How many for a security alarm?

[Shootermick]

In the Victorian regulations it states that more than 15 guns stored on your premises and you need an alarm system. So to me that would mean 16 plus. But a dealer told me last week that if you have 15 you need an alarm. Anyone know which is correct?

[TheFirearmEnthusiast]

It's 16x plus

In the legislation it says:
"The premises must be fitted with an intruder alarm system if more than 15 firearms are stored on the premises"

[AussieCapitalist]

15 really? QLD is 30.

[TassieTiger]

10 in Tas - video cams on safe, remote access to cams is ok and costs stuff all of home networked. But can use light or siren - something to deter break in...
We are only allowed 14 A/B/C and D firearms in total (not sure if H is also invluded$ before serious questions are asked for 15th PTA.

[Shootermick]

It's 16x plus

In the legislation it says:
"The premises must be fitted with an intruder alarm system if more than 15 firearms are stored on the premises"

That’s how I read it too. Also conflicting requirements on safes for cat c. I’ve got a cat a/b safe with a 6mm door, but I think it would meet Victorian cat c regulations with a 6mm min door thickness.

[womble]

Seriously who cares.
If you own just one why don’t you have security already.

[AussieCapitalist]

Seriously who cares.
If you own just one why don’t you have security already.

Serious? Because it is a waste of money not to mention useless if you live rurally.

[Oldbloke]

What fukin shets me is people giving shet advice. Rule one, if your not 100% certain keep your big mouth shut or say yr not certain. Fukin shets me big time.

People get fuked around by "experts" all the time.

[AussieCapitalist]

What fukin shets me is people giving shet advice. Rule one, if your not 100% certain keep your big mouth shut or say yr not certain. Fukin shets me big time.

People get fuked around by "experts" all the time.

I am a firm believer in going directly to the source. I printed off the weapons act, weapons regulation and police responsibilities act and have self taught myself by memorising what they entail. Every bit of info one needs is in their state firearm act.

[bladeracer]

I had my first inspection when I had thirteen I think, then I had another inspection when I bought my sixteenth to check my security.

[trekin]

15 really? QLD is 30.

Really? Never had to have a security alarm when I had 30 + firemans on my licence.

[Sergeant Hartman]

I know a few people all with 15 firearms and the only reason they haven't gone 16th is cuz they need a security system. This is in vic. Atleast one and possibly two of them have had inspections this year.

So definitely you need a security system once you get your 16th firearm.

[AussieCapitalist]

Really? Never had to have a security alarm when I had 30 + firemans on my licence.

Yes sorry I just checked the weapons reg again and it states that if you have more than 30 to follow part 20 which is for collectors. And that states you must use a vault, storeroom or container and the container is just the usual bolt down if less than 150kg or D,H,R firearms.

So in essence it is the exact same and has no limit to the amount you can own.
Its so stupid it says you can use a gun rack if you have more than 30 firearms then it says you can only have 10 max firearms in a rack.

[bladeracer]

I know a few people all with 15 firearms and the only reason they haven't gone 16th is cuz they need a security system. This is in vic. Atleast one and possibly two of them have had inspections this year.

So definitely you need a security system once you get your 16th firearm.

Explain to them that the security requirement is only a few hundred dollars for compliance, it's nothing special. A flashing light and a siren.

[Oldbloke]

Explain to them that the security requirement is only a few hundred dollars for compliance, it's nothing special. A flashing light and a siren.

Correct. Doest need to be hard wired. I know someone with one. Just a basic system.

Maybe ask the local cop

[Sarco]

I am a firm believer in going directly to the source. I printed off the weapons act, weapons regulation and police responsibilities act and have self taught myself by memorising what they entail. Every bit of info one needs is in their state firearm act.

Don't see the point of printing them out if QLD is like Vic.

In Vic, the Act alone has already been amended twice this year and typically 3 or more times a year since 2011. I dare say the Regs are probably similar, though generally they are not amended as frequently as the Act.

It is true to say that for the most part these amendments are relatively minor.

[Oldbloke]

You cant assume they are the same. Nearly the same is not identical. You MUST have the correct state.

Just keep soft copies of act and regs. I havent printed an act or any regs for years.

[No1Mk3]

G'day Shootermick,
As others have pointed out you are correct in believing an alarm is not needed until you pass 15 firearms, just remember that is total, so if your Mrs has guns it includes hers too. As for Cat C safe, the only difference between A/B and C is it can't be hardwood but must be steel "not easily penetrable". No such thing as minimum door thickness under the Act. The current Act, Version 95, is downloadable in pdf or word from the Govt website and is worth having to read for yourself, Cheers.

[womble]

Serious? Because it is a waste of money not to mention useless if you live rurally.

Good point. Sorry i was blunt. Even if you live in a major city nobody pays much attention to alarms going of.
Once again a good example of firearms legislation not keeping up with the times.

Personally i think security should be ones own initiative. Do you need mr policeman to tell you what you need.
Camera systems don’t cost a much now. Hardware stores sell them. You get an app on your phone and you can view any camera you want, replay footage save it whatever from anywhere you are.
Surveillance is a far better measure than an alarm, plus it has other useful applications.
I’m not suggesting it as an alternative to an alarm, but just one tool in a box of many security measures you can implement.

I went to a wedding on a fairly remote property last year. The house was of course open to everyone. The gun safe was massive, but i don’t feel it needed to be in plain view. I mean there was a lot of young people there. And i don’t much like young people haha.

[TassieTiger]

Does two 60kg Akita dogs count as surveillance lol ? It bloody should...almost everyone around Is have been broken in to...except us. Hang on...that makes me a sus...err...bye.

[bladeracer]

Does two 60kg Akita dogs count as surveillance lol ? It bloody should...almost everyone around Is have been broken in to...except us. Hang on...that makes me a sus...err...bye.

My neighbour in Perth had two rottweilers, very well trained and not at all aggressive when they didn't need to be. One morning he woke up and couldn't find them. Turned out they had spend most of the night in the garage keeping a very close eye on the moron who had broken in during the night - they never made a sound, and he never moved a muscle, for several hours

[Bugman]

The interesting thing about alarms, according some copper mates, is that when one goes off, most people regard them as a nuisance and they really don't want to get involved, by having to give a statement to the coppers, don't want to go to court to give evidence, mainly because of the fear of repercussions etc. So what is the point of having an alarm.
Security cameras, probably more beneficial as the coppers can view the data and make up their own minds. Yes, I have high end cameras installed but were put in for another reason.

[AussieCapitalist]

You are right about that bugman. I don't want to know what my neighbour is doing and I hope he does not want to know what I am doing. I don't dog on people so I purposely never see anything.

[pomemax]

My take on Alarms are unless they are monitored by an off site company they are not worth diddlysquat.
My alarm company will ring me then if not available ring local police with firearms notification on premises I dont need one in NSW but I think I should have one cost $1.25 a day monitored . $458 a year
24/7 video stored in the cloud not onsite
Good thing about it I can check condition If I think i have forgot to turn on from any where so long as I have mobile coverage
sort of like I am buying peace of mind

[Tomotron]

Would this or similar meet the intruder alarm requirement by itself? It has both light and sound. As "external visible" from the act would mean outside-mounted? Not sure about the AS 2201.1:2007 part.
https://www.bunnings.com.au/orion-grid- ... n_p0261692

[bladeracer]

Would this or similar meet the intruder alarm requirement by itself? It has both light and sound. As "external visible" from the act would mean outside-mounted? Not sure about the AS 2201.1:2007 part.
https://www.bunnings.com.au/orion-grid- ... n_p0261692

That appears to only be a siren and light, not an alarm system? You need some sort of sensor (motion or tamper) to activate upon an intruder entering the area and/or tampering with your security to trigger a flashing light and siren that can be seen and heard from outside the premises so that you or somebody else can act upon it.

Yeah, it took me a long time to get an actual copy of the standard, I think because all the alarm people I talked to didn't want me to know how basic the requirement actually is. Because I'm out of town though I couldn't find anybody interested in coming out to install such a rudimentary system for me.

I would strongly suggest a camera system as well that will allow you to check the cameras via your phone when the alarm is triggered. The point of the alarm is that somebody will actually come to investigate it.

[Tomotron]

Would this or similar meet the intruder alarm requirement by itself? It has both light and sound. As "external visible" from the act would mean outside-mounted? Not sure about the AS 2201.1:2007 part.
https://www.bunnings.com.au/orion-grid- ... n_p0261692

That appears to only be a siren and light, not an alarm system? You need some sort of sensor (motion or tamper) to activate upon an intruder entering the area and/or tampering with your security to trigger a flashing light and siren that can be seen and heard from outside the premises so that you or somebody else can act upon it.

Yeah, it took me a long time to get an actual copy of the standard, I think because all the alarm people I talked to didn't want me to know how basic the requirement actually is. Because I'm out of town though I couldn't find anybody interested in coming out to install such a rudimentary system for me.

I would strongly suggest a camera system as well that will allow you to check the cameras via your phone when the alarm is triggered. The point of the alarm is that somebody will actually come to investigate it.

Understood; any ideas of cheap and/or minimal systems to meet the requirement?

[bladeracer]

Understood; any ideas of cheap and/or minimal systems to meet the requirement?

It's been years since I looked at it but I have been thinking about putting in a new system now that we're getting back into handguns and adding more safes. I ended up ordering the "system" components from a company up in Melbourne, the alarm system and the CCTV system. And an IT friend in our Landcare group spent a few hours here one day setting it all up for us. I don't recall the cost but it really wasn't that much, well under $1000 I'm sure, and I would think the components are even cheaper now. I put tamper sensors on the safes themselves and tamper sensors and motion detectors on the entries to the area, and covered those entries and the safes with interlocking cameras so nobody can get access to any camera without being seen clearly by at least one other camera. Half of the cameras and sensors are wireless (with solar power) so no wires to cut or unplug.

I'm pretty clueless with electronics so I generally find something and have Rose's brother look at the intricacies of it. If he says it'll suit me then I'll buy it. By "suit me" I mostly mean "really easy to get working"

[Tomotron]

Understood; any ideas of cheap and/or minimal systems to meet the requirement?

It's been years since I looked at it but I have been thinking about putting in a new system now that we're getting back into handguns and adding more safes. I ended up ordering the "system" components from a company up in Melbourne, the alarm system and the CCTV system. And an IT friend in our Landcare group spent a few hours here one day setting it all up for us. I don't recall the cost but it really wasn't that much, well under $1000 I'm sure, and I would think the components are even cheaper now. I put tamper sensors on the safes themselves and tamper sensors and motion detectors on the entries to the area, and covered those entries and the safes with interlocking cameras so nobody can get access to any camera without being seen clearly by at least one other camera. Half of the cameras and sensors are wireless (with solar power) so no wires to cut or unplug.

I'm pretty clueless with electronics so I generally find something and have Rose's brother look at the intricacies of it. If he says it'll suit me then I'll buy it. By "suit me" I mostly mean "really easy to get working"

Looks like I've found a cheap solution that should meet it. Wireless outdoor motion sensor, strobe light alarm and siren in one!
https://forgeelectrical.com.au/forge-ou ... -wifi.html

[Wapiti]

For us, we chose a security system that warns us via alerts and real-time video records to our mobiles also.
Theives often strike when you are out, after casing your joint for awhile. They don't want to end up buried under 2m of creek gravel as yabbie feed by having their identity known.
They also provide video of people, number plates, faces, anything that helps you find out who they are.

Question is, do you want a security system to satisfy a law, or something that more useful?