, etc.

Nup, sorry mate, if the shot doesn't go on social media with a rockin' soundtrack it doesn't count...

I started another thread called " Entry Level Night Vision " a few months back, might want to have a read through that. At that time I had nothing and now I'm the owner of a Thermal Monocular and a NV clip on.
I think if you're using thermal as your scope you need top flight gear coz you don't want to be taking a shot on a white blob, not knowing what it is or where its head is.
On the other hand, my thermal monocular can show me the blobs indicating something is there, with a bit of practice ID is possible through the movement of the blobs. I then confirm the target and take the shot with my NV clip on.

Here the details on my setup: Night Tech HD 25 https://www.nighthunter.com.au/night-tech-hd-25-lite

PARD NV 007 https://www.nighthunter.com.au/pard-nv0 ... attachment

I guess this could be considered Entry level units, on saying that there are even cheaper options to go for. I mentioned in the other thread that while I'm very impressed with my thermal unit ( and the PARD ) I wouldn't go for a unit with lower specs than what this has.

As an indication, I went out last night to do some experimentation and I was picking up blobs ( rabbits ) about 200m away. There are environmental factors that need to be taken into consideration, mainly ambient temp. F##kin' cold last nigh which is the ideal.
There's a clip on YouTube where two guys are doing a review on the Leupold LTO ( extremely entry level, probably not advisable ). There pointing at a roo from 25m and its hardly showing up on the screen. The guys are saying how crap it is.
On the other hand its the middle of the day, there both wearing T-Shirts and big hats and those Aussie bush summer sounds can be heard in the background. To make an extreme point, on a 37 degree day if you point it at a human whose body temp is 37 degree, you're not gonna see much, even with expensive gear.
Anyway, long story short, I'm happy with my set up. Cost me less than $2300.
Do some research, watch a heap of youtube vids and make your choice.

[ramshackle]

There's a clip on YouTube where two guys are doing a review on the Leupold LTO ( extremely entry level, probably not advisable ). There pointing at a roo from 25m and its hardly showing up on the screen. The guys are saying how crap it is.

Yup: https://youtu.be/V7x20yuXWo0

The updated 2HD version of this tracker is an improvement at nearly $2000 https://youtu.be/Qd8tUA6no3k

[ramshackle]

I found this video very educational, showing the differences between Gen 1 ► Gen 2 ► Gen 3 ► Digital ► Thermal night visions
https://youtu.be/OIy2qY9r110

I was not aware of the Digital night vision option at all until I saw this video

[xDom]

You can get the LTO HD on Ebay from the states for about $1100


https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Leupold-LTO ... ctupt=true


The specs on my Night Tech are a step up from the LTO HD, main ones being the Detector Resolution and the Screen Hz.
I wonder how much of the price of the LTO is down to the fact that it's a Leupold?

[Blr243]

Regardless of what equipment we choose to take into the field, we must be extremely careful before we pull the trigger. There is a patch of scrub I visit at night where I have seen zero Roos a dozen wallabies a cat and a fox and hundreds of pigs. When I see white in my scope partially obscured with brush in this particular patch I’m 99 per cent sure it’s going to be a pig But I still don’t shoot. It could be a lost person sitting down haveing a rest. There is a whole new dimension to safety when hunting at night with no light.... I must plan, navigate , walk , respect and avoid stock , feel safety catches, reload ,operate scope buttons , not trip over my dog , crawl through barbed wire fences, go to the toilet, find my Ute again , all in the dark ,,,,if i make a mistake I can’t turn back time

[ramshackle]

The disadvantages of the typical IR night vision devices are that the technology relies on a photocathode with a limited-life coating. Gen 3 has a gallium arsenide coating. They can be destroyed by bright light. Thermals are much more durable and can be used day and night, but the price is astronomic.

The DIGITAL version is a little different. Does anyone have one?

Digital night vision is a much cheaper option for night vision use, often cheaper than Gen 1 devices. It doesn’t amplify light via intensifier; instead, it works through a digital signal.

Digital night vision processes and converts the image you are looking at to an electric signal. This signal is sent through a charged coupled device image sensor. These image sensors are pretty standard in digital video cameras with night vision modes.

This image sensor then sends the signal to a screen. This screen presents you the picture you are looking at. So when you look through a digital NVD, you are looking at a screen, not directly at the image.

Digital night vision is simpler and more affordable. The camera industry made this possible. However, it is quite limited in range and resolution compared to Gen 2 or Gen 3 standard night vision.

Review of a digital night vision device https://youtu.be/e3SN-ZSG7ls

[Blr243]

Snakes are another problem walking in the dark. Die to the lack of colour in my thermal scope a fox at a distance is close to the same shape as a kelpie I deal with that by ensuring working dogs are kept strictly close to home base and I only shoot a hell of a long way from home base

[xDom]

My clip on is a digital. I’d be surprised if any of the NV’s under $2k weren’t digital.

[Stix]

Snakes are another problem walking in the dark. Die to the lack of colour in my thermal scope a fox at a distance is close to the same shape as a kelpie I deal with that by ensuring working dogs are kept strictly close to home base and I only shoot a hell of a long way from home base

Yep...
Every farm i shoot on i ask the farmer--"what about dogs...?..."

I dont shoot on land where dogs arent either locked up, or around the house...

I dont want to shoot anyones dog, but all farmers want me to shoot foxes if i see them around the house &/or yard...

We come to an agreement that i take all care & no responsibility, but i always back out of it...during summer through to Easter earlier in the year ive come accross 3 fox looking creatures close or close-ish to houses & backed out of the shot every time only to have the farmer tell me next day that it had to be a fox as they locked dogs up just in case...ah well...

I rather take the thought "ill get him next time" than have what id imagine to be god awful feeling of having to pick up the farmers dog...

Better to be safe than sorry & always have that discussion.

[ramshackle]

My clip on is a digital. I’d be surprised if any of the NV’s under $2k weren’t digital.

I'm sure some are still using the photocathode technology. But digital does seem to be taking over.

The ATN X-Sight 4K Pro looks good to me. https://youtu.be/BKniEqSyeNs Not thermal, but still.

[ramshackle]

Actually the evolution of night vision is much more complex than I'd imagined. Read this
http://aunv.blackice.com.au/forum?index ... enerations
(This page is dated, circa 2010, so things will have changed)

Looks like "digital" night vision —where you use a sensor similar to the one you have in a digital camera— is inferior to Gen 2 and 3 photocathode tubes, and not much use beyond 100m (good enough for me, BTW). Comments? I suspect that digital is now better than described in that document ...

... and I suspected correctly. Here's an update from Pulsar:

Digital Night Vision

These units do not use an intensifier tube, so it won’t be damaged when used during the day. These devices us a charge-coupled device (CCD) or complementary metal-oxide-semiconductor (CMOS) and a micro display. Light that is projected onto the CCD or CMOS array from the objective lens is converted to an electronic signal. This signal is then processed and sent to the micro display to be viewed by the user. Digital night vision devices can be compared to Gen 2 traditional night vision in quality, but are much more effective, due to an infrared illuminator. Some digital night vision devices are also able to record, zoom, and change reticles. This versatility, plus the affordability, makes digital a popular choice for hunters.

I'm starting to think that thermal optics, with their unreal prices, may be overkill for all but commercial hunters and pest controllers. Digital may be enough for 95% of hunters. Comments?

[wanneroo]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CFDNEjJ0cME

Good video about digital vs. analog night vision.

[ramshackle]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CFDNEjJ0cME
Good video about digital vs. analog night vision.

Makes Gen 3 seem superior to the best digital, but I was thinking that even a little IR source would have put them on a par, plus the digital is much cheaper and more durable.

[ramshackle]

Sightmark Wraith HD 50mm, another digital contender: https://youtu.be/0SQEf3MlYWU

[ramshackle]

I guess my next question is: how to work out the best digital scope. I'm used to hold over and under on my reticle to allow for elevation and windage, and I see that some of these digital offerings (e.g. ATN) allow you to input data and estimate distance based on putting a line over and under your prey .. this is where I get confused. The Sightmark Wraith seems to lack this ... so are you back to using hold overs and unders? The reticle used in the Wraith videos shows them spot on the target, making no allowance for distance, and using a plain reticle will no mil markings. Hard to believe they are always zeroed on that distance. How do they do it?

I've been out of shooting for many years (30 years actually), so forgive my ignorance.

[on_one_wheel]

Actually the evolution of night vision is much more complex than I'd think

They're definitely over thinking it.

I'm in the late R&D stages of developing my own night vision goggles, scope attachments, binoculars and monocular.

In layman's terms, they simply block out all light bouncing off objects that you aren't looking at, effectively intensifying light from objects you are looking. That also adjust your pupils maximising the light / Image area projected onto the back of your eyeballs.

At this stage they can be mass produced far cheaper than all current NV on the market.

Batteries not required

images (5).jpeg (11.41 KiB) Viewed 19387 times

[xDom]

Do they have an IP66 rating? My concern is with moisture ingress.

[Stix]

Lol...
Ive tried that model before...

Actually the evolution of night vision is much more complex than I'd think

They're definitely over thinking it.

I'm in the late R&D stages of developing my own night vision goggles, scope attachments, binoculars and monocular.

In layman's terms, they simply block out all light bouncing off objects that you aren't looking at, effectively intensifying light from objects you are looking. That also adjust your pupils maximising the light / Image area projected onto the back of your eyeballs.

At this stage they can be mass produced far cheaper than all current NV on the market.

images (5).jpeg

they're on the money for having the most versatile exit pupil... ... but i found a completely non-reflective matt black inner tube along with using them under an umbrella in the rain a better alternative...

BTW...i expect some royalty payments for improving your prototype...!!

[wanneroo]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CFDNEjJ0cME
Good video about digital vs. analog night vision.

Makes Gen 3 seem superior to the best digital, but I was thinking that even a little IR source would have put them on a par, plus the digital is much cheaper and more durable.

Here's the problem though, digital is a battery hog, I'm sure it varies but as he points out in the video digital consumes 100x as much power.

The PVS-21 and PVS 14 I use at work use one AA battery and it lasts a long time. Also it's light in weight which is important if you are wearing them on your face for a while. That also might be a factor for people hunting on foot and dealing with a large scope or battery weight and consumption. I guess hunting from a vehicle, less a concern there.

Digital has certainly made progress. 25 years ago when my dad worked on digital color night vision, it worked but you had to put this massive helmet on your head with it being connected via a bunch of cables to a bank of computer towers.

Right now one of the big advances in night optics is goggles that do both thermal and regular light intensification and you can overlay the two images on one another. Haven't used those yet, but I did use some $50000 ones a few years ago that could switch between NV and thermal with a flick of a switch.