marksman wrote:l'm glad he did not do it with a gun
Flyer wrote:
My only contention is that cruelty can also accompany unlawful killing. Is running over a mob of kangaroos, for example, unlawful killing or cruelty if said animals are left to die slowly of their injuries, or joeys are to crawl out of their dead mother's pouches and slowly freeze to death as in this case? It's not the unlawful killing, per se, but the cruelty that often accompanies it.
mickb wrote:Flyer wrote:
My only contention is that cruelty can also accompany unlawful killing. Is running over a mob of kangaroos, for example, unlawful killing or cruelty if said animals are left to die slowly of their injuries, or joeys are to crawl out of their dead mother's pouches and slowly freeze to death as in this case? It's not the unlawful killing, per se, but the cruelty that often accompanies it.
Same could be argued for us killing female animals of any type. We cant account for any young nearby. I'd rather the guy be punished as hard as necessary for each and every animal killed, including joeys yep sure, but without the torture talk. Thats just me, I prefer to save words like that for putting away the real sadists.
rc42 wrote:Society has funny 'morals' when it comes to what's cruelty and what isn't.
Baby chickens identified as male are placed on conveyor belts that feed them into meat grinders whilst still alive and that's RSPCA approved, in fact there's no part of the meat and dairy industry that isn't based on cruelty and suffering of animals. If a food product has a smiling cartoon animal on it then that's the animal type suffered to make it.
It seems that you can commit any act of cruelty if there's money to be made and you've paid some of it to the government.
Not that I agree in any way with what these jerks have done, dangerous driving just for the sake of some kind of sick sport, but their real punishment is for the stupidity of doing it where there were witnesses, leaving evidence and bragging about it by text or social media.
marksman wrote:l actually think these guys should be studied and l do not think they are of sound mind
l dont see killing animals as a sport or a bit of fun and l cannot understand what they thought this was
mickb wrote:marksman wrote:l actually think these guys should be studied and l do not think they are of sound mind
l dont see killing animals as a sport or a bit of fun and l cannot understand what they thought this was
Not excusing these guys legally or morally but dont most hunters kill for sport or a bit of fun. I am not eating 98% of the stuff I shoot or have shot either, and dont really feel like I need to be studied because of it.
Flyer wrote:I guess it's just a matter of semantics. Whether you use the word "cruel" or "torture" it still amounts to the same thing: intent to injure, maim or kill without regard to suffering. There is a difference between that and killing cleanly without inflicting pain (or killing cruelly because you need to eat to survive and have no other means). I believe that is why they were charged and convicted of animal cruelty offences – because it was cruel and I don't see any other way to describe it.
Grandadbushy wrote:Mickb mate with all due respect i don;t think that is quiet true with most shooters,
mickb wrote:marksman wrote:l actually think these guys should be studied and l do not think they are of sound mind
l dont see killing animals as a sport or a bit of fun and l cannot understand what they thought this was
Not excusing these guys legally or morally but dont most hunters kill for sport or a bit of fun. I am not eating 98% of the stuff I shoot or have shot either, and dont really feel like I need to be studied because of it.
mickb wrote:They are dictionary definitions and they dont amount to the same thing. If cruelty is the name of the offence, that is fine slap him with it. Again torture is a different level and I dont support the new and lazy usage of it with mundane crimes. The legal system is already too sloppy these days. A drug dealer who ruins kids liives isnt tortuing them., but someone who barrels over a few marsupials is a torturer needing specialised studies by the FBI apparently. Australians are losing their sense of proportionality due to sensationalism.
cruel
[ kroo-uhl ]
SEE SYNONYMS FOR cruel ON THESAURUS.COM
adjective, cru·el·er, cru·el·est.
willfully or knowingly causing pain or distress to others.
enjoying the pain or distress of others: the cruel spectators of the gladiatorial contests.
causing or marked by great pain or distress: a cruel remark; a cruel affliction.
rigid; stern; strict; unrelentingly severe.
torture
[ tawr-cher ]
SEE SYNONYMS FOR torture ON THESAURUS.COM
noun
the act of inflicting excruciating pain, as punishment or revenge, as a means of getting a confession or information, or for sheer cruelty.
a method of inflicting such pain.
Often tortures. the pain or suffering caused or undergone.
extreme anguish of body or mind; agony.
a cause of severe pain or anguish.
TassieTiger wrote:I refuse to hunt with ppl who shoot animals for the sake of...well shooting animals and then leaving them 100% to rot / slow wounded death - and nothing more. It makes no sense to me. If you want to test your shooting skills why do it on living creatures and risk a wounded animal...move to targets...wildlife is a valuable resource in its own right.
Last year, I’ve taken an older guy on my property who wanted to shoot some wallaby for his dogs....it just so happened as we approached the main dam, a couple ducks flew over and he shot them. He then recovered them, held them up gleefully for a photo, scratched out a hole in the ground and buried them...there’s the gate mate - good luck to you...
Flyer wrote:As I said, semantics. One is a noun the other an adjective. You can't have torture without cruelty, and it is arguable that any form of cruelty is also a form or torture. What those guys did certainly meets the following definitions.
cruel
[ kroo-uhl ]
SEE SYNONYMS FOR cruel ON THESAURUS.COM
adjective, cru·el·er, cru·el·est.
willfully or knowingly causing pain or distress to others.
enjoying the pain or distress of others: the cruel spectators of the gladiatorial contests.
causing or marked by great pain or distress: a cruel remark; a cruel affliction.
rigid; stern; strict; unrelentingly severe.
As for the drug dealer reference: people who take drugs have a choice in the matter
Defenceless animals don't have a say.