Just a happy post by a newbie - BL22

[PekingDuck]

Hey all,

I've just got my first firearm here in Perth. This is more of an excitement post than anything.

The BROWNING BL22 GRADE II SATIN NICKEL.
https://www.winchesteraustralia.com.au/ ... /024108102

Took it out for the first time over the weekend, had great fun. Love the look, feel, cycling the lever and getting those reactive dings from steel 50 yds away.

Shooting at the targets, i found the sights out of the box were about 4" top-right.
Not the greatest of groups, even with something to lean on, the group was quite large ~3-4". Maybe I'm abit ambitious with my own skill to be getting smaller groups at 50yds.
Using a mix of target and hunting ammo. Some 22shorts and 22lr subsonics too.

I had a load of trouble using the open sights. I cant seem to focus my eyes on all 3 planes. After using a mates peep sights, I've got a set of SkinnerSights on their way. I wont worry about adjusting the factory sights.

What surprised me, there is an arrow imprinted on the rear sight which i found was aligned to the left. Not sure if this is manufacturing defect.. This was distracting so I've blacked it out and used a paint marker to brighten the front sight which helped focus the sights however my groups are still off. I'll use a benchrest to sight in the Skinners and hopefully see what kind of groups i get.

As is the common thing with the BL22, my trigger feels super heavy in comparison to my mates firearms. So far fired ~150 rounds and it is still noticeably heavy.
I've tried to order the springs from Boogies however he doesn't ship to Australia.
https://sbgwllc.myshopify.com/products/ ... tuning-kit
Not sure if there is anywhere else i can get them from.
I think I'll just take the rifle to a gunsmith at a cost of $180. (Does there happens to be anyone reading this and can recommend a smith with BL22 experience in Perth?) I'm going to talk to Beaton and Roy Alexander.

Does anyone have trouble getting a patch down the bore? its super super tight, to the point the jag completely pierces the patch.
I have the Allen Krome kit. https://www.xhunter.com.au/allen-kro...it-rifle-70973
I'm going to have to get a higher quality kit, the jags are plastic and rod is sectional aluminium. Very bendy and sketchy - Wouldn't recommend..

I'm using a boresnake at the moment. Seems to do the job. I used an earbud after running the snake and it came out completely clear. I didn't earbud before the snake so not sure if thats a good tell.
Ballistol smells like old/stale farts with aniseed

Anyway, it is awesome fun, cant wait to get a heap more practice in!
I'm keen to know what my particular rifle is capable of on a benchrest so can I work within my own off hand ability.

Cheers. Some photos below but I'm sure ya'll know what a BL22 looks like

[K1200]

nice

[scoot]

On my 2nd bl22, first one shot ok with cci velocitors, current one prefers something just near supersonic ~1000fps. Neither is what you would ever call target accurate. I use a 204 bore snake if I do a clean, both seem mucho tight with 224 snakes, alternatively cut your own patches. After being a bit pedantic with my first I came to the conclusion cleaning them is over rated. They seem more consistent dirty, and will get a little better with more shots through them. I got my trigger done by aprs rifles in adelaide for $120 and it's about 1.5pounds. Had this one done from new but I know my first one was factory at about 8 pounds. DO NOT try and pull it apart yourself unless you are very confident in your skills. They are PITA to assemble.
Best advise, pay a competent Smith to do the trigger, shoot and enjoy, don't expect 1/2 moa groups.

[rc42]

I've had the stainless/laminate BL-22 for about a month now, it's easily my favorite plinking rifle, that lever action is just so much more fun than anything else I have, the Savage A22R comes in second place, bolt actions are so slow and clunky after using levers.
The rifle itself is light but feels heavy for its small size and the build quality is superb, trigger is far too heavy though but that's the only bad thing about it.

Short CBs are fun as I can load about 21 in the tube but the accuracy is average at best, Winchester Z quiet rounds are terrible beyond about 20m but CCI quiets work well. For noisier rounds the Eley Std bulk ammo groups nicely and is more than good enough for open sights, haven't tried super sonic rounds as I don't want to annoy the neighbors even though they are not too close.

I did change the rear sight adjustable plate for a black washer so it works like a ghost ring but still uses the original flip up, that helped a lot, I'll get a proper commercial unit at some point, there's a youtube video where somebody did exactly that.

[bladeracer]

It's a lever-action, it's unlikely to shoot remarkably well, but with a scope and some ammo testing I reckon you'd be able to get under 2MoA at 100m without too much trouble.

Those sights look half decent to me, but I'd have to actually shoot with them to know if they'd work for me.

The generally accepted focus should be on the front sight, it is impossible to focus in three, or even two planes at once.

[in2anity]

google and practice "6 oclock hold". It's beneficial for repeatable windage and standard practice in service rifle.

[marksman]

well, your hooked aren't you

there's no turning back now

[Shootermick]

Hey all,

I've just got my first firearm here in Perth. This is more of an excitement post than anything.

The BROWNING BL22 GRADE II SATIN NICKEL.
https://www.winchesteraustralia.com.au/ ... /024108102

Took it out for the first time over the weekend, had great fun. Love the look, feel, cycling the lever and getting those reactive dings from steel 50 yds away.

Shooting at the targets, i found the sights out of the box were about 4" top-right.
Not the greatest of groups, even with something to lean on, the group was quite large ~3-4". Maybe I'm abit ambitious with my own skill to be getting smaller groups at 50yds.
Using a mix of target and hunting ammo. Some 22shorts and 22lr subsonics too.

I had a load of trouble using the open sights. I cant seem to focus my eyes on all 3 planes. After using a mates peep sights, I've got a set of SkinnerSights on their way. I wont worry about adjusting the factory sights.

What surprised me, there is an arrow imprinted on the rear sight which i found was aligned to the left. Not sure if this is manufacturing defect.. This was distracting so I've blacked it out and used a paint marker to brighten the front sight which helped focus the sights however my groups are still off. I'll use a benchrest to sight in the Skinners and hopefully see what kind of groups i get.

As is the common thing with the BL22, my trigger feels super heavy in comparison to my mates firearms. So far fired ~150 rounds and it is still noticeably heavy.
I've tried to order the springs from Boogies however he doesn't ship to Australia.
https://sbgwllc.myshopify.com/products/ ... tuning-kit
Not sure if there is anywhere else i can get them from.
I think I'll just take the rifle to a gunsmith at a cost of $180. (Does there happens to be anyone reading this and can recommend a smith with BL22 experience in Perth?) I'm going to talk to Beaton and Roy Alexander.

Does anyone have trouble getting a patch down the bore? its super super tight, to the point the jag completely pierces the patch.
I have the Allen Krome kit. https://www.xhunter.com.au/allen-kro...it-rifle-70973
I'm going to have to get a higher quality kit, the jags are plastic and rod is sectional aluminium. Very bendy and sketchy - Wouldn't recommend..

I'm using a boresnake at the moment. Seems to do the job. I used an earbud after running the snake and it came out completely clear. I didn't earbud before the snake so not sure if thats a good tell.
Ballistol smells like old/stale farts with aniseed

Anyway, it is awesome fun, cant wait to get a heap more practice in!
I'm keen to know what my particular rifle is capable of on a benchrest so can I work within my own off hand ability.

Cheers. Some photos below but I'm sure ya'll know what a BL22 looks like

I’ve got that exact same rifle, love it, congratulations on your choice. I don’t mind the open sights but have thought about putting some skinners on it too. So did you order the sight that slides onto to receiver dovetail? And what are you doing with your front sight? I’ve heard the original will work ok, or did you order a front sight too?

[SCJ429]

I cannot hit a rabbit consistently with open sights at 100, tried an Aim Point red dot which was better but a small 4x scope was just the ticket.

BL22 triggers are ordinary and difficult to tune because it moves with the lever. I would be very interested if someone could do something to turn that sows ear into a silk purse.

[deanp100]

Main question. How old are you? When I was a kid , as in 14-15 I could do incredible things with open sights. 40 years later I can’t . The guns are the same one I had back then but the eyes are failing whether I want to admit it or not.

[in2anity]

"Intense front sight focus, target is a blur"

The trick is to not center hold - center hold lends itself to (partially) covering up your target, which if it's dark, makes it near enough impossible to to get your elevation and windage super precise. You want to develop a relationship with a POI relative to above the front sight. Then precise windage can be achieved, and elevation can be fairly acurately judged based on experience and "leaving a tiny sliver of light".

I regularly see the very best master graders shoot fist-sized groups using a ww2 battle rifle, with battle sights, from the standing offhand position at 100m Simply mind boggling, but once you practise enough, you can start see how it's within the realms of possible.

Healthy vision can handle a finer front blade, which makes windage potentially even more precise. Older eyes are suited to the big fat square blade, which can also in a different way be useful for kentucky windage because you have the two reference points on both corners.

WRT to a trigger - I have a funny story. I once saw a palma guy come try out service; he had the target lined up, and after a seemingly long time, he turns and says "THE TRIGGER IS JAMMED!" Nevertheless if you stick to the one rifle for long enough, you just get this innate sense of how much pressure to load the trigger with before the break - and you can work with it. Just takes practise and familiarisation.

Moral of the story - perfect practise makes perfect permanent.

[PekingDuck]

On my 2nd bl22, first one shot ok with cci velocitors, current one prefers something just near supersonic ~1000fps. Neither is what you would ever call target accurate. I use a 204 bore snake if I do a clean, both seem mucho tight with 224 snakes, alternatively cut your own patches. After being a bit pedantic with my first I came to the conclusion cleaning them is over rated. They seem more consistent dirty, and will get a little better with more shots through them. I got my trigger done by aprs rifles in adelaide for $120 and it's about 1.5pounds. Had this one done from new but I know my first one was factory at about 8 pounds. DO NOT try and pull it apart yourself unless you are very confident in your skills. They are PITA to assemble.
Best advise, pay a competent Smith to do the trigger, shoot and enjoy, don't expect 1/2 moa groups.

Thats interesting about the ammo preferences. All the groups looked similar with varying ammo but thats probably my own beginner skills.
Do you know what APRS did for the trigger job? spring replacement, polish etc
I've seen loads of comments about the difficulty of reassembly is. There is a video on youtube with step by step. Either way, Im going to find a gunsmith hopefully.

I've had the stainless/laminate BL-22 for about a month now, it's easily my favorite plinking rifle, that lever action is just so much more fun than anything else I have, the Savage A22R comes in second place, bolt actions are so slow and clunky after using levers.
The rifle itself is light but feels heavy for its small size and the build quality is superb, trigger is far too heavy though but that's the only bad thing about it.

Short CBs are fun as I can load about 21 in the tube but the accuracy is average at best, Winchester Z quiet rounds are terrible beyond about 20m but CCI quiets work well. For noisier rounds the Eley Std bulk ammo groups nicely and is more than good enough for open sights, haven't tried super sonic rounds as I don't want to annoy the neighbors even though they are not too close.

I did change the rear sight adjustable plate for a black washer so it works like a ghost ring but still uses the original flip up, that helped a lot, I'll get a proper commercial unit at some point, there's a youtube video where somebody did exactly that.

Yeah I really like it, its comfortable and balanced.
ah thats a cool idea with the washer. I'll look that up and see how it compares.
When i know it is sighted in, i'll give different ammo a go to see if the rifle prefers something specific.

It's a lever-action, it's unlikely to shoot remarkably well, but with a scope and some ammo testing I reckon you'd be able to get under 2MoA at 100m without too much trouble.

Those sights look half decent to me, but I'd have to actually shoot with them to know if they'd work for me.

The generally accepted focus should be on the front sight, it is impossible to focus in three, or even two planes at once.

Yeah, what i've found helps is to look at the front sight whilst bringing the rifle up to my eyes. Helps me keep the focus on the front and kind of blurs the rear sight.
I've ordered a Vortex Crossfire II 2-7x32 rimfire for some exposure and practice but the main use for me is shortrange rabbit popping

google and practice "6 oclock hold". It's beneficial for repeatable windage and standard practice in service rifle.

I had a brief look at the kind of holds.
Apparently the SkinnerSight front partridge sight requires the use of the 6 oclock hold so i'll be having some practical experience soon.

well, your hooked aren't you

there's no turning back now

Hottest thing in life right now

I’ve got that exact same rifle, love it, congratulations on your choice. I don’t mind the open sights but have thought about putting some skinners on it too. So did you order the sight that slides onto to receiver dovetail? And what are you doing with your front sight? I’ve heard the original will work ok, or did you order a front sight too?

This is what i ordered, "RIMFIRE SIGHTS Model and Material: Browning BL 22 (BLUE)" http://skinnersights.com/rimfire_groove_sights_25.html and "3/8 Front Sight Height and Material: .600 BLUE" http://skinnersights.com/front_sights_5.html. Reading around, somewhere around .530" and .570" front sight is required. When i have the correct height on my rifle, i plan to replace the front with a fibre optic.

I cannot hit a rabbit consistently with open sights at 100, tried an Aim Point red dot which was better but a small 4x scope was just the ticket.

BL22 triggers are ordinary and difficult to tune because it moves with the lever. I would be very interested if someone could do something to turn that sows ear into a silk purse.

Wow, i wouldn't be able to see a rabbit at 100 with open sights. When I've got some practice in, ill try some targets at 100.
Yeah keen as to lighten the trigger.

Main question. How old are you? When I was a kid , as in 14-15 I could do incredible things with open sights. 40 years later I can’t . The guns are the same one I had back then but the eyes are failing whether I want to admit it or not.

29 this year mate, i wouldn't say i have bad eye sight however i do wear glasses for minor astigmatism. I also wear the same glasses when shooting.
I'm hanging out for the day cybernetics becomes mainstream

[snag]

Completely agree with in2anity on his sighting tip. Commonly known as the "6 o'clock hold", it's what we were taught in Cadets more than half a century ago and is still how most service rifle participants shoot. All about practice, of course, but being able to see the whole target helps a lot with shot placement.

[marksman]

+1 in agreeance with in2anity as well

a bloke at the range l used to frequent regularly could hit clay targets in the mound at 500m with an smle and mauser 98
mostly on the first shot at them, he taught me how it was done and l could do it but not like him
he only owned military rifles and not one had a scope
a true shooter who really enjoyed sharing his knowledge

[PekingDuck]

"Intense front sight focus, target is a blur"

The trick is to not center hold - center hold lends itself to (partially) covering up your target, which if it's dark, makes it near enough impossible to to get your elevation and windage super precise. You want to develop a relationship with a POI relative to (very fractionally above) the front sight. Then precise windage can be achieved, and elevation can be fairly acurately judged based on experience and "leaving a tiny sliver of light".

I regularly see the very best master graders shoot fist-sized groups using a ww2 battle rifle, with battle sights, from the standing offhand position at 100m Simply mind boggling, but once you practise enough, you can start see how it's within the realms of possible.

Healthy vision can handle a finer front blade, which makes windage potentially even more precise. Older eyes are suited to the big fat square blade, which can also in a different way be useful for kentucky windage because you have the two reference points on both corners.

WRT to a trigger - I have a funny story. I once saw a palma guy come try out service; he had the target lined up, and after a seemingly long time, he turns and says "THE TRIGGER IS JAMMED!" Nevertheless if you stick to the one rifle for long enough, you just get this innate sense of how much pressure to load the trigger with before the break - and you can work with it. Just takes practise and familiarisation.

Moral of the story - perfect practise makes perfect permanent.

Cheers for the explanation, the more im getting exposed to knowledge the more i want to practice.
Can any type of front sight be used for the 6oclock, POI holds? just going by what i read on the skinner website, beaded sights are for centre hold and partridge sights are for 6oclock. I dont really see the practical difference.

Haha that story is pretty similar when my mate tried my rifle out!

[in2anity]

A picture paints a thousand words https://images.app.goo.gl/KcWB6tUXexW2Lwuu5

[snag]

Excellent stuff in2anity. And, no, PekingDuck (I love that user name) it doesn't matter what front sight you have - the principle is exactly the same.

[snag]

Oh hey in2anity, just read back through this thread and realised that you had already given the "6 o'clock hold" advice. Didn't mean to come over the top of you on that - I have to start reading the whole threads not just the last page. Very good advice from you.

[in2anity]

PekingDuk you'll find it easier once the peep receiver arrives. The eye has a natural tendancy to want to align with an arpeture, at which point you can solely focus on the front sight as described. You should also notice the benefits of a longer sight radius (having the skinner sight just in front of the hammer instead of the v-notch halfway down) - I bet you see you groups come in at that point.

[PekingDuck]

Excellent stuff in2anity. And, no, PekingDuck (I love that user name) it doesn't matter what front sight you have - the principle is exactly the same.

Ok Great, cheers!

PekingDuk you'll find it easier once the peep receiver arrives. The eye has a natural tendancy to want to align with an arpeture, at which point you can solely focus on the front sight as described. You should also notice the benefits of a longer sight radius (having the skinner sight just in front of the hammer instead of the v-notch halfway down) - I bet you see you groups come in at that point.

Looking forward to it, will post pictures and updates when I've got it all sighted in.
Will try and get a benchrest and off hand comparison. I know its not going to be tack accurate but im curious to see my own ability (and improvements over time) in comparison to what the rifle is capable of


Thanks everyone for all your tips!

[bladeracer]

Looking forward to it, will post pictures and updates when I've got it all sighted in.
Will try and get a benchrest and off hand comparison. I know its not going to be tack accurate but im curious to see my own ability (and improvements over time) in comparison to what the rifle is capable of


Thanks everyone for all your tips!

I'm curious to see if the lever setup makes for any better accuracy.
I have the Norinco JW21 (copy of Win 9422) and the Henry 001. The JW21 shoots a little better than the Henry to 100m when they're scoped off the bench.

[rc42]

Here's a good rear sight alternative, I got a stainless steel washer of the right size and used a file to create notches for the screw fixings and replaced the rear sight plate but this is what I want to do when I get the parts:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52nrNKqOYCI

[duncan61]

I feel the need to weigh in.Welcome to the world of lever rifles.I would like you to consider this.If you wish to get small groups get in to target shooting with the proper tool.You have a fun toy try this walk around where there is rabbits that are going to bust out of cover and keep both eyes open and swing on to the target and pop away as fast as you can cycle do not remove the rifle from your shoulder.We were trained in this at the battle school in Tully with SLR that had a sleeve kit in .22 LR.If you fit proper sights and stuff you will struggle to aquire targets on the move and defeat the whole purpose of having open sights and a lever/pump.It should become instinctive.Practice moving slow as if stalking then swing on and let them go.If you use cheap bushmaster or something similar if you do hit a rabbit you will not do that much damage and probably recover a fair amount depending of course where it was hit.They die of shock most of the time.I have been sure I kicked up sand in front of where they were running and have collected them without a mark on them.If you ever hit one in the back of the head doing this and you are with other people it will blow their minds that it is possible and it will be a lot more satisfying than closing up your groups.I have somewhere we can do this in Waroona if you are interested

[duncan61]

I am going to the ABRC range shoot on Saturday morning 11/7 at Pickering brook its at 100 yards so just in distance for your 22LR.If you are going to go I suggest you invest in a box of CCI stingers them things hoot.I will probably take my 7mm Rem Mag Sendero which you are more than welcome to shoot a detail out of.It is 10 shots at a target then 5 at a pest target which will probably be a 3-5 second exposure.We take turns in the butts and that is an experience in itself.My best mate who has passed ons youngest son and I will be competing with .243 as he has his dads 1978 BRNO and its sentimental.I will of course make him cry when I out shoot him with my $700 HOWA.feel free to P.M. I have met some cool dudes on this forum

[PekingDuck]

So i got the trigger job done. It wasn't easy finding a gunsmith willing to work on the BL22 trigger!
Originally 3.3Kg pull and now its 1.7Kg. The gunsmith said any lower and it'll the sear will start to slip and could start to slam fire. Pretty happy with the trigger, its crisp and predictable now.

Also got the new Skinner aperture rear and front sights, much easier to get a sight picture using the 6oclock hold.

Tried it out at 50yd and 100yd without any elavation/windage adjustments and unrested.
Seems like its 3" low at 50yd and 12" low at 100yd.
Will get a hold of a rest and solid time to zero for 50yd.

When does wind start to affect 22lr? It was abit windy when i shot 50yd. ~20km/hr cross winds. Wind was still when i shot 100yd.

When you are pretty confident you'll shoot low and off target at 100yds, use 2 targets

[CrackThump]

Congratulations on your first (of many Im sure) .. Frikkin good looking gun too .

[marksman]

its what l call a work in progress, meaning you will be looking for different ways to be able to do it better
what l have been looking for lately recommended by in2anity but cannot find in AU is the ching sling for a steadier hold off the shoulder
l'm about to hit the button on some strap and make my own because l honestly believe it will make a big difference in my offhand shooting
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-oHZQ2smpA

well done by the way

[Oldbloke]

PekingDuk you'll find it easier once the peep receiver arrives. The eye has a natural tendancy to want to align with an arpeture, at which point you can solely focus on the front sight as described. You should also notice the benefits of a longer sight radius (having the skinner sight just in front of the hammer instead of the v-notch halfway down) - I bet you see you groups come in at that point.

Yep. ^^^^^ Peeps are pretty good

[SCJ429]

So i got the trigger job done. It wasn't easy finding a gunsmith willing to work on the BL22 trigger!
Originally 3.3Kg pull and now its 1.7Kg. The gunsmith said any lower and it'll the sear will start to slip and could start to slam fire. Pretty happy with the trigger, its crisp and predictable now.

Also got the new Skinner aperture rear and front sights, much easier to get a sight picture using the 6oclock hold.

Tried it out at 50yd and 100yd without any elavation/windage adjustments and unrested.
Seems like its 3" low at 50yd and 12" low at 100yd.
Will get a hold of a rest and solid time to zero for 50yd.

When does wind start to affect 22lr? It was abit windy when i shot 50yd. ~20km/hr cross winds. Wind was still when i shot 100yd.

Well done convincing a smith to work on the trigger, buggers of things on that Browning.

The wind will affect your bullet at any distance, at shorter distances the time of flight is smaller and the wind has less influence, say at 25m but at 200 metres the wind has a much longer period to push your bullet around. A half inch shift at 25 meters can become three feet at 200. You should put a wind flag out so you can see what it is doing.

[boingk]

Well done on the aquisition mate, and don't let anyone tell you a 22 lever action won't work - I have an Erma and mate has a Miroku, we regularly take them to the range and throw a milo tin out on the 200m rest with a rock in the bottom. Be darned if we don't hit that thing pretty much every shot, opens or not!

With zeroing, play around with a PBR calculator - Point Blank Range. See HERE for a basic one. Type in your muzzle velocity and go from there.

A PBR will tell you the best range to sight in the rifle if you want it to shoot flat out as far as possible. For a 22LR its usually about 75m, making you a few inches low at 100m. For something like a 223 you're often best sighting it dead on at 200m and simply remembering it will be a few inches high at 100, but only about 4" low at 300.

Enjoy that little lever mate, she looks tops!