A Question for our American Members

[Die Judicii]

I'm wondering if you blokes can shed some light on following,,,,,,

When you go shopping at,, Supermarkets, Hardware stores, Tool stores, Shoe stores, Sports Stores, etc
What sort of percentage of goods are on the shelves that are made in China,,,, as opposed to USA or Europe ?

Because here in Aus we are struggling to find any goods that are NOT made in China.
Is this because our government is specifically aiming for such content,,,,,, or,, is America in the same boat ( pardon the pun )

[Bugman]

Yep. I would like to know the answer to that meeself.

[Communism_Is_Cancer]

A 10 year old article says not that much as a percentage. When I was in the USA every felt like it had a made in the USA label on it. Jap cars like Honda and Toyota are even made in the USA. Not to mention some Glock pistols are even made in the USA.

https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2011 ... s-to-china

[cz515]

It's capitalism the govt has no say in what companies choose to import their products from apart from putting tariffs.

The reality is simple, China had cheap labour, huge incentives and hence all companies, to save costs and get a cheaper price moved their production to China. Obviously the customers want the cheapest item, everyone said why spend $499 when I can get a made in China for $99.

Eventually we can't even find the $499 quality item

[bladeracer]

A 10 year old article says not that much as a percentage. When I was in the USA every felt like it had a made in the USA label on it. Jap cars like Honda and Toyota are even made in the USA. Not to mention some Glock pistols are even made in the USA.

https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2011 ... s-to-china

Keep in mind though that in the US they can say whatever they like about their products. Copper-plated .22LR bullets are not plated, full-synthetic oil is not full synthetic, etc. A "made in USA" label may just apply to the label, not the product

[Johnno]

Australia reported a record trade surplus with China in May driven by higher iron ore export receipts, despite trade and political relations between the two countries deteriorating over the past 18 months.

This will change as the political relations are likely to deteriorate further. Trade volumes will be less. Increased Australia- England trade will partly compensate with this, along with the USA trade. There is also a growing sentiment in Australia to favour non-chinese products. Chinese brands also have image and low quality problems, especially with tractors, other machinery and cars.

[Downunder]

We import a lot of what we can’t get locally made in AU/NZ from the US, whilst I can’t speak for what’s on the shelves I can say that unlike Australia local manufacturing sectors such as clothing are still commercially producing in the US and quality is excellent.

[Bello]

Hi y'all
We sold our soul to China a lifetime ago.
Why?
It was cheaper. More profit in the short term....problem as I see it:
They have now got us over a barrel.
Some of the readers who have a few more years under their belt will remember when we made almost every thing here. You got a job as an apprentice, as a 16 year old, and you had a job for life. Aussie made stuff was made with good quality inputs. If there was an issue then an Aussie would fix it.

Now we have given China our soul, and they have ALL the money we used to have here. What have they done with the money. They have built themselves a first rate economy, (paying their workers nothing and making them work 12 hour days with no entitlements or OHS)
They now have a very advanced military and they threaten the world with their claims in the south China sea.

They also use that money to influence countries around us with cheap shoddy bridges, roads, buildings etc, and coerce those countries to back the Chinese mantra.

I could go on for days.
I would rather pay a little more for my goods if it meant we had real jobs here, and a future for our kids and their kids.
I do understand we need to trade with other countries for some goods that we can not produce here or may be cost prohibitive to make here.

Just my early morning rand prior to my calming jug of coffee

[bladeracer]

Hi y'all
We sold our soul to China a lifetime ago.
Why?
It was cheaper. More profit in the short term....problem as I see it:
They have now got us over a barrel.
Some of the readers who have a few more years under their belt will remember when we made almost every thing here. You got a job as an apprentice, as a 16 year old, and you had a job for life. Aussie made stuff was made with good quality inputs. If there was an issue then an Aussie would fix it.

Now we have given China our soul, and they have ALL the money we used to have here. What have they done with the money. They have built themselves a first rate economy, (paying their workers nothing and making them work 12 hour days with no entitlements or OHS)
They now have a very advanced military and they threaten the world with their claims in the south China sea.

They also use that money to influence countries around us with cheap shoddy bridges, roads, buildings etc, and coerce those countries to back the Chinese mantra.

I could go on for days.
I would rather pay a little more for my goods if it meant we had real jobs here, and a future for our kids and their kids.
I do understand we need to trade with other countries for some goods that we can not produce here or may be cost prohibitive to make here.

Just my early morning rand prior to my calming jug of coffee

If we'd continued producing here though we would've also had to keep increasing wages massively, increasing costs further, requiring even higher wages, until we imploded.
My brother worked in IT for Holden and saw the ridiculous wages being paid to labourers assembling cars.

To produce here we need to cap wages, and no government is going to be able to sell that.

[wanneroo]

I'm wondering if you blokes can shed some light on following,,,,,,

When you go shopping at,, Supermarkets, Hardware stores, Tool stores, Shoe stores, Sports Stores, etc
What sort of percentage of goods are on the shelves that are made in China,,,, as opposed to USA or Europe ?

Because here in Aus we are struggling to find any goods that are NOT made in China.
Is this because our government is specifically aiming for such content,,,,,, or,, is America in the same boat ( pardon the pun )

Supermarkets just about everything in the store is US origin with the exception being getting some fruit and veg from the southern hemisphere or Mexico in the winter. You might find some packaged goods from other countries in the international section.

Hardware stores it varies. We have a chain called "Harbor Freight" where pretty much everything is cheap but made in China. You can still get American made stuff at a higher price at other stores. You will also see stuff in hardware stores that have a mix of US and foreign parts assembled in the USA.

Shoe stores, one thing I see is a lot of stuff from countries like Vietnam or Indonesia now compared to China. A lot of clothes seem to come from central America or southeast Asia. One thing is we do a lot of trade with Mexico and Central America which I have never seen much of when I have been in Australia and NZ.

Sports stores, electronic stores, some you see made in China for cheaper stuff but you still see made in America or various countries in Europe. Here in the USA if you want the cheap stuff, you go for Made in China, if you want typically better quality at a higher price, Made in the USA or I even see stuff Made in Germany or Italy.

We also do a lot of trade with Canada and with Canada a lot of what we get from them is raw materials, oil and gas, etc. I live close to Canada so we see greenhouse grown Canadian vegetables a lot and other Canadian products at times.

[Communism_Is_Cancer]

Australia imports around 6 to 7 percent of its food. Whilst the UK is around 50 percent. No wonder at one point the Germans had them a few weeks away from starvation.

Australia can sustain itself and feed the population in troubled times yet if anything happens in places like the UK they are screwed.

[Die Judicii]

Wanneroo;
Thanks for the input Mate.
It's promising to hear that at least you still have choices in general, and that if you want cheap/cheapest stuff (typically Chinese) you have to search for it.
Unfortunately down here it's the other way round.

Hopefully for you guys I hope the tide doesn't turn.

[DaveZ]

It's capitalism the govt has no say in what companies choose to import their products from apart from putting tariffs.

The reality is simple, China had cheap labour, huge incentives and hence all companies, to save costs and get a cheaper price moved their production to China. Obviously the customers want the cheapest item, everyone said why spend $499 when I can get a made in China for $99.

Eventually we can't even find the $499 quality item

What's available on our store shelves is a direct reflection of our spending habits. Everyone loves to shop for the cheapest products, but unfortunately, this is where we end up.

[Bugman]

Yep. You definitely get what you pay.

[Communism_Is_Cancer]

Remember back in 2017 when we made rear wheel drive v8 and inline 6 turbo sedans and utes.

[DaveZ]

Remember back in 2017 when we made rear wheel drive v8 and inline 6 turbo sedans and utes.

Yep, my first new car was a BF XR8 Falcon. Sad to see them gone. Never say never, but I doubt we will ever see that industry return.

[disco stu]

From what I read about Holden it sounded like the union had the place by the balls, and then they just pushed for higher and higher wages as BR said. I heard that anyone who got a job and didn't want to join the union was pushed out in one way or another. That to me seems like short term thinking, especially when there is a thriving overseas car manufacturing market with competitive pricing, plus the other companies were slowly closing down Australian manufacturing.

Ideally, I like buying Australian made, but I'm also a broke tightarse most of the time. Without Chinese made I probably couldn't have the tools that I do that I use all the time. I kind of like the idea of buying from some other country that is trying to pull itself up out of poverty also.

One thing that takes my goat is products made cheap in China and dressed up in Japanese or similar packaging. I saw this daily in fishing tackle retail-lures that have Japanese style all over the packaging and cost "Japanese made" kind of money ($30-35 for a single lure) being made in China. Someone is raking it in there, and most of the brainless trend following fishos are to stupid to even notice they're being shafted, or they don't care because it's trendy

[Communism_Is_Cancer]

Holden was also only 1% of General Motors yearly sales. Such an an insignificant percentage to warrant its own model range and manufacturing so Detroit pulled the pin.

[bladeracer]

Holden was also only 1% of General Motors yearly sales. Such an an insignificant percentage to warrant its own model range and manufacturing so Detroit pulled the pin.

Even 1% adds up when you're dealing in hundreds of millions.
GM pulled the plug because we pushed wages to ludicrous levels making it not economically viable.
The union screwed all its members into unemployment.

[wanneroo]

Wanneroo;
Thanks for the input Mate.
It's promising to hear that at least you still have choices in general, and that if you want cheap/cheapest stuff (typically Chinese) you have to search for it.
Unfortunately down here it's the other way round.

Hopefully for you guys I hope the tide doesn't turn.

Trump made a big push to reestablish American manufacturing and did so for national security reasons, Taiwan Semiconductor(TSMC) for instance building a huge plant in Arizona but also so we have a manufacturing base to make our own stuff and not be dependent entirely on globalist supply chains. Trump managed to push through a new North American trade agreement and did a lot of other good things by getting rid of a lot of stupid bureaucratic rules that disincentivized businesses from building factories.

I'm seeing a lot more American made stuff compared to 10 years ago and there is actually a substantial amount of manufacturing in the USA. Even in my rural area, we have one plant in town that makes LED lighting and they can't hire enough people to meet demand and some other plants in the surrounding area as well.

Obviously our gun industry is heavily American. Sig Sauer is a completely American company now, Glock may as well be, CZ has opened a factory and Walther has a big factory in Arkansas.

[ZaineB]

Thank Fiat Currency for most of the aforementioned problems.

[wanneroo]

Even 1% adds up when you're dealing in hundreds of millions.
GM pulled the plug because we pushed wages to ludicrous levels making it not economically viable.
The union screwed all its members into unemployment.

A real shame what happened to Holden. But the old workers took a deal to shut the factory down and screw the younger people out of a job.

The Holden Monaros and Commodores imported here under the Pontiac and Chevy nameplates are still popular and hold their value well.

[ZaineB]

From what I read about Holden it sounded like the union had the place by the balls, and then they just pushed for higher and higher wages as BR said. I heard that anyone who got a job and didn't want to join the union was pushed out in one way or another. That to me seems like short term thinking, especially when there is a thriving overseas car manufacturing market with competitive pricing, plus the other companies were slowly closing down Australian manufacturing.

Ideally, I like buying Australian made, but I'm also a broke tightarse most of the time. Without Chinese made I probably couldn't have the tools that I do that I use all the time. I kind of like the idea of buying from some other country that is trying to pull itself up out of poverty also.

One thing that takes my goat is products made cheap in China and dressed up in Japanese or similar packaging. I saw this daily in fishing tackle retail-lures that have Japanese style all over the packaging and cost "Japanese made" kind of money ($30-35 for a single lure) being made in China. Someone is raking it in there, and most of the brainless trend following fishos are to stupid to even notice they're being shafted, or they don't care because it's trendy

I never have and never will hire someone in a trade union, never happening, no thanks they can all take a dive.

[ZaineB]

Holden was also only 1% of General Motors yearly sales. Such an an insignificant percentage to warrant its own model range and manufacturing so Detroit pulled the pin.

Even 1% adds up when you're dealing in hundreds of millions.
GM pulled the plug because we pushed wages to ludicrous levels making it not economically viable.
The union screwed all its members into unemployment.

unions do one of two things, either they do as you say, or they end up making sure everyone is being paid as little as the most useless C#nts on site. In any case there is a reason why sole traders kill the pig and wage earners drag behind.

[Downunder]

Hi y'all
We sold our soul to China a lifetime ago.
Why?
It was cheaper. More profit in the short term....problem as I see it:
They have now got us over a barrel.
Some of the readers who have a few more years under their belt will remember when we made almost every thing here. You got a job as an apprentice, as a 16 year old, and you had a job for life. Aussie made stuff was made with good quality inputs. If there was an issue then an Aussie would fix it.

Now we have given China our soul, and they have ALL the money we used to have here. What have they done with the money. They have built themselves a first rate economy, (paying their workers nothing and making them work 12 hour days with no entitlements or OHS)
They now have a very advanced military and they threaten the world with their claims in the south China sea.

They also use that money to influence countries around us with cheap shoddy bridges, roads, buildings etc, and coerce those countries to back the Chinese mantra.

I could go on for days.
I would rather pay a little more for my goods if it meant we had real jobs here, and a future for our kids and their kids.
I do understand we need to trade with other countries for some goods that we can not produce here or may be cost prohibitive to make here.

Just my early morning rand prior to my calming jug of coffee

If we'd continued producing here though we would've also had to keep increasing wages massively, increasing costs further, requiring even higher wages, until we imploded.
My brother worked in IT for Holden and saw the ridiculous wages being paid to labourers assembling cars.

To produce here we need to cap wages, and no government is going to be able to sell that.

Unions can take their fair share of liability for the demise of manufacturing in Australia as well a government and the public.
A government bipartisan approach could have easily kept jobs and industry in Australia, but alas in a race to the bottom politicians and parties sold out.

The writing was on the wall when we move from a debit society to a credit one to appease the global addiction of consumerism.
When I was young personal lines of credit beyond a mortgage weren’t never heard of, businesses, especially seasonal income ones such as farming utilised bank overdrafts to offset cash flow issues.
Impulse buying didn’t exist and luxury’s were everything you didn’t need to sustain yourself, your saved hard for those luxuries so they had to be well thought through and excellent quality built to last.

I stopped waiting for governments to look after the nations interests decades ago, I do my personal bit to address the global manufacturing dominance of China through sourcing any consumables and or luxuries I need from anywhere but Chicom.

[Larry]

Australia imports around 6 to 7 percent of its food. Whilst the UK is around 50 percent. No wonder at one point the Germans had them a few weeks away from starvation.

Australia can sustain itself and feed the population in troubled times yet if anything happens in places like the UK they are screwed.

I think the 6% of food we import is not really essential food items. Due to our large multicultural population we import a lot of cultural food items those comfort food items that you can only get in your home country. We have a whole industry of International food shops that cater to this market exclusively.

Even the major food supermarkets have a section devoted to say Asian food items, Italian food items ect. But they dont have the range of all the brands of a particular food item like the international food shops.

[bladeracer]

I stopped waiting for governments to look after the nations interests decades ago, I do my personal bit to address the global manufacturing dominance of China through sourcing any consumables and or luxuries I need from anywhere but Chicom.

I don't think it's practical to try to live entirely Chinese free. China produces virtually anything you can think of. I don't think it matters what you buy, it's a virtual certainty that part of your money filters back to China, even if it's just the printers ink used on the packaging, the plastic wrap on the packaging, the staples holding the box together, or the crew of the ship that brought it to Australia.

It's probably better to consider all the Australians that earn their incomes importing and selling the foreign goods to us. Part of your money filters out of the country, but most of it puts food on the tables of Aussie families. If the government banned all Chinese importation how many Aussies would be put out of work?

I'm happy to support local people myself, especially when they can't earn under these crazy lockdowns. Businesses are struggling and some may have good reasons to try to increase their profit margins just now to be able to keep their doors open. Perhaps a year ago they were selling ten units of an item per month with $50 profit on each, perhaps now they're struggling to sell one a month. We can try to support them in the hope they'll still be here next year, or we can spend our money buying from further away on principle, and watch them go under. To my mind the majority of businesses don't gouge customers, though some certainly do, they just try to run a viable business to support their families and communities.

[cleger]

I'm wondering if you blokes can shed some light on following,,,,,,

When you go shopping at,, Supermarkets, Hardware stores, Tool stores, Shoe stores, Sports Stores, etc
What sort of percentage of goods are on the shelves that are made in China,,,, as opposed to USA or Europe ?

Because here in Aus we are struggling to find any goods that are NOT made in China.
Is this because our government is specifically aiming for such content,,,,,, or,, is America in the same boat ( pardon the pun )

A bit late... I don't know how I missed this.

You're asking for subjective experience, and I could write a long essay. I'm 56, and much has changed in my lifetime. In short, when I was a kid, you could get practically anything made in my home town. There was a shoe factory, textile mills, a company that made locks, and a plant that made steam turbines for the navy. There were companies that made gears, pipe fittings, microwave shielding, etc. 25 years later, and nothing (at all) is made there.

I'd say we're in the same boat. Not limited to China, but things like shoes (as sold here) have been made in APAC for decades now. Re: supermarkets, our food tends to be more local, naturally -- US and Canada.

I drive a Volkswagen that was made in Mexico. I think bits of my iPhone are sourced all over the world. The only consumer products I've bought relatively recently that I can think of off the top of my head and that are American-made are guns. Oh, and my dishes.

[Die Judicii]

A bit late... I don't know how I missed this.

You're asking for subjective experience, and I could write a long essay. I'm 56, and much has changed in my lifetime. In short, when I was a kid, you could get practically anything made in my home town. There was a shoe factory, textile mills, a company that made locks, and a plant that made steam turbines for the navy. There were companies that made gears, pipe fittings, microwave shielding, etc. 25 years later, and nothing (at all) is made there.

I'd say we're in the same boat. Not limited to China, but things like shoes (as sold here) have been made in APAC for decades now. Re: supermarkets, our food tends to be more local, naturally -- US and Canada.

I drive a Volkswagen that was made in Mexico. I think bits of my iPhone are sourced all over the world. The only consumer products I've bought relatively recently that I can think of off the top of my head and that are American-made are guns. Oh, and my dishes.

Thanks Mate,,,,,, much appreciated.

[Die Judicii]

I never have and never will hire someone in a trade union, never happening, no thanks they can all take a dive.

You gotta admit though,,,,,,,,,,,, things were pretty bad here in Aus before the union movement was born.

ie: Women and children starving because the man of the family was injured or killed at work (mostly due to no OH&S)

It was the union movement that changed that for the better,,,,, and back then that was good.

The problem as I see it started when most of the good work was done/achieved,,,,, and the unions went down the ridiculous path.

Unfortunately they never stopped at the sensible point.
A perfect example was in one workplace I was at,,,,,,, We had everything we wanted plus stuff that was ridiculous.
This was proven one day when the workplace was shut down by the union rep because the THREE different flavored milks that were supposed
to be in the lunch rooms fridges,,,,,,,, hadn't been supplied that morning.
This came about due to circumstances that had nothing to do with management.